Acura NSX-T vs. Porsche 911 Turbo
- Thread starter G-man
- Start date
NSX/MR2
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I just got back from work, Ala, me reaching for the wallet for the like of you, right boy. A bet is alway a bet, your car against mine, El centro, then we can make all the bet we want, bring your lunch and your buddy, Ala.
NSX/MR2
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NSXtasy is right, if you compare the NSX to the vr4, supra, and rx7, you are definitely one.... Not surprise why you had such poor taste in vehicles. Kit cars, none reliable European machines.
Bill92NSX wrote:
"In europe they drive the hell out of them (exotic cars) and are still worth money."
I can tell you from personal experience that is not the case. January of this year I almost bought a '93 Lambo while in the French Riviera. It was perfect and had 20k km. on the clock, was going for 52,000 euros (something like $47k U.S.), and had all the updates (according to Lamborghini of Monaco). After shiping (from Germany) and getting it U.S. spec, it would have amounted to approx $75k U.S. I found about a dozen European '91-'94 Diablos were going between $40K-$65K U.S. while in France. I know Allen has had some amazing luck with his Lambos, however, after further research through U.S. and French mechanics, and about a dozen U.S. and French Diablo owners, I decided not to buy. I was very tempted, but a $25k engine overhaul (sometimes as low as 5k mi.), and $12k clutch jobs were not for me.
Interestly, I found that NSX's in Europe were going for the same price as in the U.S.
Don't freak out, or start any fires Allen. These are just my opinions/findings.
P.S. Still would be nice to have a Lambo though.
"In europe they drive the hell out of them (exotic cars) and are still worth money."
I can tell you from personal experience that is not the case. January of this year I almost bought a '93 Lambo while in the French Riviera. It was perfect and had 20k km. on the clock, was going for 52,000 euros (something like $47k U.S.), and had all the updates (according to Lamborghini of Monaco). After shiping (from Germany) and getting it U.S. spec, it would have amounted to approx $75k U.S. I found about a dozen European '91-'94 Diablos were going between $40K-$65K U.S. while in France. I know Allen has had some amazing luck with his Lambos, however, after further research through U.S. and French mechanics, and about a dozen U.S. and French Diablo owners, I decided not to buy. I was very tempted, but a $25k engine overhaul (sometimes as low as 5k mi.), and $12k clutch jobs were not for me.
Interestly, I found that NSX's in Europe were going for the same price as in the U.S.
Don't freak out, or start any fires Allen. These are just my opinions/findings.
P.S. Still would be nice to have a Lambo though.
emvanderpool the prices in Europe are alot cheaper than here but when you import one over here prices are rather similar. I think (dont quote me) that Honda built one car for the world and that is why pricing is the same. I know from Ferrari and Lotus their European counterparts are extremely different, do not know about the Lambos though. Bumpers, side beams, emmissions, are completely different not to mention engines are sometimes different as well. That is why it costs like 25-30 grand to bring the cars over and even then they dont pass DOT/EPA standards
Deqle if Allan has such poor tasts in cars then you do as well. He does own an NSX doesn't he? I don't know what your problem with other cars besides the NSX is but you do need to lighten up a bit
[This message has been edited by bill92nsx (edited 28 August 2002).]
[This message has been edited by bill92nsx (edited 28 August 2002).]
ALLAN
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the prices on lambos to begin with in europe are much cheaper to begin with. approximately 210,000 euros buys you a new murcielago. approximately 200,000 u.s.
u.s. msrp is 279,000.
an engine overhaul will cost around 25,000, but 12k for a clutch? wow your getting robbed. i can get it done for 6k.
u.s. msrp is 279,000.
an engine overhaul will cost around 25,000, but 12k for a clutch? wow your getting robbed. i can get it done for 6k.
NSX/MR2
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My buddy's, Alex 5 years old 996 is not in the best of shape neither compare to the 11 years old NSX, funny all these badge grabbing people, still turn their head when the NSX come around. Cause out here in San Diego, P is everywhere, and rarely the NSX, and I hope it's continue to be like that, let's keep on buying up all the P baby, and leave the NSX for the real enthusiasts who's appreciate the vehicle for what it is, an ass kicking, good looking, reliable, and fun SOB.
I was quoted $8k to ship, and $10-$15k to get it California Legal with all the paper work for a "Grey" market car. This was with buying the parts. I know a San Diego shop that has all the smog stuff (cats, exhaust, etc.) that he would lend me for the tests,(which means It could have been significantly less than $10-$15K), but I just couldn't get by the reliability issues.
ALLAN
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degle, i have real bad taste in cars, i know. i should of never bought the nsx, but hell, i needed a car to drive that i wouldnt care if it got, dinged up, scratched, etc. basicly if you will.... a beater!
and if you want to talk trash tough guy, you make it worth my effort to meet you, bet wise , and i will come out to race you.
lets say 10,000? i'll leave tommorow.
bill, i have the ap brakes.
and if you want to talk trash tough guy, you make it worth my effort to meet you, bet wise , and i will come out to race you.
lets say 10,000? i'll leave tommorow.
bill, i have the ap brakes.
ALLAN
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emvanderpol,
the early diablos had problems with the timing chain tensioners. they would bind the chains causing them to snap, thats why you saw early cars needing engine rebuilds. the other problem was the driveshaft was 2 weak. by now, most cars have had both the mechanical chain update and the stronger driveshaft done. with these updates, the early cars are very strong runners, and actually since their is no power steering, no abs, no hydro front jacking system, there is less to break.
the early diablos had problems with the timing chain tensioners. they would bind the chains causing them to snap, thats why you saw early cars needing engine rebuilds. the other problem was the driveshaft was 2 weak. by now, most cars have had both the mechanical chain update and the stronger driveshaft done. with these updates, the early cars are very strong runners, and actually since their is no power steering, no abs, no hydro front jacking system, there is less to break.
NSX/MR2
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I don't have problem with other vehicles, I invited quite a few non NSX owners into my club, but I will stand by my word that no other high price cars is as reliable and easy to live with than the NSX.
Deqle you make no sense. I know of a 1998 NSX that is the pits as well. If you do not take care of the car it will be ratty. I have seen Porsches from the seventies where I can't tell if they are new or not. As for everyone owning a Porsche, they must be doing something right. If the NSX sold in those numbers you'd be gloating. There is just no pleasing you.
Emvanderpool those are cheap pricing for legalizing a car from Europe. I would have done it in a drop of hat. Allan is right about those prices being out of this world. I see this happening all the time with the Ferraris and Lotus--service is like 10 grand. Outrageous-it is these misconceptions that make one believe that these cars are untouchable. In a way its good it leaves the cars to the people who have a passion for them.I will definitely get my hands on a Lambo in a year or two--preferably 98-99 SV. I have also refrained from getting one because I listened to so many NONowners scare me. I have spoken with more than a few owners-including Allan, and my fears have been set aside. You dont need to rebuild the engine or change the clutch every 2000 miles if you take care of the car.
Emvanderpool those are cheap pricing for legalizing a car from Europe. I would have done it in a drop of hat. Allan is right about those prices being out of this world. I see this happening all the time with the Ferraris and Lotus--service is like 10 grand. Outrageous-it is these misconceptions that make one believe that these cars are untouchable. In a way its good it leaves the cars to the people who have a passion for them.I will definitely get my hands on a Lambo in a year or two--preferably 98-99 SV. I have also refrained from getting one because I listened to so many NONowners scare me. I have spoken with more than a few owners-including Allan, and my fears have been set aside. You dont need to rebuild the engine or change the clutch every 2000 miles if you take care of the car.
Actually the most reliable and easiest to live with high end just happens to be a Porsche. Especially the turbo cars. I would say they are alot more reliable than the NSX and can be driven hard every single day and not pose a single problem. My friend is one of the top mechanics here in NY on Porsches and these cars are bulletproof. Especially the 993tt. As hard as it is for you to hear this, you best be sitting-don't want you to faint, the 993tt is leagues ahead of the NSX. Even modded ones with over 500hp have over 100,000 miles and the reason why you never see any for sale with these miles is because no one wants to sell them. They are too happy with them. Believe me if you want but that is reality
NSX/MR2
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hahaha,
Exactly my point,$$$, that is all you are about, empty inside. My 10,000 would better be spend on a woman, at least she will play along nicely, how is yours fiancee these days, just a friendly check up. Why don't we just meet up and race, then we will decide how much bet we want to place, think about it, I had to drive a long distance just to meet...., don't you think that is enough tortue for me already. And you got it the other way around, it is your Eroupean's cars that are junks, smart investment on yours part I am sure.
Exactly my point,$$$, that is all you are about, empty inside. My 10,000 would better be spend on a woman, at least she will play along nicely, how is yours fiancee these days, just a friendly check up. Why don't we just meet up and race, then we will decide how much bet we want to place, think about it, I had to drive a long distance just to meet...., don't you think that is enough tortue for me already. And you got it the other way around, it is your Eroupean's cars that are junks, smart investment on yours part I am sure.
The RX-7, MR2, 300zx, 3000GT, Supra, etc. were killed by a highly unfavorable exchange rate with the Yen and increasing insurance costs. As an example, when I went to buy a new MR2T in '95, they were stickering at $29,000 before dealer add-ons. For this kind of money, one could have bought a very nice two-year-old 911 at the time. As much as I hate to say it, but anyone who bought a new MR2 in '95 probably needed to have his/her head examined. Likewise, the RX-7 was stickering at over $32k and the Supra was in the neighborhood of $45k (the MR2 price I'm sure of, the RX-7 and Supra my recollection may be less accurate).
In any event, these were the significant players in the market at the time and they all disappeared as public interest in forced induction sports car waned and transferred instead to the emerging fashion of the time, the SUV. Of course, now as the SUV trend seems to have peaked and begun its inevitable decline, its interesting to note the emergence of a new wave of 2 seater sports cars and forced induction "rally" cars including the S2000, Boxster, WRX and (soon) Lancer EVO VIIs.
I believe that the NSX survived because Acura, a relatively new brand in the market at the time (less than 10 years in existence in the U.S., 6 of which included the NSX in its line-up) could not afford to be without the "halo effect" of the NSX, even if they weren't exactly selling like hot cakes.
Where would Acura be, after all, without its flagship NSX and its corresponding "trickle down" technology bolstering Integra sales? For that matter, how much of a sports car would the Integra be perceived as without salesmen being able to make a passing nod to its VTEC big brother, the NSX?
Acura also needed a "high dollar" car to maintain its image as a luxury brand. The NSX fit the bill for this as well. Whereas the MR2, RX-7 and others drew scorn for pricing themselves out of the segment that they helped create, the NSX's stratospheric price actually helped establish Acura here in the U.S. as a top-shelf brand on par with the other new Japanese luxury offerings, Lexus and Infiniti, thereby bolstering not only "sporty" Integra sales, but just as importantly, the sales of its "up-market" Legends and Vigors.
By contrast, Toyota didn't need an MR2 or a Supra to sell its bread and butter Corollas and Camrys. Mazda already had its sporty Miata with the RX-7 being nothing more than a warranty nightmare for its dealerships. Nissan and Mitsubishi were just struggling to stay afloat and had to pare down their respective line-ups considerably. Acura was the anomaly here. IMHO, the NSX's survival had everything to do with market presence for Acura and precious little to do with the quality or value that the NSX represented as a sports car on its own merits.
-- DavidV
www.boostedgroup.com
I have always been a fan of the 993TT but the interior is CRAP! It looks awful. For a car that costs 110K, they should have done a lot better. Even the 996 interior is ugly. It looks much better than the 993, but it is IMO still crappy looking compared to the NSX.
The first time I ever got a ride in a porsche, all I could think of was how bad the interior is for a car that expensive. It really turned me off. Now, the 996 and boxster nearly look the same inside.. which is not a good thing in my book.
The final thing I can't stand about the interior is that when you don't get all the options, you get a big black button that does nothing. This is not acceptable in a car costing so much.
Why does a car that costs that much need options anyway?? It should just include everything.
The first time I ever got a ride in a porsche, all I could think of was how bad the interior is for a car that expensive. It really turned me off. Now, the 996 and boxster nearly look the same inside.. which is not a good thing in my book.
The final thing I can't stand about the interior is that when you don't get all the options, you get a big black button that does nothing. This is not acceptable in a car costing so much.
Why does a car that costs that much need options anyway?? It should just include everything.
Wow.. I think what boostedPOS said acutally made sense for once
(i am just messing with you)..
I think your points are right on.
I think your points are right on.
NSX/MR2
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Bill92NSX,
For you buddy, I rather shoot myself with my 45.
For you buddy, I rather shoot myself with my 45.
While I agree with you the interior is not all that great, it is simple. That causes for less problems. I actually do not like the noew interior at all. I had the sport seats in mine which was a huge difference appearnace wise and comfortable wise over the regular seats. And they did have lumbar and heated as well (something the NSX doesn't offer). Also my car had the turboS kit inside (full carbon fibre) which was also made it look better inside. I am not a fan of Porsche, just wanted to see what everyone was talking about. I actually traded it to buy the Esprit. Ride was way too harsh for my liking. Made it quite uncomfortable. I actually prefered my brothers c2 over the turbo (minus the power). I will never again own a Porsche, G-man no offense to you. That is another thing that turned me off about the Porsche, was its lack of options that came standard with the car. A 99,000 dollar car can easily fetch up to 125,000 just to make more appealing. One thing I do like in Ferrari and Lotus is everything comes standard only cosmetic options are deleted and minor ones at that.
NSX/MR2
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I just don't think that yours NSX is in the right hand, how sad for the NSX. Should get rid of it to an NSX enthusiast, and get another P. Honest brother I don't have a problem with you, you are allright in alot of the things you said, but I don't think you should own the NSX, it's not he right vehicle for you, I am still trying to raise my buddy who's want the NSX, hope he amswers soon.
ALLAN
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hahaha degle, you crack me up! first off, i see you have to pay for your women. sorry to hear that. my fiancee is now my wife, and she's at work right now, making me money!
since you said you'd rather spend your 10,000 elsewhere, your already admitting to defeat, by making that statement.
i love your race and betting philosophy though, you should run it by some vegas bookies. 1st. we race. 2nd. i beat you. 3rd.we decide how much you pay me? great idea! your brilliant!
as far as the porsche interiors concerned, yes it is not the greatest, but whats soo special about the acura? plastic and vinyl. true it is comfortable, but soo is the porsche.
btw, i have seen many, many nsx's in sad sad shape. any car that is uncared for, will fall apart.
since you said you'd rather spend your 10,000 elsewhere, your already admitting to defeat, by making that statement.
i love your race and betting philosophy though, you should run it by some vegas bookies. 1st. we race. 2nd. i beat you. 3rd.we decide how much you pay me? great idea! your brilliant!
as far as the porsche interiors concerned, yes it is not the greatest, but whats soo special about the acura? plastic and vinyl. true it is comfortable, but soo is the porsche.
btw, i have seen many, many nsx's in sad sad shape. any car that is uncared for, will fall apart.
ALLAN
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in the back of evo magazine there is synopsis of each vehicle tested:
1. diablo sv-pay for the best engine noise in the world and get a great car free!
2.lotus tt v8- ever improving british supercar, still sounds like a 4 banger.
3.porsche 911 turbo- worlds greatest all weather supercar-it doesnt rain enough
4.honda nsx-the original useable supercar-still chasing the 911.
god, give something a compliment and then slap it in the face! pow!
1. diablo sv-pay for the best engine noise in the world and get a great car free!
2.lotus tt v8- ever improving british supercar, still sounds like a 4 banger.
3.porsche 911 turbo- worlds greatest all weather supercar-it doesnt rain enough
4.honda nsx-the original useable supercar-still chasing the 911.
god, give something a compliment and then slap it in the face! pow!
