Where are all the Production deliveries ??

Does anyone know how many 570s mclaren is selling? It's a bit more expensive but ultimately I think it and the r8 are the NSX closest competition.

lately Audi seems to be consistently selling 10X as many R8's as Acura sells NSX's each month. McLaren's? who knows, but that's a very different company compared to Audi and Acura. they don't make sedans, SUV's, coupes, etc. if the Audi is a benchmark, Acura has missed it by titanic margins...
 
I hate to say it, but I'm just guessing that the sales figures would have been a lot better if Honda (Japan) brought the HSV to market in the low $100k's. Let the NSX name die with the old gen 1's.
:

I so wanted the V10 HSV! The BMW M5 V10 was a beast but I know that Honda's engine revved higher and sounded better. Personaliy, I think the HSV looked much more exotic - particularly the front end - compared to NSX 2.0. It's a shame it didn't come out 6-7 years ago, they would have sold at a steady clip in the low $100K range. And I agree, it didn't need the NSX name to sell, they coulda called it the "Acura XXX A-Spec" and gear heads and the general public alike would have bought it...its a sexy beast that would have looked truly stunning on the streets of Tokyo, LA, London, et al...its design is elegant, and flows from front to back...not a bunch of odd angles and 6 different grille materials....it didn't even have a grille...!
 
McLaren sold 125 models in April and 119 models in May; there's no breakdown by individual model. Those sales are US only. Clearly people are spending money on the F1 pedigree and breakneck performance, electric gremlins are apparently irrelevant at these prices.
 
McLaren sold 125 models in April and 119 models in May; there's no breakdown by individual model. Those sales are US only. Clearly people are spending money on the F1 pedigree and breakneck performance, electric gremlins are apparently irrelevant at these prices.

what we do know is they aren't buying McLaren SUV's, entry level cars for teenagers and luxury sedans. their Supercar models seem to be doing quite well...
 
It really sucks that Honda keeps taking blows to the nuts and apparently liking it... The recipe is so simple. Lightweight and up the power. Nothing else needed. Ditch the ec motors up front, rwd but keep the torque fill ec motor. At least the gen 2 owners will have quite the rare car a few years from now.
 
It really sucks that Honda keeps taking blows to the nuts and apparently liking it... The recipe is so simple. Lightweight and up the power. Nothing else needed. Ditch the ec motors up front, rwd but keep the torque fill ec motor. At least the gen 2 owners will have quite the rare car a few years from now.

You know deep down that you want a Nouvelle Blue. :D
 
I'm sure Audi has over the years purchased a few new nsx to dissect..will be intrested to see if any of the other oem's design thier own similar hybrid system like honda ...If they don't then I guess they don't see the benefit.
 
I'm sure Audi has over the years purchased a few new nsx to dissect..will be intrested to see if any of the other oem's design thier own similar hybrid system like honda ...If they don't then I guess they don't see the benefit.

I think anybody who was planning a AWD Hybrid Supercar is now re-evaluating their business plans in light of NSX 2.0. Clearly, when Ferrari, Porsche, McLaren made $1M hybrids there was and still is a market for that. The question becomes "can we deliver superior performance at 1/4 the price and will people buy it?"

My view is that the new target for manufacturers is the 720s: let's get down to ultra light weight, big power instead of adding an ultra complex drivetrain. I strongly believe Nissan will take that approach with the R36 rather than emulate Honda's sales fiasco. Audi said it best - we're gonna go all ICE as hard as we can, and then flip to all electric models. There is no Hybrid middleground because it's like being indecisive. Pick a swim lane and go.
 
I'm sure Audi has over the years purchased a few new nsx to dissect..will be intrested to see if any of the other oem's design thier own similar hybrid system like honda ...If they don't then I guess they don't see the benefit.

i can't see Audi being the slightest bit concerned with the NSX. they certainly have no reason to be.

Audi knows what their customers want, and they're building them those cars. at 60+ cars per month versus 6 for Acura, their formula is obviously more desirable and proven (even at a higher price)...

I think anybody who was planning a AWD Hybrid Supercar is now re-evaluating their business plans in light of NSX 2.0. Clearly, when Ferrari, Porsche, McLaren made $1M hybrids there was and still is a market for that. The question becomes "can we deliver superior performance at 1/4 the price and will people buy it?"

My view is that the new target for manufacturers is the 720s: let's get down to ultra light weight, big power instead of adding an ultra complex drivetrain. I strongly believe Nissan will take that approach with the R36 rather than emulate Honda's sales fiasco. Audi said it best - we're gonna go all ICE as hard as we can, and then flip to all electric models. There is no Hybrid middleground because it's like being indecisive. Pick a swim lane and go.

concerning the Hypercars, not only are they ridiculously high performers, but i'd say people will buy just about anything Ferrari, Porsche and McLaren will build when it comes to these types of machines. there is no question that you're getting the best possible car any of those manufacturers can produce. their reputation is well founded and legendary, there will never be the question of, "how will this car stack up"? they can charge whatever they want. whether it's $1,000,000 or $5,000,000 there will always be a market for those cars from the Italians, Germans and Brits...
 
The update

After the recent flurry of new info, I followed up with the NSX Specialist to see what news he has.

He had not heard about the $20K incentive through Jan 3, 2019 on in stock cars but it did not surprise him.

Goofy that Acura intended to BTO only for 2018 but allowed dealers to put cars on the floor and then gives them an incentive to help move the cars they probably shouldn't have ordered.

We already knew about the new color, orange for 2019 and he believes there will be a new interior color but did not have it. It will be announced soon.

Acura pulled an interior out of a current car and put the new interior bits in it. He was invited to go have a look and he will do so soon.

He seems to believe the HP boost being discussed is real.

One guy took his Gen 2 car to McD's, did the drive through and then someone drove into his door. What we learned is that if a current owner needs a body part in short supply, Acura will delay building a in production car to get the current owner back on the road quickly.

There is not target run duration for the car. There is a 20 year target for parts support. Parts like gaskets/seals that will age if left uncovered are packaged in a sealed manner.

One fighter has a Gen 2 with after market exhaust and some pipes. The car is throwing some codes, the dealer wouldn't touch the car due to the aftermarket stuff and the Specialist is trying to intervene to assist the VIP.

I mentioned there is a crap load of new merchandise. He said he got no heads up of it coming out. One guy has been trying to get one of those chairs, but he wanted the full semi-aniline version, but the factory did not have a spare full leather seat yet. The item was envisioned only with alcantara.

One guy wanted to buy a GT3 car and the Specialist connected him with HPD, no info if the guy ordered one.

The targa and vert are not happening. With the volume the car is doing, Honda is not interested in extra investments. Plus they would have to pay a million dollar safety crash test fee.
 
B&B, As usual, thanks for the updates. Interesting info. The demise of the targa & vert is not at all surprising and their disinterest makes sense. One thing that stands out is that the updates they plan to release do not seem to have any tangible relevance to significantly increasing interest in the car. Sorry. I do find the 20 year parts support to be fascinating. Though I wonder if they would really bother if the car meets an early termination in say 2-3 years.
 
The update

After the recent flurry of new info, I followed up with the NSX Specialist to see what news he has.

He had not heard about the $20K incentive through Jan 3, 2019 on in stock cars but it did not surprise him.

Goofy that Acura intended to BTO only for 2018 but allowed dealers to put cars on the floor and then gives them an incentive to help move the cars they probably shouldn't have ordered.

We already knew about the new color, orange for 2019 and he believes there will be a new interior color but did not have it. It will be announced soon.

Acura pulled an interior out of a curren and put the new interior bits in it. He was invited to go have a look and he will do so soon.

He seems to believe the HP boost being discussed is real.quote



Has there been any info on retroactive hp gains being made available to 17/18 cars - eg a plug-in tune from Acura?
 
Last edited:
I had that question in my mind during the conversation but since he had no real details on what is coming, I held up.

Bugatti does retrofitting to bring previous cars up to revised specs.

I kinda doubt Honda will but once the details are released, I will certainly ask the question.

The update

After the recent flurry of new info, I followed up with the NSX Specialist to see what news he has.

He had not heard about the $20K incentive through Jan 3, 2019 on in stock cars but it did not surprise him.

Goofy that Acura intended to BTO only for 2018 but allowed dealers to put cars on the floor and then gives them an incentive to help move the cars they probably shouldn't have ordered.

We already knew about the new color, orange for 2019 and he believes there will be a new interior color but did not have it. It will be announced soon.

Acura pulled an interior out of a curren and put the new interior bits in it. He was invited to go have a look and he will do so soon.

He seems to believe the HP boost being discussed is real.quote



Has there been any info on retroactive hp gains being made available to 17/18 cars - eg a plug-in tune from Acura?
 
yuuuup. $20k is back. i think it applies to any 2018, not just ones currently on the ground.

i'm waiting for confirmation. as usual, acura bulletins are clear as mud.
 
yuuuup. $20k is back. i think it applies to any 2018, not just ones currently on the ground.

i'm waiting for confirmation. as usual, acura bulletins are clear as mud.

I may be confused as to what the Honda associate Build to Order Purchase Plan is then. I figured that meant BTO cars were excluded but maybe it is a program I don't know about?
 
Honda/Acura employees (associate) who BTO a car are not eligible for the $20k. If they take an in-stock NSX, then they're eligible.
 
I had that question in my mind during the conversation but since he had no real details on what is coming, I held up.

Bugatti does retrofitting to bring previous cars up to revised specs.

I kinda doubt Honda will but once the details are released, I will certainly ask the question.

Sounds good!

I think McLaren retrofitted some of their cars with extra power too
 
Dejavu anyone? It still blows me away that we’re still having the same would be, could be conversations here about the gen 2. It’s a neat car, not a protege to the gen 1, and has been swirling around the drain since day 1. These threads do bring back my memories though... Honestly, when it first dropped and you had a few dozen would be gen 1 owners at expo with Interest in the car, Acura wouldn’t let anyone even sit in the car. Did they think they would place huge deposits on this car? Really, not sure who’s head is up who’s ass at this point and I do not care. You can have all the jet set analysts head this one, but the proof is in the puddin’
 
Last edited:
Decided to run the numbers again and recreate the monthly sales chart I did in a previous post. Some interesting information to be found there.

First, here is my old chart which shows sales shortly after the launch of NSX2. While they numbers were a bit low, really they weren't that far off from other vehicles in the market segment and to be honest I took this to be a good sign.
NSX-sales2018-2.jpg
View attachment 154773

Fast forward to recent sales and the more disturbing trend shows up:
View attachment 154774
NSX-sales2018-1.jpg
As you can see, the NSX has lagged significantly behind the German cars and struggles to keep up with the GTR (its about 200 cars behind). The real winner though is the Mercedes which is doing spectacular in the segment. A better graph to show just how much the Benz is doing is to isolate the 2018 model year
View attachment 154775
NSX-sales2018-3.jpg

So what is going on here? I'd say there are a few things:

Price
Base price is too high for the Acura NSX and should have been between $110k-130k. The community knew it and said so, but I believe Acura highly underestimated how much their brand has deteriorated and priced their car apples to apples against the competition rather than including a significant market discount for the front badge. That is a bitter pill to swallow, but an important one not to ignore. Given the specs of the NSX2.0, it certainly warrants the $158 MSRP compared to its competitors specs, but that isn't how the game is played. Furthermore, the competition has lower entry points. Not surprisingly the Benz shines here with its entry price of $112k, but if you look closely at the numbers you can see why the NSX is priced where it is. The image below shows the story, the "base" model of the NSX is considerably stronger than the other bas versions and more on par with the top trim vehicles and the price reflects that. As much as that is logical, it isn't helping their sales numbers. The real problem is the lack of a cheaper NSX and that leads to the next key point - limited options. It is also worth pointing out that Nissan includes a significant "badge discount" and offers you a ton of power for a lot less money than the German brands. While that seems to help it to out perform the NSX, even value alone isn't overcoming the badge stigma.

NSX-Competition.jpg

Lack of Options

There is pretty much just one NSX in a small selection of colors and the ability to either toggle carbon fiber on or off. This is a dramatic departure from their competition which offers significantly more colors and options - most notably a less expensive, less powerful version. This is easy to understand if you realize that Audi and Mercedes are luxury brands whereas Acura would do well to acknowledge that they are a premium brand. The crossover in materials for your Performance Car when you have a lineup of sedans and SUVs that sell for over $100k is vast. When your sedans and SUVs are only pulling price tags at half that price you are really stuck. So Mercedes and Audi CAN offer a wider variety of options and not get crushed on manufacturing costs whereas for the NSX to do so comes at a very high price tag! A similar story trickles all the way down the line.
I have no doubt that Honda/Acura accountants were well aware of that when they put the brakes on vehicle options, I just hope they also computed the dramatic effect that would have on sale numbers as well.

This car is designed to lose money and it needs to lose more
I am sure that Acura already knew they were going to lose money on this car, but I think they under estimated just how much money they SHOULD lose on this car. Acura let their brand slip for nearly 20 years and buying that brand image back is going to be expensive. In the 90s, when someone said "Acura" you probably first thought "Integra". The Integra was a great car which stood head and shoulders over the Civic and was widely regarded as one of the best (if not THE best) sporty cars. If you say "Acura" now, people's first thought is "MDX - a great budget SUV with nice features".

If they want to get back on track and truly become the luxury brand they advertise to be a fabulous car like the NSX is a good start. The upgraded RDX is a solid follow up too. They need to keep going though - either commit to starting a journey or don't even bother starting and stick with just being a Premium brand. A nice, less expensive option to the true luxury brands like Mercedes or Audi. If they want to commit, double down on the NSX and do what it takes to get back in the marketplace in the time honored fashion - give people more than they pay for.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top