Remote reservoir dampers. What's your experience with noise?

[CL65 Captain]

LOL... its just a phase I am going through. First puberty, then mid-life crises, and now the desire to get a bunch of race parts. I was actually considering Movit Ceramics until Ravi saved me with an add for a new set of Stoptechs.

I'll be at the racetrack like those dudes that show up at the driving range with a set of $5000 golf clubs, then hit the side fence with their shot. Stylin' it's called.

Everyone I know with ceramics that tracks their car pulls them and installs steel rotors. Ceramics are great for true racing, but 30 min HPDEs aren't necessary. Not to mention, the replacement costs of rotors are out of this world. Plus, ceramics are bad on the street as they require heat to work well.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Everyone I know with ceramics that tracks their car pulls them and installs steel rotors. Ceramics are great for true racing, but 30 min HPDEs aren't necessary. Not to mention, the replacement costs of rotors are out of this world. Plus, ceramics are bad on the street as they require heat to work well.

They are MUCH lighter, and you probably never have to replace the rotors (at least not even remotely as soon as steel ones) so the cost is somewhat irrelavent.

I agree it's overkill, the best brakes are probably the ones Billy uses, the PF BBK with the 4 pad setup. But Movit Ceramics? Come on.... Stylin' Jim, you just don't get it. :tongue:

 

[CL65 Captain]

With street use you will never have to replace them, track use you WILL and they are $$$$$ to replace. I think they are close to a couple grand per rotor.

The PF setup uses steel rotors.

 

[biscuits]

They are MUCH lighter, and you probably never have to replace the rotors (at least not even remotely as soon as steel ones) so the cost is somewhat irrelavent.

I agree it's overkill, the best brakes are probably the ones Billy uses, the PF BBK with the 4 pad setup. But Movit Ceramics? Come on.... Stylin' Jim, you just don't get it. :tongue:

Oh good, now you're installing racing brakes you don't need so you can come on here and bitch about how they squeak and squeal like your suspension does because your confused as to whether you're building a track car or a date car that's a poser.

You need to decide what you want this car to do. I'm completly dumbfoundied that you're surprised that all these racing modifications you're doing to your car are negatively affecting its daily driving poise.

 

[RYU]

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

Cheap Asian Coilovers ftw! i kid, i kid

 

[CL65 Captain]

Seriously Dave, what you need to do is buy a salvaged title NSX and transfer over all your goodies and make it a track car. What you are.trying to do with your 05 is turn it into a 458 or Mclarren and as you can see it's not possible as the factory spent hundreds of millions making a super car that minimized all the compromises that you are now dealing with.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Oh good, now you're installing racing brakes you don't need so you can come on here and bitch about how they squeak and squeal like your suspension does because your confused as to whether you're building a track car or a date car that's a poser.

You need to decide what you want this car to do. I'm completly dumbfoundied that you're surprised that all these racing modifications you're doing to your car are negatively affecting its daily driving poise.

Bro why don't you cool it a bit with the negativity, I'm not a kid here and because I joke around and make fun of things including things I do, it doesn't give you permission to start talking to me like this. I probably know a lot more about this car than you do, so unless you have something positive to add I ask that at least you refrain from borderline insulting me.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Seriously Dave, what you need to do is buy a salvaged title NSX and transfer over all your goodies and make it a track car. What you are.trying to do with your 05 is turn it into a 458 or Mclarren and as you can see it's not possible as the factory spent hundreds of millions making a super car that minimized all the compromises that you are now dealing with.

Jim I have to tell you I had a long drive today, and short of the squeak these KW's are nothing short of amazing. I simply cannot believe how the car has transformed. It feels like a different car!!! Seriously it is that big of a difference. It just feels extremely planted and sure footed to a whole new level. The ride feels no worse right now than a stock car on Bilsteins. And the overall handling and responsiveness... Just waaaay beyond the limits of what I've been able to test on the street. I have an autoX Saturday and a 2 day track event on the 17th, can't wait. Knowing the squeak is normal, it really doesn't bother me much now. Plus as Dave suggested I will try playing with the settings.

If I had to do this all over again, I would still do it in a second.

 

[TURBO2GO]

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

Cheap Asian Coilovers ftw! i kid, i kid

LOL... Hey so what do you think of shad not caring much about meth or even an intercooler on 1K2GO's car? It kind of goes against all this worrying about heat soak on the CTSC.

 

[RYU]

remind me please what did you upgrade from? (in terms of dampers)

was it a set of Teins?

LOL... Hey so what do you think of shad not caring much about meth or even an intercooler on 1K2GO's car? It kind of goes against all this worrying about heat soak on the CTSC.

Hey, i'm not derailing your thread this time!

The 2.3L will run cooler but I suspect 1K2GO's car will still heat soak at around 160-170degs on a warm/hot day (better than 200+ on a 1.7L on high boost though!). To push that kind of HP you need the volume and it's a known fact that a bigger blower will run cooler IATs but also at the expense of more parasitic drag. Just like your damper situation now.. it's all a trade-off.

I'm hoping he posts IATs soon. I think Shad knows it'll heat soak a little bit but he's also interested in packaging that kit retail so I'm sure he's concerned about total costs too. I just hope they've got that F/IC dialed in to compensate for all conditions or else.. it'll probably end up like Batmans. I hope not though! Very promising info on that thread!

 

[TURBO2GO]

remind me please what did you upgrade from? (in terms of dampers)

was it a set of Teins?

I upgraded from OEM.

 

[biscuits]

Bro why don't you cool it a bit with the negativity, I'm not a kid here and because I joke around and make fun of things including things I do, it doesn't give you permission to start talking to me like this. I probably know a lot more about this car than you do, so unless you have something positive to add I ask that at least you refrain from borderline insulting me.

Bro, sorry I spoke the truth in a way that doesn't make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside but for someone who supposedly knows more about this car than I do you sure do ask a lot of questions that anybody who has modded a car extensively would already know the answers to.

Howabout this? You're suspension squeaks because it was built for racing and squeaking wasn't a huge concern of the manufacturer.

 

[RYU]

I upgraded from OEM.

i'll be honest. A good set of dampers like KW V3, DG-5s, JRZs, will probably have you just as elated w/o all the side-effects you're having with your $10k set.

I'm also equally as infatuated with my DG-5s every time I go out for a drive in them. I'm sure KW V3 ppl and JRZ RS owners are the same. Just sayin...

 

[TURBO2GO]

Bro, sorry I spoke the truth in a way that doesn't make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside but for someone who supposedly knows more about this car than I do you sure do ask a lot of questions that anybody who has modded a car extensively would already know the answers to.

Howabout this? You're suspension squeaks because it was built for racing and squeaking wasn't a huge concern of the manufacturer.

Yeah if you know so much about noise on these dampers then you should have posted. All you are doing is repeating what I posted already. And if you don't think I should ask about the noise on this thread, just move to another one. You are acting as if everyone knows already, and my thread is dumb when the reality is only a handful of people have this type of damper and the only one here that really knows it is Billy Johnson. I am posting my conversations with KW to add value to the thread and help the next guy. Go do a search on this forum and see how many threads you can find about using 3 way adjustable dampers. I am posting stuff for the first time probably few know about, and that is the value of the tread. If you want to police threads there are a whole host of useless ones you can go after instead of mine.

 

[TURBO2GO]

i'll be honest. A good set of dampers like KW V3, DG-5s, JRZs, will probably have you just as elated w/o all the side-effects you're having with your $10k set.

I'm also equally as infatuated with my DG-5s every time I go out for a drive in them. I'm sure KW V3 ppl and JRZ RS owners are the same. Just sayin...

Ryu, how do you know? Have you been in a car with these? Because I can tell you Billy or Ravi who have first hand experience with these would disagree with you completely. I seriously doubt a set of V3's sitting on 1000 pound springs would ride like OEM's on Bilsteins. I've been in cars with various coilovers, they aren't like this at all.

The noise isn't that bad, I am a bit particular. If there is something I can do to get rid of it, I want to know. If there isn't, it's probably nothing anyone else would complain about.

 

[RYU]

Well im definitely not in any mood to debate it with you. As long as you're happy who cares what we think

 

[CL65 Captain]

Ryu, how do you know? Have you been in a car with these? Because I can tell you Billy or Ravi who have first hand experience with these would disagree with you completely. I seriously doubt a set of V3's sitting on 1000 pound springs would ride like OEM's on Bilsteins. I've been in cars with various coilovers, they aren't like this at all.

The noise isn't that bad, I am a bit particular. If there is something I can do to get rid of it, I want to know. If there isn't, it's probably nothing anyone else would complain about.

Yes and no. First off, the KW v3 would have to be revalved to handle high spring rates. I think what RYU was trying to say is the clubsport type coilovers like the jrz rs and Moton CS can deliver 90% for 1/2 the cost and without the street manner compromise.

Just like audio, the law of deminishing returns applies and you have to pay big to get that last 10%. And unfortunately in this case it also comes with some noise.


However, I think if you increase the low speed compression you might be able to minimized it.

 

[Honcho]

i'll be honest. A good set of dampers like KW V3, DG-5s, JRZs, will probably have you just as elated w/o all the side-effects you're having with your $10k set.

I'm also equally as infatuated with my DG-5s every time I go out for a drive in them. I'm sure KW V3 ppl and JRZ RS owners are the same. Just sayin...

Then I probably should not mention my BCR's here. They are Cheap Asian Coilovers, so they must be garbage, right Ryu? Though, my cheap BCR monoball mounts are silent... I hope you can make it to XPO. I'd really appreciate your track impression of them.

 

[CL65 Captain]

Then I probably should not mention my BCR's here. They are Cheap Asian Coilovers, so they must be garbage, right Ryu?

I can't comment on the BCR since I haven't driven them. HOWEVER, the design characteristics of high end coilovers like JRZ, Penske, Moton, KW, Olins, etc are different than others..... they use very large piston rods and high pressure nitrogen to give a MUCH, MUCH smoother ride and better track performance. It's apples to oranges. We aren't even talking about build quality, but about the design and the adjustable range. JRZ & Motons for example can run anything from a 200# spring to 1000# without having to revalve.

Though, my cheap BCR monoball mounts are silent...

Hopefully, they stay that way. Knock on wood. Usually, what happens is they start that way and over time start wearing as the bearings used in the monoballs are cheaper with greater tolerances which eventually leads to increased wear and noise.

I have a fake SS Datejust Rolex that is beautiful. Made in China and not one of the "Canal St" specials but a really good copy with an Asian clone of a Swiss ETA movement. It looks perfect and practically indistinguishable from my real Datejust, and runs better too +/- 2 sec a day vs +/- 7 for the real one. But I highly doubt that 20 years from now it will still be running, where my Rolex bought in 1987 is still going strong.

 

[TURBO2GO]

You know what's a bit odd is the KW manual suggests using a mountain bike pump to get 150 PSI in the cannisters if Nitrogen is not available. I can just see myself at the track with a hand pump LOL...

 

[RYU]

Then I probably should not mention my BCR's here. They are Cheap Asian Coilovers, so they must be garbage, right Ryu? Though, my cheap BCR monoball mounts are silent... I hope you can make it to XPO. I'd really appreciate your track impression of them.

I would love to try them out one day. None of us, except for Billy, are professional race car drivers. Our car is a point of enjoyment so i'm a firm believer in 'ignorance is bliss' when it comes to these things. I won't be at XPO this year

I can't comment on the BCR since I haven't driven them. HOWEVER, the design characteristics of high end coilovers like JRZ, Penske, Moton, KW, Olins, etc are different than others..... they use very large piston rods and high pressure nitrogen to give a MUCH, MUCH smoother ride and better track performance. It's apples to oranges. We aren't even talking about build quality, but about the design and the adjustable range. JRZ & Motons for example can run anything from a 200# spring to 1000# without having to revalve.



Hopefully, they stay that way. Knock on wood. Usually, what happens is they start that way and over time start wearing as the bearings used in the monoballs are cheaper with greater tolerances which eventually leads to increased wear and noise.

I have a fake SS Datejust Rolex that is beautiful. Made in China and not one of the "Canal St" specials but a really good copy with an Asian clone of a Swiss ETA movement. It looks perfect and practically indistinguishable from my real Datejust, and runs better too +/- 2 sec a day vs +/- 7 for the real one. But I highly doubt that 20 years from now it will still be running, where my Rolex bought in 1987 is still going strong.

Let's not open the can of worms on the coilover debate again.

I think what RYU was trying to say is the clubsport type coilovers like the jrz rs and Moton CS can deliver 90% for 1/2 the cost and without the street manner compromise.

Basically yes, but i'd include DG-5s in your list as a cheaper, high quality, alternative

You know what's a bit odd is the KW manual suggests using a mountain bike pump to get 150 PSI in the cannisters if Nitrogen is not available. I can just see myself at the track with a hand pump LOL...

This perfectly sums up why so many things is a compromise. In this case, you're willing to install the "ultimate" dampers but you don't see yourself make the adjustments necessary to make them work to it's full extent as well as not happy with certain side-effects like the squishing noises. You're like a walking contradiction and I don't mean to be an a-hole cuz i'm the same way sometimes.

This is how I felt about the KW V3s for example. The 350# seem too soft for me and i'm not good enough to know how to adjust the compression vs. rebound given it's dually adjustable damping feature so I decided they weren't for me. I don't think they're a bad damper at all for it's design purpose. Price is a different story but let's not go there in this thread. Though they've actually become cheaper!

 

[TURBO2GO]

You're like a walking contradiction and I don't mean to be an a-hole cuz i'm the same way sometimes.

This is how I felt about the KW V3s for example. The 350# seem too soft for me and i'm not good enough to know how to adjust the compression vs. rebound given it's dually adjustable damping feature so I decided they weren't for me. I don't think they're a bad damper at all for it's design purpose. Price is a different story but let's not go there in this thread. Though they've actually become cheaper!

Ryu, we disagree on damper philosophy, and there is nothing I am "not willing to adjust" like you are saying. I really don't know what you are talking about specifically, but if it's about the pump I will tell you that it needs a lot less attention than your tires. If that is a big deal to you, it isnt to me. If you are talking about compression/rebound adjustment, I am very happy it is all here and one way or another I will learn it. In 6 months to a year I will know more about this than everyone short of Billy or some hardcore track guys with experience on these particular dampers. I am excited to experiment and learn the behavior.

I usually like to post in the track section because the input I normally get is more concise and about my question, not about why I bought these or what my personality is like. I hope the next few posts can just be about dampers and nothing else.

 

[RYU]

Bygones... Hope you didn't take offense.

I'd love to get out on the track with you .. I think that'll be a lot of fun regardless of outcome.

 

[TURBO2GO]

I'd love to get out on the track with you .. I think that'll be a lot of fun regardless of outcome.

That's not a problem but I will outrun you everytime and it will be because of these dampers. Then you'll be eating your words. :smile:

 

[RYU]

That's not a problem but I will outrun you everytime and it will be because of these dampers. Then you'll be eating your words. :smile:

Them's fightin' words! Challenge accepted! :biggrin: