Where are all the Production deliveries ??

The NSX is a GOOD CAR but it does have some deadly sins.

1) American Honda tried too hard to give the NSX the 2009-17 Acura sedan design philosophy(Beak and rounded rear fascia) that hurt it's looks(front and rear fascia). That exterior design is in the top 10 ten of the worse exterior design in auto history(per auto reporters).

2) Took some easy manufacture routes over good looks(vents on the hood). Just look at any Racing GT that needs cooling or air outlet on the front hood(smooth NACA aero profile).

3) Not hitting the magic PR horsepower number........600. 573 hp was ok in 2010 but not in 2017.

4)Not enough color choices and interior choices.

Being Hybrid wasn't a deadly sin but using the same system(73hp) in the 60k RLX in the 150-200k NSX was just crazy! It should of been 150hp.
The eSH-AWD was before it's time but they just went too conservative.(everybody is now working on a copy)
 
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^ I hated looking at the scoops on the hood while driving the Nsx. They looked like eye floaters that wouldn’t go away.:biggrin:
But then again, I don’t like scooped hoods on my NA1 so whatever. Lol.
 
To the Japanese the American Muscle Cars.... are WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!! To Them the Muscle Car is the most Exotic car.

The NSX was designed at the Tokyo Design Center under Toshinoba Minami(Ext.) and Yoshinori Asahi(Int.) drawing design clues from the American Muscle Car(NA American Market was planned to be it's main market).
Autonews.com story on June 11, 2012
Then it was passed over to the LA Design Center to finish and make more Acura like.

100% fact in which herein lies the inherent problem. It was Minami's originally penning that caused this irreparable predicament that lost a lot of existing US marketshare. What Minami thought would be gold is not revered in the USA like it is there. A proper designer would not have designed to what he or she likes or gets excited about (that's an artist), but rather designed to what sells for the targeted demographic plain and simple. After spending many summers in Japan I can attest to this phenomenon that 40-55 year olds there grew up being obsessed with American culture...that was our hay day to them-Levi's, Elvis, Harley's, Michael Jackson, Cindy Crawford, McDonald's, Brooke Shields, etc. But the sobering reality is this...if Americans want American muscle, guess what Acura, they will buy an American-made muscle car...not a Japanese car (or any other foreign built) that gets its inspiration/influence from American muscle cars.

To contrast, the simple brilliance of what Okuyama did with the first gen was take his inspirational lines from what was highly coveted back then, but unobtainable to many (the Italians machines). It was akin to Prometheus stealing fire from the gods and giving it to mere mortals. Minami did the opposite, he took fire we already had and tried to repackage it, and so far it hasn't worked (c'est la vie 3 units).

Um...then how come Michelle Christensen is officially credited with the NSX 2.0 design in all the Honda marketing materials and PR outreach...?

That is all it really is...just PR to go in tandem with more PR-like jargon i.e. being eco-green, affordable luxury, yada-yada. I think they thought Michelle would be a good fit because the story goes "she grew up in her father's garage and developed a love for classic American muscle" so the decision-makers at large probably felt confident she would carry the torch from the fire Minami had started [LINK] to fruition. And she did exactly what she was supposed to do to give credit where credit is due. And sales today are not a result of her doing imo, nor marketing entirely for that matter either, instead it boils down to the fact that you just can't fix a flawed concept: a design intended to express American muscle reproduced, as interpreted w/Japanese taste (vs just simply expressing its Gen 1 predecessor) no matter how hard you try. If Minami's concept was right, this car should at least be flying off the shelves in Japan...but it's not...because to them it is not authentic American. So a double-shot to the foot.

As their Global Creative Director at Honda/Honda's Executive Designer/Global Exterior Design Leader to name a few titles, who was entirely responsible for a look that would sell, it was on him to fully grasp how the brand game has played out in the states, and to have realized that Americans in todays market are still very interested in "affordable Italian"...not repackaged American nor overt deviation from its predecessor en masse. You might also find it interesting to know that it was him who insisted on keeping the beak on their lineup during those years where they lost traction.

You don't see similarities to this?

muscle-comparo.jpg

I see it gobble, for me it centers around one distinct feature of the cars' face—in addition to the thin, slit headlights they both have, they share a particular feature that defines a vehicle style category–hung headlights (discussed here) i.e. giving the appearance that the hood line is above the headlights (typical American muscle car). Which is archetypically not how traditional exotics (lambo, ferrari, lotus, porsche, etc.) are done (wedge-shaped w/headlights above the hood line). But hey, given what Mogami posted above about wanting to reproduce American Muscle, how could we have expected anything else? For me personally, the hybrid does not steer me away, nor does the price (w/incentives), it simply boils down to looks and without homage to the original (which paid homage to the Italians), and instead Minami's concept paying homage to American muscle just doesn't work for me; so I don't find myself having any intention of getting one unfortunately as much as I wanted to add another NSX to my garage.

As an aside while reading this thread, it should be mentioned that there is a very distinct difference between assessing the car itself vs. assessing the bigger picture which is the Acura brand and their entire business model. On one hand the NSX is a truly unique and phenomenal car that offers an unbeatable value proposition at an unbeatable price (w/the incentives) without question. All those that acquired one and love them are a very select, fortunate group. But they are on the outskirts of the bell curve and in no way reflective of the market for this category of vehicle (c'est la vie 3 units). For anyone that owns one and loves it, that is an entirely separate matter which consequently does not make the car (which is after all a product of a business model) immune to any outside criticism. I for one want to see Acura succeed, by not only dominating in mid-luxury SUV's, but I would also like to see them be more desirable than Lexus and Infinity in the sedans category. And ultimately, I would just love to see them be the most desirable Japanese supercar, and it's no newsflash that presently they are not.

Acura is not winning a lot of battles right now nor winning the mid-luxury class wars below the Beamers and above the Avalons (however they are waging war with SUV sales). Their stubbornness around a decade ago of not listening to public feedback regarding the look (in particular the beak grill) cost them billions and resulted in losing major ground in this niche category they used to be doing much better in. They will have to claw aggressively to get back the lost years and the new grill (which consequently is inspired after King Abdullah's Financial District Metro Station located in Riyadi, Saudi Arabia) is their latest attempt to rebrand and gain marketshare. Well, we shall see...

grill_concept.jpg
 
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i'm wondering if looking for comparisons find some other pics than gray NSX (obviously not the bset pics) car sitting inside a dealership
IMO the new car is much more exotic looking than the old gen.
also 458 > 488
one of the great features of the car is the flying buttresses. few cars have them. they should have made them more pronounced (i like big buttresses and i cannot lie). the ones on the ford gt are more visible. you can barely see the ones on the nsx.

F430 > 458/88. too many sharp creases on the newer F-cars.
 
It attracts a large crowd every single day of the week in the Nissan Showroom in Ginza. It was designed by Shiro Nakamura to be 100% Japanese and resemble RX-93 Gundam. It doesn't try to copy anyone, it always does it's own thing and it has the street cred other cars wish they had. NSX 2.0 has the severe, apparently irreversible sales problem--R35 sales are up 30% year on year...⚡

I've been to that showroom (very amazing and futuristic) and I knew Nakamura was inspired by Gundam for R35, but I had no idea it was specifically the RX-93...interesting.
 
Fair point, sorry to misrepresent you.

no worries mate, just making sure what i'm saying isn't misunderstood or misconstrued. certain Primers like to do that if anything but praise isn't lavished on the car. even in a thread discussing sales numbers, or lack thereof.

and as i have said, literally dozens of times, i like the car. i've driven it, thrashed it, cruised in it. it's a very nice car, i prefer it to some of its competitors. and to be completely honest, i never thought it would get down to selling three a month. i knew it wouldn't sell in R8 numbers, but i'm shocked that it's selling in single digits each month (apparently even with big incentives). and even more shocked that an 11-year old Nissan is outselling the new NSX by huge margins, 10 times plus.

as several other posters have stated in the last page or two, there is a myriad of reasons for the failure of the NSX to sell. there have literally been 100 excuses
for the lack of success of the NSX. however, the only fact of the matter is that Acura didn't build a car many people want to buy.

it's a shame, i'd imagine everybody expected a lot more. it's a bigger shame, as Acura/Honda have done in the past, that they won't be doing anything to remedy it. one can only wonder what the next few months will hold, and if the year will end with a month or two of zero NSX's sold. at this current trend, it's looking very likely...
 
That is probably the worst NSX photo I have ever seen - the dark caves in the wheel wells and the weird shadows over the car are not flattering (or representative)

That's the photo I took after driving two hours to look at one. That's what it looks like in person. Very underwhelming.

I was in Beverly Hills two weeks ago and stopped at Ferrari, Lamborghini, McLaren/Koenigsegg and Pagani. At each of those dealerships I said WOW every time I turned my head. Looking at the new NSX in person was more like "that's it? eh."

Anyway the market has clearly spoken on this disaster. Time to look for something else.
 
I was in Beverly Hills two weeks ago and stopped at Ferrari, Lamborghini, McLaren/Koenigsegg and Pagani. At each of those dealerships I said WOW every time I turned my head. Looking at the new NSX in person was more like "that's it? eh."

And every single one of those cars were how much more than the NSX? How many were how much more than MULTIPLE NSXs? That's not making an apples to apples comparison. You clearly don't like the car, but between Camaros and Paganis you're being a bit ridiculous.
 
When the first gen car came out I got that WOW reaction when seeing one at the dealer. I still do on the rare occasion I see one. I remember the first time I saw one, it was behind red ropes at a dealership the no longer exists. I wanted it so bad but wasn't even old enough to drive. Why didn't they try for that with this one? Some of these MSRP at $210k, should be some wow factor at that price.
 
I agree. When I first saw the gen 1 Nsx as a pre teen and heard the sounds it made I told myself I MUST HAVE ONE. Fast forward 25 years, I got the rare opportunity to drive a fresh new Nsx in 2016 without limit thanks to chrisn who I never see here anymore. The car left me numb and didn’t create the love affair it did long ago. I could’ve walked away from it even with 140k burning a hole in my pocket. Times change, people change, the nostalgia of the Nsx Definately changed. I wanted to love it, but current price tag is a huge turn off. Even priced at 140k I think is quite a stretch for Acura. One thing I will say is the comfort level and ease of use is spot on. The car just needs some refreshing here and there. But unfortunately, Acura will probably slap an A badge on the front big enough for Run Dmc in the near future as they do not seem to understand astetics and marketing.
 
A guy I know was interested in NSX 2.0 but he is going to get an Aston instead.
His reason is he doesn't want to buy a car that has an image problem. He feels he will need to "explain"
his NSX 2.0 to his peers whereas the Aston speaks for itself...
 
...fragile egos need not apply.....:wink:
 
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Maybe Honda should include the models in their delivered tally. It's a quick way to double the US delivery count.

IMG_E3799.jpg
 
Check out this post from 2012 on the VTEC forums...this guy predicted the future:notyper wrote: I'll say it unequivocably right here, draw a line in the sand so to speak - the green approach on a high end sports/sporty car is a huge mistake. It will cost sales and hurt profits. It will do nothing to improve's Acura's image as a premium car maker and provide no basis for Honda/Acura to develop an ongoing premium sports model that can be developed for many generations. The decision makers at Honda are operating based upon assumptions about the market that were relevant 5 years ago. They are not being predictive but _reactive_. The impetus that pushed the market towards superficially "green" cars is already waning. In another 5 years the regulatory push towards the same will fade. Honda needs to improve their strategic planning folks in a hurry. SC
That post from Gondo89, Mogami and vf2ss clearly summarize the entire debacle that is the NSX. These posts outline the multitude of missteps that Acura has taken and likely will not address or fix. Too bad cause I had wanted to add a new NSX to my collection.
 
...fragile egos not apply.....:wink:

Exactly. If you're afraid that you're going to have to explain the car to everyone, then this isn't the car for you. Heck, the 1st gen NSX isn't for you, either. This ain't for a brand snob worried about their "image," it's for someone who understands the car and enjoys what it brings to the table. I've had a few snide comments from people (an Airman at the local Air Force Base gate said "you actually bought one of these?") but like 99.99% of the people who see it in person absolutely love it. I got much worse comments in my NA2 car from haters than I have in this one.

As has been said many times, if they slapped a prancing horse on the hood it'd be selling like hotcakes at a much higher price.
 
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everyone is quoting my sad grammar...:redface:....but you got the point...:smile:
 
As has been said many times, if they slapped a prancing horse on the hood it'd be selling like hotcakes at a much higher price.

Ferrari wouldn't and hasn't built that car. if Ferrari had built something similar, it would look, drive, and sound nothing like the NSX currently does. there's no comparison between a Japanese car and an Italian one. so that statement is completely invalid.

me personally, with the hybrid tech and a $200,000 price tag, if it matched the other $200,000 cars, i'd buy one. but the overall opinion seems to be, no one thinks it's worth the money...
 
Ego, is the reason why we persue perfection and push forward with technology. That’s the whole entire point of buying a car placed above a class of people who may not or cannot afford it. Did anyone get the memo sent out on Monday?
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but never in automotive history has a major manufacturer taken a model that's moving 3 units per month and invested more in it? I'm not sure how anything other than a software upgrade gets justified at this point, from a pure economics standpoint. And different variants, like a Targa, Convertible or Type R--about as likely as Ford coming out with a new Yamaha-powered Taurus SHO...
 
People who buy Acuras in general are less concerned about image. If I were worried about what people at the country club thought, I’d buy a Ferrari and not worry about EITHER NSX, first or second gen. I’d have a tri-star or a roundel on my daily driver rather than an upside-down Honda “H”.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but never in automotive history has a major manufacturer taken a model that's moving 3 units per month and invested more in it? I'm not sure how anything other than a software upgrade gets justified at this point, from a pure economics standpoint. And different variants, like a Targa, Convertible or Type R--about as likely as Ford coming out with a new Yamaha-powered Taurus SHO...


I think someone (BricksandBio maybe) in another thread stated no targa or convertible.


I believe you maybe correct regarding Honda lacking appetite to invest anymore in the car. It will suffer a similar fate as the CR-Z.

All this negativity regarding the new NSX is fairly overwhelming and is mirrored by the dreadful sales numbers. I wonder if those who work on the car actually read any of what we post? I'm sure they aren't allowed to comment but it would seem a curiosity if potential customers nag, would they respond?
 
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What I would do to it for MMC(2021).

Smaller front grill openings(add a few more inches to the front length.....better smoother looks and aero)
New hood vents(clues from Ferrari California T)
Get rid of the TLX rear fascia(more wild looking diffuser and exhaust)
Add more color choices
More interior choices
Bore engine to 3.7L(600hp)
Raise TMU power to 150hp and power front wheels up to a min. 150 mph

For 2019.
50 more ICE hp would help.
TMU powering to 150 MPH

For 2020.
Type-R would be nice!!!! :)
ICE 600hp
Rear eMotor 100 hp
Get rid of front TMU
Active aero
3300 lb curb weight
 
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Mogami, Nice thoughts. Some of those changes might make people take pause and re-look at the NSX. But the reality is that I sincerely doubt that Acura will do 1/10th of what you listed. Also, I fear that it will be too little too late....
 
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