Tsunami Pictures

I guess it would be a huge effort to install a warning system that works when a Tsunami of this scale occurs. Imagine, it was a seaquake of 9.0 magnitude and the flood waves traveled not only in the Bay of Bengal but also to East Africa (which is about 5,000 kilometers away from the epicenter!) killing hundreds in Somalia and Kenia. There would have been dozens of countries to warn - some with nearly no communication infrastructure that would have been sufficient to reach tourists at the beaches.

The travel speed of the Tsunami in open see is reported here to be close to 1,000 km per hour - so they would have had only 5 hours to warn the people in Africa in the middle of the night. This may work in the Pacific region between Japan and the U.S. west coast but you're on another infrastructure level there.

Death toll in Asia and Africa could rise to 100,000 overall - including tourists from America, Europe and elsewhere - this is a global catastrophe and requires the biggest help effort in the history of mankind. Although I'm sure a warning system could have saved the lives of some thousands.
 
it's not that difficult of a system to set-up, it's getting all thr coastal countries together to hammer out a plan, and pay for a monitoring facility. Hopefully, this event will make that happen.
 
BTW, local seismologists are claiming that the ground shifted ½ inch here in St. Louis.

There is a semi-active fault in your area. I can't recall the name of it, I think it begins with a "B".

Shell operates a major pipeline that originates in Saint James, Louisiana and terminates in Wood River, Illinois. The maximum capacity of this crude oil pipeline, which is the largest in the contiguous US, is a bit over 1,000,000 BPD. Many years ago, a respected seismologist predicted activity in this fault. Shell went so far to shut the pipeline down for a few days to avoid a crude oil release. Even for a few days, the Capline System had financial repercussions in New York City with oil futures.

In the end, there was no fault activity at that time.
 
AndyVecsey said:
Many years ago, a respected seismologist predicted activity in this fault. Shell went so far to shut the pipeline down for a few days to avoid a crude oil release. Even for a few days, the Capline System had financial repercussions in New York City with oil futures.

In the end, there was no fault activity at that time.
Click to expand...
Perhaps you're talking about the New Madrid Seismic zone? Would the prediction you speak of happen to be the Iben Browning prediction of Decemeber 3, 1990? If so, there was a major event that day, and I remember it oh so well: My daughter was born. :biggrin:

BTW, most all other respected seismologists rejected his prediction. Never heard much from ole Iben after his prediction.
 
just some quick info in how much energy that quake generated that I got from another science site.

"The total energy released by a magnitude 9.0 earthquake such as this one exceeds the total amount of energy consumed in the United States in one month, or the energy released by the wind of a hurricane like Hurricane Isabel over a period of 70 days. Using the mass-energy equivalence formula E=mc², this amount of energy is equivalent to a mass of about 100 kg (220 lb) (much more than is actually converted to energy in a nuclear explosion), or enough to boil 5000 litres (1,300 US gallons) of water for every person on Earth.

Based on one seismic model, some of the smaller islands southwest of Sumatra have moved southwest up to 20 m (66 ft). The northern tip of Sumatra, which is on the Burma Plate as opposed to the southern regions on the Sunda Plate, may also have moved southwest up to 36 m (120 ft). Other models suggest that most of the movement would have been vertical rather than lateral. Further measurement is needed to determine the nature of the actual movement. The massive release of energy and shift in mass also caused the earth to rotate 1/10,000th of a second faster."
 
Video

Below is a link that has the first video I have seen where someone captured footage of the wave coming ashore. After clicking on the link, go to row 2, column 4 -"Amateurs capture tsunamis' power."
 
With or without the "warning system" the problem is getting the word out to the people at risk. The vast majority of the casualties were not in tourist areas but in small villages with limited communication infrastructure. But all that aside, it's a pretty safe bet that a 9.0 quake in deep water will create a tsunami, so all the buoy warning system would have done is confirm the obvious. And even if they weren't sure, all efforts should be made to warn people just in case. Unfortunately, without a siren system along the entire coastline of each country or island it would be difficult to reach small villages, so a very organized chain of communication through local police would need to be in place.
 
As it would have it... I am actually sitting in India right now. There is no warning system in place at this time. On BBC today they were talking about just that. And it seems unlikely right now that anything will be put in place in the near future. The reason being, the rarity of such a quake/tsunami. Not all that sensible in my eyes, but what can you do. But like sjs commented, even with the system in place the ability to let people know is lacking. Most these countries do not have the $ to spend on the needed infrastructure. They can't keep people out of poverty...
 
sjs said:
The vast majority of the casualties were not in tourist areas but in small villages with limited communication infrastructure.
Click to expand...

Not entirely true - a lot of tourist resorts with fairly good communication infrastructure have the same amount of casualties - such as Phuket, Khao Lak, Maldive etc. I'm pretty sure it will turn out that the percentage of casualties will be the same for tourists and citizens. Just an example: In just one hotel in Khao Lak with about 400 guests (most of them germans) only 150 have been found alive until now - you may calculate the percentage if you like.

OTOH you're right: The information has to be brought quickly to the beaches (which I already meant in my previous post). In this case there was no difference in security or communication for tourists and the citizens. Some experts here say that it is not only a question of money but also of political ignorance and the lack of will to improve it. Don't forget that some of the areas are still under civil and religious war conditions (Sri Lanka).

edit: typos and additional information
 
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Incidentally, I read today in USA Today that US oceanographers were aware of the earthquake within 20 minutes and highly confident that a catastrophic tsunami could result, but were unable to relay any information to anyone in the region due to a complete lack of any procedural systems. Since the Indian Ocean very rarely experiences earthquake activity, money has been spent elsewhere instead of on an early warning system.

The article literally said that the oceanographers relayed it up their chain of command and then "they don't know where it went from there". Not that much could have been done, but it's a sad situation no less.

There were some incredible stories of survivors in the paper today - sadly, 30,000 too few.
 
NSX-Racer said:
...I'm pretty sure it will turn out that the percentage of casualties will be the same for tourists and citizens...
Click to expand...

I'd make a bet on it if this weren't such a tragic situation. I've spent a lot of time over there and can assure you that the tourist losses overall will be far exceeded by locals in small villages far from any resort. In places like Phuket and the Maldives the numbers might be close and in some cases more tourists, but those probably total to no more than a few thousand compared to many times that overall. Of course, every tourist will be accounted for and assumed lost if not located whereas most small villages will be lumped together in estimates, so we'll never know the real numbers.
 
sjs said:
I've spent a lot of time over there and can assure you that the tourist losses overall will be far exceeded by locals in small villages far from any resort.
Click to expand...

Of course you're right but maybe I wasn't clear enough about my point regarding warning systems. As there is none in that region - not in the small villages and not in the resorts - the tourists had no advantage above the citizens, not even in the Khao Lak Lagoon Hotel with IDD telephone and Internet connection in every room.

It's the opposite: In the areas where you had about the same number of tourists and citizens the death toll for the tourists is greater because many tourists where at the beaches or in the sea when the Tsunami came whereas the citizens usualy aren't lying on the beach shore.

OTOH in regions with nearly no tourism it's the small villages and the people in fishing boats that where hit hard in numbers that will hardly ever be reveiled. Not to speak of the fact that tourist survivors can leave the country while the people there would suffer and maybe die later from diseases and the lack of food and water.

BTW: Thailand has a Tsunami warning system but only on the opposite coast of the country which has not been affected this time - tragic.
 
LeftLane said:
There were some incredible stories of survivors in the paper today - sadly, 30,000 too few.
Click to expand...

As I already wrote nearly 2 days ago in this thread:

Death toll in Asia and Africa could rise to 100,000 overall - including tourists from America, Europe and elsewhere - this is a global catastrophe and requires the biggest help effort in the history of mankind.

International red cross just released the same estimation of 100,000 victims.
 
Death toll currently at 76,000+ right now. :(

mn_tsunamipropagates.gif
 
MiamieNeSeX said:
Holy Shit!!! is the only way to describe this video.

http://www.notworksafe.com/videos/vidshow.php?vurl=tsunamiphuket.wmv


Armando
Click to expand...

Being a Midwesterner that never has to worry about a tidal wave of any kind, but it's hard for me to comprehend how this wave could have killed 70,000 people and climbing. From the video here, I am assuming that this guy lived and they were basically right on the beach. It looks as if anyone in a 2-3 story building on the beach was ok. There must have been a much stronger wave that hit in other areas I guessing?

They said it was 30 feet high right? I thought I read that tidal waves could be in upwards of 100 feet high or more so it could have been even worse. Also, they talked about it hitting at 500 mph which makes me think it would hit like a nuclear explosion, but I watched these people on the ground running away from the water that was moving fairly slow compared to the 500 mph. I'm not understanding how this could have done so much damage. How far did the wave go inland? What a tragedy!
 
Perhaps you're talking about the New Madrid Seismic zone?

Yes, that's the one.

Would the prediction you speak of happen to be the Iben Browning prediction of Decemeber 3, 1990?

See, I knew there was a "B" somewhere in all this. :smile:
 
jlindy said:
They said it was 30 feet high right? I thought I read that tidal waves could be in upwards of 100 feet high or more so it could have been even worse. Also, they talked about it hitting at 500 mph which makes me think it would hit like a nuclear explosion, but I watched these people on the ground running away from the water that was moving fairly slow compared to the 500 mph. I'm not understanding how this could have done so much damage. How far did the wave go inland? What a tragedy!
Click to expand...

These waves travel with up to 1000 km/h over open see with a height of no more than about 30 cm (1 foot). Ships passing this waves sometimes don't even notice it. The brutal force is made at the shores when the wave breaks and forms this higher waves losing speed but no energy. A 10 feet tidal wave at the shore is something completely different than the usual 10 feet wave in Hawaii where some people use to surf.

In the actual case this tidal waves went between 200 and more than thousand meters inland depending on the ground profile and the energy of the wave. In some cases the force of the water flowing back to sea was harder than the water coming in. There are even parts of the beach that are now more than 300 meters more broadly than before - that means: Where you had water before you have sand now. On other beaches it's vice versa.

BTW: You can see recent earthquakes in realtime (time base is GMT or world time) here - there are a lot of big ones every day now.

edit: Info added
 
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jlindy said:
Being a Midwesterner that never has to worry about a tidal wave of any kind, but it's hard for me to comprehend how this wave could have killed 70,000 people and climbing. From the video here, I am assuming that this guy lived and they were basically right on the beach. It looks as if anyone in a 2-3 story building on the beach was ok. There must have been a much stronger wave that hit in other areas I guessing?

They said it was 30 feet high right? I thought I read that tidal waves could be in upwards of 100 feet high or more so it could have been even worse. Also, they talked about it hitting at 500 mph which makes me think it would hit like a nuclear explosion, but I watched these people on the ground running away from the water that was moving fairly slow compared to the 500 mph. I'm not understanding how this could have done so much damage. How far did the wave go inland? What a tragedy!
Click to expand...

I watched the special on the tsunami on abc and have a much better understanding of what and how they do their damage. It was sickening to watch to footage of mothers carrying their newborns that didn't make it along with all the children that passed away. I'm just kind of staring in disbelief right now.

I did see that the US raised their contribution from 15 million to 35 million. Also, Pfizer matched the 35 million from the US as well and is the only company to offer relief so far. My hats off to them for taking that step.
 
As it happens, I am currently working as a contractor at Pfizer. Today we (employees and contractors) received an email from CEO Hank McKinnell which told us of two employees still unaccounted for in the region, and mentioned the $25m in products + $10m in cash they have pledged along with the personal efforts of other employees in the disaster areas. Also from that email
For U.S.-based colleagues, the Pfizer Foundation will match individual donations to these and other relief organizations. Details are available on the Pfizer World Café ...
Click to expand...
I realize that Pfizer is part of an industry very much under fire these days, (even before the recent problems with COX2 inhibitors and other anti-inflammatories) and that donations of this type may be in part an effort to improve their image. However, at times like these I applaud their decision and hope that their generosity is paid back several times over with future successes.
 
Did I hear correctly today that Pfizer is the only US company to contribute something so far?
 
I've gotta commend Pfizer, and also the US govt for increasing their aid to $35M. Given the enormity of this calamity, and how the US burns through money in some of their 'questionable' military operations, the initial $15M offering seemed 'paltry'. It's bad enough that so many people died in this disaster, but what's going to be worse are all of the people that are going to die from rampant disease in these regions. Hopefully the world can unite their efforts and help prevent these needless deaths.
 

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