Frustrating month
- Thread starter mskrotzki
- Start date
From personal experience I would rinse any new radiator through the garden hoses or with distilled water before install.
mskrotzki said:
Looks like #2 and 3 got a bit of a steam cleaning. This is a good time for an engine refresh- it's all opened up. Might as well replace all of those $2 o-rings. I also notice you've still got the original LMAs. I would think hard about replacing those with the updated version. You're gonna be ok.
nigel said:
The Koyorad itself is an upgrade over the OEM in terms of durability and cooling performance. However, Koyo has been having shipping damage issues lately. My new Koyo was damaged in shipping. I strongly recommend a thorough inspection and rinse before installing to make sure it isn't damaged.
OK. Here is where we are.
(1) Putting an out of spec engine block (spec = 0.004, measurement = 0.005) back together with milled heads is a non-starter.
(2) Rebuilding the entire engine (after bringing the block back into spec) is way pricey and parts are difficult, if not impossible, to source. This high mileage car will never be collectible so matching numbers are useless.
(3) J swap is not in my cards. I'll either have an NSX or I won't. A bastard will not live in my garage.
(4) Sell it. What would I get? Little is of interest. Fiat 124 Abarth? I don't think so. Porsche 550 Spyder replica? Intriguing, but too much of a toy.
(5) Used engine. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.
I have found a candidate in LA but requires a pickup; seller won't ship. In normal times I wouldn't hesitate to jump on a plane, rent a van and pick it up myself. Could even be fun. However these are not normal times and I am considered an "at risk individual." This doesn't rule out such a plan, but not ideal. LTL shipping appears quite reasonable, if I can find a service that will prepare the engine for pickup at the seller's home -- draining all fluids, attaching to a pallet or crating it, wrapping the result (while leaving access to dip stick so LTL can establish crankcase is empty.)
So my question: Does anyone know of such a service in the Ontario airport area?
Thanks is advance
Mark
(1) Putting an out of spec engine block (spec = 0.004, measurement = 0.005) back together with milled heads is a non-starter.
(2) Rebuilding the entire engine (after bringing the block back into spec) is way pricey and parts are difficult, if not impossible, to source. This high mileage car will never be collectible so matching numbers are useless.
(3) J swap is not in my cards. I'll either have an NSX or I won't. A bastard will not live in my garage.
(4) Sell it. What would I get? Little is of interest. Fiat 124 Abarth? I don't think so. Porsche 550 Spyder replica? Intriguing, but too much of a toy.
(5) Used engine. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.
I have found a candidate in LA but requires a pickup; seller won't ship. In normal times I wouldn't hesitate to jump on a plane, rent a van and pick it up myself. Could even be fun. However these are not normal times and I am considered an "at risk individual." This doesn't rule out such a plan, but not ideal. LTL shipping appears quite reasonable, if I can find a service that will prepare the engine for pickup at the seller's home -- draining all fluids, attaching to a pallet or crating it, wrapping the result (while leaving access to dip stick so LTL can establish crankcase is empty.)
So my question: Does anyone know of such a service in the Ontario airport area?
Thanks is advance
Mark
Is this the engine with the bad compression numbers that's been listed in the for sale forum for over a year? I would avoid that unless he does the compression test again and gets 210+ on every cylinder.
Parts for rebuilding a C30 aren't hard to find and the block deck being warped a few thousandths isn't going to affect the price really at all, it has to be rebored, decked, and probably line honed either way. HQ engineering has rebuilt quite a few NSX motors recently so it might be worth giving them a call as well as maybe SoS, Driving Ambition, or Asteri motorsport.
Parts for rebuilding a C30 aren't hard to find and the block deck being warped a few thousandths isn't going to affect the price really at all, it has to be rebored, decked, and probably line honed either way. HQ engineering has rebuilt quite a few NSX motors recently so it might be worth giving them a call as well as maybe SoS, Driving Ambition, or Asteri motorsport.
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It is. He is doing a leak down test Monday morning. We'll see what that brings and go from there.
Mark there is a C30A for sale on FB, although it’s taken all apart so maybe you can buy just the pieces you need. I’ll send you a PM with the guys name and contact info
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
OK, Thanks.I'll follow up and see what gives.
Stay healthy
Mark
Stay healthy
Mark
Wow.. I hope you find something that doesn't break the bank..
I feel your pain...
I hope you post some good news shortly!
I feel your pain...
I hope you post some good news shortly!
As I write this my engine (the pieces of the engine loosely “reassembled”) are on their way out to SOS to take part in their engine refresh program. Frankly, if the program were not from such a long term and respected outfit I would find it “if it seems too good to be true – it likely is”.) Here is what it entails:
Precision blueprinted assembly including pistons, cylinder head studs, and new seals, gaskets & bearings.
components:
I will already have or purchase the following additioinal items:
For all intents and purposes this is a new engine.
This should take about a month and cost around $6500.00. Again, if this were any other outfit I would run away screaming “this is too good to be true.”
Of course there will be shipping, Paul Z’s removal, testing and installation and other things I haven’t thought about yet. I understand the engine got so hot the timing belt covers all melted – yet more expense.
On another issue, the used engine: I requested a leak down test which was performed and failed. The seller immediately took the engine off the market and, I believe, intends to tear it down and sell the parts. Of all the misery this episode has caused I may have fulfilled Diogenes’ quest for the last honest man – this seller. I’ve always been an optimistic person (to the point of delusion sometimes) but this reflects unbelievably well on our community, and is worth celebrating. Good stuff still happens in this world. Decent people still exist in the crazy world of ours.
Again many thanks to all the people who have been following this (miserable) adventure, and I look forward to meeting many of you and a future drive.
Mark
Precision blueprinted assembly including pistons, cylinder head studs, and new seals, gaskets & bearings.
components:
- ScienceofSpeed piston set (pistons, rings, locks, & pins) with Xylan skirt coating
- MLS head gasket set
- ARP head stud set
- complete new genuine factory cylinder head seal set, cylinder block seal set, bearing set, & timing belt
- cylinder heads: surface heads, inspect guides, competition valve job
- cylinder block: surface deck, machine, bore, & hone cylinder sleeves to size
- clean & inspect cylinder heads, cylinder block, connecting rods, and crankshaft
- bushing of factory connecting rods for floating pin
- blueprinted assembly: set ring gap, measure and adjust clearances, record weights, provide specification sheet
I will already have or purchase the following additioinal items:
- ScienceofSpeed Lost Motion Assembly Kit
- factory water pump (already have)
- ScienceofSpeed Billet Oil Pump Gearset
- factory timing belt (already have)
For all intents and purposes this is a new engine.
This should take about a month and cost around $6500.00. Again, if this were any other outfit I would run away screaming “this is too good to be true.”
Of course there will be shipping, Paul Z’s removal, testing and installation and other things I haven’t thought about yet. I understand the engine got so hot the timing belt covers all melted – yet more expense.
On another issue, the used engine: I requested a leak down test which was performed and failed. The seller immediately took the engine off the market and, I believe, intends to tear it down and sell the parts. Of all the misery this episode has caused I may have fulfilled Diogenes’ quest for the last honest man – this seller. I’ve always been an optimistic person (to the point of delusion sometimes) but this reflects unbelievably well on our community, and is worth celebrating. Good stuff still happens in this world. Decent people still exist in the crazy world of ours.
Again many thanks to all the people who have been following this (miserable) adventure, and I look forward to meeting many of you and a future drive.
Mark
Thanks for the update, I've been very happy with the products and service from SOS. I hope they take care of you and you're back on the road soon!
My engine is still in Chandler, AZ getting a full refresh. The $6500 price has rapidly ballooned to over $8000 with LMAs, Engine hoses, oil pump, clutch (why not -- engine is out and existing clutch has 120K+ ib it) and a host of other items. I'm also going to spend the extra $1900 and turn it into a 3.2L with the sleeves and pistons.
Does anybody have experience with
https://www.scienceofspeed.com/inde...lsd/6-speed-transmissions-conversion-kit.html
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DESCRIPTION
1991-1996 manual transmission NSXes were equipped by the factory with a 5-spd transmission using a twin disc clutch.1997-2005 manual transmission NSXes were equipped by the factory with a 6-spd transmission using a single disc clutch.
Owners of early model 5-speed transmission owners may upgrade to the later model 6-speed transmissions. The conversion process is simple. In order to install the transmission, you will need:
1. 6-spd transmission (complete assembly)
2. single disc clutch or convert using a twin spline input shaft
3. reverse lock out solenoid electronics
reverse lock out solenoid electronics:
1997-2005 NSX use a circuit that is a part of the engine control unit (ECU) to fire a solenoid pin when the car exceeds 25 mph. By doing this, a driver can not accidentally engage reverse when the car has forward speed. Since 1991-96 NSX lack this circuit, it must be added. There are three solutions:
The factory 6-spd transmission uses a single spline input shaft that is compatible with single disc clutches only. If you have a 1991-96 NSX, you may use this transmission with a single disc clutch (like the ScienceofSpeed Sport Clutches). If you prefer to use a twin disc clutch (either factory or aftermarket), we can exchange the input shaft in the transmission using the twin spline 6-spd input shaft from the NA2 NSX-R. The shaft is sold separately below. We also offer the service to exchange the input shaft.
[TABLE="class: data-table grouped-items-table, width: 459"]
<tbody>[TR="class: first odd"]
[TD="class: name last"]Honda 6-speed A61 Transmission Assembly
dpp-221
$9,959.30
<input type="text" name="super_group[68]" maxlength="12" value="1" title="Qty" class="input-text qty" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 8px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 19px; line-height: 1.5; color: rgb(209, 23, 24); appearance: none; border-radius: 0px; border-width: 1px; border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(209, 23, 24); background: rgb(255, 255, 255); height: 32px; width: 76px; max-width: 100%; text-align: center; vertical-align: middle; float: left;"><button type="button" class="button btn-cart" style="margin: 0px; padding: 5px 28px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 18px; line-height: 22px; cursor: pointer; touch-action: manipulation; color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background: rgb(209, 23, 24); border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; text-transform: uppercase; vertical-align: middle; white-space: nowrap; float: left; border-radius: 0px;">ADD TO CART</button>[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: last even"]
[TD="class: name"]ScienceofSpeed 6-spd Lock Out Controller
dpp-223
$657.47
<input type="text" name="super_group[1087]" maxlength="12" value="1" title="Qty" class="input-text qty" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 8px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 19px; line-height: 1.5; color: rgb(209, 23, 24); appearance: none; border-radius: 0px; border-width: 1px; border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(209, 23, 24); background: rgb(255, 255, 255); height: 32px; width: 76px; max-width: 100%; text-align: center; vertical-align: middle; float: left;"><button type="button" class="button btn-cart" style="margin: 0px; padding: 5px 28px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 18px; line-height: 22px; cursor: pointer; touch-action: manipulation; color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background: rgb(209, 23, 24); border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; text-transform: uppercase; vertical-align: middle; white-space: nowrap; float: left; border-radius: 0px;">ADD TO CART</button>[/TD]
[/TR]
</tbody>[/TABLE]
</form>
If this works, then I'll have nearly an NA2 coupé. Wish me luck.
FWIW, the used 3.2 in CA that was taken off the market a stripped for parts: I've purchased the 3 timing belt covers (mine melted) and a nearly new aftermarket HB. It was the least I could do after he had a disaster nearly as bad as mine. It does feel good to know there are decent people in this world -- and they live on NSXPrime.
I've purchased a Moates Demon 2 Tuning Hardware, a WB O2 sensor, TunerPro RT software so I can tune my NA1 ECU to run the larger 3.2L engine. This will be quite the project and is simply a validation of my favorite saying: In adversity lies opportunity.
Thanks for all your interest.
Mark
Does anybody have experience with
https://www.scienceofspeed.com/inde...lsd/6-speed-transmissions-conversion-kit.html
- NSX, 1991-05/
- 6-speed Transmissions & Lock-Out Controller Kit
<form action="https://www.scienceofspeed.com/index.php/checkout/cart/add/uenc/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuc2NpZW5jZW9mc3BlZWQuY29tL2luZGV4LnBocC9uc3gvZHBwL3RyYW5zbWlzc2lvbnMtZ2VhcnMtbHNkLzYtc3BlZWQtdHJhbnNtaXNzaW9ucy1jb252ZXJzaW9uLWtpdC5odG1s/product/876/form_key/d4VD4Htvpai5qzUs/" method="post" id="product_addtocart_form" style="padding: 0px; box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; color: rgb(209, 23, 24); font-size: 16px; line-height: 18px; overflow-wrap: break-word; text-align: justify;">
DESCRIPTION
1991-1996 manual transmission NSXes were equipped by the factory with a 5-spd transmission using a twin disc clutch.1997-2005 manual transmission NSXes were equipped by the factory with a 6-spd transmission using a single disc clutch.
Owners of early model 5-speed transmission owners may upgrade to the later model 6-speed transmissions. The conversion process is simple. In order to install the transmission, you will need:
1. 6-spd transmission (complete assembly)
2. single disc clutch or convert using a twin spline input shaft
3. reverse lock out solenoid electronics
reverse lock out solenoid electronics:
1997-2005 NSX use a circuit that is a part of the engine control unit (ECU) to fire a solenoid pin when the car exceeds 25 mph. By doing this, a driver can not accidentally engage reverse when the car has forward speed. Since 1991-96 NSX lack this circuit, it must be added. There are three solutions:
- plug and play solenoid controller - controller uses circuit that plugs into factory speed sensor and solenoid. Just like factory, activates solenoid when the car reaches 25 mph. Plug and play using factory connectors, no wire cutting required.
- simple relay using brake lights as a trigger - this is the standard method used by ScienceofSpeed. To engage reverse gear, the driver must first step on the brake pedal. Included by default with the transmissions. Requires cutting factory wires and installing relay.
- aftermarket ECU - if your NSX has an aftermarket ECU (such as the AEM EMS) with output triggers - you can configure the computer to activate a relay to control the solenoid.
The factory 6-spd transmission uses a single spline input shaft that is compatible with single disc clutches only. If you have a 1991-96 NSX, you may use this transmission with a single disc clutch (like the ScienceofSpeed Sport Clutches). If you prefer to use a twin disc clutch (either factory or aftermarket), we can exchange the input shaft in the transmission using the twin spline 6-spd input shaft from the NA2 NSX-R. The shaft is sold separately below. We also offer the service to exchange the input shaft.
[TABLE="class: data-table grouped-items-table, width: 459"]
<tbody>[TR="class: first odd"]
[TD="class: name last"]Honda 6-speed A61 Transmission Assembly
dpp-221
$9,959.30
<input type="text" name="super_group[68]" maxlength="12" value="1" title="Qty" class="input-text qty" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 8px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 19px; line-height: 1.5; color: rgb(209, 23, 24); appearance: none; border-radius: 0px; border-width: 1px; border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(209, 23, 24); background: rgb(255, 255, 255); height: 32px; width: 76px; max-width: 100%; text-align: center; vertical-align: middle; float: left;"><button type="button" class="button btn-cart" style="margin: 0px; padding: 5px 28px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 18px; line-height: 22px; cursor: pointer; touch-action: manipulation; color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background: rgb(209, 23, 24); border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; text-transform: uppercase; vertical-align: middle; white-space: nowrap; float: left; border-radius: 0px;">ADD TO CART</button>[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: last even"]
[TD="class: name"]ScienceofSpeed 6-spd Lock Out Controller
dpp-223
$657.47
<input type="text" name="super_group[1087]" maxlength="12" value="1" title="Qty" class="input-text qty" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 8px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 19px; line-height: 1.5; color: rgb(209, 23, 24); appearance: none; border-radius: 0px; border-width: 1px; border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(209, 23, 24); background: rgb(255, 255, 255); height: 32px; width: 76px; max-width: 100%; text-align: center; vertical-align: middle; float: left;"><button type="button" class="button btn-cart" style="margin: 0px; padding: 5px 28px; font-family: "Open Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 18px; line-height: 22px; cursor: pointer; touch-action: manipulation; color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background: rgb(209, 23, 24); border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; text-transform: uppercase; vertical-align: middle; white-space: nowrap; float: left; border-radius: 0px;">ADD TO CART</button>[/TD]
[/TR]
</tbody>[/TABLE]
</form>
If this works, then I'll have nearly an NA2 coupé. Wish me luck.
FWIW, the used 3.2 in CA that was taken off the market a stripped for parts: I've purchased the 3 timing belt covers (mine melted) and a nearly new aftermarket HB. It was the least I could do after he had a disaster nearly as bad as mine. It does feel good to know there are decent people in this world -- and they live on NSXPrime.
I've purchased a Moates Demon 2 Tuning Hardware, a WB O2 sensor, TunerPro RT software so I can tune my NA1 ECU to run the larger 3.2L engine. This will be quite the project and is simply a validation of my favorite saying: In adversity lies opportunity.
Thanks for all your interest.
Mark
Sorry to hear about your misfortune, but it sounds like you'll be ready for another 48 state tour shortly.
Regarding your last post, I have a (non SOS) 6 speed swap in mine. I opted for the NSX-R main, the OE twin disc clutch, Jun light (but not ultralight) flywheel and a Comptech lockout box. I retained the original R&P. These have been in the car for the last 14 years, and I am quite pleased with them.
Maybe a little late for your consideration, but I think the 6 speed is a better improvement than the .2L of additional displacement in terms of driving enjoyment. Both in a coupe would be perfect
Edit: I missed the point about the 3.2L needing standalone engine management / tuning. If you need that anyways, I'd have to think very hard about a supercharger vs 6 speed.
Regarding your last post, I have a (non SOS) 6 speed swap in mine. I opted for the NSX-R main, the OE twin disc clutch, Jun light (but not ultralight) flywheel and a Comptech lockout box. I retained the original R&P. These have been in the car for the last 14 years, and I am quite pleased with them.
Maybe a little late for your consideration, but I think the 6 speed is a better improvement than the .2L of additional displacement in terms of driving enjoyment. Both in a coupe would be perfect
Edit: I missed the point about the 3.2L needing standalone engine management / tuning. If you need that anyways, I'd have to think very hard about a supercharger vs 6 speed.
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Thanks for your kind thoughts. I agree that the better change would (will) be the 6 speed, especially the improved mph/1000 RPM for long distance driving. Finding a 6-speed is proving to be extremely difficult, however.
If you go to the NA performance section, you'll see it is now possible to tune the '91 - '94 ECU. Some Prime members have cracked the ECU software, and you can purchase data logging hardware and software from specialty manufacturers. That is what [MENTION=18194]Honcho[/MENTION] and I are going to do out here in Colorado. I want to stay NA just because that is what I want to do. I'm not interested in being crazy fast in the NSX.
When my wife's Series 3 6MT Acura TL finally dies I'll be getting her a Tesla Model 3 Performance, which will blow the doors off any NA1 or 2. It won't be nearly as much fun or a connected as the NSX, but what a combination for my 109 year old garage!
If you go to the NA performance section, you'll see it is now possible to tune the '91 - '94 ECU. Some Prime members have cracked the ECU software, and you can purchase data logging hardware and software from specialty manufacturers. That is what [MENTION=18194]Honcho[/MENTION] and I are going to do out here in Colorado. I want to stay NA just because that is what I want to do. I'm not interested in being crazy fast in the NSX.
When my wife's Series 3 6MT Acura TL finally dies I'll be getting her a Tesla Model 3 Performance, which will blow the doors off any NA1 or 2. It won't be nearly as much fun or a connected as the NSX, but what a combination for my 109 year old garage!
It should be possible to program the stock 91-94 ECU to control the reverse lockout solenoid on the 6MT with no additional hardware. On M/T cars there are some unused digital outputs that would normally be connected to the transmission computer that could be repurposed.
That's welcome news indeed. I would be in no hurry to install the lockout next to 6th gear. It is not exactly like some '50s English cars where reverse was next to 2nd where a fast double-clutched snap 3 -2 downshift could become very expensive very fast. I've never snap shifted into 6th.
But if it is relatively easy to install the lockout without an additional $600+, why not.
Thanks
But if it is relatively easy to install the lockout without an additional $600+, why not.
Thanks
The lockout solenoid controller is more like $200 from RFY or KSP, you also have the option to wire a relay into your brake lamp circuit, so you can only select reverse when brake applied, which would be considerably less money. Programming the ECU interesting though.
Yep, finding a 6 speed was never easy (for me anyways) and I understand your point completely about feel vs power. If you are anything like me, I suspect you'll be quite pleased with the swap. I don't know how far you want to go with it, but the NSX-R main/twin disk/light fly is a very nice addition. It makes the car much more 'S2000 playful' in terms of engine responsiveness/transmission engagement.
In any case, best of luck with your journey. Please keep us posted. I look forward to learning from your experience, and had no idea the ECU had been unlocked. Very cool stuff.
Good update.. She will be good for another 222k!! and faster!
- Joined
- 20 August 2020
- Messages
- 3
Frustrating Month? Let' see, how about frustrating year - 2020.
Broke my hip earlier this year - doc put four three inch screws in my hip to fix it - later spent some time in ICU on unrelated issue. Then fell and broke my shoulder followed by five days in ICU three of which they had me on a ventilator and told my family it wasn't looking good.
So frustrating month????
Good news now my sales guy sent me this email last week: Heard back this afternoon from the factory. Your car is #2 in the October build schedule! It is coming up fast! It should be in assembled in the first week. So overall it's looking good now although getting your new NSX and not dying are two completely separate issues, right?
Now - can someone point me to the best threads on NSX performance exhausts they have installed and like????
Broke my hip earlier this year - doc put four three inch screws in my hip to fix it - later spent some time in ICU on unrelated issue. Then fell and broke my shoulder followed by five days in ICU three of which they had me on a ventilator and told my family it wasn't looking good.
So frustrating month????
Good news now my sales guy sent me this email last week: Heard back this afternoon from the factory. Your car is #2 in the October build schedule! It is coming up fast! It should be in assembled in the first week. So overall it's looking good now although getting your new NSX and not dying are two completely separate issues, right?
Now - can someone point me to the best threads on NSX performance exhausts they have installed and like????
Last edited:
Hell of a first post you got there.
I was thinking the same thing...
yep scammer are constantly hitting up sites like prime to get their post count up so they can do something nefarious...
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