97 Hardtop Blue Production numbers

[harrier]

Originally posted by kinnsella:
Harrier,

If people pull out of your auction when they know of all the inconsistencies with your vehicle that you are unable to explain, whose fault is that. I'm sure they were able to make up their own minds about the validity of your claims. If you bought this vehicle without knowing its true condition, which is quite possible at any auction, I feel sorry for you.

When it is libel, are these facts not true:

A. the vin doesn't match the body style.
B. the car is missing parts and has some parts that indicate it was a Targa, most notably a triangular brace in the engine bay....might want to take that out

C. there are many signs of repair, especially in the front bay where there is over spray and you can clearly see welds across the firewall that don't exist on an undamaged vehicle.
D. Many other suspicous details, sold at auction when it was only 5 months old. Not registered in CA for almost five years, It wouldn't have been legal to drive it after 6/99. Then it was registered in two different states within 40 days...I could go on.

I ask you as many members have of this forum to explain these issues. If you have a valid explanation, I know these guys will drop it. You have failed to answer any of these allegations....

Anyway, I have said my piece and will hold comments until you reply. I await your response.

[This message has been edited by kinnsella (edited 13 January 2003).]

You shouldn't go out of your way to contact our high bidders on Ebay. That is illegal!! You have done a diservice to this forum.

 

[sjs]

Originally posted by harrier:
You shouldn't go out of your way to contact our high bidders on Ebay. That is illegal!! You have done a diservice to this forum.

I suspect that you are dead wrong on the first point, and I know that you are dead wrong on the second.

I too feel for you if you got stuck when purchasing this car, but one of the valuable aspects of this forum is that we watch out for the interests of fellow owners or prospective ones. Don't like it? Go elsewhere.

Your car is a mess. While we don’t' know all the facts, it is clear that it is not as represented in your descriptions. Additionally, if it is found that you are in any way connected with the person who claims to have inspected it and said how nice it is, then you are quite likely guilty of attempted felony fraud since it was done as a direct attempt to hide facts already disclosed here.

Think about it buddy, cause I'm keeping an eye on you and plan to find the eventual buyer if I have any evidence.

Lud, what can you tell us about jjperkins?

 

[Tony Montoya]

Edited to save me.

[This message has been edited by Tony Montoya (edited 13 January 2003).]

 

[BostonNSX]

OMG he the seller shawn edited and deleted everything on the first post of this thread!

 

[ChrisK]

Just an update on this Blue 97 NSX-T.

Over the last few years while I was looking to purchase my NSX, I made a list of all the poor NSXs that I should stay away from. Some of the NSXs were from the crash and burn section on NSX Prime, while others where by owners crashes or stories posted here and elsewhere on the internet. Anyway, I looked back at my old list which I have on an excel spread sheet in my computer and guess what I retrieved? Yes, I did record this Blue NSX-T as one I should avoid. Unfortunately, I did not make notes as to why I should avoid each poor NSX, but the VIN # of JH4NA2167VT000020 does show up on my list as a Blue NSX-T that I should not buy. Therefore, I'm pretty sure this NSX was indeed a NSX-T earlier in its life. The last time I updated my "Bad NSX List" was sometime early 2002. My theory is that a Coupes roof was welded onto this NSX-T.

I know to the seller my little notes don't mean a thing, but in my mind, I know for a fact that I recorded this as a Blue NSX-T.

[This message has been edited by ChrisK (edited 13 January 2003).]

 

[Periokid]

Wow ChrisK, that is REALLY interesting.

I wish you had the details recorded!!

 

[kinnsella]

Originally posted by ChrisK:
Just an update on this Blue 97 NSX-T.

Over the last few years while I was looking to purchase my NSX, I made a list of all the poor NSXs that I should stay away from. Some of the NSXs were from the crash and burn section on NSX Prime, while others where by owners crashes or stories posted here and elsewhere on the internet. Anyway, I looked back at my old list which I have on an excel spread sheet in my computer and guess what I retrieved? Yes, I did record this Blue NSX-T as one I should avoid. Unfortunately, I did not make notes as to why I should avoid each poor NSX, but the VIN # of JH4NA2167VT000020 does show up on my list as a Blue NSX-T that I should not buy. Therefore, I'm pretty sure this NSX was indeed a NSX-T earlier in its life. The last time I updated my "Bad NSX List" was sometime early 2002. My theory is that a Coupes roof was welded onto this NSX-T.

I know to the seller my little notes don't mean a thing, but in my mind, I know for a fact that I recorded this as a Blue NSX-T.

[This message has been edited by ChrisK (edited 13 January 2003).]

Any idea where you think you found that info on that VIN?

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by BostonNSX:
OMG he the seller shawn edited and deleted everything on the first post of this thread!

Must have something to hide.

 

[ck]

I don't know why you guys believe that this guy doesn't know exactly what he bought and has. Once again, I'd like to hear where you purchased this vehicle from. Which auction in So. CA? I will put my money on it being an insurance or salvage auction.

 

[ChrisK]

Originally posted by kinnsella:
Any idea where you think you found that info on that VIN?

It could have been right here. I just did a search with that VIN on Prime and there is an old topic something to the effect "97 NSX with 843 miles. Too good to be true?" That is not the exact tittle but close to it. Unfortunately, the link is broken. I wonder if Lud has a trick that can bring back a dead link? There might be some useful information in that topic.

The only thing I know is that it would have been something pretty bad for me to add a Blue NSX with that low miles on the list. The Monte Carlo Blue is one of my favorite colors and to have it in a 6-Speed with black interior and low miles would have been my dream car. If it were just minor fender benders and repaint I probably would not have added it to my list.

 

[Paul65K]

One thing that the seller hopefully realizes at this point is that all sales transacted on eBay fall under the jurisdiction of the Feds and intentional misrepresentations could constitute Mail Fraud, which is enforced by the Feds and not simply some impotent state agency as is the case with most automobile transactions.

It is now painfully obvious that the seller has been made aware of "Possible" issues with this car and now has an obligation to disclose these "Possible" concerns to any potential buyer unless they are able to defend themselves with the feds at some time in the future if need be.

While this may never come to the attention of a subsequent buyer, what do you think would happen if that subsequent buyer happened upon this forum (Highly likely) in an effort to understand why their new "baby" has a "Unique" center console, or something else.

I'm thinking that if I was the dealer in GA at this point I would be seriously thinking about a course of FULL DISCLOSURE or taking action to get a refund from the Dealer Auction as this is a reversible transaction under the terms of almost every dealer auction that I know of based on my previous experience in the car business.

Just something to think about, but then again actions such those currently being displayed by Shawn (Harrier) are the reason most people hold car dealers in such low regard!!

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by ChrisK:
It could have been right here. I just did a search with that VIN on Prime and there is an old topic something to the effect "97 NSX with 843 miles. Too good to be true?" That is not the exact tittle but close to it. Unfortunately, the link is broken. I wonder if Lud has a trick that can bring back a dead link? There might be some useful information in that topic.

Remember, with the exception of a topic that's primarily a flame war or hate speech, what appears to be a broken link is usually a topic that Lud has simply moved to another NSXprime forum, not deleted.

The topic you're looking for is right here, and it is indeed the same VIN as the car being discussed here.

 

[SITNLOW]

1)One thing noticed: Is that the factory
phone antenna base on the rear glass hatch?
2) It is possible that this car for sometime
was driven with a dealers plate & the mileage would not be recorded as to show on a title search. Just my .02

 

[kinnsella]

Originally posted by nsxtasy:
Remember, with the exception of a topic that's primarily a flame war or hate speech, what appears to be a broken link is usually a topic that Lud has simply moved to another NSXprime forum, not deleted.

The topic you're looking for is right here, and it is indeed the same VIN as the car being discussed here.

After reading this other thread, funny how each owner of this vehicle becomes a threatening hostile ass****......must be the blue color. I think we should add this vin to the totaled ones.



[This message has been edited by kinnsella (edited 14 January 2003).]

 

[BostonNSX]

Man this is getting interesting .. I wonder does Shawn knows about this

 

[BostonNSX]

And it seems to me that ever owner of this "blue 97" gets pissed off easily , and anxious to sell it right away!!

 

[blurr]

Originally posted by harrier:
You shouldn't go out of your way to contact our high bidders on Ebay. That is illegal!! You have done a diservice to this forum.

I am not a lawyer so I don’t really know, though I would like to know.

Is contacting the high bidder of an auction illegal if you don’t pass on false information to that bidder. It might be against ebay rules, but illegal?

Would not passing on the information told to the seller by those that know most everything about the NSX from this forum not be illegal in that selling a car without passing on all knowledge of that vehicle would be illegal?

Does my question confuse anyone as much as it confused me?

 

[SCS2k]

Originally posted by nsxtasy:
Remember, with the exception of a topic that's primarily a flame war or hate speech, what appears to be a broken link is usually a topic that Lud has simply moved to another NSXprime forum, not deleted.

The topic you're looking for is right here, and it is indeed the same VIN as the car being discussed here.

Interesting. I wonder if it was a targa then. By the way, who says cars aren't good investments. This one has already appreciated over $11,000 in the last 6 months.

 

[kinnsella]

Originally posted by blurr:
I am not a lawyer so I don’t really know, though I would like to know.

Is contacting the high bidder of an auction illegal if you don’t pass on false information to that bidder. It might be against ebay rules, but illegal?

Would not passing on the information told to the seller by those that know most everything about the NSX from this forum not be illegal in that selling a car without passing on all knowledge of that vehicle would be illegal?

Does my question confuse anyone as much as it confused me?

My point exactly, passing on information can hardly be described as libel, if Harrier could convincingly refute the claims on this site, buyers wouldn't be pulling out of the auction. Nobody is forcing the buyers out, they see the info and make their own judgement. You may have apoint, he is aware of problems and on his ebay site is passing the car off as perfect. If the eventual buyer finds out about the problems and that Harrier was well aware of them, they WILL have a case against Harrier for fraud.

 

[mlambert890]

"harrier" probably *is* that guy from the other thread. They have a similar speech pattern and make similar errors. Harrier also refers to the car is "our car" and that "lowmiles97" guy was saying it was him and his brother selling.

The only thing I can't figure out is why someone would be a big enough idiot to come back here twice or, for that matter, knowing they have a hacked together POS salvage job, why they would come here at all.

 

[Larry Bastanza]

Guys,

I have been following this thread for a few days now. Lud, that is the most "unprofessional" detective work I have ever seen

. And those "opinions" WOW

.

Anyway, I did a complete review of the "terms" for the auction. Just an FYI, the seller gets 20% down within 2 days. If you go to buy the car and it is not as stated they will return your "complete" deposit, MINUS 10% restocking fee + $75!!!!!!!!!!!!

So if he gets 3-4 knowledgable "car guys" to go there, over the next year, after winning a bid, and nobody actually buys it and the purchase price is repeatedly about $50K, he gets $5k per disappointed bid winner!!!!!!

It pays to read the fine print

.

Frankly, after months of our discussions about e-bay, I really don't think I would buy an NSX this way, just too much uncertainly for me.

"oh, just throw another log on the fire....."

LarryB

 

[Black Knight]

Excellent work to all members. I think nsxprime is ready for a startup firm....Cars R Us....doing detective and anti-fraud work.

Motto: Give us the VIN and we'll give you the truth....

------------------
'98 Blue NSX-T

 

[randall]

i don't think this one was to tough though.

 

[BostonNSX]

1 hr 45 mins to end of auction.. time of fate to see whether the car change hands or not

 

[BostonNSX]

18 mins and going up... price kicked up by a new ebayer registered Jan 13 with 0 feedback check history!

I'm not fortunate enough to see how its gonna end.. I got more important things to do.. such as going to eat dinner now!
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=2400050352

[This message has been edited by BostonNSX (edited 17 January 2003).]