She is scared of hitting NSX pulling into/out of garage. Besides, she doesn't keep her car very clean. I HATE THAT !!!
Thanks for your well wishes.
Your view of '04 TL
- Thread starter 4AU4LIFE
- Start date
Thanks for your well wishes.
TL and 3 car quandry
ISONSX and 92NSX,
I'm in the same boat in many regards, with a few additional twists. We are a 3 car family with a 2 car garage. Usually the wife's car and the NSX sit cozy in the garage while the family minivan sits outside, windshields frosting over in winter. We are the parents of two boys, ages 2 and 6.
It's been real nice to fulfill that High School fantasy of NSX ownership for the past three years, but the truth of the matter is
I just don't get to drive the NSX enough. On the rare occasion I got to drive it, some family thing would come up and I had to pickup the kids, which means going home and swapping cars. We hardly ever utilize the 3rd row of the minivan, only occasionally carting an extra passenger for a total of 5(usually the Mother in law). Both my wife and I despise the van, me more than her I suspect. She would rather driver her 3 series than the van.
Where the van excels is for family vacations. Pop in a movie, crank the AC and those 10 hour rides to Orlando or NYC melt away. But you know what, Enterprise rents vans for that 2-3 family vacations a year.
At work those who don't know me formed negative preconceptions soley because of the shiny flashy NSX. For the working schmoe, not the way to gain influence and win favor. As coworkers got to know me, the almost universal comment is, wow you turned out to be a real nice guy. I thought you were a real a$$h0le when I saw you pull in that NSX
After taking my NSX to the edge of performance with the BBSC, I get a been there, done that feeling. The only other cars I covet beyond the NSX are Italian, have small displacement V8's, and are equally impractical.
The NSX, esp supercharged is just too much to enjoy responsibly around town. At Drivers Education type events, its alot of fun, but you realize what a compromise a streetable sports car is after you drive a dedicated track vehicle. Not to mention the risk of balling up ~$40k worth of car. For me that epiphany was doing a Bertil Roos school in an open wheel Formula Ford car. Another alternative is road course Karting.
Property tax and extra insurance are a several hundred dollars a year reality. That can go a long way to 2-3 Roos type schools a year.
As a sensible plan, I'm considering consolidating the NSX and Minivan into a performance oriented sedan. My short list goes from sensible and reliable to not so much so. They are;
04 TL 6MT, G35 Sedan 6MT, 00-02 540 Sport 6 speed, to an 00 M5.
All fall within a ~$10k range. From low 30's with full factory warranty and low running costs, to no more factory warranty and potentially expensive repairs. I have driven them all and am still undecided which one woudl get the nod once I sell off the NSX.
I have driven the 04 TL, in both auto and 6 speed. The 6speed doesn't have torque steer like lets say a Maxima or Altima 6, but it's there. It's not twisting the wheel out of your hands, it manifests itself as a loss of steering feel and numbness. The automatic didnt' have any torque steer that I could feel, but really the clutch is light enough, and the gear selector is slick enough that it's a joy to change gears. Prob the 3rd best Honda manual (NSX, S2K, 04 TL). The DVD audio sounds awesome, the Bluetooth integration and voice command appeal to the techie in me.
To me the chinks in the armor are few, they are
1) Crappy braking performance, even with Brembo's and Summer tires. This is true of the MDX, Pilot, Accord as well(But not TSX, RSX). It shoudl not take a performance sedan close to 200 feet to stop from 70mph. The G35 does it in ~40 feet less. That's a good bit of school bus to mow into in a worst case scenario.
2) FWD. The occasional use of throttle steering is what makes predicatble, neutral RWD cars like BMW's so much fun to drive.
3) Lack of folding rear seats. Limits the occasional bulky item carrying capacity. Important to me if we're to survive with two sedans and no van/suv
4) Trunk swing arms vs articulated hinges for trunk lid. The 3 series has been doing it for over a decade. The G35 does it, the TSX does it. Why intrude on the precious trunk space with this yesteryear design???
As you can see I'm being super picky becuase everything else about it is so damn perfect. The interior design is awesome. By comparison the new BMW 5 series is amazingly dull and cheap feeling.
The G35 6MT was a little less pleasing. The exterior styling is simply handsome, not stunning or exciting. The interior shows where they saved money. The leather is not quite so nice, the vinyl on seat backsides is loose and rather nasty. The clutch felt like absolute shit compared to Honda/BMW. Every vibration of that big 3.5l V6 is felt in your knee. The shifter throws require deliberate action. No forefinger flinging. You need your whole palm. Not bad, but no snick snick here. The Bose audio lives up to the craptitude in our cars. I can't sit behind myself like I can in the other 3.
However the steering feel is phenomenal. Absolutely magic. Very much like BMW 3 series. The brakes stop you RIGHT NOW. Even w/o being Brembos. The torque delivery is very very strong. It's rowdy in ways the others aren't. It really is a 4 door 350z. I suspect that extra bit of Noise, vibration and harshness could get old on a daily basis.
The 540 sport 6 speed and M5 are awesome of course. They offer about the same interior space for my 6'2" frame and do an excellent job of masking their almost 4000lb weight. But they have that delicious V8 sound, effortless torque delivery and great interiors. Both offer folding rear seats. Both will barely break 20mpg. Buryng the tach in the M5 is orgasmic, just like taking the NSX to redline in 2nd. A symphony for the ears. But unlike the NSX, I can carry my most precious cargo in the back seats.
Take the badge off the back and the M5 hides in the corporate parking lot along with all those other 525 and 530s lease specials, more a plus than a minus. A definate change from being stalked by the teen crowd at shopping centers, stoplights, drive thru's.
Sigh, tough decisions ahead. First I must find the right buyer for my Tokyo mistress.
-Fabian
91 BBSC
ISONSX and 92NSX,
I'm in the same boat in many regards, with a few additional twists. We are a 3 car family with a 2 car garage. Usually the wife's car and the NSX sit cozy in the garage while the family minivan sits outside, windshields frosting over in winter. We are the parents of two boys, ages 2 and 6.
It's been real nice to fulfill that High School fantasy of NSX ownership for the past three years, but the truth of the matter is
I just don't get to drive the NSX enough. On the rare occasion I got to drive it, some family thing would come up and I had to pickup the kids, which means going home and swapping cars. We hardly ever utilize the 3rd row of the minivan, only occasionally carting an extra passenger for a total of 5(usually the Mother in law). Both my wife and I despise the van, me more than her I suspect. She would rather driver her 3 series than the van.
Where the van excels is for family vacations. Pop in a movie, crank the AC and those 10 hour rides to Orlando or NYC melt away. But you know what, Enterprise rents vans for that 2-3 family vacations a year.
At work those who don't know me formed negative preconceptions soley because of the shiny flashy NSX. For the working schmoe, not the way to gain influence and win favor. As coworkers got to know me, the almost universal comment is, wow you turned out to be a real nice guy. I thought you were a real a$$h0le when I saw you pull in that NSX
After taking my NSX to the edge of performance with the BBSC, I get a been there, done that feeling. The only other cars I covet beyond the NSX are Italian, have small displacement V8's, and are equally impractical.
The NSX, esp supercharged is just too much to enjoy responsibly around town. At Drivers Education type events, its alot of fun, but you realize what a compromise a streetable sports car is after you drive a dedicated track vehicle. Not to mention the risk of balling up ~$40k worth of car. For me that epiphany was doing a Bertil Roos school in an open wheel Formula Ford car. Another alternative is road course Karting.
Property tax and extra insurance are a several hundred dollars a year reality. That can go a long way to 2-3 Roos type schools a year.
As a sensible plan, I'm considering consolidating the NSX and Minivan into a performance oriented sedan. My short list goes from sensible and reliable to not so much so. They are;
04 TL 6MT, G35 Sedan 6MT, 00-02 540 Sport 6 speed, to an 00 M5.
All fall within a ~$10k range. From low 30's with full factory warranty and low running costs, to no more factory warranty and potentially expensive repairs. I have driven them all and am still undecided which one woudl get the nod once I sell off the NSX.
I have driven the 04 TL, in both auto and 6 speed. The 6speed doesn't have torque steer like lets say a Maxima or Altima 6, but it's there. It's not twisting the wheel out of your hands, it manifests itself as a loss of steering feel and numbness. The automatic didnt' have any torque steer that I could feel, but really the clutch is light enough, and the gear selector is slick enough that it's a joy to change gears. Prob the 3rd best Honda manual (NSX, S2K, 04 TL). The DVD audio sounds awesome, the Bluetooth integration and voice command appeal to the techie in me.
To me the chinks in the armor are few, they are
1) Crappy braking performance, even with Brembo's and Summer tires. This is true of the MDX, Pilot, Accord as well(But not TSX, RSX). It shoudl not take a performance sedan close to 200 feet to stop from 70mph. The G35 does it in ~40 feet less. That's a good bit of school bus to mow into in a worst case scenario.
2) FWD. The occasional use of throttle steering is what makes predicatble, neutral RWD cars like BMW's so much fun to drive.
3) Lack of folding rear seats. Limits the occasional bulky item carrying capacity. Important to me if we're to survive with two sedans and no van/suv
4) Trunk swing arms vs articulated hinges for trunk lid. The 3 series has been doing it for over a decade. The G35 does it, the TSX does it. Why intrude on the precious trunk space with this yesteryear design???
As you can see I'm being super picky becuase everything else about it is so damn perfect. The interior design is awesome. By comparison the new BMW 5 series is amazingly dull and cheap feeling.
The G35 6MT was a little less pleasing. The exterior styling is simply handsome, not stunning or exciting. The interior shows where they saved money. The leather is not quite so nice, the vinyl on seat backsides is loose and rather nasty. The clutch felt like absolute shit compared to Honda/BMW. Every vibration of that big 3.5l V6 is felt in your knee. The shifter throws require deliberate action. No forefinger flinging. You need your whole palm. Not bad, but no snick snick here. The Bose audio lives up to the craptitude in our cars. I can't sit behind myself like I can in the other 3.
However the steering feel is phenomenal. Absolutely magic. Very much like BMW 3 series. The brakes stop you RIGHT NOW. Even w/o being Brembos. The torque delivery is very very strong. It's rowdy in ways the others aren't. It really is a 4 door 350z. I suspect that extra bit of Noise, vibration and harshness could get old on a daily basis.
The 540 sport 6 speed and M5 are awesome of course. They offer about the same interior space for my 6'2" frame and do an excellent job of masking their almost 4000lb weight. But they have that delicious V8 sound, effortless torque delivery and great interiors. Both offer folding rear seats. Both will barely break 20mpg. Buryng the tach in the M5 is orgasmic, just like taking the NSX to redline in 2nd. A symphony for the ears. But unlike the NSX, I can carry my most precious cargo in the back seats.
Take the badge off the back and the M5 hides in the corporate parking lot along with all those other 525 and 530s lease specials, more a plus than a minus. A definate change from being stalked by the teen crowd at shopping centers, stoplights, drive thru's.
Sigh, tough decisions ahead. First I must find the right buyer for my Tokyo mistress.
-Fabian
91 BBSC
FAB NSX,
What an absolutely wonderful post. I am grateful to have gotten to read it. Thank's for sharing.
I can drive my NSX anytime I would like to but only normally do it on the weekends. I like to think of it as my desert. I work all week and then on the I get to enjoy the fruits of my labor then. But for some reason it just doesn't feel the same anymore. I guess maybe because there is something else out there that has really caught my eye and I think/feel like I would be happier with it instead. I may be dreadfully wrong about it but I can't say for sure until I take that step. It is not like I couldn't get another NSX down the road if I absolutely had to have it.
Driving the Integra on a daily basis helps keep me grounded. I have relied so heavily on that car all these years to take me places and carry things for me and I won't get right of it.
I don't know, maybe I'm having an early(33yrs) mid-life crisis and am looking for something more practical now.
What an absolutely wonderful post. I am grateful to have gotten to read it. Thank's for sharing.
I can drive my NSX anytime I would like to but only normally do it on the weekends. I like to think of it as my desert. I work all week and then on the I get to enjoy the fruits of my labor then. But for some reason it just doesn't feel the same anymore. I guess maybe because there is something else out there that has really caught my eye and I think/feel like I would be happier with it instead. I may be dreadfully wrong about it but I can't say for sure until I take that step. It is not like I couldn't get another NSX down the road if I absolutely had to have it.
Driving the Integra on a daily basis helps keep me grounded. I have relied so heavily on that car all these years to take me places and carry things for me and I won't get right of it.
I don't know, maybe I'm having an early(33yrs) mid-life crisis and am looking for something more practical now.
I have gotten the same reaction from my fellow employess also. Strange how people can base their outlook on somebody strictly by what they drive without ever even knowing them at all.
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