You guys won't believe this. My stereo install.

[TURBO2GO]

meh... not impressed sorry. maybe you should not have tried to make it sound so interesting

If you are referring to the title of the thread, the reason I originally posted "you guys won't believe this", was because I was referring to the type of bass response I was able to get adding an aperiodic damper to the woofer. I was very surprised of the response myself, and so I said "you guys won't believe this" as in "you won't believe what is working".

Gee do I need to really explain myself on this?!

I am trying to do something worthwhile and good for the community, exploring all the options not trying to be "interesting". The interesting surprises that work or don't work regarding acoustics happen and I report.

You really made a post just to say you don't like my thread?!

 

[TURBO2GO]

Production models

I am a long way away from anything like that. It's nothing but an idea right now, I don't even have my array of drivers yet.

 

[biscuits]

Have you considered any spatial restoration processors? They would help focus your center stage and pullup your sound floor without the need for exacting driver localization.

 

[biscuits]

Folks interested in group buys may want to keep in mind that sound quality is subjective. A perfect score on sound quality competition sounds like ass to most human ears. In my 20 years of car audio experience one of the first and oft repeated things I learned was that everyone's ear is slightly different. While the use of higend equipment is a great start the final tuning to the buyers ear may actually eliminate some of the equip or at the very least require find tuning and alternate mounting locations.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Have you considered any spatial restoration processors? They would help focus your center stage and pullup your sound floor without the need for exacting driver localization.

You can't really "makeup" for poor mechanics with processing. The problem with processing is always that it will fix one thing but break another. When you EQ, you can fix a response problem but you exaggerate phase shift. When you correct phasing for one seat, you make it worse for the other seat. It is always a compromise and never a substitute for proper driver placement.

But to answer your question, yes, of course. If you read through my thread I've talked about lots. The JBL MS-2, the MS-8, the Alpine pxah800, the kicker Front Row, various audiocontrol units, the fosgate 360.3, I've looked into the bit one and the pioneer head unit, as well as mini-DSP and another brand of German amp/processors which I don't remember the name of now.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Folks interested in group buys may want to keep in mind that sound quality is subjective. A perfect score on sound quality competition sounds like ass to most human ears. In my 20 years of car audio experience one of the first and oft repeated things I learned was that everyone's ear is slightly different. While the use of higend equipment is a great start the final tuning to the buyers ear may actually eliminate some of the equip or at the very least require find tuning and alternate mounting locations.

I have to disagree to a certain extent. I agree that everyone hears differently, but there is such a thing as correct and incorrect acoustics. Correct and incorrect placement. There are clearly things that will sound better to everyone, and things that will sound worse to everyone. Installing a system that is done correctly and fine tuning it to your taste is a different thing than saying "all systems are personal".

It is a fact however that people get "used to" bad audio and video, and it becomes their reference over time. When that system is fixed, often times their immediate perception is that something is "missing". But it takes about a week to allow their senses to adjust to something proper, and if you give them their old system back, they absolutely cannot believe that is what they used to listen to or watch. I deal with this every single day at work.

In any event, I have never made a claim that what I am putting together for myself, and a few copies for others that may want to the same, is the end-all be-all. It is also a system that makes certain compromises. I am conscious about added weight, and alteration of the vehicle as well as quality of sound. The first two seem to not be in he equation for most installers. So all this is, is an experiment. If what I do is appealing to you and you want the same, I will try to make it available. If not, there are already hundreds of pieces of gear out there and many NSX specific pieces like our sub boxes.

I am however, as far as I know, the first person to be taking measurements and documenting things. Perhaps some installer some place used a DSP to tune the cabin of some NSX to his particular system, but I am trying to create something more universal without the added penalties of weight and vehicle alteration. Since all NSX's have the same acoustics in the cabin, that makes this possible.

 

[PHOEN$X]

If you are referring to the title of the thread, the reason I originally posted "you guys won't believe this", was because I was referring to the type of bass response I was able to get adding an aperiodic damper to the woofer. I was very surprised of the response myself, and so I said "you guys won't believe this" as in "you won't believe what is working".

Gee do I need to really explain myself on this?!

I am trying to do something worthwhile and good for the community, exploring all the options not trying to be "interesting". The interesting surprises that work or don't work regarding acoustics happen and I report.

You really made a post just to say you don't like my thread?!

I think Marc works in the same industry as you, so perhaps he didn't have time to properly articulate his thoughts. As an outsider who used to enjoy reading about a/v equipment (via "Stereophile" and "Sound & Vision" publications), I find what you're doing interesting even though I don't understand a lot of it. I'm glad that you're so open to sharing what you're doing, and am looking forward to seeing the end product(s).

 

[Valhalla]

Subscribed and following this very closely. I love that fact that you are trying to make our NSX's sound system current. Yes there is a lot of high end gear out there. If I were made of money I might go to XYZ Installations and just plunk a wad of greenbacks on the counter and tell them to install an awesome audio system. But God knows what would be installed/hacked up and how much it would cost and weigh.

I appreciate Dave's attempts here to provide details on how to install your own system, with options as to costs and high end if you want to go there. The spectrum of NSX owners ranges from the miserly to the what-ever-it-costs group. I like options and can appreciate compromises as long as I am aware of the costs of those compromises. You go Dave!

 

[UnhuZ]

Hi,

Dave, from this thread and from all you have been posting, i can resume your
work in the following topics:

- Not a single custom work that modifies the car (irreversibly)
- Retain a OEMish system (you even keep some or all enclosures)
- save weight
- keep costs reasonable
- improve enormously the sound quality

If you manage to follow all of them, i think you will have a winning solution.

Of corse not all of Primers are sensible to this, and may want more bling for whatever reasons, but i think you will have a good target, this if you decide to sell kits.

If you do so, i can only see 2 options:

- OEM Sub enclosure with different driver
- 1 or 2 bazookas in front of the seat/seats

i closely follow your work, and i can even tell you i will remove every OEM component this next weekend. I can't use it as it is right now, and then it's ready for whatever work it will need to be done.

Keep up with this excellent work.

Thanks,
Nuno

 

[Valhalla]

Hi,

Dave, from this thread and from all you have been posting, i can resume your
work in the following topics:

- Not a single custom work that modifies the car (irreversibly)
- Retain a OEMish system (you even keep some or all enclosures)
- save weight
- keep costs reasonable
- improve enormously the sound quality

If you manage to follow all of them, i think you will have a winning solution.


Thanks,
Nuno

^^^^^^^This.

 

[biscuits]

Ugh. Why do you always reply to a post with condesention and dismissal only to agree or affirm the very point made in said post?

I've got two decades of experience in car audio. I suggested an ESP of some sort then you tell me how flawed they are only to post that you've looked Ito them all apparently. Then when I post that audio is subjective you Agrre with me but then don't?

Sorry I tried to help.. I'm out.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Thanks guys. So have any of you had firsthand experience using rhino liner truck bed liner? I saw some in a spray can and it looks like it becomes a rather hard shell after it dries. I haven't used the stuff but I'm wondering if it would add some stiffness to the OEM enclosures. It'd be an easy spray on.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Biscuits you have a strange take to my very factual reply. I don't know for the life of me where I was "condescending" or impolite. Just because I disagree with you on some things doesn't mean I'm being condescending to you. I don't know how I can say things in a more factual and non-personal way. I'm happy to talk acoustics if that's what you'd like to do.

 

[Valhalla]

I know that the Rhino truck bed liner is similar to Line-X. Line-X is awesome. In fact the Marines send their Humvees to the Line-X dealer in San Diego to shoot the entire bottom of the vehicles to aid in IED protection. The stuff is that strong. It sure would aid in "wrapping" your enclosures.

 

[LMR]

Thanks guys. So have any of you had firsthand experience using rhino liner truck bed liner? I saw some in a spray can and it looks like it becomes a rather hard shell after it dries. I haven't used the stuff but I'm wondering if it would add some stiffness to the OEM enclosures. It'd be an easy spray on.

I have Rhino liner as a protective coating on the rock sliders on my 4Runner and it's very durable. It was done by Rhino but I would think the spray can would work good for your intended use.

 

[TURBO2GO]

I have Rhino liner as a protective coating on the rock sliders on my 4Runner and it's very durable. It was done by Rhino but I would think the spray can would work good for your intended use.

It's a bit rugh too, isn't it? I'm going to tray a can. See if it does anything. Might as well go all the way and make the enclosures as good as possible.

 

[Valhalla]

When it dries it is a rough texture. Rougher than a crinkle finish and 5 times thicker. It will seal well and for a long time.

 

[TURBO2GO]

When it dries it is a rough texture. Rougher than a crinkle finish and 5 times thicker. It will seal well and for a long time.

Have you seen this X stuff in a can?

 

[Valhalla]

Line-X is only applied by licensed dealers. You can find them everywhere and they may give you a deal on spraying your boxes at their store locally. Stuff is amazing. Lifetime guarantee on the product and if it does fail or scrub off, go to any Line-X dealer anywhere and they will re-shoot it for free.

 

[LMR]

I would try the Rhino spray can as it will be a lot cheaper and for your application should work just fine.

 

[Valhalla]

I agree with Les. A can of Rhino spray will be way cheaper than Line-X.

 

[01blacks4]

If you are referring to the title of the thread, the reason I originally posted "you guys won't believe this", was because I was referring to the type of bass response I was able to get adding an aperiodic damper to the woofer. I was very surprised of the response myself, and so I said "you guys won't believe this" as in "you won't believe what is working".

Gee do I need to really explain myself on this?!

I am trying to do something worthwhile and good for the community, exploring all the options not trying to be "interesting". The interesting surprises that work or don't work regarding acoustics happen and I report.

You really made a post just to say you don't like my thread?!

actually turbo..your really not using a aperi setup. these would need to be tuned and i dont think you tuned these. the system you are using will not play lower, i repeat it can not make a woofer play lower than its FS. the only thing that this system can do is smooth off the response, by controling the cone excursion. similar to a box. actually a box can make a woofer play lower or louder. the aperi can not. i wasnt being rude, your just trying to do what we all did 20 years ago

line x and most spray can stuff will not help resonance as it is to stiff and brittle it you actuall measure things pre and post you will find this out.

 

[TURBO2GO]

actually turbo..your really not using a aperi setup. these would need to be tuned and i dont think you tuned these. the system you are using will not play lower, i repeat it can not make a woofer play lower than its FS. the only thing that this system can do is smooth off the response, by controling the cone excursion. similar to a box. actually a box can make a woofer play lower or louder. the aperi can not. i wasnt being rude, your just trying to do what we all did 20 years ago .

Well thank you for a more precise post.

What you are referring to applies in an ideal situation for a woofer, it is correct in theory, but it does not apply to what I was posting about. That is not the situation I was comparing it to. The actual comparison was between the woofer mounted on a currently available door plate, and one with the woofer within the back half of the enclosure breathing through a damper. I did spend a lot of time tuning it, I took actual measurements with a calibrated microphone for an entire day. This is very labor intensive work. This was a Rockford woofer, and it's not like they gave me thiele-small parameters. It's all a lot of trial and error.

As far as the spray, we are talking about a plastic enclosure that is prone to flex. Anything that stiffens it will help, and I am looking to do so without adding a lot of weight. It's a moot point now anyway, because even after hacking up my woofer, it still will not fit in the factory box and I am going with a different driver. That driver likes to see a ported box and not a sealed one, so it is much less critical in that situation.

 

[TURBO2GO]

I think finally my long hard search for a proper crossover is coming to an end. This unit has pretty much everything I am looking for. High pass for the tweets, a band pass for the door speakers, a sub EQ, time delay, and a remote controller all at a reasonable price. Small, and light. 32 step all done in the digital domain. Even has a compressor for speaker protection at high levels with adjustable limits, stolen right out of professional audio gear. Something like this a few years ago was $2000 not $300. Seems like a really remarkable piece for the $. Not overdone, just right. I am very happy. This is great news for all of us. It is just starting to ship. I will get my hands on one of the very first ones.

 

[TURBO2GO]

I have to start getting into the center channel area. I've searched for photos of what is back there but not found much. Who knows about that space? Does that center channel have an enclosure?