perhaps less tongue in cheek i can add this comment: WHen i purchased my '03 TL type S it was september '03. I asked what the pricing was on the new '04 TL (which was due in 6 weeks and the salesman said they didn't know, and in fact were not told of what the MSRP on the '03 was until the literal morning of delivery of the '03's... so, if Honda keeps it under wraps that tightly, i wouldn't trust a friggin thing from anyone until i see the car on the lot.