I am seriously interested in buying a 2002 NSX and I am finding dealers all around the country that are discounting their 2002 NSX's down to the low 70's. Should I take this that they want out of these in anticipation of something new? I know there doesn't seem to be any real hard evidence of a replacement, but it sure seems interesting to see such deep discounts. Am I wrong in this assumption? What are your thoughts here?
Should I be hesitant to buy a new 2002 now?
- Thread starter Rococo
- Start date
I think they're worried that if they don't sell them in the next 4-6 weeks, they're going to have to cover the floor costs (financing) to keep them in the showroom until next spring, since the sports car market is pretty quiet over the winter.
All indications are that the NSX will be sold for at least another year before the next generation NSX comes out. (And my personal belief, based on nothing concrete other than things never happening on schedule anywhere, is that it might be another 6-12 months before the next gen is here.)
I think a 2002 for low 70s (low 70s? best I had heard was $75K) is a great deal. If you want one, get it. If you're worried about depreciation though, get a used NSX instead of a new one - and the older, the better.
All indications are that the NSX will be sold for at least another year before the next generation NSX comes out. (And my personal belief, based on nothing concrete other than things never happening on schedule anywhere, is that it might be another 6-12 months before the next gen is here.)
I think a 2002 for low 70s (low 70s? best I had heard was $75K) is a great deal. If you want one, get it. If you're worried about depreciation though, get a used NSX instead of a new one - and the older, the better.
It's my guess that the discounted selling prices are more due to:
1) decreasing demand for the NSX, in general (has been slowing decreasing for a number of years: 10+ year old design, less hp than competition, etc.),
2) low interest in the minor facelift, and
3) the economy.
It seems like the economy is a major factor considering the prices of 97+ seem to have dropped dramatically over the last year (even accounting for sharp initial depreciation).
------------------
ojaspatel.com/nsx
1) decreasing demand for the NSX, in general (has been slowing decreasing for a number of years: 10+ year old design, less hp than competition, etc.),
2) low interest in the minor facelift, and
3) the economy.
It seems like the economy is a major factor considering the prices of 97+ seem to have dropped dramatically over the last year (even accounting for sharp initial depreciation).
------------------
ojaspatel.com/nsx
Sales of the 2002 are up somewhat over the previous year.
http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=35298
But the numbers are still so small that it's somewhat meaningless.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=35298
But the numbers are still so small that it's somewhat meaningless.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
Wow! As of August, they already sold 158 NSX out of 200 cars that are allocated to US. You better get the car while there are some left.
How much is the lowest offer that you have?
I am looking to get one Imola Orange color maybe next year if I don't like the next generation NSX. I think it is supposed to be shown on Fall of next year Japan auto show.
How much is the lowest offer that you have?
I am looking to get one Imola Orange color maybe next year if I don't like the next generation NSX. I think it is supposed to be shown on Fall of next year Japan auto show.
My opinion is that we will all see the 02 cars selling for less money than the 00,01 NSXs within a year. I believe a 00 NSX in one year will still bring 64-68k, an 01 will still bring 67-73k while the 02's will sell for 63-67k. The 02/03 NSXs will be looked at as the least desirable NSXs in a few years unless, of course, the 'new' 04 NSX is even more of an abomination..... Opinion only....
It's hard for me to picture a scenario that will result in rising prices for the '02 NSX. If the next gen car is highly desirable, '02's and '03's will take the biggest hit. If the next gen car is a complete flop, people will be no more interested in '02's and '03's than a clean older car. I'd say wait and see what happens with the next gen car.
While I respect Todd's opinions on current pricing, I don't agree with this speculation. I think the 02 will always sell for more than the '00-01, because (a) "newer" is perceived as "better" (a newer car almost always sells for more than the lower model); (b) the '02 has some nice functional improvements, like the HID and the wheels; and (c) the difference in appearance is so minor that I seriously doubt that very many people would let it affect their decision.
Of course, this is merely conjecture, just like Todd's. Let's re-surface this topic in September 2003 and we can see who turns out to be right.
New cars almost always depreciate. I don't think anyone is predicting that an '02 NSX will go up in price. The question is, how much will it go down.
Like the comment about being able to buy an '03 Imola Orange when the next gen car comes out, you need to realize that there aren't going to be very many new current-gen cars available at the time when the new ones come out, so you may not have much choice. You may or may not be able to get the color you want, and you may or may not be able to get the price you want. This is the exact same situation we have had for the past few years, at the end of each model year, when there have been only a few new NSXs still available.
You know, after looking at the sales numbers once again it is really kind of amazing that there's only a few hundred NSX sold here per year.
I can understand why Honda is not selling 4000 per year but I am surprised that they can't sell at least a paltry 1000 or 2000 units per year.
Sure, it might not have the same marque recognition as Porsche, Ferrari or even the Corvette, but I would have expected there would be at least a few thousand people who would appreciate this car.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
I can understand why Honda is not selling 4000 per year but I am surprised that they can't sell at least a paltry 1000 or 2000 units per year.
Sure, it might not have the same marque recognition as Porsche, Ferrari or even the Corvette, but I would have expected there would be at least a few thousand people who would appreciate this car.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
If you look at Best Motoring International 4.. where they Test the 2002 NSX vs ALL the old NSX's. (typeS, S-zero, R), The 2002 car did really well. They loved the way it handled and immediately said it was better than the old cars. Of course, theirs was a 2002 type S. But, nonetheless, the said the new car was a definite improvement. They were not sold on the styling, but they said as long as it is fast, who cares
I think right now the biggest competition for the 2002 NSX is the 1991-1997 NSX. They're a lot lower in price and they're otherwise quite similar.
I also think for the next-gen NSX to sell well, it will have to be overall a lot better than the current one. If they come out with a 3200-pound car with, say, 350 hp and it costs $90K, it's not going to do much better. Bump the horses up a lot more than that, and/or bump the price down significantly, and it will sell more.
But what if they added a lame 50hp electric motor
I think Honda thought back in the late 80s that they could successfully compete against Porsche and Ferrari.
From a pure product perspective I think they can and did compete quite well.
From a marketing perspective I think they failed.
For whatever reasons Honda/Acura is not successfully competing with these marques with the NSX. I think the lame sales figures (except for the first two or three years) show that.
In my opinion, if Honda wants to sell more than few hundred NSX's per year then they have to make significant changes as suggested AND lower the price somewhat.
A $65K-$80K MSRP would still be a notch above the Corvette and in Porsche territory. If Honda sold a few thousand per year, we would still have a very exclusive automobile.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
From a pure product perspective I think they can and did compete quite well.
From a marketing perspective I think they failed.
For whatever reasons Honda/Acura is not successfully competing with these marques with the NSX. I think the lame sales figures (except for the first two or three years) show that.
In my opinion, if Honda wants to sell more than few hundred NSX's per year then they have to make significant changes as suggested AND lower the price somewhat.
A $65K-$80K MSRP would still be a notch above the Corvette and in Porsche territory. If Honda sold a few thousand per year, we would still have a very exclusive automobile.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
Maybe Honda just doesn't care anymore. Maybe Honda just feels that building cars like the accord and civic and the image that those cars bring is more important than their sports car line up.
I mean, Honda is a maker of a variety of different vehicle for different purposes, not just the NSX.
Ferrari and Porsche ONLY build sports cars (and in Porsche's case, a fast SUV as well).
With the name Porsche or Ferrari, u know right away that u r talking about some sort of sports car. With Honda and Acura, people have no idea and would most likely think u r talking about an accord, civic, CRV, MDX, etc.
Something like this is very hard to change...
------------------
2001 NSX-T
- Bilstein Shocks
- '02 OEM Wheels
I mean, Honda is a maker of a variety of different vehicle for different purposes, not just the NSX.
Ferrari and Porsche ONLY build sports cars (and in Porsche's case, a fast SUV as well).
With the name Porsche or Ferrari, u know right away that u r talking about some sort of sports car. With Honda and Acura, people have no idea and would most likely think u r talking about an accord, civic, CRV, MDX, etc.
Something like this is very hard to change...
------------------
2001 NSX-T
- Bilstein Shocks
- '02 OEM Wheels
That's a good point and it's probably one reason why Honda has found tough to complete with these marques.
I think for most people Honda is kind of like a VW and Acura is kind of like an Audi.
Honda is unlikely to change this perception any time soon.
That's not to say that the NSX doesn't belong in the Acura lineup. Audi could probably offer a similar vehicle. But I think it's unreasonable to think that the NSX could ever compete on a marketing/perception basis with Ferrari.
It might be possible to compete with certain Porsche models (standard 911 and the Boxsters) however.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
I think for most people Honda is kind of like a VW and Acura is kind of like an Audi.
Honda is unlikely to change this perception any time soon.
That's not to say that the NSX doesn't belong in the Acura lineup. Audi could probably offer a similar vehicle. But I think it's unreasonable to think that the NSX could ever compete on a marketing/perception basis with Ferrari.
It might be possible to compete with certain Porsche models (standard 911 and the Boxsters) however.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
I agree with most of the past few posts, but...
...at least let's give them credit for keeping the NSX in production all these years. As sales dropped, it would have been very easy to kill it off, as happened with most of the Japanese sports cars in the mid nineties. If Honda were only interested in its image for family cars and compact cars, the NSX would have been dropped long ago.
...at least let's give them credit for keeping the NSX in production all these years. As sales dropped, it would have been very easy to kill it off, as happened with most of the Japanese sports cars in the mid nineties. If Honda were only interested in its image for family cars and compact cars, the NSX would have been dropped long ago.
A car has it's largest drop in market value the first 3 to 4 years. I do not care if you buy it at dealer invoice you will loose $5000 a year for the next 3 to 4 years. Your best value is a low mileage 4 to 7 years old NSX
Good point. I was wondering how does the NSX sales fair in their domestic market, Japan?
It seems like most japanese sports cars gets discontinued here in the US(like the MR2, Supra, 300ZX, RX-7, 3000GT) but continue to be available in their domestic market. I know the 3000GT has been axed in Japan as well now, what about the rest?
------------------
2001 NSX-T
- Bilstein Shocks
- '02 OEM Wheels
Originally posted by NetViper:
But what if they added a lame 50hp electric motor
Please, please, please, stop making those type of comments. Someone may take that comment to heart @ Acura. All talk of electric assistmust die!!!
Heh...Heh...
Yeah, that's right.
We wouldn't even want a kick-butt 50 HP electric motor let alone a lame one.
...or at least, I don't think so.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
Yeah, that's right.
We wouldn't even want a kick-butt 50 HP electric motor let alone a lame one.
...or at least, I don't think so.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
I still believe there won't be a new generation of NSX - it just wouldn't make sense. Honda has lost money all these years by continuing to produce the NSX. Sure, they can afford it and they did it to keep the image of a high performance/exotic car in the showrooms and on the street, but to top the current NSX and the competition from Porsche and Ferrari Honda would have to spend a pile of money producing the car.
The end result IMO would be warm sales the first year or two and a sure decline later on. If one can buy a Ferrari or a Porsche for the same price, one will buy one of those other two. Those of us who are buying new NSXs (I'm one of the 200+ people who bought a new NSX in 1999) are a rarity because we either fell in love with the car years ago and have been waiting to have the cash to do it, or care more about the NSX virtues than the status symbol a Ferrari or a Porsche provides - very few people indeed.
What Honda might do is to produce a car that will compete with the Boxster in the 50K range - that car will not be of the NSX caliber, no matter what they want to call it.
To answer the original question: get a new car now because the new generation will be horribly expensive (if it comes) or it will not be up to the NSX sophistication. I disagree with the previous comment that the '02 is not substantially different from the old car, it is! Honda just ruined the timeless look of our classic NSX - I'm so glad I have the classic car. The '02 model will be much less desirable in the next few years. As always, this is just my opinion - of course.
The end result IMO would be warm sales the first year or two and a sure decline later on. If one can buy a Ferrari or a Porsche for the same price, one will buy one of those other two. Those of us who are buying new NSXs (I'm one of the 200+ people who bought a new NSX in 1999) are a rarity because we either fell in love with the car years ago and have been waiting to have the cash to do it, or care more about the NSX virtues than the status symbol a Ferrari or a Porsche provides - very few people indeed.
What Honda might do is to produce a car that will compete with the Boxster in the 50K range - that car will not be of the NSX caliber, no matter what they want to call it.
To answer the original question: get a new car now because the new generation will be horribly expensive (if it comes) or it will not be up to the NSX sophistication. I disagree with the previous comment that the '02 is not substantially different from the old car, it is! Honda just ruined the timeless look of our classic NSX - I'm so glad I have the classic car. The '02 model will be much less desirable in the next few years. As always, this is just my opinion - of course.
Wait a minute. Lots of folks here are willing to spend thousands to get a supercharger to add hp and drop their quarter mile times by a good second. So nobody here would want an additional electric motor even if it could achieve the same result?
I think you're all too stuck in thinking about how the technology was used in the past, in ways that would not have achieved these results. Hopefully, if Honda is considering this, they have the imagination that is lacking here, and will only deploy it if it does result in great improvements in performance.
If it does indeed perform, those who poo-poo the idea will see only the taillights of the new version, when it passes them by.
And if it fails to perform, it won't sell, so no one will see it at all.
They will win us over, or not, based on the results. I'll cut them slack and won't pre-judge them. They did a nice job the last time, and they know what they're doing.
[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 09 September 2002).]
In its early years, it did much better than in the United States. In the last few years, it has done much worse.
Japan has about 44 percent as many people as the United States (127 million vs 288 million), so keep that in mind. For this look at the numbers, we'll leave out Canada, which tends to follow the same ups and downs as the States, at about 11 percent the size (31 million).
In its first few years, the NSX sold about as many cars in Japan as in the States. Which means on a per capita basis, it was twice as popular as here. In the past few years, it has done much worse in Japan, where it has only sold 20-30 percent as many cars as in the States, so it's less popular on a per capita basis.
Overall sales numbers for the States are in the FAQ here through '98, and has sold 200-300 cars each year since. Sales numbers for Japan are here. Numbers for any specific year are not directly comparable, since the American numbers are by model year and the Japanese numbers are by calendar year (or, alternatively, their model year may reflect the calendar year in which the car was sold, I'm not sure which).
I think most people are willing to give Honda the benefit of the doubt when it comes to what will power a next-gen NSX, but I suspect many people have some valid technical-engineering concerns why a hybrid NSX would be undesirable.
Superchargers are very light for the power they create. Batteries are not. Unless there's a technological battery breakthrough that we've haven't heard about, I doubt a hybrid NSX could remain true to the original mission of a lightweight, good handling sports car.
I have no doubt Honda could build a Hybrid performance vehicle such as the D-NX prototype we've seen, but that's a big heavy 4-door sports sedan and hardly a lithe, light sports car like the NSX.
In order to remain true to the original mission of the NSX, it's my opinion Honda could go with...
1. Larger displacement i-VTEC V6 with or without forced induction. 400 HP should be easily obtainable.
2. An i-VTEC V8 with or without forced induction. I see no reason why Honda couldn't extract 500 HP from such an engine.
Either one of these engines combined with keeping the weight under 2900 pounds, a sexy new body and a MSRP under $75K sounds like a winner in my book.
I'm certainly open to consider a Hybrid NSX and I have a lot of respect for Honda engineering, but as an engineer, I remain skeptical.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
[This message has been edited by Jimbo (edited 09 September 2002).]
Superchargers are very light for the power they create. Batteries are not. Unless there's a technological battery breakthrough that we've haven't heard about, I doubt a hybrid NSX could remain true to the original mission of a lightweight, good handling sports car.
I have no doubt Honda could build a Hybrid performance vehicle such as the D-NX prototype we've seen, but that's a big heavy 4-door sports sedan and hardly a lithe, light sports car like the NSX.
In order to remain true to the original mission of the NSX, it's my opinion Honda could go with...
1. Larger displacement i-VTEC V6 with or without forced induction. 400 HP should be easily obtainable.
2. An i-VTEC V8 with or without forced induction. I see no reason why Honda couldn't extract 500 HP from such an engine.
Either one of these engines combined with keeping the weight under 2900 pounds, a sexy new body and a MSRP under $75K sounds like a winner in my book.
I'm certainly open to consider a Hybrid NSX and I have a lot of respect for Honda engineering, but as an engineer, I remain skeptical.
-Jim
------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
http://homepage.mac.com/jimanders/PhotoAlbum1.html
[This message has been edited by Jimbo (edited 09 September 2002).]
And what I'm saying is, the engineers at Honda are aware of everything you've said. In fact, they've probably achieved as much in the corporate-objective areas of both high performance and fuel efficiency due to reducing the weight of their vehicles, as they have due to their engine technology. They are not going to suddenly forget the benefits of reducing weight.
More than any other major automaker, Honda is extremely unlikely to introduce a vehicle that is derided in the media for being overweight.
All the more so when it's a sports car that succeeds an all-aluminum sports car that was acclaimed for its performance and, particularly, its handling.
Nissan could get away with introducing a heavy sports car because it's in the $28K price range and because it's succeeding a previous-gen heavy sports car. I think you guys are silly for spending any time worrying that that will happen at Honda.
More than any other major automaker, Honda is extremely unlikely to introduce a vehicle that is derided in the media for being overweight.
All the more so when it's a sports car that succeeds an all-aluminum sports car that was acclaimed for its performance and, particularly, its handling.
Nissan could get away with introducing a heavy sports car because it's in the $28K price range and because it's succeeding a previous-gen heavy sports car. I think you guys are silly for spending any time worrying that that will happen at Honda.
Similar threads
- Locked
