NSX is one of the worst handling cars ever.

nsxtasy said:
No. You measure handling as "how it handles very close to the limit, regardless of where that limit occurs". The rest of the world measures handling as "how it handles at a given speed". By your definition, a wheelchair has better handling than an NSX, because a wheelchair has better handling at 2 mph than an NSX does at 150 mph. Most people would call that a bogus comparison.
Click to expand...

Wow I can’t believe that I am actually going to cross swords with NSXTASY.
This is really quite daunting.
I don’t think that my definition of handling is that far out of whack. The rest of the world do not all measure handling at a given speed. When Road and Track does a review on the new Ferrari Enzo. They don’t say we drove it at our usual 50 mph around the test track and if handled flawlessly so we went home. They talk about how the car “Handled” close to the limit. Because if it’s not close to the limit there is nothing to talk about. It just went around the corner and there was no under steer or over steer, no discussion of how much opposite lock was required.
Then we look at the slalom speed and the lap times and the skid pan numbers to make the non bogus comparison with other cars.

Regards,

Patrick
 
SugrueNSX said:
Wow I can’t believe that I am actually going to cross swords with NSXTASY.
This is really quite daunting.
I don’t think that my definition of handling is that far out of whack. The rest of the world do not all measure handling at a given speed. When Road and Track does a review on the new Ferrari Enzo. They don’t say we drove it at our usual 50 mph around the test track and if handled flawlessly so we went home. They talk about how the car “Handled” close to the limit. Because if it’s not close to the limit there is nothing to talk about. It just went around the corner and there was no under steer or over steer, no discussion of how much opposite lock was required.
Then we look at the slalom speed and the lap times and the skid pan numbers to make the non bogus comparison with other cars.

Regards,

Patrick
Click to expand...

*I* can't believe you're that much of an idiot. IF that's what you were talking about why didn't you say so in the first place ? (That's a rhetorical question BTW) Why didn't you refer to magazines taking the cars "to the limit" ?

You wanted to start shit and you did. So, you got what you wanted. You got your attention.

If *I* am talking to someone about the relative handling merits of a VW Golf vs a Corvette I would be referring to how the 'Vette takes a particular curve with grace and as if it was on rails where the Golf's body lean and apparent readiness to break loose would unnerve me AT THE SAME SPEED !!!

You've had your fun - now please don't go away mad - just go away ! :rolleyes:

That's it - I'm done here. (You're welcome :biggrin: )
 
nsxtasy said:
No. You measure handling as "how it handles very close to the limit, regardless of where that limit occurs". The rest of the world measures handling as "how it handles at a given speed". By your definition, a wheelchair has better handling than an NSX, because a wheelchair has better handling at 2 mph than an NSX does at 150 mph. Most people would call that a bogus comparison.
Click to expand...
Not to highjack this discussion but when I'm too old to drive, now I'll have thoughts of having a championship white titanium wheelchair, red upholstery, Type R emblems, R compound tires, lowered, white wheels. No stereo or A/C..:biggrin:

Sorry for the sidebar.
 
SoCalDude said:
Not to highjack this discussion but when I'm too old to drive, now I'll have thoughts of having a championship white titanium wheelchair, red upholstery, Type R emblems, R compound tires, lowered, white wheels. No stereo or A/C..:biggrin:

Sorry for the sidebar.
Click to expand...

No stereo ?!?!?! :eek: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:
 
NSX-GUY said:
No stereo ?!?!?! :eek: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:
Click to expand...
Part of the weight savings program.:tongue:
 
I think he needs to sell his NSX and get a fwd understeering pig of a car that he will feel safe in. He is obviously afraid of oversteer, mostly because he doesn't understand it.

Hopefully he will stay away far away from 911's.
 
SugrueNSX said:
The NSX is one of the worst handling cars ever built IMHO.
I expect that someone may disagree with me?
If so let us discuss in a calm manor.

Regards,

Patrick
Click to expand...

I have had a revelation.:rolleyes:

Your definition of handling and the logic you use to defend it are totally inverted.:eek:

So your inflammatory statement about the "NSX being one of the worst handling cars" is really a "very high compliment" of how the NSX actually preforms in "Our World"; where the definition of handling is based on the ability of a car to respond to the divers input and precisely execute his intentions under his guidance at the highest speed possible.:cool:

I will now retire from this discussion to ponder why I am so grateful God made Guinness. :biggrin:
 
Bob Kenney said:
I have had a revelation.:rolleyes:

Your definition of handling and the logic you use to defend it are totally inverted.:eek:
Click to expand...
I honestly thought that was the point he was trying to make from post #1. The way I read it was that he was complimenting the NSX because he was essentially saying that performance and handling are inversely proportional to one another. Thus if the NSX is one of the worst handling cars then it is one of the best performing cars.
 
SugrueNSX said:
I have never driven an EVO.
I spent some time in an STI on a skid pan. (wet and dry) Is it anything like that?

Regards,

Patrick
Click to expand...

Had WRX, Evo 8, Evo 8MR, and good friend had 04 STi and 05 STi. The evo is easier to drive and more percise than the STi. STi feel more raw and more fun. The Evo is strange. When you drive slower you are faster and feels like a factory tunned lancer race car :wink:
 
redshift said:
I honestly thought that was the point he was trying to make from post #1. The way I read it was that he was complimenting the NSX because he was essentially saying that performance and handling are inversely proportional to one another. Thus if the NSX is one of the worst handling cars then it is one of the best performing cars.
Click to expand...

This is what i was assuming also by his posts. I think it was the titile of this thread that made it what it is.
 
I think I know where's he's coming from on this.

I think with extreme capabilities come extreme consequences for problems, where minor "handling" idiocyncracies are major given higher speeds and limits.

That said, I don't think I agree.

In my definition of handling, I'm focused on what the car does, how it behaves, and how it reacts to my inputs. If it gets out of shape, what does it communicate? If I make a correction, how does it respond?

True, I can drive my Miata 45 degrees sideways and catch it easily. It's so light. But I was surprised that given some too-aggressive inputs with the throttle that I can dirt-track the heavier NSX with its inertia mass mostly behind me wanting to do what it wants. Is it as comfortable and confidence-inspiring? No. Is it as responsive to corrections? No, it can't be due to its weight. Does it handle badly? No, since it reacts well to corrections.

If you ham-fist a car with razor-sharp responses, you won't like the result. If you mash the gas exiting a turn in car with a high-torque motor, you won't like the result. However, if you control your inputs you'll find that the "handling" of most high-performing cars is indeed commensurate with their performance.

Remember that with higher limits and higher capabilities come more extreme consequences, and requires higher skills to control. I don't, however, equate that to poor handling.
 
dquarasr2 said:
Remember that with higher limits and higher capabilities come more extreme consequences, and requires higher skills to control.
Click to expand...

I think this is the point the OP was trying to get accross; what created such carnage on this thread was the part where he labeled that discription as handling.
 
redshift said:
I honestly thought that was the point he was trying to make from post #1. The way I read it was that he was complimenting the NSX because he was essentially saying that performance and handling are inversely proportional to one another. Thus if the NSX is one of the worst handling cars then it is one of the best performing cars.
Click to expand...

This is true.

Regards,

Patrick
 
Scin said:
I think he needs to sell his NSX and get a fwd understeering pig of a car that he will feel safe in. He is obviously afraid of oversteer, mostly because he doesn't understand it.

Hopefully he will stay away far away from 911's.
Click to expand...

Me afraid of oversteer? Why just the other night I was coming on to my favorite on ramp and I’m doing about 65 mph so I short shift into 3rd before I commit to the turn and I’m going in a bit hot and the back starts to come around and before I know it I have lifted of the throttle just a bit. I could not help myself, and the back goes light and starts to come around even more but I have some opposite lock on now and it’s not too bad other than the fact I have big concrete barriers both sides. So I figure I have been driving for half an hour and my tires are warm so I check my mirrors coz I know I’m going to need both lanes and I get on the gas and now I have full on power oversteer and I just drift the NSX all the way around that curve and just unwind the steering on exit with just a little wiggle the car straightens up and I red line it and grab 4th and then I wake up.
Your damn right I’m frightened of oversteer in an NSX.

Regards,

Patrick
 
then I wake up.
Your damn right I’m frightened of oversteer
Click to expand...

Damn Patrick!! Got me believing that for 5 seconds...... It could be done, I did once and ever since then my wife would say something when I approach any 90 degree corner in 2 nd gear....

Are you coming to meet us at Red Robin tomorrow night? It's been a while (maybe more than a year) I've last talked to you.

I didn't read all the posts as there are a lot more attacks than I cared, anyway, I do understand your reasoning... My dad used to go to the Mitsubishi's dealership for service and I would be the one who got their POS Mirage Loaner, everytime I'm amazed how well it handled, and I'm basically going balls in to my favorite corners on my way to work, tires howling, slightly pushing the car offline, then throttle steered the car. Everytime I got off the car, I looked at those $30 Sears tires (or worse), I would have a mental shock that, 1. the drive was kind of fun, 2. Why are we spending 30k for sports cars? 3. Why are we pouring tens of thousands to modify it.??

I believed one pointed out the comfort level and /or the limit of the car, a lot of avg. people would think that if they have a Porsche 997 GT3 race car today, they could beat other guys out there at the track. Experience told me that more likely he would be humilated by other good drivers out there driving a less capable car or he would put the GT3 into the wall. My point is the driver's skills goes hand in hand with a faster car. You put me into any F1 car today, I will stall it or just passed out in my own piss at the end of the straightaway.... :)

Funny that some of you mentioned STI / Evo, this is something that nsx started it all, cars nowaday already took an evolution that a chimp could drive "pretty fast" in a AMG, M series, Audi s?... not unlike that before man ever goes out of space, we sent a chimp up to the sky. NSX is definately not falling out of the league, but to archeive the same performance, you have to drive harder and you feel a lot more. However once you getting used to all those information the car components sent you. You would scared the way a STI and EVO drives. There's not much feedback, yet, you are taking a lot of faith dive bombing into a corner and let the car took care of you.

As a miata, I just purchased a used one for 2.5k, hardly a set of rims for the nsx. I hate to admit that, but I like it more and more. I wouldn't think your wife would say anything if you just go snatch one from Ebay.
 
NSXDreamer2 said:
Damn Patrick!! Got me believing that for 5 seconds...... It could be done, I did once and ever since then my wife would say something when I approach any 90 degree corner in 2 nd gear....

Are you coming to meet us at Red Robin tomorrow night? It's been a while (maybe more than a year) I've last talked to you.

I didn't read all the posts as there are a lot more attacks than I cared, anyway, I do understand your reasoning... My dad used to go to the Mitsubishi's dealership for service and I would be the one who got their POS Mirage Loaner, everytime I'm amazed how well it handled, and I'm basically going balls in to my favorite corners on my way to work, tires howling, slightly pushing the car offline, then throttle steered the car. Everytime I got off the car, I looked at those $30 Sears tires (or worse), I would have a mental shock that, 1. the drive was kind of fun, 2. Why are we spending 30k for sports cars? 3. Why are we pouring tens of thousands to modify it.??

I believed one pointed out the comfort level and /or the limit of the car, a lot of avg. people would think that if they have a Porsche 997 GT3 race car today, they could beat other guys out there at the track. Experience told me that more likely he would be humilated by other good drivers out there driving a less capable car or he would put the GT3 into the wall. My point is the driver's skills goes hand in hand with a faster car. You put me into any F1 car today, I will stall it or just passed out in my own piss at the end of the straightaway.... :)

Funny that some of you mentioned STI / Evo, this is something that nsx started it all, cars nowaday already took an evolution that a chimp could drive "pretty fast" in a AMG, M series, Audi s?... not unlike that before man ever goes out of space, we sent a chimp up to the sky. NSX is definately not falling out of the league, but to archeive the same performance, you have to drive harder and you feel a lot more. However once you getting used to all those information the car components sent you. You would scared the way a STI and EVO drives. There's not much feedback, yet, you are taking a lot of faith dive bombing into a corner and let the car took care of you.

As a miata, I just purchased a used one for 2.5k, hardly a set of rims for the nsx. I hate to admit that, but I like it more and more. I wouldn't think your wife would say anything if you just go snatch one from Ebay.
Click to expand...

Well if anyone could do it, it would be you. I will never forget that ride you gave me at SIR.
So are we talking about Wednesday night at Red Robin? Which one and what time?
Let me know and I will be there.

Regards,

Patrick
 
btcog82 said:
Edit, so...hope no one feels the edit was directed towards them
Click to expand...

This post is also not directed at anyone.

Edited for the sensitive reader.

If you have nothing to contribute then shut the heck up you mother hecking moron. Go heck yourself and stop acting like a complete heck up.

End edit.

Regards,

Patrick
 
SugrueNSX said:
This post is also not directed at anyone.

Edited for the sensitive reader.

If you have nothing to contribute then shut the heck up you mother hecking moron. Go heck yourself and stop acting like a complete heck up.

End edit.

Regards,

Patrick
Click to expand...

Pretty much what you're saying is the car handles so well it makes me want to push hard past the limits, I loose it , so it must be a poor handling car.
I know you'll disagree with that but sorry, it's a catch 22.

To compare the handling of, say, a Yugo and a NSX, drive both on the same surface at the same speed. Which one "handles" better?

Then there is the performace /handling logic.

A simple semantic splitting of hairs, and I really must be bored to even respond at this length, my god, I need to get a life.:biggrin:
 
SugrueNSX said:
This post is also not directed at anyone.

Edited for the sensitive reader.

If you have nothing to contribute then shut the heck up you mother hecking moron. Go heck yourself and stop acting like a complete heck up.

End edit.

Regards,

Patrick
Click to expand...

Perhaps you should take your own advice ???

You've contributed nothing but your circular (and pretty ridiculous) "logic".

:rolleyes::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

[edited to put quotes around "logic" - or should that be ""logic"" ? :biggrin:]
 
gene said:
Pretty much what you're saying is the car handles so well it makes me want to push hard past the limits, I loose it , so it must be a poor handling car.
I know you'll disagree with that but sorry, it's a catch 22.

To compare the handling of, say, a Yugo and a NSX, drive both on the same surface at the same speed. Which one "handles" better?

Then there is the performace /handling logic.

A simple semantic splitting of hairs, and I really must be bored to even respond at this length, my god, I need to get a life.:biggrin:
Click to expand...


You are wrong! I don’t disagree with you.
O man now I’m really confused.
But seriously Its obvious that you get it.
I LOVE my NSX but I also like to experience over steer and control it with the throttle.
And the NSX is not the best car to do that with on a public highway or even the track.
One day when I’m a super duper driver maybe. So as others have pointed out I think I also need a Miata to practice my skills because I suck.

Regards,

Patrick
 

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