760NSX said:
This kit is independent of rim size. Just imagine the hub tilting/rotating in positive camber direction.
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NSX Camber Kit Before and After Photos
- Thread starter Thom
- Start date
This kit is independent of rim size. Just imagine the hub tilting/rotating in positive camber direction.
Exactly!!!B Feelgood said:
Planning of lowering the NSX soon and I was told by the alignment shop that they wont be able to bring the alignment back to specs.
I hope this camber kit will be able to correct all those lowered NSX alignment issues.:smile:
Thom.
Do you have any sample photos of the prototype, so we can have a better idea how this kit looks like?
amgnsx said:
I'll release some information on the kit's features when the Provisional patent is fully submitted. Upon a USPTO "Patent Pending" allowance of display on the item I'll post it. Thanks for the interest.
Looks like a nice product, good luck.
Just want to point out camber does not cause tire wear, toe causes tires to wear on the inside edge. I am running 2.6 degrees negative camber on the rear and my tires wear almost perfectly flat because I run 0.1 degree of toe in. The down side of such little toe is the car is effected by 'truck ruts' in the pavement to quite a high degree.
Just want to point out camber does not cause tire wear, toe causes tires to wear on the inside edge. I am running 2.6 degrees negative camber on the rear and my tires wear almost perfectly flat because I run 0.1 degree of toe in. The down side of such little toe is the car is effected by 'truck ruts' in the pavement to quite a high degree.
I can not see how the negative camber is not the factor in excessive tire wear that lowered NSX's have. If your settings truly were the answer, why does everyone here eat tires left and right with lowered suspensions? I am not trying to start an argument, just wondering how your miracle cure is such a secret to the rest of the world.
Back on topic: What is the estimated cost of this kit?
Back on topic: What is the estimated cost of this kit?
Thank you so much for making this possible. I am interested in your camber kit as well. I am sick and tired of my rear tires looking like this from behind / \, I hate that look. Your before/after pics came out great, exactly what I need.
I currently have -2.7 degree ~ -3 degree rear camber. I will like to reduce the camber to -1 degree
I currently have -2.7 degree ~ -3 degree rear camber. I will like to reduce the camber to -1 degree
Shumdit said:
Check the toe settings, all of them run 2 to 3 times as much toe. Stock toe settings eat up tires. That is why Honda gave away so many tires for the folks who bought the first NSXs, then they changed the spec to get acceptable wear.
I run 2 degrees negative in the front with 0.1 degree toe out as well. The fronts do get some wear on the inside, but my rears are pretty damn flat. If you run as little toe as I do, there is a price in the way the car feels when driving over regular roads, most folks are not willing to make the trade off of 'hands free tracking'. I like almost no toe, both front and rear, the car feels great under threshold braking on the track and I don't mind that it wanders a bit on the interstate.
More toe sets up tension in the sidewalls of the tires which makes the car start to turn quicker, and the tension between the tires make the car track straighter. The price you pay for this is wear, the tires are scrubbing as you drive, and wearing out. If the inside edge(negative camber) is making contact with more force, it will be the side which wears out first. The less toe there is, the less the tires scrub and wear. I have gotten 50% more tire life by reducing the toe settings.
I think it is great someone is offering a camber kit, tires will wear less quickly if the camber is close to 0 degrees. My point is that toe is the component of the alignment which causes wear, camber just makes it so it shows up on the inside of the tire first. All of you would increase your tire life if you reduced the amount of toe, no matter what you do with the camber. Personally, I am working on a camber kit which will increase the negative camber for track use, but you don't have to make a permanent change to the suspension arms, like the Comptech offset bushings. These will have mono-ball pivots to reduce deflection, plus be sealed to keep grease around the bearings. The fronts should be reversible, so they could be a nice compliment with the ones Thom is working on for the rear...
This would be quite a nice product if it comes to market, works and is safe.
Owners who have lowered cars, resulting in neg. camber, some as far as -3 or greater, will finally get to revisit what it feels like to drive a NSX as it was intended. They will no longer be driving with only 3" of the rear tire making contact.
I always thought it ironic that folks lowered their cars and got wider tires only to result in a much smaller contact patch except when under hard cornering at the track which for the most part is seldom or never.
When I raised my car up and got the rear camber to just a -.25 degree over the spec., I was surprised just how much I gained in handling and feel.
Owners who have lowered cars, resulting in neg. camber, some as far as -3 or greater, will finally get to revisit what it feels like to drive a NSX as it was intended. They will no longer be driving with only 3" of the rear tire making contact.
I always thought it ironic that folks lowered their cars and got wider tires only to result in a much smaller contact patch except when under hard cornering at the track which for the most part is seldom or never.
When I raised my car up and got the rear camber to just a -.25 degree over the spec., I was surprised just how much I gained in handling and feel.
B Feelgood said:
Factory specs, especially the earlier models will still chew through tires, because of a combined effect of negative camber and toe, although I believe its mostly the toe, which causes tire scrubbing. At least with the camber kit you can dial it in to what you want depending on how you drive. Its good to have options:biggrin:
http://www.nsxprime.com/FAQ/TireWheel/alignment.htm
amgnsx said:
Let me say one more thing on your question about the kit. I'm sure some are alluding to or questioning the quality of this kit. I’ll say that this design is a solid piece of engineering. It is not a Mickey-mouse engineering effort. The product is very quality, and has been engineered stronger than needed (many X times) yet refined enough to be used on the NSX. I’m sure you will all be completely satisfied with the product. Besides having a degree in engineering, I have been wrenching on cars my whole life. I’ve spent much time with many of my M.E. engineering colleagues for determining the best application. It has gone through many phases of design. It is the best result of all designs we considered and fabricated. One of the other designs we encountered and liked will be used for the next kit, which will allow for more degrees of correction and might even satisfy the harshest of critics. When many of you begin to have this installed you will be comfortably surprised. I am willing to help with the install on all local DFW NSXers.
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Fantastic idea!!!! I hope this comes to market soon. Good luck working out the bugs!!
I learned in the past that camber is not what causes the bulk of inside shoulder tire wear but that it's actually toe, due to the scrubbing effect mentioned in this thread and I posted that on Prime before. I cited examples of cars that have lots of negative camber but someone replied that it's not comparing apples to apples because the cars I mentioned did not have the advanced suspension that the NSX does. But I still believe toe is the major culprit.
Back on topic: Thom, how many millimeters would you say the top of your wheel moved outboard when dialing out your camber? Also, what were your before and after camber measurements? Thanks for your work, BTW. Sounds like a great product.
J
Back on topic: Thom, how many millimeters would you say the top of your wheel moved outboard when dialing out your camber? Also, what were your before and after camber measurements? Thanks for your work, BTW. Sounds like a great product.
J
02#154 said:
I'll answer your second question first.
The before measure was -2.2° left and -2.2°right.
The after measure is -0.2° left and +0.1° right.
This is the pure change, obviously once on the the rack I dialed it to -0.2° left and right.
First question. Simply put, I did not measure the distance from the outside fender to tire.
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Besides the obvious toe and camber setting for the tire wear, please take consideration of the driving habbits too. I found too often that people who drives responsively on the street, who doesn't speed thru corners... (Bling cruzers!!) do wear tires prematurely with lowered suspensions.
Driving slow wears out your tires????? Hmmmm...I will stay on the track so my tires last!!!!:wink:NSXDreamer2 said:
clr1024 said:
With cars that run very negative camber say 1 to 2 degrees of additional negative camber you will see uneven wear, mostly on the inside even with a neutral toe setting. This is what this product can help relieve. The inside of the rear tires will still wear sooner but not as fast and overall, the rear tires will have more even wear.
I want this set up. As soon as it is available it will be on my car and my car on my alignment rack. -1.25, I'm coming!
Do you have any idea on a time frame? I live in Houston and would drive to Dallas. Are you talking 2 weeks? 2 months? a year? Any guesses would be nice.
Thanks,
JM
Thanks,
JM
johnny010 said:
See post #3 of thread. It could be possibly less than three months, but three months is the date based on manufacturing limits as of right now.
Price, let me just say we are trying to achieve at or about $350.00 (US), max would be $400.00
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titaniumdave said:
LOL. Dave, I think you know what I'm talking about, the subject is even wear vs premature wear on tire's inner side...:biggrin: It's unfortunate that the we can get the tires wear evenly with 6 months life...
Oh, btw, I just want to point out the wear characteristics of straight line driving, which most drivers and sadly, majority of the enthusiasts do. And lowering the car to the point of having premature wear just showing that they weren't driving the car they should with the specific setting== wasting money on tires.
Don't remember if I said this before on another thread, but please put me in for a set. My 11" threads are mostly riding on inner 4" except for moments of reckless interstate entrance and exits.
Thanks Regard
Paul
PS: Is excessive +camber responsible for excessive tram-lining with very wide tyres?
Thanks Regard
Paul
PS: Is excessive +camber responsible for excessive tram-lining with very wide tyres?
Thom, I'm interested in a kit so put me on the list to get one. How long will it take the novice person to install this kit?
Gotta see how bad my wear is going to be with the tein s tech 1" drop in the back first. But if it's not low enough or still crappy wear, count me in!
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