NOS at the track?

The Answer

Yes.
It is a viable solution on the track.

Ed Klemz uses it to good effect. He has a 70 shot (the old RM Racing kit) and uses about 1 bottle per day. So, buy 2 bottles and if you run a 50 or 70 shot, you'll have enough gas for the weekend.

You do not HAVE to drill holes in the car.
If you mount the tanks in the trunk (like Ed), there are holes already in the firewall that you can use.
You would need to make a slit in the trunk liner to pass the hoses through, but if removed I believe they would not be noticed.
 
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Their are a few guys that use it at the track but I think they are the exception, Ed Klemz would be one of them and he swears by it. I as others have stated would contact him as he indeed runs it at the track and thats the feedback you wanted. FYI yes their are ways to install the bottle without drilling the trunk but I dont believe they are legal for safety reasons at a track.bottle must be secure.I use several methods to mount bottles. the kit ED runs is no longer made so you would have to find another source. hope this was helpful.
 
For What it's Worth

Many track events won't even let you run if you have a bottle of NOS in your car.
 
The cars are a pretty good match, however, with most victories came on the NSX side. I don't lose to E46!
 
I do not want to flame either, but I just do not have E46's pull on me on the long straights, even before the diet. Now that I have less weight, the only car to pull on me was a 500+hp Supra. I can match a supercharged NSX until we get above 130, and only if there is an uphill section involved.

I think the headers will help (I do not have any yet), but drop all the ancillary stuff from the car for that day and keep your tank under 1/2 full. Make sure your car has been recently tuned up, and the air filter is clean. Check the easy stuff.

Four hundred pounds is like an anchor, with a very big chain:D
 
gobble said:
I'm a little disappointed. Your advice is usually very helpful and on point, not the flaming kind. I didn't ask how can I get faster lap times, I asked if NOS was useful on a road course. Some have been able to give me a useful answer while others haven't. I too have been in close to 50 events since I bought my first Porsche in 1991. Since nobody knows anything about my driving skills, it doesn't seem appropriate to comment. You also know nothing about the other driver. :)

You said in your first post you're looking for a way to keep up with your friends M3 at the track yet you rule out 'becoming a better driver'. You're close minded...end of story. NOS will do noting for you on a road course that a set of brakes and tires won't do ten times better.

Oh and I'm sorry bu I have not had ANY trouble with an E46 M3 from speed and he should not be blowing you away to the point where you need N2O to keep up. I/H/E will do the trick, as will brakes and/or tires. I have I/E, suspension, and a lot of wight reduction on my NSX, but never ran an M3 at the track...only at the strip.
 
ncdogdoc said:
I do not want to flame either, but I just do not have E46's pull on me on the long straights, even before the diet. Now that I have less weight, the only car to pull on me was a 500+hp Supra. I can match a supercharged NSX until we get above 130, and only if there is an uphill section involved.

I think the headers will help (I do not have any yet), but drop all the ancillary stuff from the car for that day and keep your tank under 1/2 full. Make sure your car has been recently tuned up, and the air filter is clean. Check the easy stuff.

Four hundred pounds is like an anchor, with a very big chain:D

What mods do you have on your car? What specifically did you take off for track day to cut down the weight besides obvious like engine cover, spare tire and bracket, etc.?
 
My car is stripped, so it is not really comparable to what I suggested for a track day car. Do a search for multiple ideas. I think Brian2by2 has his list for what he removed for the dragstrip, and that is a good place to start.(posted today in a thread about NSX fastest car in Japan) I am below 2600# now and still have AC, windows, insulation, rear hatch, etc, etc, etc, to remove.

SCCA allows 2350 which I think is below reason (class allows tube frame cars) and Honda Challenge is 2750 with driver.
 
Re: For What it's Worth

slashmatt said:
Many track events won't even let you run if you have a bottle of NOS in your car.

This is what I thought as well.
 
gobble said:
You're getting 272 at the wheels with just intake/headers/exhaust? I have headers and exhaust on the way and am anxious to see the difference.

Good idea with removing the engine cover. I've taken it off before but don't like the loose fit of the window without the cover. Not a bad idea to remove it on track days though.

The car is a 97 so it has a 3.2, 272 RWHP with I/H/E is reasonable considering that the engine internal is stock. I've heard about bone stock 3.2's that have dynoed at up to 260RWHP on the same dyno where I dyno my NSX.

I also know about a rebuilt 3.0 engine putting down 280RWHP with I/H/E as well as some internal engine mods from Comptech a 6speed and short gears.

I'm sure that your headers and exhaust will help in closing the gap on the E46.

Good luck,

Ken
 
Not that you need any help against a (i don't lose to) E46 in stock-to-stock form.
 
NSX/MR2 said:
Not that you need any help against a (i don't lose to) E46 in stock-to-stock form.

thats what i say!!

To get my car down to 2700lbs, i removed the engine cover, tools, spare tire, floormats, passenger seat (track only), tow hook thing, spare tire/bracket, lightweight battery, lightweight suspension, lightweight exhaust, lightweight rims, 1/4 tank of gas at weigh-in, and a few more other things i cant even think of right now...
made the car much quicker and VERY VERY nimble! can't wait for sway bars though!
 
How do you guys get by with 1/2 or 1/4 tank of gas? I'd be running out to the gas station 2 or 3 times during the day. Do you have a support car that comes with gas cans? I like the passenger seat removal idea. This also probably makes it easier to get the track tires inside the car. Also, what is the tow hook thing?
 
Larry Bastanza said:
gobble,

What is your gearing setup? R&P?

LarryB

Everything was stock last year except a DC Sports exhaust, Kumho track tires and Carbotech pads.

I didn't mention that the M3 I'm chasing has probably $10,000 worth of Turner Motorsports suspension and Stoptech brake modifications. However, I'm close on a smaller track.

I have B&B headers and the Anytime exhaust ordered.
 
Has anyone else here had their injectors cleaned and mapped? It sounds like a cheap way to get a few extra hp. Is this worth doing (for those that consider it a good thing to try and get the most out of their car)?
 
That was a BIG thing not to mention!!!!!!!!!!!!

Suspension can shave a few seconds easily, if done correctly. $10,000 means they got the money part correct:). He must have better exit speed, which is why I asked about gearing. On the most important exits on to the straight what rpm are you exiting at, below 5Krpm??

LarryB
 
Gobble, for the benefit of others on this forum, can you tell us about the differences between your car and your friend’s car, e.g. tires, brakes, suspension.

As you know, tires can make a pretty big difference in terms of corner exit speed and are probably the biggest factor in terms of lap time after the Nut. Could it be that his tires grip better than yours and therefore his corner exit speed is higher than yours? What brand and size tires are you running compared to his?

A few years ago, at my local track there was a gentleman who was faster than me in almost every corner. Our cars were almost identical: same tires, same model (’91 and ’92 NSX) and same color. Other than tires, his car was stock: my car had H/E and dali street bars. We decided to spend the rest of the day driving lead/follow and then discuss our lines and braking points after every few laps. By the end of the day we were both faster and I was able to learn his line in several corners which made our lap times almost identical. Point: he was faster because he was driving a better line and if I were on the bottle then I would have missed an opportunity to learn a faster way around the track.

For an example of how the nut behind the wheel can make a difference, here is a link, 2001 NSXPO at RA: www.nsxprime.com/Gallery/multimedia/multimedia.htm (fourth video down). Here, I’m driving my ’92 NSX with stock tires, stock engine H/E and big brakes. The car in front of me is a heavily modified NSXes with supercharger, big Hoosiers, suspension, and a bunch of very expensive weight reduction. It is no contest in the straights, but in the corners is a different story. On second lap I have to lift to remain safely behind. I am not saying that one driver is better than the other, neither of us had any previous experience on this track and it was early on the second track day. One driver just felt comfortable pushing the car harder than the other. But it shows that a “faster” car is not always faster. This leads to my last point:

This is a public forum. A lot of people with difference experience read these threads to help make informed decisions and to learn about our cars. Our responses are not intended solely for the benefit of the thread originator. I understand that you did not want a discussion about driver skill and I understand that very well and I apologize for going outside your terms. My response was aimed to benefit those who are reading this thread and also want to get faster at the track. These people need to know that there are lots of ways to get faster at the track and NOS might be a good option, but only after a certain skill level has been achieved. In ’97 I wasted 3k installing short gears because a few skilled track guys had a narrow discussion about how the shorties made them faster. I wish someone else had let us lurker novices know that for us, short gears wouldn’t make us better drivers or make much difference at the track. Fortunately, we have that counterbalance on these forums.

Have fun,

DanO
 
Larry Bastanza said:
That was a BIG thing not to mention!!!!!!!!!!!!

LarryB

I didn't mention it because I can stay with him in the corners and on shorter tracks. Believe it or not, I can usually catch him in braking at Road America.
 
gobble said:
How do you guys get by with 1/2 or 1/4 tank of gas? I'd be running out to the gas station 2 or 3 times during the day.
Not true. Just look at the numbers. The NSX fuel tank holds 18.6 gallons of fuel (which weighs around 6 pounds per gallon). On the track, I find that I get around 9 miles per gallon. In a typical HPDE event, with 80-100 minutes of track time per day (including time changing run groups, such as time waiting in line at the grid), I generally get to drive roughly 75-90 miles on the track, give or take. If I started the day with 1/2 tank, it would be absolutely impossible to use so much gas that I would need to go to the gas station more than once during the day.

gobble said:
I like the passenger seat removal idea.
Just check with the group running your event to see if this is permitted. Some groups will require you to have a seat for the instructor.
 
I must be doing something wrong. I've gone to Blackhawk and have had to run to the gas station having started with a full tank. The Porsche club will do 5 - 25-30 minute sessions. I guess I could buy race fuel from the track. The seat shouldn't be a big deal because I usually ride in the students car.
 
This is an interesting thread. If I may add my $.02. My car, a '91 3.0, makes 271 rwhp with just H/E and I reel in and pass M3s all day long. Even the 2001 models. IMO nitrous would simply amplify any of your current problems on the track, not solve them.

It sounds to me that you may have plenty of track experience, but does that include actual time with an instructor? Regardless of your desire not to hear it, the best driving investment is on the nut that holds the wheel.
 
gobble said:
I must be doing something wrong. I've gone to Blackhawk and have had to run to the gas station having started with a full tank.
That doesn't sound right. I can see needing to fill before the end of the day on an instructor day with open lapping, but not on a day when you only drive in one of 4-5 different run groups. It's just not possible (assuming you're not sharing your car with another driver...?). Not when you're putting on less than 100 track miles. Even if you put on 125 track miles - highly unlikely (see below) - you wouldn't run so low that you would need to refill.

How many miles do you run in a day? And how many gallons do you put in the car when you leave to fill it?

gobble said:
The Porsche club will do 5 - 25-30 minute sessions.
I thought PCA runs five run groups (four student groups and an instructor group) - at least, they have at their events that I've attended. Doing five 30-minute sessions for each of five run groups means that they would need a green track for twelve and a half hours. Even five 25-minute sessions would need a green track for ten and a half hours. Most tracks are green for only seven or eight hours per day. :confused:
 
nsxtasy said:
I thought PCA runs five run groups (four student groups and an instructor group) - at least, they have at their events that I've attended. Doing five 30-minute sessions for each of five run groups means that they would need a green track for twelve and a half hours. Even five 25-minute sessions would need a green track for ten and a half hours. Most tracks are green for only seven or eight hours per day. :confused:

No. 3 groups at Blackhawk. Novice (with instructor), intermediate, advanced. Each group has four runs with a half hour free for all at the end open to anyone left standing. You should join us sometime. They put on a great event.

They do 4 groups at Road America which is a bummer.
 
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