Noob question about NSX body/top/paint styles

[Richard EVO]

I'm considering the purchase of an early NSX (probably no later than 1994 model year). There's something I don't quite understand about the configuration of the tops and the paint schemes. I believe that in 1995, all US NSX went to a targa roof, and before that, they were fixed roof coupes.

But what I'm not clear about is why some first gen. NSX have body colored roofs, and others have black roofs, no matter the color of the car.

I know if I searched this site studiously, I could probably find the answer, but I don't have time right now. Can someone clue me in? Thank you.

 

[robbiedawg]

this will tell you.look for the 94 and 95 changes.enjoy your search,
http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Changes_by_Year

 

[Richard EVO]

Thanks. However, that does not exactly answer the question. It says that in 1994, the early green cars had black roofs and the later green cars had body colored roofs. It also says that all coupes starting in 1995 had body colored roofs. But what it does not say is if all cars through 1994 had black roofs (except the later green cars), or if some pre-1995 coupes had body colored roofs and others had black roofs. I have been looking at a car that is for sale. It is a 1994 red NSX. The roof is red. I know the car has been painted, to a high standard. Was the roof originally black and they painted it red, or could it have always been red?

 

[nsxtasy]

All cars through 1994 had black roofs except the later green cars. The roof on the car you're looking at was originally black and has been repainted.

And the version of the NSX with the removable roof panel is called the NSX-T. ("Targa" is a registered trademark of Porsche.)

 

[Richard EVO]

All cars through 1994 had black roofs except the later green cars. The roof on the car you're looking at was originally black and has been repainted.

And the version of the NSX with the removable roof panel is called the NSX-T. ("Targa" is a registered trademark of Porsche.)

Thank you. I think the car looks better with a body colored roof, and I don't like black cars (even though by defenition they have body colored roofs, even before 1995). However, the lower price and light weight of the earlier cars outweighs the undesirable black roof in my view.

 

[DRIFTER]

Thank you. I think the car looks better with a body colored roof, and I don't like black cars (even though by definition they have body colored roofs, even before 1995). However, the lower price and light weight of the earlier cars outweighs the undesirable black roof in my view.

You also have to realize the earlier cars came with a 3.0 and a 5 speed (NA1)
(NA2) came with a 3.2 and a 6-speed (with a few exceptions)

 

[Richard EVO]

You also have to realize the earlier cars came with a 3.0 and a 5 speed (NA1)
(NA2) came with a 3.2 and a 6-speed (with a few exceptions)

Is the 6-speed that much better than the 5-speed? As I understand it, the NA2 motor had 20 bhp more than the NA1 motor. I'm not sure how much difference that makes to me. I prefer the S2000 AP1 with 2.0 liter motor to the second generation AP2 with 2.2 liter. I think Honda dumbed everything down with the second generation S2000. The AP1 was just sharper than the AP2

I don't know enough about the NSX to know if the same thing is true. But when cars get heavier over time and loaded up with more useless luxury doodads, I prefer the older, lighter, less complicated models.

 

[DRIFTER]

Is the 6-speed that much better than the 5-speed? As I understand it, the NA2 motor had 20 bhp more than the NA1 motor. I'm not sure how much difference that makes to me. I prefer the S2000 AP1 with 2.0 liter motor to the second generation AP2 with 2.2 liter. I think Honda dumbed everything down with the second generation S2000. The AP1 was just sharper than the AP2

I don't know enough about the NSX to know if the same thing is true. But when cars get heavier over time and loaded up with more useless luxury doodads, I prefer the older, lighter, less complicated models.

I prefer the 6-speed the gear ratios are tighter. I have built 5-speed with JDM gear ratios and the NSX-R final drive, and its similar to the 6-speed without the 6th gear. The difference in the 3.2 and 3.0 is noticeable not sure if its has to do with the gear ratios or the extra HP. But it is noticeable.

 

[nsxtasy]

I think the car looks better with a body colored roof

When I first had my car, I used to think that it would look better with a red roof (remember, this is when they weren't available from the factory that way). However, once I saw one, I decided I liked it better the way it is, with the black roof. The black roof accentuates the smooth lines of the body. This photo, posted by Jonathan in the Picture Gallery forum of NSXprime, shows what I mean:

You also have to realize the earlier cars came with a 3.0 and a 5 speed (NA1)
(NA2) came with a 3.2 and a 6-speed (with a few exceptions)

No exceptions. All NA2 NSXs came with the 3.2-liter engine and a six-speed. All NA1 NSXs came with the 3.0-liter engine, either with a five-speed manual or with an automatic.

Is the 6-speed that much better than the 5-speed? As I understand it, the NA2 motor had 20 bhp more than the NA1 motor.

Unlike the S2000, there is almost a complete consensus among NSX owners that the 3.2-liter is better than the 3.0-liter and that the six-speed is better than the five-speed, other than the higher cost of the faster options (and of the clutch for the six-speed).

The difference in the 3.2 and 3.0 is noticeable not sure if its has to do with the gear ratios or the extra HP. But it is noticeable.

Most of the difference is due to the extra horsepower. Bob Butler calculated numbers for 0-60 and 1/4 mile acceleration, starting with a stock '91 NSX Coupe, and looked at the effects of adding 15 HP and of changing the tranny to the six-speed. He also calculated numbers for the '97 NSX-T and NSX Coupe, which are slightly different from the modified '91 because they added 20 hp (but the weight is slightly different also). As you can see, even a 15-hp addition makes for a faster car than converting to the six-speed. All cars have manual transmissions.

Stock '91 NSX: 5.31 seconds 0-60 13.67 seconds 1/4 mile
'91 NSX with +15 HP: 5.00 seconds 0-60 13.35 seconds 1/4 mile
'91 NSX with six-speed: 5.09 seconds 0-60 13.56 seconds 1/4 mile
'97 NSX-T: 4.93 seconds 0-60 13.39 seconds 1/4 mile
'97 NSX Coupe: 4.79 seconds 0-60 13.24 seconds 1/4 mile

 

[mlambert890]

Is the 6-speed that much better than the 5-speed? As I understand it, the NA2 motor had 20 bhp more than the NA1 motor. I'm not sure how much difference that makes to me. I prefer the S2000 AP1 with 2.0 liter motor to the second generation AP2 with 2.2 liter. I think Honda dumbed everything down with the second generation S2000. The AP1 was just sharper than the AP2

I don't know enough about the NSX to know if the same thing is true. But when cars get heavier over time and loaded up with more useless luxury doodads, I prefer the older, lighter, less complicated models.

This never happened with the NSX. The NA2 *targa* roof models are heavier because of the targa roof.

An NA2 coupe, admittedly a unicorn level beast in rarity, isn't heavier (unless Im forgetting - if it is, its not by much)

Point is there were no luxury doodads added. If anything, a criticism of the NSX could be that from 1991 - 2005 it had pretty darn near the exact same interior and "amenities" with very minor differences in the "face lift" models (02+)

I find the performance difference between an NA1 coupe and NA2 T to be noticeable.

 

[Honcho]

Early coupes (91-94) tend to be the most "raw" in terms of performance becuase they are light and rigid (I am not counting NA2 coupes because there are only about 30 of them in the US). I could have afforded a NA2 but I chose a 91 Coupe because of this issue, as I would likely have to wait years to find a NA2 Coupe for sale.

In my estimation, the only down side to the NA1 Coupe is the 5-speed transmission. Honda changed the gear ratios in USDM cars to make them longer. This may have a slight advantage for track driving on some long, fast tracks, but it ruins the day-to-day driving experience in my experience. The problem is mostly with 2nd gear. Any sort of sporting shift to 2nd results in this terrible lag/lug because the engine drops too many rpm. Thankfully, there is a solution. As Drifter mentioned, you can buy the JDM gearset, which completely cures the lag issue. It's not quite as nice as the 6-speed, which I agree is the ultimate NSX transmission option, but it's about 90% there. I have this upgrade on my 91 (thank you LarryB) and I love it.

Finally, the 20hp bump in the 3.2 is due almost entirely to Honda's use of tubular stainless steel headers on the engine. You can get this same bump by putting headers on your 3.0. I have NA2 OEM headers on my 3.0 and I notice the difference, especially above 6000 rpm.

HTH

Is the 6-speed that much better than the 5-speed? As I understand it, the NA2 motor had 20 bhp more than the NA1 motor. I'm not sure how much difference that makes to me.

 

[clr1024]

Early coupes (91-94) tend to be the most "raw" in terms of performance becuase they are light and rigid (I am not counting NA2 coupes because there are only about 30 of them in the US). I could have afforded a NA2 but I chose a 91 Coupe because of this issue, as I would likely have to wait years to find a NA2 Coupe for sale.

In my estimation, the only down side to the NA1 Coupe is the 5-speed transmission. Honda changed the gear ratios in USDM cars to make them longer. This may have a slight advantage for track driving on some long, fast tracks, but it ruins the day-to-day driving experience in my experience. The problem is mostly with 2nd gear. Any sort of sporting shift to 2nd results in this terrible lag/lug because the engine drops too many rpm. Thankfully, there is a solution. As Drifter mentioned, you can buy the JDM gearset, which completely cures the lag issue. It's not quite as nice as the 6-speed, which I agree is the ultimate NSX transmission option, but it's about 90% there. I have this upgrade on my 91 (thank you LarryB) and I love it.

Finally, the 20hp bump in the 3.2 is due almost entirely to Honda's use of tubular stainless steel headers on the engine. You can get this same bump by putting headers on your 3.0. I have NA2 OEM headers on my 3.0 and I notice the difference, especially above 6000 rpm.

HTH

I agree with all of this, especially the lag on second...however if you are considering going the FI route, I wouldn't make the JDM gear set a priority, just my $.02.

 

[nsxtasy]

(I am not counting NA2 coupes because there are only about 30 of them in the US)

Sounds like you're forgetting about the 50 Zanardi's.

 

[oscar_driver]

..Finally, the 20hp bump in the 3.2 is due almost entirely to Honda's use of tubular stainless steel headers on the engine..

OMG but we all know here that although not noticeable, there TONS of new stuff that Honda changed after 97 which are all mostly common knowledge on prime.

Oscar

 

[RedWings]

I prefer the older, lighter, less complicated models.

If thats your purchase criteria for an NSX, then it sounds as if you are targeting a 1991-1994 model, and lucky for you many are available and can be found at good price points. Absolutely invest in a well-qualified pre-purchase inspection... the difference could be $5K or more of additional cost to sort out any deferred maintenance or issues. There are 91-94's available from 3000 miles to 200,000 miles on the dial, many of those have some nice mods/fixes already bolted on... caveat emptor

Robbiedawg's link to the wiki is required reading if you are deciding on what year to target... big changes @ 97' in the NA2/manual cars

 

[oscar_driver]

I think getting a cheap 91 @ 20-25K + investing 15-18K on FI + gearing + suspension + tires + exhaust is the way to go!

 

[Honcho]

Sounds like you're forgetting about the 50 Zanardi's.

I lump them in with the NA2 coupes- pretty much unavailable, at least in a un-wrecked, no stories form.

 

[nsxtasy]

I lump them in with the NA2 coupes- pretty much unavailable, at least in a un-wrecked, no stories form.

Not true. Some become available from time to time. Others are out there but kept by their original owners, so they're unavailable TO YOU, but they do exist.

70 NA2 NSX Coupes were sold in the United States - 51 Zanardis and 19 non-Zanardis. Some may have been totalled, but the number out there is still surely more than 30. And ALL NSXs have stories - some good, some bad.

 

[soloracer951]

Wasn't the throttle by wire something added to the NA2's? If I remember correctly I was told that if you plan to modify your car (CTSC, etc) you are better off with an early model.

 

[docjohn]

Wasn't the throttle by wire something added to the NA2's? If I remember correctly I was told that if you plan to modify your car (CTSC, etc) you are better off with an early model.

95-96 cars were a bridge to the na2 - obd2 and throttle by wire but the 3l motor and the chevette exhaust manifold. Now what did the 94 coups have?

 

[usafdarkhorse]

there is almost a complete consensus among NSX owners that the 3.2-liter is better than the 3.0-liter

Depends on who ya talk to.

 

[shawn110975]

the one thing I notice driving 1992 is while in 5th gear its seems like it needs to shift one more time. when cruising at like 70mph the rpms are at like 5K its like if i shifted to 6th which I dont have its would drop to 3K rpm

chime in you fancy 6 speed owners. LOL

I will be getting the 6 speed soon LOL waiting on the title JASON........

lol

 

[nsxtasy]

the one thing I notice driving 1992 is while in 5th gear its seems like it needs to shift one more time. when cruising at like 70mph the rpms are at like 5K

Not true. When you're at 70 mph in fifth gear in a stock '92 NSX, the engine is doing 3011 RPM. And it's impossible to run out of revs in fifth gear; you won't even reach redline when it tops out at a drag-limited 168 mph (at 7226 RPM).

 

[Caustic]

70 NA2 NSX Coupes were sold in the United States - 51 Zanardis and 19 non-Zanardis. Some may have been totalled, but the number out there is still surely more than 30.

I want one so bad. Either would be awesome. The Zanardi would be great for collection purposes. Keep it stock and pristine. But the non-Z would immediately be modified and tracked. Gawd I want one so bad.

the one thing I notice driving 1992 is while in 5th gear its seems like it needs to shift one more time. when cruising at like 70mph the rpms are at like 5K its like if i shifted to 6th which I dont have its would drop to 3K rpm

chime in you fancy 6 speed owners. LOL

I will be getting the 6 speed soon LOL waiting on the title JASON........

lol

I love my 6 speed. "Close" ratio, great overdrive. I've had a 6 speed since my '94 Firebird V8, I don't think I could ever go back.