Keep getting lowballed. How much are these cars worth?

[NSSEX91]

I bought my 91 NSX for 29,000 6 months ago. I put 15,000 miles on it and is now at 90k. Has most records including 90,000 mile service and minor mods including refreshed interior.

I keep getting told by every buyer that 25,000 is to much.

I'm told that 91's go for 18-22,000.

I looked in Auto Trader to get an idea of what other poeple are charging and sure enough just as I thought 91's with 90-130,000 miles are averaging $28,000 bucks.

So I would think that 25,000 is average for my car considering that it needs AC / rear tires and window alignment.

Just because one person does a world search for NSX's and sees one go for 15 grand somehow means that all NSX's are now worth 15 grand.

Considering that only 1-3 NSX's are sold in Southern Cali at any given time and average above my asking price, I feel that I can up my asking price and still be an ok deal.

Also, I hate joy riders. I let one guy drive it like a mad man which I later found out had absolutely no intention of buying the car and no cash. WTF! So from now on I am requesting to see cash in hand before riding. Is that to much to ask?


What are your thoughts?

 

[Briank]

If your price was too high you would not get any calls so you are right in the ball park. If you don't ask for a discount you will not get one. For a lot of people $25,000 is a lot of cash to come up with and getting loan for that amount is even harder. $18,000 - $20,000 is much more reasonable to come up with, just write a check out of your home equity line or take a cash advance from a couple of credit cards.

Also you may be getting wholesale offers from dealers, which need to buy at $18,000 - $20,000 so they can retail at a normal market price of $25,000.

Oh only give rides until a buyer gets serious, meaning paying for a PPI.

 

[NSSEX91]

Ah great idea on the PPI.

Thanks

 

[zahntech]

I deal with people that think their car is worth a mint everyday..and you sir are not one of them..25K for a nice condition car at 90k miles is a very reasonable price...you just need to hold on till you find someone that is serious..winter time is the worst time to sell a sports car too....

Let people know that The Blue Book value is not accurate for these cars, and if they want a Salvage car or a car with 150k miles and many beat up/crappy mods they will be able to pick one up for 17-22k

I have seen only one person buy a sub 100k car that was not beat up, in the low 20s...he got lucky.

 

[poncekim]

I considered your car when I was looking for a 91. The reason I didn't even make an offer was because I didn't like the mods on your car(specifically the interior). This may be why you're not getting very many solid offers.

That being said, I still think 25K is a reasonable asking price. You'll just need to be patient. Good luck.

 

[annointed]

Selling a car like this is a matter of patience, and you'll have to put up with low-ball offers. You should stay firm on your price, as it sounds reasonable, which a serious buyer will recognize. I've bought and sold quite a few cars (I'm 28 and have owned 16 cars already), and I've had several sales take 6-9 months to find a serious buyer. One downside with this wait is that you have to continue making insurance payments, which could add up to a significant loss as the months go by.

 

[NSSEX91]

I don't remember you inquiring about the car and am not pointing fingers at any one person.

The seats are releathered with red stitching like the Type R's. It looks factory and costed $1500 bucks.

This is an EXCUSE! for I told poeple that I have all the OEM interior parts. Everybody I know LOVES the seats BTW!

I guess the $5000 doller Stereo W/DVD/Navigation & Sirius is a turn off.

Should I just put the stock one back in?

 

[Zishan]

I noticed you said something about a/c? What's the deal with the a/c? That would be a huge drawback to me. I've heard of a/c problems costing big bucks. Then again, it maybe the simple a/c unit problem that BrianK can fix. A lot of times buyers don't know that. So that maybe have something to do with it.

Good luck,
- Z

 

[kmrumedy]

I am in the market for an NSX. If you are looking for honest feedback from a well funded serious buyer, I can tell you what my thoughts were when I read your ad. ( I think your asking price is reasonable by the way. Actually thought it was too low at first. I also thought you were an honest seller noting the items that needed to be fixed).

Here is why I didn't consider your car. I hope this helps you. ( It is not a criticism on your vehicle... just my initial reaction to your ad and very blunt comments)

1. Not enough detailed pictures. Especially if seller has noted things wrong with the car. i.e. I want to see a picture of that dent. I ALWAYS have to see pictures of engine bay. I think sellers are hiding something when the pictures are very general glory shots. I won't go visit a car unless the pictures are detailed and upfront
2. I didn't mind the look of the seats. Actually looked kind of cool. However, as soon as I see a mod like this....the cars screams that it has been raced or driven hard by a younger owner at some point.
3. You mentioned you drove the car at 140 mph. Makes me wonder how hard this car was driven and because of the issues with the car, did the seller have funds to take good care of the car.
4. You said you were in Iraq. I like to negotiate with a seller in person. I need to see him and listen to him as we walk around the car. Not a friend of the seller. I want the seller to drive the car so i can see how he drives.
5. A/C can be an expensive fix. Would like to know the exact reason it doesn't work and the cost to fix it. It shows me that you care about the car, that you took it in and had someone look at it.

My general impression from this ad was that the car was driven hard by a seller that didn't have the funds to take proper care of it and that is why the price is so low.

I'm sure I am way off.....but that is what your ad said to me.

You could easily fix this ad, make a few more fixes to your car, and get more money for it....from well funded buyers who know what they want and have the money to spend. You'll always get low bid dreamers with any ad but you will also attract more serious buyers like me with a few changes.

Hope this helps you.

 

[mickeylex]

Your asking price is fine. Just wait for the right buyer and your car will sell.

 

[NSXGMS]

The nature of these times is that there are a lot of young people trying to squeeze into a 91-92 NSX that could never afford one before.

They see NSXs listed for various prices between $20-25K and don't really know the difference between a well-maintined, clean NSX and a bad one. The Blue Book value is deceptive and most people don't understand why. It would definitely appear that 25K for a 91 is high but in reality it is not.

And yes, lenders loan on book values. Most young people want 100% financing and won't be able to get it if a 91 is priced higher than about $20K.

If your NSX is clean it will sell eventually for the price you're asking.

 

[nsxtasy]

I think most of the previous posts are providing good insight. You put together all of the comments, and all are possible explanations.

The first thing to realize is that there are lowballers out there. They try to buy cars for significantly less than the actual market value of the car. They will give you lots of excuses why they think the car is not worth what you are asking. They are hoping you will fall for their scam and sell the car for less than its true value. Don't fall for it. I wouldn't even waste time arguing over the phone with anyone who offers you a lowball price. If they don't want to make you a reasonable offer, then just thank them and hang up.

A car with 90K miles may be worth $20K, or $25K, or $30K. It's all about condition. For $30K, I would expect a car that is perfect mechanically, meaning that there is absolutely nothing that needs fixing, all maintenance is up to date, and the exterior and interior look like they're in excellent condition consistent with the mileage - in other words, you would expect paint chips on the front bumper, but you would not expect faded paint or ripped seats. For $25K, you would expect a few "flaws" from that description, flaws that would take a few thousand dollars to fix.

You also need to realize that some "flaws" send a message that the seller/owner does not bother taking care of his car. The A/C, rear tires, and window alignment fall into this category. I would spend $1K and fix all of these flaws before selling (and bump the price by $1K if you want). I'm assuming here that the A/C problem can be fixed by BrianK for a few hundred dollars - but if you're instead looking at a multi-thousand-dollar repair, then those thousands of dollars should be deducted from your asking price. Even with an expensive repair, it may be worth fixing before selling. Or else, don't expect anywhere near the price you would get for a car without such problems.

As BrianK implies, most buyers expect sellers to knock a little bit ($1-2K) off their asking price. This is reasonable. You should build a cushion into your asking price to permit you to come down.

I agree with zahntech when he notes that some sellers think their cars are worth more than they really are. (90 percent of sellers think their cars are in above-average condition. ) Don't compare your car with one or two other cars in your area. Compare it with all the cars available nationwide if you want to get a better feel for what price is reasonable. In doing so, keep in mind that almost all cars are posted with asking prices slightly above what the seller actually is willing to sell for (see previous paragraph) and also keep in mind that a few sellers have an unreasonable idea of what their cars are worth, so don't pay attention to a few listings that seem way out of line on the high side.

I haven't seen your interior so I can't comment on it specifically. However, most interior mods make it more difficult to sell at a given price, because it is then less attractive aesthetically to the vast majority of potential buyers.

I don't agree with all the comments by kmrumedy. Some, but not all. Lots of pictures help. I don't at all agree that red stitching in the seats "screams that it has been raced" (but see my point above about interior mods). I wouldn't mention driving the car at 140 mph, although I don't think that is necessarily a serious issue. I agree that a remote seller can be a BIG problem in selling a car, for all kinds of reasons.

I think all of these factors, put together, should give you a better idea of how much your car is worth. You can take action items from the above feedback (from everyone) - consider fixing the things that need fixing, build a cushion into your price, don't worry about lowballers, be patient, be present for the sale process - and decide for yourself how much you should be asking and getting for your car. Good luck.

I guess the $5000 doller Stereo W/DVD/Navigation & Sirius is a turn off.

Should I just put the stock one back in?

Yes. You can sell the aftermarket stereo separately and you will probably get more money that way. A big-buck stereo rarely increases market value by much at all, let alone by what you could get selling it used.

 

[NA1MT]

Unfortunately when you check blue book pricing a minty 91 is listed at around $18,500. But....the educated consumer knows that is not a realistic price. I paid $25,000 for my 91' in August and it is in excellent shape and has 16k- 20k stereo (depending on who builds it). The stereo could actually though be a deterrent to some buyers unless they are familiar with the installation shop that did the work,as well as any other mods. And they might not want that type of work anyway. Someone will eventually fall in love with your car if you wait long enough though. I would also edit your ad to take out the part about driving 140 mph though like the other poster said. Just my .02 as I have not seen the ad personally. Good Luck!

 

[Big_D]

It is easier to sell a sports car in the spring and summer months. I think you should wait for the right buyer. These cars hold their value better than blue books.

 

[froggie]

Hi, "madman" chiming in, believing I am pretty much the only one who got to see NSSEX 91's car in person. I decided to step forward to the risk of discrediting myself to the eye of this community.
first, and for the record, I had every intention to buy the car, but you left to Iraq two days later; what was I supposed to do? Pretty short time to make a decision. Also, I regret to have been perceived as joyriding the car, which wasn't the case; for that I am sorry.
Now back to the subject:
25K was pretty appropriate, given the other cars I saw before, and given the mods...etc. Although I would probably offer something in the '24 K range. Some of these mods, the stereo system and the two tone interior execution and craftsmanship to name a few, were not to my taste, sorry. Although I really like the wheels and the drop, as well as the seats.
I believe, and to your credit when you mentionned you didn't have the time, a good detailing would have done a great job helping you sell the car.
Moreover, as nsxtasy mentionned, and I believed he summed it up pretty well, I would greatly recommend fixing all or most of the flaws before putting a car on the market; especially the ones you mentionned- although minor-, that need to be taken care of by that insurance; nobody wants to deal with that. I know, one can say, "Oh, I can knock it off the price", but the initial perception greatly influences the buyer's final decision. I know, I found a huge dent on my car's right fender that I just put for sale, and I have to have it fixed before any potential buyer sees it.
Finally, more detailed shots, wil do wonders.l
All in all, this is a pretty clean car, which is priced about right. Of course, everyone wants to serve best their interests. If I were you, I would not lose hope, and ask whoever stands behind with her, to take some glamour shots of your car.
Some of you might think I have some nerve to comment about this car after joyriding it :wink:, but this is my honest feedback.

 

[jond]

What are your thoughts?

Patience.

Some people will try to get you to sell for bluebook. The bluebook on my 1966 mustang is 1/50th of what it's appraised and insured at. Bluebook is only good for new cars that depreciate at normal rates.

I wouldn't let anyone drive it unless they have money in hand.
When I was shopping for NSXs, some owners would let me drive, some wouldn't. I didn't expect any of them to let me.

If they mention a NSX they saw for cheaper, ask them if it has been salvaged, wrecked, theft recovery etc.

 

[Cairo94507]

Well having had my NSX for sale for over 1 year, I sold it once and the deal fell apart when the buyer could not sell his M3, and I have had probably 6 offers since then for 40K to 50K. I am pretty sure that anyone who knows my car will agree it is clean and everything done to it has been done in good taste. I truly believe the car will sell for the high 50's. For less than that I will probably just keep it and drive it when I want.

I have had a ton of low-ball callers just asking if I would take $40K? It is hard not to just hang up on them but I take the time to explain this is not a salvaged, wrecked, raced, heavily ricer (no offense) modified car. I also tell them I own it and am not in a financial bind to sell it.

So.....sooner or later that one buyer who wants that one right car will come along, recognize what they are looking at and gladly pay to own it -as I did and would again if I were still looking for an NSX- the best car ever made in my opinion. I just wish my wife and I were 20 years younger to really enjoy this car.

So, keep your price where it is, get the dent and AC fixed and take some great pictures and re-list it and wait for the buyer.

 

[jond]

I have had a ton of low-ball callers just asking if I would take $40K? It is hard not to just hang up on them but I take the time to explain this is not a salvaged, wrecked, raced, heavily ricer (no offense) modified car. I also tell them I own it and am not in a financial bind to sell it.

I imagine you could make a healthy living low balling people on high-end cars and reselling them at a profit. $10-15k is a lot of money.

 

[Packard]

Ah great idea on the PPI.

Thanks

Well, I'm new here and "PPI" either means "Producer Price Index" or "Pixels Per Inch" and I'm not sure how either would be of much help.

Of course there might be some other meaning for PPI that I am not aware of so clue me in.

 

[ANYTIME]

Well, I'm new here and "PPI" either means "Producer Price Index" or "Pixels Per Inch" and I'm not sure how either would be of much help.

Of course there might be some other meaning for PPI that I am not aware of so clue me in.

Pre Purchase Inspection

 

[NSSEX91]

Just to clear things up a bit there is NO DENT IN THE CAR!

The car was reversed into another car and the tail light broke. The bulb went out and was insured by insurance so I'm asking poeople to get the bulb replaced by insurance "If they want" otherwise it's not a big deal to me. The bumper was bulging out a couple milimeters as well at the very corner lip.

I was not talking about Froogie and my sister tells me werid poeple come to check it out. I came with cash to check out this car. As soon as I saw the stereo and seats and riding donw the street for about 20 seconds I was sold! Never drove a car like this.

More importantly I told buyers to take whatever mods they don't like and mechanical problems and subtract that from my asking price. I would have gone as low as 23,000 for Froogie. I offered another guy 23,000 but wanted to go 21k because of the missing front plastic clip ($45) and says the clutch feels worn...The clutch is fine.

The problem is I'm to honest about theh car. I didnt need to say it was reversed into another car. I also didnt need to mention I went 140mph. Most poeple like the seller before me waited for me to come and find out for myself. Thats just how you sell shit these days. Waste the buyers time and not the sellers. Maybe I should do that instead lol

As a matter of fact I may just keep the car for now and trade up to a T later.

 

[mickeylex]

If you can keep the car, then keep it. You might as well enjoy it for as long as you can. Selling for a very low price (you mentioned $21 or $23K) would be a shame if you didn't really have to sell it.

 

[rickysals]

The interior and stereo would both be turnoffs for me if I were purchasing your car. For my personal taste - the interior is tacky and I would have to return it to black (or stock parts if you had them).

If you can return the stereo to stock and it works fine - I would do it. You wouldn't have to remove a penny from your asking price, and you can sell the stereo seperately. I know nothing about them - but $5K in stereo equipment has to be worth something - more than you will get with it in the car.

Your forsale thread says you bought it for $29K this year and put 15K miles on it. I'd get the little things fixed (AC/frontbumperthing/taillight/window alignment/tires) and wait for the right buyer at $27,000. That gives you room for negotiation w/out ripping yourself off.

Good luck

 

[froggie]

Well, I'm glad you weren't talking about me; now I feel embarassingly paranoid:biggrin: .
Indeed, if the stereo equipment is a turn-off for many, why not parting it, or at least get rid off the big sub in the passenger footwell?
But it might turn out to be a bigger headache for you.
Just tidy-up all these little blemishes, and you should be good to go.
and as mickeylex states, do you really have to sell your car? I felt the only reason you did, is because you had to leave. Look at the bright side: You won't be driving your car during your absence, therefore keeping the mileage low.
And I am pretty sure you'll be happier having the NSX waiting for you, rather than having to go through the hassle of finding the right one again.

 

[nsxtasy]

Just to clear things up a bit there is NO DENT IN THE CAR!

The car was reversed into another car and the tail light broke. The bulb went out and was insured by insurance so I'm asking poeople to get the bulb replaced by insurance "If they want" otherwise it's not a big deal to me. The bumper was bulging out a couple milimeters as well at the very corner lip.

Since the bumper is mis-aligned, this is NOT just a matter of replacing a two dollar bulb. What you are saying, in so many words, is that the car has body damage that was not repaired properly. That, all by itself, probably reduces how much you're likely to get by several thousand dollars.