Income required to comfortably buy an nsx

lol no nomination for the best troll of the year. :biggrin: we got quit a few other mind boggling threads of awesome perportions that goes before yours.

if we wanted to discuss finances, im definitely down. we can talk economy while we are at it... but the issue of $$$ / year income to buy the nsx, that differs and is should be evaluated on a case by case basis. Everyone's field is finances, that's life.

just because someone else has a formula that works for them, does not mean it will work for someone else or be beneficial.

if someone makes 150K a year and buys an nsx and we come to the consensus that 150K is the "magic" number. that might give someone the wrong impression about how much they really need, if we come to the consensus that 60k a year will do... in GSR's case 5k a month in expenses will definitely not be able to handle the car with out paying cash up front.

Redshift, its nice to see that your field is economics, personal finance, business etc. Im sure your knowledge is endless and you could have easily seen that this topic requires case by case analysis and that one general sweeping number will not fit every box. Also it is not the proper advice since if this individual is incapable of making this purchasing decision by himself and if he was really using our "figure" as a basis to purchase an nsx, it would surely lead him on the wrong path.

I still fail to see how asking someone how much money you "should" make is relevant to owning an nsx or planning a purchase.

im sure someone can own a P-car on a lot less then 390K..... i know personally i make less than that and i can go out and get one.

"I’m just here to see how they do it and a discussion on money (in general) is beneficial to everyone."

sum up the answer in one sentence.

cut/minimize all expenses.

im sure everyone has this figured out. just getting it done is the hard part.
 
aaaah...finally finished up my oil change with the tall filter, synthetic oil, and new washer...

oops, wait, wrong thread...

(lol thought I would add some levity to the thread haha):biggrin:

lol you JUST finished?! left my shop 8 hours ago :wink:
 
lol you JUST finished?! left my shop 8 hours ago :wink:

drain drain drain drain....made sure this thing was bone dry :) umm...i did have it draining since last night, but i thought i saw a drip, so i let it sit while i went to yamato with the familia...now i feel good all the oil was out:)


not sure if it is healthy to be this anal?:biggrin:
 
:..If the average income of a p-car owner is 390k, and a p-car is similarly priced to an nsx, then I’m outta my league. Or is there something that I’m missing about the statistic?..

Wasn't it median income, not average income? I think that means that as many people earn under 390k as earn above 390k. There are plenty of Porsche owners that make 5 figures.

Young people can still buy an NSX. Just don't get an 80k car. get something in the $40's. It will not depreciate much over 5 years, then sell it. The cost of a car is what you pay for it, less what you sell it for in the future.
 
aaaah...finally finished up my oil change with the tall filter, synthetic oil, and new washer...

oops, wait, wrong thread...

(lol thought I would add some levity to the thread haha):biggrin:
:biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

RON98 said:
just because someone else has a formula that works for them, does not mean it will work for someone else or be beneficial.

That is very true, that is the reason my "figure" was an ideology and not a number. I do think hearing other people's formula can be both beneficial or detrimental depending on how you interpret them, but it still gives you options. :)


RON98 said:
Redshift, its nice to see that your field is economics, personal finance, business etc. Im sure your knowledge is endless and you could have easily seen that this topic requires case by case analysis and that one general sweeping number will not fit every box. Also it is not the proper advice since if this individual is incapable of making this purchasing decision by himself and if he was really using our "figure" as a basis to purchase an nsx, it would surely lead him on the wrong path.
Yes, I completely agree. That is the reason I chimed-in in the first place. I read the other posts before mine and thought they were a little too static; they gave hard numbers and formula. I wanted to give GSR a more general approach that could be applied on a case-by-case basis. The opening of a discussion tends to flush out information that helps in formulating a plan.

RON98 said:
I still fail to see how asking someone how much money you "should" make is relevant to owning an nsx or planning a purchase.
If you take this literally, then perhaps you are right about its relevance. Before I answered it, I personally expanded the question into, "What does it take financially to own an NSX?" I imagine gsr had a bit of both questions in mind when he asked... we all certainly have a voyeuristic curiosity on some level as to what socio-economic tier the joneses fall into.

RON98 said:
im sure someone can own a P-car on a lot less then 390K..... i know personally i make less than that and i can go out and get one.
I agree, that is why I think income is irrelevant and net worth is the real metric to be considered in every single case that pertains to money - just my opinion.

RON98 said:
"I’m just here to see how they do it and a discussion on money (in general) is beneficial to everyone."

sum up the answer in one sentence.

cut/minimize all expenses.
That is one method, but it is your personal formula. To somebody else they might not want to cut/minimize all expenses, but instead they might want to make more money. That might sound silly because it is sometimes assumed that all people want more money, but that isn't true in my experience. Most people think think they want more money, but they aren't willing to do the necessary work to gain it. It is just not worth the effort, sacrifice, or stress when they are already "comfortable" (that word is the bane of wealth). So for them the only way to expand their profit column (and tax burden) is to cut expenses.

Some people might just be able to move money into different types of accounts or utilize the time value of their checking account better to make more money. For them, it just takes a little financial management and all of a sudden they can buy their NSX... without cutting expenses.

So you see, I think you were dead on before where you said it was case-by-case. Cutting expenses is just one method that can be employed with many others to achieve your financial goals.

It is really cool that you ended up answering the original question. :biggrin:
 
I thought I made enough....but I was wrong. I have no idea how much income you need...somehow the car keeps taking more and more and more...
 
Why are we pretending to talk about 80k nsx,there are none:wink: you should be talking about 35-40 k nsx which won't depreciate too much

Yeah, but the question is an interesting one. Posed as if it's 2005 and you can still buy a $95,000 NSX new. I have the window sticker for mine, it was about $95,000 back in 1997.

The tricky thing with our cars is you can get a 17 year old one that looks just like a 3 year old one. BIG difference in price though!


As far as the people who bought new, I've met a few:
2- Medical Doctors. One teaches PHd students how to operate, the other practices.
1- Lawyer.
1- Business owner. Owns a HVAC company and he had a 05 supercharged NSX, a M5 with a carbonfiber roof, a newer Porsche 911 Turbo, and a bike.


I can't imagine anyone spending close to $100,000 on a secondary car and not making a LOT MORE than $100,000...
 
Greetings

We are really talking about the wrong financial number here. We are talking about income and should be talking about net worth. I know couples who make over $300K/year that I would not loan $1000 to. They simply don't know how to handle money. There are a lot of millionaires who have never made over $100K per year in their entire life. Take your age times your income and divide by 10 to get a ballpark number where you should be -- formula from "The Millionaire Next Door". (You don't count equity in your home in your net worth calculations.)

Martin
 
Greetings

We are really talking about the wrong financial number here. We are talking about income and should be talking about net worth. I know couples who make over $300K/year that I would not loan $1000 to. They simply don't know how to handle money. There are a lot of millionaires who have never made over $100K per year in their entire life. Take your age times your income and divide by 10 to get a ballpark number where you should be -- formula from "The Millionaire Next Door". (You don't count equity in your home in your net worth calculations.)

Martin

Hey, I'm glad someone on Prime read The Millionaire Next Door.:cool:
 
for what its worth i came up with an eqaution for it when i was about ten LOL:tongue: for some reason i remember it, it was after my dad stepped up to mercedes from volvo. and these were back in the day when i was a little mathmetition, now im just st00pid all around

car=1/2 your yearly income(if your good with money/low debt)
house=6-10x your yearly income,


now that i think about it again, i would say 5-8x your income for a house, but thats just what i think, and all your cars =1/2 your income(im a 1 woman man but a multiple vehicle man :cool: )
 
Hey, I'm glad someone on Prime read The Millionaire Next Door.:cool:

OT

I glanced at a decent book. I think it's called Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Basic idea is:

1. Drive your income to the investment section (revenue producing assets) of your balance sheet, not the expense section of you P&L statement.
2. Take that investment income and drive it also to the same place. Think of it as turbo charging your wealth generation.
3. Keep liabilities low.
4. Learn to invest in tax shelters.
 
Greetings

I read "Rich Dad, Poor Dad". Found out later that there was no rich dad -- he is a composite of people Robert has known throughout his life. He believes stocks and the market are risky and real estate is not. I believe that both have some risk and invest in both. Kind of off thread here, but here is a link that evaluates the various people who hawk "Real Estate Investment Tools". Reed sells
newsletters and books, but not something that will cost you thousands of dollars. He trades real estate and even lets people know the addresses of property he has traded.

http://www.johntreed.com/realestate.html

Martin
 
OT

I glanced at a decent book. I think it's called Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Basic idea is:

1. Drive your income to the investment section (revenue producing assets) of your balance sheet, not the expense section of you P&L statement.
2. Take that investment income and drive it also to the same place. Think of it as turbo charging your wealth generation.
3. Keep liabilities low.
4. Learn to invest in tax shelters.

Excellent fundamentals to wealth accumulation! One point on the step 4 though, I don't think investing in tax shelters is altogether good blanket advice. It is certainly a bonus when you find an attractive investment vehicle that is also a tax shelter, but you shouldn't let the tax shelter tail wag the dog. By that I mean that you should always seek the greatest risk adjusted return on your investments, tax shelter or not.

Take this example for instance. You can deduct $25K in passive losses in real estate (if you claim you're a real estate professional with the IRS) and that is all well and good. Now say you buy a piece of commercial property for $1M and put $100K down and your expected return pre-taxes is 35% per annum over the next 10 years on your principle... sounds good right? Sure it does, it is good... but not astronomical by any means.

Now lets say that you have an opportunity to invest that $100K in a proven business venture that is looking for capital to expand (you buy equity). Maybe that venture has a current top-line of only $1M/year, but with proper funding should be able to scale out to take its entire market, and lets say that market is a $1B/year industry - yummy. You crunch the numbers and come up with an expected return of 45% per annum over the next 10 years on initial capital outlay (45% is a VERY low figure for this type of investment as any VC will tell you, but it suits our example well). No tax shelter here.

Before we go any further, keep in mind that "expected return" utilizes the probability of outcomes, so your expected return is where the most likely outcome is likely outcome to occur (have to assume a lognormal distribution for equities).

Okay, so which investment do you choose assuming you are not risk averse? Do you take the 35% return with additional tax shelter, or the 45% without tax shelter - both with a commitment of 10 years? The tax shelter only gets you an additional $8.7K/year (assuming 35% tax bracket). That is hardly even a drop in the bucket compared to the extra compounding of 10% over 10 years. At the end of our sample time frame, the real estate tax sheltered investment got you $2.1M ($2.65M if the $8.7K was reinvested - which it isn't in our example)... lets say you got really clever with the tax shelters and you bought the property with your Roth... now you've sold the property to cash out and you get to keep the whole enchilada... that is one huge sheltering. However, the second investment will net you $3.5M after paying capital gains taxes when you cash out. So you make an extra $1.4M over 10 years by not going with the double tax sheltered investment.

The moral of the story. Look for attractive investments, not attractive tax shelters. They'll both make you rich, but the former will do it faster. :)
 
Greetings

I read "Rich Dad, Poor Dad". Found out later that there was no rich dad -- he is a composite of people Robert has known throughout his life. He believes stocks and the market are risky and real estate is not. I believe that both have some risk and invest in both. Kind of off thread here, but here is a link that evaluates the various people who hawk "Real Estate Investment Tools". Reed sells
newsletters and books, but not something that will cost you thousands of dollars. He trades real estate and even lets people know the addresses of property he has traded.

http://www.johntreed.com/realestate.html

Martin
Robert Kiyosaki's "Rich Dad" book is an excellent motivational tool. It is also quite educational to the the balance sheet layman. Otherwise, it is full of badly mis-priced risks that are not immediately observable to the non-investor types... you would not make it very far if you really followed the numbers he uses in his examples. His other books are pure garbage, please don't waste your time with them. I think every aspiring entrepreneur early in his/her career should read his first book though, but don't put too much stock in it... the concepts are solid and it should get you pumped up, but it is not the gospel as I've heard some of my less financially savvy friends preach... it couldn't be further from it.
 
man i need some writeoffs....owe owe owe....i dont even get child tax credits lol

Better start now on the child tax credit for 2008.:biggrin: I have 4 kids, love those tax credits.:wink:
 
Better start now on the child tax credit for 2008.:biggrin: I have 4 kids, love those tax credits.:wink:


i get hit with amt...i dont get any credit for kids....there is a point where you dont get these credits anymore unfortunately.
 
go figure, the poster owns a Integra GSR (gsr.sedan). just an other dreamer sturing the pot. Your single and you have a 5K expense... that's ridiculous. If your not running a business, 5K is just stupid.

seriousley though, if you can afford 5,000 a month living expenses you can afford an nsx and you should have been laughing at integras a long long time ago,


although ron98 throws down on gsrsedan he has a point, i mean how the hell does an integra driver afford 5k living expense per month



a)if you have the money in the bank and have a good job then you can afford it

b)if you make alot of money and have some money saved up for down payment and good job security than you can afford it

c) if you drive an integra, you probably cant afford it

d)if you can afford 5k a month living expense than you should be able to afford a 30-80k dollar car, if you spend 60k a year on living expenses/etc and your a car person and you only have 1 integra, than you either make alot of money and just really love your integra or your trying to ball out of control when you spend all your money on a nice house/nice stuff and.........i forgot where i was going with this....


OP if you should know better than everybody if you can afford it, but if this is a real question than you should post up good details about you like income/cost of living/money in the bank, etc etc. or you can go ask somebody at your bank if you can afford it
 
I disagree with much of the above.

In my business, most people make 7 figures and some make 8. So there is a ton of dough in ppls pockets.

My boss, who makes about $10mm a year, drives a 10 year old pathfinder. Driving expensive cars is a terrible financial decision.

My opinion, for what its worth, is that any luxury/discretionary items like a car shouldnt be noticeable financially. If that $1,$2, or $5k a month payment or downpayent or full cash price of the car is felt by your wallet, IMO, its too early from a financial perspective. I understand if you're an enthusiast and you've gotta have it anyways. That's the price you pay!

Just my two
 
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