Income required to comfortably buy an nsx

[LJSB]

The NSX is a used car and really as a raw number not that much. They vary from about $25k to $65k depending on year and condition. Most nice exmaples fall somewhere in the middle of that figure.

It's not the numbers of a used 02' on up Lamborghini or Ferrari. Half at the most.

The numbers are more comparable to late model used Corvettes.

They were, or rather some were, 89k cars at full MSRP, but they are not any more.

As for raising the stakes in a business, investing what a used NSX would cost is not that much of an investment IMO.

 

[Daedalus]

Just to throw out a round number, based on your post, you should be earning over $100,000 per year to even consider buying that NSX. Even then, it may not be the smartest move.

+1 I was thinking $140k/year would comfortably finance su vida loca + an $80k car, depending on rates, tax status, insurance premiums, etc. Comfortable, though not wise.

 

[ExCfive]

Fully dependent on what your liquid assets (cash stash) are, and your disposable income. If your disposable income is $500.00 a month then you are gonna have to get into that cash stash for about 35-40k and carry a loan balance which the disposable income will cover monthly. This does not really take into account what you earn a year...just how well you have preserved it! (I'm thinking 65k as there are probably not too many NSX's running in the 80's)
In addition, I highly doubt that the average P car buyer makes close to $400k a year...that seems and sounds ridiculous. Now go buy your car!

 

[MCM]

“Take the Porsche 911. Its buyers are 86.8% male with the average age of 51 and median income of $390,000.”

$400K / Year is a fairly small group. I am not buying it.
No offence P owners. But this just sounds like BS.
Do you suppose it was an owner "survey"? LOL LOL


"Income required to comfortably buy an nsx"
As most here pay cash, income had nothing to do with the purchase.

On another note, $70,000.00 in 1990 = $120,000.00 in 2008.:smile:

 

[VTC]

I saw this quote from Forbes.com and I was surprised by how well p-car owners do. “Take the Porsche 911. Its buyers are 86.8% male with the average age of 51 and median income of $390,000.”

Not buyin this quote....
i would guess half that, and that's being generous.
not trying to insult the 911 guys, as I am (was) one of them and know many.
All do pretty well, few are at $390k though

 

[drew]

$400K / Year is a fairly small group. I am not buying it.
No offence P owners. But this just sounds like BS.

If this number surprises then you then you are not keeping track of current economy of this country AND basic statistics.

We now live in a Winner Take All society and that is causing an extreme amount wealth is getting concentrated into very very few hands.

Consider the fact that Bill Gates and Paul Allen both own a 959. These two guys *ALONE* probably make the average from from $150K to $400K.

Now, I like Bill and Allen (they earned their money), but there are 40 new billionaire hedge fund managers that traded in sub-prime loans in 2007...I'm sure they all have Porsche's too.

Averages can be very deceiving when there are extremes in the mix. Which is why this countries economy looks great on paper: as averages assume everybody is about equal, which is no longer the case.

**

Here is how buying a car should work (and getting ahead in life):

A non-essential depreciating asset must be purchased with cash. Loans are an extreme no-no.

The younger you are, the more your immediate money is worth to you. I figure every $5 that I spent on non-essentials at age 20, was later worth $50 when I was 35 and $85 at age 40. (Gawd, I wish I would have not bought some of the things I did)

I only buy my non-essentials as presents to myself for *making* money (this means free/clear in the bank). Never celebrate when landing a deal, getting a promotion or a investment....often they just don't work out as well as you think. Only reward yourself after it has gone to fruition.

You are not as good as you think, failures are expensive and success is difficult to come by. Try hard anyways, because every 5-10 years, something will become so successful that it will throw you way over the top....it does snowball and quickly at that, it is like winning the lottery.

And remember any good investment opportunity is a lot of work, takes a lot of time and fraught with danger of failure. Otherwise it is probably a scam.

Drew

 

[DocL]

As long as your basic needs are meet, buy anything that your heart desires. Let's say you buy the NSX today, when you are on your death bed are you going to say " Fvck!!!! I shouldn't have bought that NSX." I don't think so. So my advice is to buy one and enjoy it while you can.

 

[MCM]

"Consider the fact that Bill Gates and Paul Allen both own a 959. These two guys *ALONE* probably make the average from from $150K to $400K. "


Your probably right. Its just that I see them zipping around everyday and had a tough time believing their ave is $400k.
Point taken..........


Ave income of NSX owners is probably declining.:smile:
Huge turn over past few yrs.
But It would not suprise me in time if many orig owners come back.

 

[beckertb]

Consider the fact that Bill Gates and Paul Allen both own a 959. These two guys *ALONE* probably make the average from from $150K to $400K.



Not to get picky, but he quotes median incomes, not mean. These 2 would have no more impact than the 2 at the bottom with 0 income.

 

[VTC]

Consider the fact that Bill Gates and Paul Allen both own a 959. These two guys *ALONE* probably make the average from from $150K to $400K.



Not to get picky, but he quotes median incomes, not mean. These 2 would have no more impact than the 2 at the bottom with 0 income.

And the quote states "911 owners"

 

[drew]

And the quote states "911 owners"

I never realized that real life can be complicated. <sigh>

Does this dataset include leases?

If the cars were loaned on then the real owner is the bank, the borrower is merely the Registered Owner.

At what point and where was this data collected? POS? DMV? Poll?

 

[slamstrom]

The younger you are, the more your immediate money is worth to you. I figure every $5 that I spent on non-essentials at age 20, was later worth $50 when I was 35 and $85 at age 40. (Gawd, I wish I would have not bought some of the things I did)
Drew

This is so true. The power of time will help your money grow faster than you can ever earn over the long haul (in most cases). Just imagine going a whole year without your daily Starbucks, and watch that money grow for 5, 10 or 20 years.

Has anyone read The Millionaire Next Door? It's been at least 7 years since I read it, but as I recall, the summary/survey is basically this: most people who drive expensive cars are livng beyond their means. Especially those in affluent areas where they are more prone to have to keep up with the Joneses. Instead of putting money away for retirement, they're keeping up with the Joneses.

I don't think how much you make is as important as how much you put away regularly. My model that I learned from a friend is that you should always have living expesnes saved for X number of months. My rule of thumb is for every $10,000 you make you need to have at least 1 month of expenses saved for that unexpected lay-off. For example, if you make $120,000, you should have 12 months cash/short term securities saved. Reasoning is that studies have shown it normally takes about a month to find a job for every $10,000 in salary. For you real talented folks, your job seeking time may be less if it ever happens to you. During the dot com bubble burst, I have 2 friends on the opposite end of the specturm. One had to sell his house, and moved out of the Bay Area, and the other was able to weather out 3 years before he found another job. Oops, I am digressing.

Bottom line is to pay yourself first before spending on non-essential things. Hope you are already doing that as part of your $5,000 monthly cost of living.:smile:

 

[supra2nv]

If this number surprises then you then you are not keeping track of current economy of this country AND basic statistics.

We now live in a Winner Take All society and that is causing an extreme amount wealth is getting concentrated into very very few hands.

Consider the fact that Bill Gates and Paul Allen both own a 959. These two guys *ALONE* probably make the average from from $150K to $400K.

Drew

it said Median (in the middle) not Mean (average), but there could also be the possibilty of more millionares in number than not....know what I mean jelly bean?:biggrin:

 

[docjohn]

Why are we pretending to talk about 80k nsx,there are none:wink: you should be talking about 35-40 k nsx which won't depreciate too much ,so buy it if it keeps you up at night.but please have the resources to garage it, maintane it ,insure it ect.FWIW in this day and age of keeping up with the jones ect don't forget inheritence,when your neighber looks to be living beyond thier means quite possibly they have been the beneficiery of our parents frugal ways.My parents (near 80 yo) was the generation of savers.Sadly as the generations get younger seems less is being kept for future generation,this is the era of the spenders,and the depters.

 

[supra2nv]

Why are we pretending to talk about 80k nsx,there are none:wink: you should be talking about 35-40 k nsx which won't depreciate too much ,so buy it if it keeps you up at night.but please have the resources to garage it, maintane it ,insure it ect.FWIW in this day and age of keeping up with the jones ect don't forget inheritence,when your neighber looks to be living beyond thier means quite possibly they have been the beneficiery of our parents frugal ways.My parents (near 80 yo) was the generation of savers.Sadly as the generations get younger seems less is being kept for future generation,this is the era of the spenders,and the depters.

yes there are lol..ask me

 

[redshift]

A non-essential depreciating asset must be purchased with cash.

Drew, I really like what you said and agree with you 100% on everything except the quote above. As long as the carrying cost of the non-essential is higher than the risk-free rate of return, then you should very obviously finance it. For example, many lenders offer 0% financing on autos, obviously you should take that financing rather than paying with your own cash (since you lose the spread between the cc and rfr). You would also be making inflation work for you in this case. Like you said, $5 in your 20s is worth $50 in your 40s... this is so dead on true and it applies to what I've just said because the time value of assets is so important. In my example, if you discounted the future value of $50,000 (for a car) over 3 years (compounded) at the current risk free rate (~4%), then you'd save $750/year. Sure, that isn't a ton of money, but it leaves you more liquid at a savings to boot - which is very important. Of course, once you start factoring in higher rates of return, the amount you "save" (really lose by buying with cash) starts to go up dramatically.

gsr.sedan, I agree that the numbers are a bit lofty, but I aim high. To be honest, when I started my financial journey (and I'm still young, 28, and very much still finding my way), my family and friends thought my financial targets were unreachable (i.e. lofty). However, I was still somehow able to become a net-worth millionaire before 30. I'm NOT trying to boast, $1M might be a lot of money to some people and very little to others, but it illustrates how limiting our own thoughts can be - like that of my family. If you don't think you can do achieve your goals, you won't. If you believe you can, you will... pretty simple really.

It is great that you can work hard and make good money doing so, but you really do need to learn how to manage your finances to get and stay wealthy. Just start from the broad context of free-market economies and the money supply and work your way down.

 

[Jonmarsh]

If this number surprises then you then you are not keeping track of current economy of this country AND basic statistics.

We now live in a Winner Take All society and that is causing an extreme amount wealth is getting concentrated into very very few hands.

Consider the fact that Bill Gates and Paul Allen both own a 959. These two guys *ALONE* probably make the average from from $150K to $400K.

Now, I like Bill and Allen (they earned their money), but there are 40 new billionaire hedge fund managers that traded in sub-prime loans in 2007...I'm sure they all have Porsche's too.

Averages can be very deceiving when there are extremes in the mix. Which is why this countries economy looks great on paper: as averages assume everybody is about equal, which is no longer the case.

**

Here is how buying a car should work (and getting ahead in life):

A non-essential depreciating asset must be purchased with cash. Loans are an extreme no-no.

The younger you are, the more your immediate money is worth to you. I figure every $5 that I spent on non-essentials at age 20, was later worth $50 when I was 35 and $85 at age 40. (Gawd, I wish I would have not bought some of the things I did)

I only buy my non-essentials as presents to myself for *making* money (this means free/clear in the bank). Never celebrate when landing a deal, getting a promotion or a investment....often they just don't work out as well as you think. Only reward yourself after it has gone to fruition.

You are not as good as you think, failures are expensive and success is difficult to come by. Try hard anyways, because every 5-10 years, something will become so successful that it will throw you way over the top....it does snowball and quickly at that, it is like winning the lottery.

And remember any good investment opportunity is a lot of work, takes a lot of time and fraught with danger of failure. Otherwise it is probably a scam.

Drew

+1

Amen.

 

[drew]

For example, many lenders offer 0% financing on autos, obviously you should take that financing rather than paying with your own cash

In general, I would think that the initial price of the car absorbs the cost of the loan.

In which case, it would be reasonable to think that you could drive a harder bargain by paying cash and lowering the initial price of the vehicle (negating the value of a low/zero interest loan).

If it is not possible to drive down the original cost of the vehicle, then you would be correct.

My mantra: It is very expensive to be poor. Things that are geared for folks with little means tend to have lesser value.

Drew

 

[Chris NSX]

Just like I tell my 10 year old son " just worry about yourself" , some people will have more than you and some will have less than you. Be happy with what you have; work hard and save for what you want (Xbox 360). Try to keep your priorities in order (stop buying $10.00 Halo action figures if you want save enough money to buy a Xbox 360).

If someone wants to finance a NSX or to buy on cash, it is on that person to figure out if they can afford it or not.

I started on by son at the age of 6, he earns about $16.25 a month for chores. At first he was allowed to spend half and save half, now the decision is his what to save or spend. I got him is piggy bank when he was 6. Hopefully when he becomes an adult he will make wise financial decisions.

<a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/c12a1b1/Stuff/photo?authkey=V3mI-PNEx-I#5168389166764925570"><img src="http://lh6.google.com/c12a1b1/R7nOkFoAIoI/AAAAAAAACa8/r5ZmovMpPsw/s800/IMG_3405.JPG" /></a>

No need for me to beat my chest, because I am poor.:frown:

 

[RON98]

<a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/c12a1b1/Stuff/photo?authkey=V3mI-PNEx-I#5168389166764925570"><img src="http://lh6.google.com/c12a1b1/R7nOkFoAIoI/AAAAAAAACa8/r5ZmovMpPsw/s800/IMG_3405.JPG" /></a>

wow your kid got more money than I do. good for him and congrats you to for starting out your kinds young by teaching them responsible spending. I'll be doing the same with my kids when I get to that point in my life.:smile:

I think this topic is very silly. Income is very personal issue. Also like many has said before, its all about expenses. you can make 4000$ a month and have 1000$ in expense and save more than someone making 12000$ and have 10k in bills.

What's the point of this thread other than beat our chest about who makes more money?

go figure, the poster owns a Integra GSR (gsr.sedan). just an other dreamer sturing the pot. Your single and you have a 5K expense... that's ridiculous. If your not running a business, 5K is just stupid.

Never thought prime would have a thread like this but times are changing with new members who dont own an nsx posting rediculous threads that we should all have the better judgement to ignore and avoid.

we should be celebrating our ownership.

 

[LJSB]

times are changing with new members who dont own an nsx posting rediculous threads that we should all have the better judgement to ignore and avoid.

Amen.

 

[redshift]

My mantra: It is very expensive to be poor. Things that are geared for folks with little means tend to have lesser value.
Drew

I do agree. The car loan was just an example in relation to the risk-free rate. In reality there will be almost zero chance of borrowing money below that rate since properly priced risk should always have a premium. This might be a better example... if you believe that you can generate a 15% ROI on your capital then it would be unwise to pay down a 7% mortgage prematurely... you would want to drag it out as long as possible and take that 8% spread. Now... many risk averse people would probably think that is just plain imprudent, but that is because they would rather trade comfort (the lack of volatility) for wealth. That's totally fine, but logically (if your goal is to make money) the more prudent choice is to deploy as much capital to your higher yielding investments as possible; the mortgage debt principle only yields 7% as you pay it down while some other investment vehicle (or combination) is presumably yielding 15%. Of course, that 7% is risk-free while the 15% carries risk, but that is just a matter of how skillful you are at pricing risk - for which I've assumed has been done correctly in our example.

Anyway, its just the classic example of the widget factory. If building another widget factory earns you 10% on your investment and you must take down debt with a servicing fee of 5%, then you just created wealth out of thin air at a 5% clip, and everybody wins.

I think this topic is very silly. Income is very personal issue. Also like many has said before, its all about expenses. you can make 4000$ a month and have 1000$ in expense and save more than someone making 12000$ and have 10k in bills.

What's the point of this thread other than beat our chest about who makes more money?

go figure, the poster owns a Integra GSR (gsr.sedan). just an other dreamer sturing the pot. Your single and you have a 5K expense... that's ridiculous. If your not running a business, 5K is just stupid.

Never thought prime would have a thread like this but times are changing with new members who dont own an nsx posting rediculous threads that we should all have the better judgement to ignore and avoid.

we should be celebrating our ownership.

Ron, that was an unkind post and I don't really think it was productive, but it is certainly your right to share your perspective. I happen to know for a fact that the original poster learned some new information from this thread, so I think it served its purpose for him. I hope that might make you reconsider your negative words directed toward him and this threads participants.

 

[RON98]

Ron, that was an unkind post and I don't really think it was productive, but it is certainly your right to share your perspective. I happen to know for a fact that the original poster learned some new information from this thread, so I think it served its purpose for him. I hope that might make you reconsider your negative words directed toward him and this threads participants.

Hey Redshift, you where on my mind today, was just talking about you with another customer of mine today, we both agreed that your a cool operator and you where wise beyond your years :wink:

I think if someone has to have a hypothetical thread to decided if they can purchase or afford an nsx or not... its probably best they dont buy the car.

Also what has the owner learned? the key to it all is expense management? has he learned anything here that he could not have figured out if he sat quitely for 5 minutes and acturally thought things through?

if someone needs to be tought that lesson, then the nsx is probably not the right car since they probably have better things to do with their money like pay the bills.

here's something to think about. save up 3 month expenses + 3 month of car payment if he is going to pay through the bank. 15K for this guys situation for expenses and another 3k for 3 month car payment. then when he has save that up, start putting aside something every month to an nsx fund. when he saved up the $ for the down payment or saved up the $ in full. go buy the car.

most of us when we purchased our nsx or nsxs knew right off the bat that we had a solid financial foundation.

Look at the original post again.

"Let’s pretend the NSX is being sold today, new for $80k.

I’m single, with no debt. My cost of living per month is $5k. So how much should I be making so that I can have an nsx and still sustain my vida loca "

anyone else think this question is silly? if he cut down on the vida loca, he'll probably cut his expenses and get the nsx sooner. also all the hypothetical trivia on nsxprime of late are getting old and played out. life is about sacrifice.

happy motoring

Rob

 

[gsr.sedan]

I can’t believe I’m getting flamed by Ron98

I’ve learned a lot from prime. I’ve been looking at late model nsxs for over a year. When I saw the forbes quote, it got me thinking. If the average income of a p-car owner is 390k, and a p-car is similarly priced to an nsx, then I’m outta my league. Or is there something that I’m missing about the statistic? Can I buy a 80k nsx? 80k seem unthinkable today? Supra2nv said that you can ask him.

Can I buy an 80k nsx? You betcha. But would it be a smart move? I don’t make $390k/yr and I would guess that there are guys here who don’t either, and yet still drive a late model nsx. I’m just here to see how they do it and a discussion on money (in general) is beneficial to everyone.

The average cost of a home in Orange County is 550k, so 5k a month is very reasonable. Some posters have mentioned how expensive is out here, and they’re right, it is a little crazy.

Isn't this the correct forum nsx wannabes? So do I get the nomination for best troll thread of the year? :biggrin:

 

[redshift]

Hey Redshift, you where on my mind today, was just talking about you with another customer of mine today, we both agreed that your a cool operator and you where wise beyond your years :wink:

... real nice Ron. Thanks for all your help and kind words. I'm glad you took time out of your busy day to try to help somebody - as opposed to putting them down. Kudos to you.

I guess I'm just a sucker for financial topics, that is my field of expertise after all... but since this is a car forum I guess I should just shut my mouth and leave all the no-nonsense straight talk to speed oracles like yourself.

I’ve learned a lot from prime. I’ve been looking at late model nsxs for over a year. When I saw the forbes quote, it got me thinking. If the average income of a p-car owner is 390k, and a p-car is similarly priced to an nsx, then I’m outta my league. Or is there something that I’m missing about the statistic? Can I buy a 80k nsx? 80k seem unthinkable today? Supra2nv said that you can ask him.

Can I buy an 80k nsx? You betcha. But would it be a smart move? I don’t make $390k/yr and I would guess that there are guys here who don’t either, and yet still drive a late model nsx. I’m just here to see how they do it and a discussion on money (in general) is beneficial to everyone.

The average cost of a home in Orange County is 550k, so 5k a month is very reasonable. Some posters have mentioned how expensive is out here, and they’re right, it is a little crazy.

Isn't this the correct forum nsx wannabes? So do I get the nomination for best troll thread of the year?

You really shouldn't have to justify your curiosity. For whatever reason, some of us thought the topic was valid while others didn't. It's cool that you did get multiple points of view on the subject though. It helps to look at things from different perspectives, especially if you hadn't considered it previously. Good luck!