I need tire help. PLEASE! (track/street)

[TURBO2GO]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Scan your policy and email it to me and I will let you know whether you have coverage. Don't believe your "agent" since they just want to sell you the policy to make the commissions on the renewals and may be concerned you will switch carriers if they give you the "wrong" answer. After all, they figure if you have to ask what your policy says then you haven't read it and they can say anything.

And get street tires.....

Thanks Bob, will get a copy of that policy today from my agent. I appreciate the help.

So one last question guys... will the R compounds help me (even in the smallest way) avoid a possible disaster or not? That was a huge motivating factor for me. And I will get an acusump.

 

[RSO 34]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Thanks Bob, will get a copy of that policy today from my agent. I appreciate the help.

So one last question guys... will the R compounds help me (even in the smallest way) avoid a possible disaster or not? That was a huge motivating factor for me. And I will get an acusump.

You can scan and email it to me at RSO34 at NSXCA dot org or fax it to me at nine one four seven six four nine one zero eight.

 

[Hrant]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Thanks Bob, will get a copy of that policy today from my agent. I appreciate the help.

So one last question guys... will the R compounds help me (even in the smallest way) avoid a possible disaster or not? That was a huge motivating factor for me. And I will get an acusump.

You are still shopping for that post ...... :tongue:

Define what you mean "help me (even in the smallest way)"? You are all over the place with your post from safety to seeking to go faster.

If you mean safer for you, the answer is still no! Given your driving skill level, R compound "may" give you better grip when the car is pushed beyond the limits of street tire adhesion - which will not be your case yet. But most likely, they may overcome your rookie or low intermediate driver mistakes giving you an added false confidence which means your learning curve will not be optimized.

Again, listen to the more sage elders when they tell you stick with street tires for now and at least another season.

 

[RSO 34]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

p.s. And since you admit you are not looking to "push" the car to its limits, why would you want to increase the car's limits? I still say you don't know what you don't know - - - that is you have not learned YOUR car's limits because you have not found your own. This is a result of the combination of inexperience and unwillingness to push the car to such an extent that you know the limits of adhesion of street tires.

By way of comparison (and certainly not bragging since I get passed regularly on that portion of the track by other "open trackers" as if I am standing still), at Kids' Day at the Glen I had to use an old set of OEM Bridgestone Potenza RE010s on my POS '96 with stock engine and transmission (120,000 miles) when I picked up a nail in my Rs. With a passenger I was at 125 on the back straight and without that ballast I was at 132. Your car is much faster than mine and your admission that you "coast" should tell you that you should stick with street tires until you get more experience. Your "personal" limits have you well below your car's limits so stop raising the bar of the car and raise your own.

 

[CL65 Captain]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Dave,

I'm going back to street tires (Kumho XS) on my 16/17 and selling my track wheels - 17/17 RFP01s after I kill these Nitto NT01s. Dealing with the wear and swapping wheels and worrying about whether it's going to rain or not isn't worth all the trouble. A good Extreme performance street tire is plenty adequate for HPDEs.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

You are still shopping for that post ...... :tongue:

Define what you mean "help me (even in the smallest way)"? You are all over the place with your post from safety to seeking to go faster.

I mean if I make a mistake and have to break to keep from hitting a wall, will the R compound help me stop quicker. Will it help me from cracking up the car like the Corvette did on my HPDE day at NHMS or the Mini that went off the track and rolled 3 times right in front of me at WGI. I know I am not at the limits of what the car can do now. I think John is right. It's not so easy to learn in this car. Had I gone to the track sooner I wouldn't own a CTSC... or a whole host of other parts. That is all the result of boredom and keyboard racing. If the car was NA I may lay into it all the way down the straight, but right now I am uncomfortable with 140. It's clearly too much car.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Billy thanks for the driving tips. Will do.

 

[RSO 34]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

I mean if I make a mistake and have to break to keep from hitting a wall, will the R compound help me stop quicker. Will it help me from cracking up the car like the Corvette did on my HPDE day at NHMS or the Mini that went off the track and rolled 3 times right in front of me at WGI.

Tires had nothing to do with that Mini rolling in the bus stop at the Glen. That was a hard lesson learned about not entering a gravel pit sideways.

Just like tires had nothing to do with the Factor X NSX crashing at NSXPO 2004 at the Glen but that incident should stand out as an example of a bad outcome when a driver modifies the car beyond the driver's ability to handle it.

 

[jtower]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

I mean if I make a mistake and have to break to keep from hitting a wall, will the R compound help me stop quicker. Will it help me from cracking up the car like the Corvette did on my HPDE day at NHMS or the Mini that went off the track and rolled 3 times right in front of me at WGI. I know I am not at the limits of what the car can do now. I think John is right. It's not so easy to learn in this car. Had I gone to the track sooner I wouldn't own a CTSC... or a whole host of other parts. That is all the result of boredom and keyboard racing. If the car was NA I may lay into it all the way down the straight, but right now I am uncomfortable with 140. It's clearly too much car.

r-comps will not help you in those cases, in fact they'll make things worse by elevating the speed at which things go wrong.

it sounds like you have a healthy amount of respect for the car (that's good) and also recognize your limitations as a driver (also good). the smart thing to do at this point might be to pick up a less expensive track car so you can develop your driving skills at a more reasonable pace and with less fear of recrimination should things go awry. everyone will have their favorites, i'm going to suggest a e36 bmw - cheap, plentiful, good rwd dynamics, solid brakes, enough power to be interesting, and half the paddock has probably owned one at some point. drive this for a year and i bet you will emerge a *significantly* better driver than if you spent that time in the nsx. a miata is also an excellent learning tool.

 

[Liquid]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

I think John is right. It's not so easy to learn in this car. Had I gone to the track sooner I wouldn't own a CTSC... or a whole host of other parts. That is all the result of boredom and keyboard racing. If the car was NA I may lay into it all the way down the straight, but right now I am uncomfortable with 140. It's clearly too much car.

This is an important point I think. When you modify the car, you inherently change the balance of the way the car has been engineered. I don't mean weight distribution... I mean obvious things like more power necessitates larger brakes as well as less obvious things like more power makes the car much more tricky at the limit and requires much more driver skill in applying the throttle, or stickier tires may require better oiling system or whatever.

I think almost everyone who modifies the NSX does so without fully considering the second order effects of what they are doing. Not to mention by increasing your investment in the car you increase your financial risk as well.

 

[NSXDreamer2]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

if you are uncertain about the lift at 140mph, you need more downforce and/or mechanical grip. But then do you need to go over 140 is another question. If you don't need to take a passenger, you could remove the pass. seats, the tires can fit in the car.

with 9 events at the same track, I actually think that you are fine to go with R compound tires. Go pick up a GT wing too.

 

[Ski_Banker]

It sounds like you're really getting into the HPDE thing, which is great. I'm sorta in the same boat, but I have to ask -- don't you worry about putting your pristine 05 into a wall???? That's great if you're in the "ya gotta pay to play" financial situation, and of course insurance should cover you for the most part. But still... if I hit something solid, or even took a painful offroad trip, in mine, I know I would be beyond pissed. Seems like that's only a matter of time. And all of the zero owner 05 NSXs have been spoken for...

For me, if I realize that the track-bug is bearing down, I'll probably bail out and get an Elise/Z06/miata for track duty before I go all in with my NSX. That's just me obviously. :redface:

 

[tosugrad]

Love my Z1s.

 

[Blackoutz]

Go with the Z1's. I am about to go on my second set and have loved them since day 1!!!!

Blaine

 

[Matt_337]

Where is this rebate for the Dunlops?
I want to order a set

 

[FXMDBilly]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

140 is not bad atall in these cars. I wouldn't be too concerned about lift.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Where is this rebate for the Dunlops?
I want to order a set

It's through Dunlop. Only a few days left Matt.

 

[TURBO2GO]

It sounds like you're really getting into the HPDE thing, which is great. I'm sorta in the same boat, but I have to ask -- don't you worry about putting your pristine 05 into a wall???? That's great if you're in the "ya gotta pay to play" financial situation, and of course insurance should cover you for the most part. But still... if I hit something solid, or even took a painful offroad trip, in mine, I know I would be beyond pissed. Seems like that's only a matter of time. And all of the zero owner 05 NSXs have been spoken for...

For me, if I realize that the track-bug is bearing down, I'll probably bail out and get an Elise/Z06/miata for track duty before I go all in with my NSX. That's just me obviously. :redface:

It's always a concern. I am considering a dedicated track car. If I do that, I may actually sell my NSX. Right now however, I am going 8/10ths at most and being extra cautious. The only thing I worry about is others, or some mechanical failure. I just don't push hard enough to lose it and smack a wall.

 

[jtower]

It's always a concern. I am considering a dedicated track car. If I do that, I may actually sell my NSX. Right now however, I am going 8/10ths at most and being extra cautious. The only thing I worry about is others, or some mechanical failure. I just don't push hard enough to lose it and smack a wall.

that's what i said just before i spun my m3 into a tire barrier

 

[Ski_Banker]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Is it true that R-comps generally give less feedback before they let go, compared to high end street tires? If that is true, then I think for Turbos question (will R-comps be safer with more grip?), the answer would be no- it makes the safety problem worse. Unless you're looking at the speedo at every turn and keeping it pegged to where you'd take a turn on street tires.

 

[NSXDreamer2]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Is it true that R-comps generally give less feedback before they let go, compared to high end street tires? If that is true, then I think for Turbos question (will R-comps be safer with more grip?), the answer would be no- it makes the safety problem worse. Unless you're looking at the speedo at every turn and keeping it pegged to where you'd take a turn on street tires.

there's R compound and THERE's R compound. (RA1 vs Hoosiers in mind) I'm not sure how's the new BF Goodrich R1 reacts, but the old design isn't a too forgiving tires.

I've used RA1 and Nt01, tried the A048 a few times. They are pretty good at the limit and I don't find them "not forgiving". However, the R compound added traction will let you bring more speed into the corner, and things can happen much quicker at 90mph than 75mph. Without knowing the driving habbit and sitting in his car, I really don't know if Turbo2go will be benefit from it or the other way around.

 

[FXMDBilly]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

RA1/R888/NT01 all are pretty audible and let you know when they are going to go, and have a good amount of grip after they start to slide.

Hoosier R6 and BFG R1 are have a design closer to a real slick with a slightly more abrupt break-away, but not a whole lot.

Yes higher cornering speeds can = more problems but all said tires make way more noise and have more grip past their optimum slip angle than Falken 615s in anything over 80*F.

615s are super greasy, make no noise, and are not very forgiving when its hot out, but they make a lot more grip, tire noise, and are more forgiving when the track temps are really cold.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

OK the latest is that I tried to buy a set of AD08's but they are backordered for weeks and I can't wait that long as I have a track event at Monticello Motor Club with the Ferrari club in a week. So I ordered a set of Dunlop Z1 Star Specs. Discount Tire direct hooked me up, $50 less than the tire rack. $540 for the set delivered to me. I'll let you guys know how these feel. I'll get R comps later as I get better.

Thanks to all for making a great very informative thread.

 

[Matt_337]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

OK the latest is that I tried to buy a set of AD08's but they are backordered for weeks and I can't wait that long as I have a track event at Monticello Motor Club with the Ferrari club in a week. So I ordered a set of Dunlop Z1 Star Specs. Discount Tire direct hooked me up, $50 less than the tire rack. $540 for the set delivered to me. I'll let you guys know how these feel. I'll get R comps later as I get better.

Thanks to all for making a great very informative thread.

Hey Dave

I reported to Discount Tire that their prices for these tires were more than Tirerack just a couple of days ago and they didn't get back to me.
Got a number that I can call that will give me the set at the same price you got?

 

[TURBO2GO]

Re: Tire help. PLEASE!!!

Hey Dave

I reported to Discount Tire that their prices for these tires were more than Tirerack just a couple of days ago and they didn't get back to me.
Got a number that I can call that will give me the set at the same price you got?

Matt call and ask for Earl. I told him I had just missed the deadline for the rebate and he said "well I know, it was $80 (it was actually $60 on the Z1), and I know you wanted the AD08 and we didn't have them, so I will give you an instant $40 if you want, making the total $540 delivered to your door if you buy them now". And so I did. Tell him "a Dave with a 2005 NSX called yesterday and bought a set from you for $540" and see if he will do the same for you. I also found a place that will do a mount and road force balance with the new Hunter machine for $15/wheel! So all in all, mounted and road force balanced I am out the door for just under $600!