Gas price forecast

Yellow Rose said:
Why the diatribe of "splitting hairs" over gasoline taxes?

As liftshard more than accurately presents, the price of crude oil....thus the price of gasoline....will only go up, never down for substantial time periods until our dieing days on this planet have arrived.

Post how you wish all you want that you do not like rising gasoline prices, but it is a fact of life. Another fact of life is that.....we will all die; however, I don't see posts of "I don't like knowing that I will eventually die." :confused: So why all the commotion about gasoline prices? :confused:

To put this into another perspective.....who here complains about the price of a gallon of milk or a quart of orange juice or a jug of laundry detergent or your favorite cologne that perhaps costs $50 for just a few ounces or a juicy hamburger that can easily cost five bucks but you can make it at home for about two bucks? I haven’t seen those complaints, have you? Do you folks not put things into perspective with respect to life's grand scheme of things? :mad: Obviously not. Sorry Lud, just calling it like it is.

How about the price of water? If you had told me 10 years ago I would be paying a buck for a 20 oz bottle of water I would have told you you're nuts. Ofcourse if you were at woodstock 99 water would have cost you 5 bucks for a 12oz bottle. :eek:
BTW...."I don't like knowing that I will eventually die." In fact it haunts me on a daily basis.
 
Sounds like a bit of the "chicken little complex" to me, from the research I have seen there are billions of barrels of oil yet to be pumped from the earth but the oil providers (nations/oil companys) are limiting the production as to inflate the cost to us and profits for them, I am not yet storing up gas like Mad Max but I am buying stock in Exxon-mobil,Shell,ect ect :smile:
 
NetViper said:
US price in Savananh is 2.33 a gallon.
So the price of gas is $2.01 and the tax is 32 cents.

So we in the US are paying roughly 35 cents more per gallon for actual gasoline.

In other states that would vary, but mostly more!

Could be that someone (gas station, distributor, importer, ...) wants his part $$$? Just wondering... :confused:
 
Well rising gas prices suck regardless of hwere you live/drive.

I own an '05 Prius for my daily driver and just mailed in my application to the DMV to get the sticker to allow me to drive in the commute lane when alone and also use the commute lane to cross the bridges at commute time.

Just doing my part to keep the environment clean and get there faster....
 
I should have filled up this morning. On my way to a job in my Chevy pickup, passed a gas station where regular was $2.46. I figured I'd wait till my way home this afternoon. Eight hours later, with an almost empty tank, I had to stop. Price for regular went up to $2.61 :frown:
 
If gas costs too much, drive less. It is pretty simple, just like everything else in life. We have seen wonderful prices on many staples for the last 5-10 years (except real estate). All commodities will eventually get more expensive, then less expensive, then more, etc.

Just to put it in perspective, I hauled the rat down to Barber last weekend for the Chin event. Since I work every Saturday, I drove down Saturday afternoon to run the Sunday portion. Dragging the trailer behind the Suburban (5.7l 3/4 ton model) averaging 7-8mpg, it cost me $253 in gas alone to get 30 minutes of track time before the car broke. VIR looks nicer and nicer everyday:D
 
zahntech said:
Sounds like a bit of the "chicken little complex" to me, from the research I have seen there are billions of barrels of oil yet to be pumped from the earth but the oil providers (nations/oil companys) are limiting the production as to inflate the cost to us and profits for them, I am not yet storing up gas like Mad Max but I am buying stock in Exxon-mobil,Shell,ect ect :smile:

I agree. Alaska has trillions of gallons of crude that could be drilled, but many of the conservatives would rather limit our ability to drill for it in effort of the environment. Many of these people are of the type that threatened the lives of Ted Nugents children because Daddy was promoting deer hunting to children instead of drugs. Okay, enough said about that.

Greed, in my opinion, is linked to almost every problem that man knows. And with oil prices, this is no exception. People are getting rich off of this. This supply and demand theory is a crock of BS if you ask me.

We all look at the pump as the barometer for the price of crude, but in reality, it hits us all in so many other ways. Everything from the plastic on your keyboard to the machine that threaded the shirt you wear depends on energy. And as the price of energy continues to increase, the price for everything will go up.

A lady at the Shell station I go to near the interstate said that driveoffs have increased so much over the last couple of months, that they are considering getting an off duty police officer to stay on the premises. And we as the consumer will indirectly be paying his salary, free donuts, and coffee. :wink:
 
djdrock said:
This supply and demand theory is a crock of BS if you ask me.

Isn't global macro-economics driven by S-n-D?

I'm fairly certain that every college professor will say "yes".
 
Yellow Rose said:
Isn't global macro-economics driven by S-n-D?

I'm fairly certain that every college professor will say "yes".

I said THIS and not THE S/D theory. To clarify what I was saying...High fuel prices being totally attribiuted to supply/demand is a crock of BS. People are getting rich off of high gas prices. If this was not the case, then maybe I would give the S/D theory more credibility.
 
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Ahh yes. I've got a post in a similar thread dated the start of the year on another site. Same comments just the price was hovering under $2 USD / gallon.

I’m in with the adjusted for inflation, the price hasn’t moved much camp. Nobody was complaining when cost of living was rising faster than the price of gas for obvious reasons. Just time for it to catch up.

Would you be surprised to find out the oil production quantities around the world? US is number 2 on the list. The issue is that we import about as much as we make. See worldwide production numbers here.
 
whealy said:
Would you be surprised to find out the oil production quantities around the world? US is number 2 on the list. The issue is that we import about as much as we make. See worldwide production numbers here.

Wow, I had no idea about that. I would "hope" that we are not exporting oil just to import it from somewhere else. But I imagine that this is probably not the case. Politics....
 
Non-Opec

djdrock said:
I would "hope" that we are not exporting oil just to import it from somewhere else.

United States is not a member of OPEC.
 
donwon said:
I just saw 2.97 for premium :eek:

Just saw that here today too. I managed to sneak it at one place for $2.55 for 87 octane in my truck, but premium was just shy of $3.00 at the stations that had gone up already.
 
The laws of supply and demand are more effective when the balance of the number of suppliers to the number of consumers is more even, The main problem with oil is that there is huge worldwide demand and only a small # of source companies/nations in comparison to the demand, we really need southwest airlines to start drilling and put some competition back into the oil market...JZ
 
zahntech said:
Sounds like a bit of the "chicken little complex" to me, from the research I have seen there are billions of barrels of oil yet to be pumped from the earth but the oil providers (nations/oil companys) are limiting the production as to inflate the cost to us and profits for them, I am not yet storing up gas like Mad Max but I am buying stock in Exxon-mobil,Shell,ect ect :smile:

Your misperception in this regard is a common one. There are hundreds of billions, even trillions of barrels in the ground. This is not the issue.

The issue is that, in each and every year, we expect our economy to grow. GDP "growth" is what matters. If we don't have growth, we have a recession, when GDP shrinks. GDP is tied to energy production. In fact, there's a recent article in the Washington Pest about Chinese energy inefficiency which expressed $1M of additional GDP in various rates of energy consumption. Each additional unit of GDP requires *some* amount of additional energy. It keeps the lights on, powers the machines, keeps the conveyor belts moving.

So, to continue to grow our economy, we need to continue to grow our energy supply. Our supply must grow each and every year as compared to the last year. This is what our population has done and our GDP has done. And, everything and everyone needs power.

Our solution thus far has been to just pump more oil this year than last year. And, for about 120yrs or however long we've been pumping this stuff, that has worked just fine. Oil supply has increased every year as compared to the year before.

So, we plan to continue to do what we've always done. However, physics has played a cruel trick on us. Perpetual exponential growth is impossible. Insofar as oil supply is concerned, at some point, every well, every nation, and the world as a whole, achieves a peak supply rate. This is the point at which oil is being pumped out at its peak level. After this, Peak Oil, the supply rate achievable begins to decline. More net oil CANNOT be pumped out next year, at any price.

This condition was first posulated by a guy called M. King Hubbert, who was a geologist and engineer. Sadly, he was roundly laughed at and pilloried by economists and other people who think they're smarter than engineers. Hubbert predicted the US would achieve Peak Oil in the early 1970s, and he did so in the 1950s. And, everyone laughed. Haha, dumbass. And, then, in 1970, the USA did exactly that, hit Peak Oil. We all know what followed. Hyperinflation (for the USA anyway) as Nixon decoupled the dollar from gold, economic recession, the collapse of very large US industrial interests, etc. I.e., life changed. At about 1988 or 1989, the USSR hit Peak Oil as well. What happened to the USSR afterwards is well-known. Within a short span of time, their entire societal model collapsed and they no longer exist. In fact, the reason why Chernobyl happened was because the USSR was recklessly nuclearizing in response to surprise Peak Oil-caused energy shortage. Once their hasty reactor exploded, they could no longer politically sustain deployment of reactors and could not meet power needs. Everything fell the hell apart rapidly.

The point of this is that Peak Oil is a significant issue for the world and it's coming up within the next 5 or so years. And, it has nothing to do with how much oil is still in the ground. When the USA hit Peak in 1970, we still had hundreds of billions of barrels still in the ground. And, we are still pumping them. We pumped over 7 million barrels per day last year and were the world's #1 oil producer as recently as like 2001. In 1970, we peaked at beyond 10mbpd...now, we've lost about 34% of our production rate capacity and we continue to decline.

Peak is a real phenomenon. Predictions of apocalypse as a result are just speculation. Nobody really knows what will happen. Much depends upon the slope of the other side of the supply curve. The steeper it is, the worse things will be, up to and including mass starvation and whatnot. If it's shallow enough and we can divert war resources and stuff like that, money paid to old people to be old, and find great efficiency gains, we can do a lot to soften the downslide. But, stagflation occurs anyway. Without an increase in energy every year, we cannot grow GDP as an ongoing proposition.
 
djdrock said:
Wow, I had no idea about that. I would "hope" that we are not exporting oil just to import it from somewhere else. But I imagine that this is probably not the case. Politics....

I don't want to sound insulting, but don't you think you should be fully educated on the oil market before making comment on why you think prices are so high?

The USA consumes far more oil than it produces. We have been a net importer since USA Peak Oil. For the better part of a century, we were world #1 oil producer. The USSR was right up there with us.
 
Liftshard, Thats all very interesting, you seem to be a firm believer in the "peak oil" concept however you have yet to explain why oil production cannot be increased? not enough labor avalible? not enough mechines? why?
 
liftshard said:
At about 1988 or 1989, the USSR hit Peak Oil as well. What happened to the USSR afterwards is well-known. Within a short span of time, their entire societal model collapsed and they no longer exist. In fact, the reason why Chernobyl happened was because the USSR was recklessly nuclearizing in response to surprise Peak Oil-caused energy shortage. Once their hasty reactor exploded, they could no longer politically sustain deployment of reactors and could not meet power needs. Everything fell the hell apart rapidly.

The Chernyobl reactor incident was in early 1986, and the Cherobyl plant and all the reactors operating at the time of the accident were built and brought online through the late '70s and early '80s.

Your retelling of Hubbert's Peak Oil position is interesting, but you are far too casual with your assignments of cause and effect throughout.
 
I never liked Hubbard's theory... he also predicted in 1970 the end of available oil between '90 and '95. :rolleyes:

Anyway, more critics here (not an easy read but very interesting):
http://www.gasresources.net/Lynch(Hubbert-Deffeyes).htm
 
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