Does your car react differnetly at different tracks?

Just a follow up on this thread.

Today, the commentator Bob Varsha (sp?) for Speed Channel noted during the F1 pole position qualifications at Nurburgring that this was a track that "induced understeer" especially at the slow speed turns.
 
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Hrant said:
Just a follow up on this thread.

Today, the commentator Bob Varsha (sp?) for Speed Channel noted during the F1 pole position qualifications at Nurburgring that this was a track that "induced understeer" especially at the slow speed turns.

he should have said it the other way around. Because this track calls for several slow speed turns, the cars have to fight understeer due to the lack of aerodynamic help on the front tires. It's not the track that induces understeer, it's the F1 car's configuration. I've driven at the Nurburgring and the Hockenheimring (not F1 cars of course :rolleyes: ) and different cars behave in a complete different manner in the same turns. :wink:
 
Re: Poor Bob

this track calls for several slow speed turns, the cars have to fight understeer due to the lack of aerodynamic help on the front tires.

So, to put it another way, what he was really trying to say is that the most important turns on the track are high speed, and since the set up is optimized for those, it unavoidably sucks for the lesser important slow speed turns. Guess I'll pay attention to the race tomorrow to see what else is going on in the slow corners...maybe off camber and other grip problems?

Yeah, Bob’s a pretty knowledgeable guy about a lot of things but he makes me laugh when he tries to talk technical. He can be as confused and imprecise as Dubya :redface: gets when he tries to talk technical or unscripted. (Anyone else enjoy the daily calendar of "Bushisms"?)
 
Which just goes to show that track tuners who are interested in the fastest times for the whole lap, concentrate on the corners which usually lead onto fast straights. This is where you make up time and every book or instructor that I've run across has said the same thing. The most important corners are those leading onto the fastest longest straights. If you can get out of those corners quickly and onto the straight at a faster rate, then your speed at the end of that straight will be faster and thus your time will come down. Given how aerodynamics will also come into play, the faster speed should enhance your cornering at the end of this straight as well. All other corners which lead to onto shorter straights or other corners, such as turns 11 & 12 at Thunderhill's (S turn) are not as important for car setup. Turn 12A is important because it leads down the back straight and the combination turn 14/15 which leads down the front straight is extremely important. There are other variables but that's what the driver is for. :cool:
 
I’m timid to chime in, as this subject gets close to ones personal style and ego. But I have a few thoughts that I think are related to the threads question.

Tracks can positively be designed to induce different characteristics for your specific car or the way it is setup. For instance If your car is setup with a lot of negative camber for heavy load sidewall flex, and you go to a track with a slow corner or a corner that is too warn to grip well, then the tire wont roll enough to use it’s full width and may push. On the other hand if at a track that grips like crazy and uses all of the negative camber, you may find that your rears have less grip then the fronts. An example of this is skid pad testing. The speeds are too slow to use much camber, so your best results would be with much less negative camber then a normal race setup.

Another example might be exit types, where under steer is noticed vs. never a consideration because of the width of the track or amount of camber on the track.

Most of us try to round out our car so it’s good over-all, and then we use the techniques mentioned above to compensate in the abnormal corners. The great tuners will study the track, and may try to specifically tune the car for important corner. Those corners may not always be the turn before the longest straight, it may be a particularly troublesome corner for that car or the whole field, or they got an infraction or qualified poorly they may tune for a specific corner that’s good for passing. The point is that all tracks, conditions, and circumstances will constantly change. The people who can tune so the car does most of the work, are the ones who do great in points. Even though I understand the concepts, I’m sure not claiming to be one of the great tuners… I’m usually chasing down a problem rather then tuning. But when you do get the time, try some things and go past the point of good returns in both directions so that you know from experience what works. Teams that are the most prepared before they get to the track actually have time to tune and are usually the ones up front.

Another point is that as a driver you need better define the condition that needs correcting. Regardless if you’re doing the tuning or have a crew chief, saying that your loose in turn two is not enough. Were you loose on entry, apex/transition, or the exit. They all have different weight transfer and different adjustments that work best for the situation.
 
Reviving an old thread! I am vindicated with my question!!

Watching the F1 Hungarian Gand Prix, and once again the commentator noted that this track was notorious for its understeer (presumably because of low speed turns) and the proof they showed how the Lotus of Romain Grosjean understeered and then snap oversteered at the first turn while battling with Vettel (who tried to pull a vintage MS forced wheel to wheel squeeze shove but this time to the left of the track) ........ watching on delayed Tivo now ....
 
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