Any members performed or know of someone that has performed a non-Honda engine swap into the NSX chassis? If so I'd like to know more about your project.
Different engine swaps in an NSX chassis?
- Thread starter Bigglezworth
- Start date
Bigglezworth said:
I believe Mark Crisman (sp?) aka Mark911 is doing a LS swap. He previously had a gruppeM SC on his NSX. Very handy guy so I'm sure if anyone can pull it off, it will be Mark.
Regards,
Danny
ps The RX7s with LS2s are now pretty common. Loads more torque and the driveline is only 50 pounds more. An RX7 with a NA LS7 clone put down 520 rwhp
lowellhigh79 said:ps The RX7s with LS2s are now pretty common. Loads more torque and the driveline is only 50 pounds more. An RX7 with a NA LS7 clone put down 520 rwhp
Plus the motor's won't blow up every 20K miles!
lowellhigh79 said:ps The RX7s with LS2s are now pretty common. Loads more torque and the driveline is only 50 pounds more. An RX7 with a NA LS7 clone put down 520 rwhp
I wouldn't say common but there are a good number of FD's with the LS1 swap. I've only heard of a couple of cars with the LS2 and the advantages don't really justify the added cost/complexity of that motor. For those not familiar with these motors they can make an easy 400whp/400wtq NA with just a couple thousand in mods.
As far as swapping motors in an NSX I can't see the point.
The only reason its justified in the RX cars is because the rotary is so poorly suited to real world use. Look at all the people on this board who have beat on their NSX's over years of track days and have only recently experienced minor, preventable failures. Just my opinion but I would never swap that motor for anything but another stock or built/stroked monster.
Miss your X Nate? Look me up when you are in CVG and you can visit with mine. :smile:
Jim
Jim
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Big_nate said:I wouldn't say common but there are a good number of FD's with the LS1 swap. I've only heard of a couple of cars with the LS2 and the advantages don't really justify the added cost/complexity of that motor. For those not familiar with these motors they can make an easy 400whp/400wtq NA with just a couple thousand in mods.
As far as swapping motors in an NSX I can't see the point.
We were in a competition recently with some high hp cars and the RX7 with the LS7 clone looked the most like the car that had more engine than the chassis could handle (this is a compliment). As for the NSX, I think a LS would be a cool idea although I don't know howor which tranny would work out. Using the NSX tranny retains the achilles heal of all high hp NSXs, the tranny.
Regards,
Danny
I was speaking with Jeff from Full Race in Arizona and he would love to build an S2k motor and boost it. He said by swapping to that motor and some trans that i honestly forgot the name of that a 800+hp nsx could be possible. And he is the boost master!
lowellhigh79 said:
Is that your NSX in the background at the end of this video? Twin turbo, no?
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/3c33e75d-de7e-4370-bc4d-984201588c21.htm
Jim,
I may have to take you up on that.:biggrin: Yes, I do miss the NSX.:frown: The RX7 is a lot of fun but an altogether different experience.
Nate
You've hit the nail on the head with the hammer for the most part. The biggest part of the equation that I didn't lead on with the starting post of this thread is that I am seriously contemplating taking a salvaged NSX with blown motor and tearing the drivetrain out to put in a Buick Motorsports Stage II V6.Big_nate said:
Something along the lines of this type of a powerplant - except in a classy NSX chassis vs. the Mustang it's in with this photo.
For those that cite the LS examples for engines, let it be known that the single and twin turbo versions of a 4.1-4.3L stroked V6 stomp all over the NA V8's - AND - weigh less.... I have a Buick GNX that I ran a "relatively mild" 700+RWHP Stage II 4.1L engine in for 5 years prior to putting it back to stock a couple of years back. It's straight forward enough to have a daily driver laying down 1000+RWHP from these engines and personally - I think that would rock in an NSX chassis. Thus the reason for asking the question.
Cheers
Tim
BTW. The engine in the photo is laying down a tad over 2000hp at the flywheel and utilizes custom 400lb injectors.....
IT's also NOT for daily driving for obvious reasons. Still could do half that power easily and do groceries every day for life.
Big_nate said:
Yes....:wink:
anyone hear of someone putting an NSX engine in something else?
Deltron Zero said:
CRX
Deltron Zero said:
Stephan Papadakis's Turbocharged NSX motored Sand Rail.
I've head of people buying an engine to try and do a swap - but later finding out the NSX motor is a 90 degree V6 and wider than their chassis will support.Deltron Zero said:
Yeah the TQ is the killer on these LS swaps. My Rx7 was around 2750lb and I made 402rwhp and about 389TQ, it was sick. Definitely will outbeat any Supras at 500rwhp for sure. Powerband was wonderful, and the 6spd, will got around 28mpg.
Drawback, felt like you were driving on train tracks all day long (ok, not that bad). Even with the swap, its not a daily like you would a Supra or NSX.
Drawback, felt like you were driving on train tracks all day long (ok, not that bad). Even with the swap, its not a daily like you would a Supra or NSX.
I mentioned before in a similar thread, Ian Palmer, who races a NSX in Australia fitted a Formula 3000 V8 (3ltr 500HP). Can't remember if it was a Mugen or Judd. But ended up puting the Original engine back in with a couple of turbos. Cause the small displacment V8 didn't have much Torque.
I spoke with him a while back, said he can only run about 450HP in the Class he's in but has wound the boost up to 830HP on the dyno.
I spoke with him a while back, said he can only run about 450HP in the Class he's in but has wound the boost up to 830HP on the dyno.
whrdnsx said:
Interesting, anyway to get any documentation or pictures on that project?
I suspected that might be an issue. At first glance, a long time ago I had the idea of something radical like a de-tuned 3.5L Aurora V8 mated to a sequential which can sound awefully appealing- as they are attainable, compact, with a low center of gravity and low reciprocating mass, and very, very, powerful. With a lot of chassis and custom fab as with anything it is possible. However, since the weight of even a fully stripped NSX is still relatively high, in theory having all of that high end optimization would actually work to ones detriment- although it would probably sound really, really good as KMT once told me that even fully de-tuned on pump gas one of their naturally aspirated engines can turn 675rwhp at 13,500rpm.
For the NSX, I came to the conclusion also long ago that it is better to work with the stock C30A or C32B power plants as opposed to considering radical swaps unless their is a genuine obscure purpose. The cost is very high for a swap that could actually be widely accepted as an improvement, and the practicality & inevitable pay-out very low. If you lived in an emission inspection area, there is no way you could likely retain it as being street legal anyway- which IMO is somewhat a justification for the platform as a whole (otherwise, another platform like an SR8 would just be cheaper and faster for off-road only)
Besides, if you have the funds and know how to conqure a custom project like that and do it right, I could well see it running up into the six figures over several years... and at that point it might be better to save those dollars towards a factory built race car, or if you just have unlimited funds get a retired Lola TS-020 or something along those lines that is just amazingly fast. I can't say how long the fun would last or where you would even drive it (I'm certain if the engine blew you would be just screwed), but I'm sure it would be the best of times.
Here is the link to the CRX-NSX project I was thinking of...
http://www.mahdavimotorsports.com/images/crnsx/crnsx.htm
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I'm currently working on the LS7 swap for my track only car. In my experience, I can REPLACE the entire LS7 crate motor for about the same money as REBUILDING a stock NSX motor. The LS7 motor is lighter and has a lower CG. With some minor work it’ll rev darn near as high (if needed). And when it comes to performance parts the choice isn’t even close. There’s decades of experience and literarily thousands of suppliers for small block performance parts. For example, you can get a 7” dia carbon/carbon clutch for about 1/6 the cost for the NSX. Granted, you don’t have the fancy “engineering” of 4 valves per cyl or twin OHCs but you gotta admit, they’re not that far off when it comes to HP/liter considering its 50 year old pushrod technology. Those NASCAR guys are pretty darn smart. The only disadvantage is actually an advantage when going with big HP/torque numbers (700/600 plus), and that's the trans. Due to space limitations I'll need to mount the LS7 longitudinally. The gas tank will need to be relocated but the selection of heavy duty sequential transaxles is pretty good thanks to the ever expanding offroad racing aftermarket business. Obviously this isn’t the ticket unless you’re willing to make some major modifications.
Mark911 said:
Mark, any pictures or preliminary info on your personal NSX project you care to share? That sounds like a pretty amazing DIY under taking. I am more familiar with the LS1 V-8 which is the most common install for the Ultima GTR's turn key'd out of Cali, and you are absolutely correct about the lower cost and better support with an LS7- that sounds far more viable and has proven very popular as of late, as I recall the cost of a crate is around a competitive 13 or so.
I am most interested in the component placement.. It sounds like their is an opportunity to lower the engine placement which is just fantastic for handling... but initially I would think you would have cut out the trunk area, and have left the fuel tank and firewall as-is? Could you share a layout diagram or CAD rendering with your thoughts?
John@Microsoft said:
Not sure if you guys have seen this or not but the aftermarket is starting to speak with 'LS7' blocks.:biggrin:
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=568894&page=1&pp=20
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=548511
Big_nate said:
While a basement bargain in the NSX world, the cost from GM for a new LS7 crate including the ECU is relatively high for what most of the enthusiasts and hot rodders state side are accustomed to.
http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results.cfm?partnumber=17802397
It is not surprising that a lot of aftermarket companies have come to the table offering LS7 crate motors using LS1 blocks and their own internals at far lower prices as in your above threads, and unlike the small vendors in a niche community like NSX, an engine builder like Katech is a product you can trust when racking up the miles on the platnium visa card.
Still, I'd await to see Mark's project pics- definitely very exciting to hear some out of the box thinking in this area. Form definitely follows function, and one of the core advantages why GM is picking up momentum with enthusiasts here in the US, is that unlike Honda, they are not only competitive but offer full technical disclosure- one of the main reasons in fact why Aerial has transitioned to GM engines in their atom this year.
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Not trying to be abrasive or negative as i've met mark in person and admired the great work he has done farbricating brake mounts and his previous intercooled SC on the NSX. HIs work is amazing and if anyone can do the ls7 swap it is Mark.
With all the above said, why on earth would you put a LS7 in an nsx?? If I wanted an LS7 and a 6speed that bad, i would just go buy a new Z06 and have a 5 year 100K warranty.
I really don't understand this.. what will the impaced by to the weight distribution of the car? What rear suspension will be used? Where will the fuel tank go? Will it still be a nsx in the end or more like a kit car.
Please help me understand??
thanks
tom
With all the above said, why on earth would you put a LS7 in an nsx?? If I wanted an LS7 and a 6speed that bad, i would just go buy a new Z06 and have a 5 year 100K warranty.
I really don't understand this.. what will the impaced by to the weight distribution of the car? What rear suspension will be used? Where will the fuel tank go? Will it still be a nsx in the end or more like a kit car.
Please help me understand??
thanks
tom
The urge to create is pretty strong when a gearhead starts dreaming! To make a unique, potent, beautiful car that goes like stink, and nobody else has is a lot of fun. $$$ yes, but think how many happy hours in the garage it will provide!
