Audi R8

[NSXLuvr]

Therefore, I can't worship Audi just because they came out with R8. I'll continue to worship Honda for creating my NSX.

That is truely a laughable comment. You worship Honda for creating a car designed in mid 1980's and launched in 1990. We are talking about 2008. The world has moved on. The NSX was a great car. WAS being the key word. Honda forgot to update it. Honda also forgot to update their other sports car - the s2000. Lets see: 7 year old car with more weight, less HP and lower redline - WHAT A JOKE!!!

The sports car community has moved. I love my NSX but I am also open to new cars that pull at my heartstrings. The R8 does it for me.

Btw Vance, I feel you are partially biased because your modified car with great motor is much faster than the avg. NA2 NSX.

 

[NSXLuvr]

A lot of folks are missing a key point, Audi actually built something after promising that it would be built, on the other hand Honda hasn't kept any of it's promises when it comes down to the NSX replacement , that says quite a bit about Audi and about Honda as well.

The R8 might not be the jaw dropping car as the NSX was when it came out, but it's still something unique. It might share a lot of design cues from other Audi vehicles but that's because it's an Audi.

Some folks have mentioned the Boxster vs 911 and the price difference not been that much. I guess those folks don't remember the 996GT2 which was offered at 180K, more than 4 times the price of a base 986 Boxster which was in the low 40k's.

And for those folks who say that the R8 is not worth more than 120K, I would ask the following questions:

- Have you actually purchased a car that is more than 120K?
- Why did you choose to purchase a NSX even if there are other cars that can perform better than the NSX for less money? Was it a personal choice? Same thing will probably happen for many of the buyers who decide to buy a R8.

BTW: I hate the Audi TT (glorified Golf/Rabbit) and everything that car stands for, but I'm still openminded about the R8 (only because it's a MR car ) until I have a chance to drive one and be able to experience it for myself

Thanks Ken. I agree 100%. I couldn't have said it any better.

 

[ericwgnsx]

Viper ( still looks like a "I'm compensating car" to me no offense to anyone who has them )

One thing that I think we NSX owners seem to forget (and this is not necessarily directed at you, WingZ) is that to 95% of the general public, all high-performance cars appear to be "I'm compensating" cars. And that includes Vipers, Ferraris, R8's, Porsches, and definitely NSX's.

 

[|Adeel]

It doesn't do anything for me at all. I really try do dig it but I can't

Why are some of you guys so busy deciding which car is exotic and which is not That alone is a ridicilous discussion.

 

[WingZ]

One thing that I think we NSX owners seem to forget (and this is not necessarily directed at you, WingZ) is that to 95% of the general public, all high-performance cars appear to be "I'm compensating" cars. And that includes Vipers, Ferraris, R8's, Porsches, and definitely NSX's.

LOL I can hear it know

Look he's totally compensating by buying an "underpowered" low maintenance Honda.

Just kidding. I'm sure people who can't afford sometihng would say something like that , but come on times out of ten whenever I see a Vette or Viper or really big SUV some little guy gets outs and does a loud "beep beep" to lock the car.

Of course according to other enthusiats isn't the NSX a "poor mans exotic"..LOL

 

[Ski_Banker]

And for those folks who say that the R8 is not worth more than 120K, I would ask the following questions:

- Have you actually purchased a car that is more than 120K?
- Why did you choose to purchase a NSX even if there are other cars that can perform better than the NSX for less money? Was it a personal choice?
Same thing will probably happen for many of the buyers who decide to buy a R8.

I totally agree. I would say most NSX owners, in general, love the car's performance/looks/reliability/driveability/construction -- the whole package -- but they DON'T want a Corvette or a 911. And for a purebred sportscar, those are about the only other choices that fit the bill (sorry M3 doesn't). Also, on a similar note, someone that wants a unique/exotic car. So, a mainstream SL 55 won't cut it.

So, that being said, the R8 is filling that same niche (and basically the same pricepoint/buyer as the original NSX for $65k in 91 did). Porsche buyers won't move to the R8 in any big way, and R8 buyers probably could care less about "the latest 911."

Point being, I love the R8, and, for the record, have no burning desire to buy a Porsche of any kind. Nice, fast, great cars. But I'm not a Porsche guy any more than am a Vette guy.

Second point being, the "only 420hp for $120k is not worth it" is nonsense, especially from low-powered NSX owners. The R8, just like a Ferrari, is not about horsepower per $. It's about sportscar per $.

 

[Silver F16]

Saw the R8 in person. The design does not invoke passion for me. For $120K, the car better invoke passion to the eyes, regardless of performance.

 

[NSXGMS]

I totally agree. I would say most NSX owners, in general, love the car's performance/looks/reliability/driveability/construction -- the whole package -- but they DON'T want a Corvette or a 911. And for a purebred sportscar, those are about the only other choices that fit the bill (sorry M3 doesn't). Also, on a similar note, someone that wants a unique/exotic car. So, a mainstream SL 55 won't cut it.

So, that being said, the R8 is filling that same niche (and basically the same pricepoint/buyer as the original NSX for $65k in 91 did). Porsche buyers won't move to the R8 in any big way, and R8 buyers probably could care less about "the latest 911."

Point being, I love the R8, and, for the record, have no burning desire to buy a Porsche of any kind. Nice, fast, great cars. But I'm not a Porsche guy any more than am a Vette guy.

Second point being, the "only 420hp for $120k is not worth it" is nonsense, especially from low-powered NSX owners. The R8, just like a Ferrari, is not about horsepower per $. It's about sportscar per $.

I certainly agree that hp isn't the end-all-be-all for performance cars. But there are several things to consider with the R8.

First, the looks are less than inspring for a disproportionate amount of people. Second, the car is not a race/track-bred car. At 3,500 lbs it's going to compromise quite a bit. Third, its price puts it in a category with a lot of competition and cars that out-perform it and arguably look better.

True, the NSX faced it's own set of issues but it still performed very well for its price range, looked better and had the intangible reliability factor, even in 2005.

I'm simply looking at it from a pros and cons standpoint. I just don't see enough pros to justify purchasing an R8 over a 997 TT.

The 91 NSX had many, many pros and very few cons. Price was high, yes, but you were getting a car that looked amazing, was more reliable & comfortable than any other car in it's class and was race/track-bred with performance the same or very very close to its competition. I don't think one can really compare any car to the niche filled by the 1991 NSX as it was leaps and bounds ahead in virtually every way to anything else in it's class.

I also do think that for a MR "performance" car it does need to actually perform. Horsepower is a piece of that puzzle but again, I'm not necessarily hung up on "only" 420 hp. I'm hung up on the fact that most of the other cars it's competing with would probably beat it handily on a track including a Type-R NSX that's 100 hp less.

The R8 is a very cool car indeed and if you're an Audi fan go ahead and endorse it. I am not saying it's a train wreck--I don't think anyone is. Most of the responses here are basically "I could care less" type responses.

It seems to me the package the R8 delivers at the price it's being offered at is causing people to consider a lot of different options and people aren't falling in love with it.

 

[Ski_Banker]

I certainly agree that hp isn't the end-all-be-all for performance cars. But there are several things to consider with the R8.

First, the looks are less than inspring for a disproportionate amount of people. Second, the car is not a race/track-bred car. At 3,500 lbs it's going to compromise quite a bit. Third, its price puts it in a category with a lot of competition and cars that out-perform it and arguably look better.

True, the NSX faced it's own set of issues but it still performed very well for its price range, looked better and had the intangible reliability factor, even in 2005.

I'm simply looking at it from a pros and cons standpoint. I just don't see enough pros to justify purchasing an R8 over a 997 TT.

The 91 NSX had many, many pros and very few cons. Price was high, yes, but you were getting a car that looked amazing, was more reliable & comfortable than any other car in it's class and was race/track-bred with performance the same or very very close to its competition. I don't think one can really compare any car to the niche filled by the 1991 NSX as it was leaps and bounds ahead in virtually every way to anything else in it's class.

I also do think that for a MR "performance" car it does need to actually perform. Horsepower is a piece of that puzzle but again, I'm not necessarily hung up on "only" 420 hp. I'm hung up on the fact that most of the other cars it's competing with would probably beat it handily on a track including a Type-R NSX that's 100 hp less.

The R8 is a very cool car indeed and if you're an Audi fan go ahead and endorse it. I am not saying it's a train wreck--I don't think anyone is. Most of the responses here are basically "I could care less" type responses.

It seems to me the package the R8 delivers at the price it's being offered at is causing people to consider a lot of different options and people aren't falling in love with it.

You have a good point about "the whole package" on the original NSX being leagues ahead of anything else (which the R8 isn't by any stretch). Performance wise and reliability wise, the R8 might be pretty similar to other sportscars in the low 100s. And looks wise - I think it is gorgeous (when I think most new cars are fugly these days) but certainly a judgement call. Even diehard Ferrari fans fell in love with the NSXs looks when it came out.

So, I definitely see your point -- the R8 isn't as groundbreaking or standout as the original NSX -- but look at the bright side, it's all we've got! :tongue:

 

[NSXLuvr]

I personally find to be a great all around package. However, I wish they priced it to be competitive with a 911 C4S. I wish it listed for $90's and topped out at $100-110 range. Right now it looks to be $110k base, $130 with options. That puts it in the GT3, and TT category.

The other concern I have is that there is no bump in HP between the RS4/A8 and the $50k more expensive R8.

 

[NSXGMS]

I personally find to be a great all around package. However, I wish they priced it to be competitive with a 911 C4S. I wish it listed for $90's and topped out at $100-110 range. Right now it looks to be $110k base, $130 with options. That puts it in the GT3, and TT category.

The other concern I have is that there is no bump in HP between the RS4/A8 and the $50k more expensive R8.

Price is part of the "package". :wink:

I think you just reinforced my point and summed up my feelings about the R8. In a nutshell I agree with every word you just wrote. :smile:

 

[AutoVation]

 

[BD]

I personally find to be a great all around package. However, I wish they priced it to be competitive with a 911 C4S. I wish it listed for $90's and topped out at $100-110 range. Right now it looks to be $110k base, $130 with options. That puts it in the GT3, and TT category.

The other concern I have is that there is no bump in HP between the RS4/A8 and the $50k more expensive R8.

The flaw of this R8 Package is it's price and weight. If Audi shed another 200lbs off it, it will increase the performance dramatically.

As for the way it looks, I'm not a fan, but than again, one man's treasure is another man's trash. The only true worth of this car will be judged by press compareson and how well it sells. I think we'll see it in a couple of years; if not, sooner.

 

[WingZ]

I personally find to be a great all around package. However, I wish they priced it to be competitive with a 911 C4S. I wish it listed for $90's and topped out at $100-110 range. Right now it looks to be $110k base, $130 with options. That puts it in the GT3, and TT category.

The other concern I have is that there is no bump in HP between the RS4/A8 and the $50k more expensive R8.

I think Audi is pricing it higher so that it doesn't hopefully fall into the same price rut the NSX did. Honda made the NSX too inexpensive to really garner the prestige ,but it got to high to sell like hot cakes. If the price hadn't increased and it was still selling in the mid sixties. Towards the end sales possibly could've been better and maybe justified Honda doing a NA3??

If Honda realizes it in time they could take advantage of Porsche and Audi pricing performance gaps. Build the HSC with a modified version of the RL's 3.5 ( Hey the NSX was using a modified version of the Legends engine ) tweaked to 350-375 in a car weighing 28-2900lbs. Use mass production and parts from some of their other cars. Price it from $60-65K. This car would outperform the Cayman S, 911, 911S and the R8 and price cut all those cars by $10-60K.

I know I'll probably get flamed for suggesting a "lower power" than most of you want ,but the car I mentioned above would be extremely reliable and durable , track ready, descent fuel mileage for a DD and probably not that expensive to insure. Resale value would be great and it would fit nicely with Acura's current price profile of cars. Boy almost sounds like I'm describing an NSX:biggrin:

 

[NSXLuvr]

more detaiiled pics.

http://6speedonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76619

 

[nsxsupra]

The R8 is more radically styled and much faster than any NSX.

I'm saying this - and I have a love affair with the NSX.

To say the TT and R8 look identical is an ignorant statement and just doesn't hold water. They are vastly different, much moreso than Porsche's line. The proportions are just so different

Just my 02cent. If it is ok to tell you my true honest opinion about R8. Great car on paper, but the look is simply not for me. I tried to like it, but the look is just drop dead "not" gorgeous.

The R8 simply doesn't have that wow factor the first time you see it. The first time I ever saw a NSX year ago. I was completely in love. If I come across a R8. I will let you know how it stack up.

It is a nice sports car, but there are so many other cars I would rather have.

Mostly used:
360 Modena (black or white)
Turbo NSX coupe with 02 conversion
Black Supra TT BPU++++
996TT
997TT
SL55
Exige S
RX-7 with LS1 swap
C6-Z06
996 GT3
997 GT3

 

[kreh]

Jason,

My feelings exactly.

 

[NetViper]

I saw the R8 at the auto show in atlanta and it was stunning. I am in love.

The only thing I am a little disappointed with is the performance. So far it is no faster than a c6 in a straight line. Not that that is slow, but it is $70K more dollars.

Regardless, I think this car is the perfect car to replace the NSX.

 

[AutoVation]

Dave,

I feel the same way when I saw it at the NAIAS. Beautiful car that stood out as "not trying too hard". Classic look that is not overdone.

Vance,
I don't agree that a measure of how good a car is is related to its sales. If so the NSX suxors... In fact, I feel the lower a car sales numbers are the better (as long as I like that is...).

I saw the R8 at the auto show in atlanta and it was stunning. I am in love.

The only thing I am a little disappointed with is the performance. So far it is no faster than a c6 in a straight line. Not that that is slow, but it is $70K more dollars.

Regardless, I think this car is the perfect car to replace the NSX.

 

[NetViper]

One more thought.

For those of you putting this car down, I have a good feeling if it had a HONDA badge on it and it was called NSX, 95% of you would be thrilled and in line to get one. It is a HELL of a lot better than that POS ASSC.

Just my opinion.

 

[WingZ]

One more thought.

For those of you putting this car down, I have a good feeling if it had a HONDA badge on it and it was called NSX, 95% of you would be thrilled and in line to get one. It is a HELL of a lot better than that POS ASSC.

Just my opinion.

It's my opinion that the R8 is a POS:biggrin: of course we both know the old saying about opinions and belly buttons. If you guys like it fine by me. I tried to like it and couldn't.

It's an Audi and all that that entails. No references yet to Ferrari in any of the articles I've read. NSX always had Ferrari references and after the NSX Ferrari had to live with NSX references. The R8 is being compared to the 911 not the turbo mind you the 911S to which it costs about $40k more. Everyone knows the 911TT is a better performer and less money. The NSX when it debuted was compared to cars costing more not vice versa. So you guys can keep calling it an "NSX replacement" or the "new NSX" ,but you know it isn't. All this "if Honda had made it crap" is just unecessary! Honda makes simple cars and the R8 is hardly simple! Once it breaks down and it will ( it's an Audi ) you'll remember it's not a Honda.

 

[BD]

Vance,
I don't agree that a measure of how good a car is is related to its sales. If so the NSX suxors... In fact, I feel the lower a car sales numbers are the better (as long as I like that is...).

I agree on lower the number sold, better it is for buyers. However, NSX is really not a failure in sales. 15,000 sold world wide the first 3 years is not a bad number. Can R8 pull that number, I highly doubt that, considering there are a lot more cars to choose from. Perhaps that is why the MSRP is going to be around 130k to make up the difference.

 

[AutoVation]

I agree on lower the number sold, better it is for buyers. However, NSX is really not a failure in sales. 15,000 sold world wide the first 3 years is not a bad number. Can R8 pull that number, I highly doubt that, considering there are a lot more cars to choose from. Perhaps that is why the MSRP is going to be around 130k to make up the difference.

Some items to note:

• Audi plans to sell about 1000 R8s per year in the U.S.
• From C&D: Given that we were able to run the 0-to-60-mph sprint in 4.6 seconds in the like-engined RS 4 that weighs 17 percent more, Audi's claim seems quite conservative. We think a time of 4.3 seconds is a better guess.
• About a year later, the 5.2-liter V-10 from the S6 and S8 will be available, with output nearing 500 hp. This or the diesel V12 w/600hp.
• A convertible version is on the way in 2009
• FWIW, the entire allotment for England is already sold out.

The NSX lost Honda a ton of money when you consider the program by itself. As a marketing tool it was a success but as a standalone program it was not profitable.

 

[NetViper]

It's my opinion that the R8 is a POS:biggrin: of course we both know the old saying about opinions and belly buttons. If you guys like it fine by me. I tried to like it and couldn't.

It's an Audi and all that that entails. No references yet to Ferrari in any of the articles I've read. NSX always had Ferrari references and after the NSX Ferrari had to live with NSX references. The R8 is being compared to the 911 not the turbo mind you the 911S to which it costs about $40k more. Everyone knows the 911TT is a better performer and less money. The NSX when it debuted was compared to cars costing more not vice versa. So you guys can keep calling it an "NSX replacement" or the "new NSX" ,but you know it isn't. All this "if Honda had made it crap" is just unecessary! Honda makes simple cars and the R8 is hardly simple! Once it breaks down and it will ( it's an Audi ) you'll remember it's not a Honda.

Have a read of the latest AUTOMOBILE magazine where they compare the R8 to the F430 and 911S.

You are right though. Audi have aimed at the 911 with this car, and IMO, it should have performance to match dollar for dollar.

 

[bitbuster]

What you shouldn't forget when discussing the price: The R8 is built here in Germany. And right now 1 Euro is worth over 1,3 USD!
So IF the R8 is beeing offered for around 120k in the US - That's a hell of a deal! That's around 92k Euros. Compared to the 104.400 Euros MSRP for the base model (http://www.audi.de/etc/medialib/cms4imp/audi2/product/r8.Par.0002.File.pdf)
So you could even get the car ALOT cheaper then we do here in Germany.
I'm not an Audi-Fan. But the first time I saw this car in Person I fell in love...