Another medical question: knee/joint injury

[Vega$ NSX]

Calling all doctors, I've seen a few off topic posts on medical questions so I thought I'd give the forum MD roulette wheel a spin as well.

A long time ago (about 3.5 years) I was skiing in Portland when I got all out of whack on my skis. Long story short, body went one way, foot went another, knee couldn’t decide which way to go. It got twisted pretty bad and it was several days before I could walk without a limp. I never got it fully diagnosed so I don’t know the extent of the injury. It healed and I believe it fully recovered.

Fast forward to a few weeks ago. Again skiing, again body/foot malfunction, again same knee got twisted. Now the pain was on the inside part of the knee. Inside part below the knee cap. I immediately iced it down was walking with a very minor limp for about 1 day afterwards. This injury didn’t seem as bad but yet concerned me because of repetitive damage to the same knee. It’s been about 3 weeks now and the knee feels ok. No pain, no limp. I can support weight, I’ve done leg presses, leg extensions, leg curls and have run several miles recently all without issue. However, in certain twisting motions, I can feel soreness/pain in my knee. All straight ahead motions feel ok, but twisting/lateral forces will cause me to feel it. Example: standing legs shoulder width apart, and I twist my mid-section (ab exercise). If I increase my speed, and load up on the forces my legs need to take for the rotational motion, I can feel it in my knee. It doesn’t feel like an ACL, LCL, PCL injury as knee feels very stable. However, I’m concerned it is an MCL injury. I can feel it most when I’m fully bent at knees and put pressure on it. Example: I’m sitting on my knees and feet, legs completely bent with pressure of my body compressing my thighs to my calves. As I load up on the weight pressing down, the inside part of my knee rapidly build in pain, first from general soreness and uncomfort to rapid increasing sharp pain.

So my questions are this:
1) What is this injury? Is this a tear of the MCL?
2) Will this injury heal on its own or will it require surgery?
3) Can I continue to do exercises like leg presses and running when I feel no discomfort, or should I stay off those exercises as well until my knee fully heals?
4) What else should I know about this injury, beside hanging up the skis for and pick up snowboarding instead? :biggrin:

 

[DrVolkl]

Could be MCL or medial meniscus (or both of course)... but you really can't diagnose anything by just symptoms. I'd be concerned, but not overly. (it's not like your leg is going to fall off)

An MCL sprain will heal, assuming you didn't tear the ligament too badly... a meniscus tear may at some point require surgery... but that would be based more on your pain/symptoms.

Give it some more time to heal... 6-8weeks. If you're still having pain, go see a Doc and have it looked at.

That's all my personal opinion. :smile:

 

[docjohn]

If you are concearned about a ligament tear or even a meniscal tear then you need to be examined.There are twisting/bending tests done by an orthopod (not an insect) that can determine torn vs sprained.

 

[sahtt]

Word from the wise, don't tear your meniscus.

 

[drtruong]

I would suggest you not to do any wild things until it is checked out and ruled out any damages by MRI. At this time, put on the knee brace on. You can get it at any sporting goods dept.

 

[Vega$ NSX]

That's all my personal opinion. :smile:

Thanks Doc. I'll take two and call you in the morning. :smile:

If you are concearned about a ligament tear or even a meniscal tear then you need to be examined.There are twisting/bending tests done by an orthopod (not an insect) that can determine torn vs sprained.

Thanks. Do you have a rough idea on these kind of tests? Anything I can self administer? The last time I went in to check on my plantar fasciitis the entire process was a debacle and basically got nothing useful and I was better off self diagnosing and treating myself.

 

[nsx2tall]

I'm not a doctor, but I have experience with an unrepaired ACL tear and a portion of my meniscus removed. If you choose not to have a doctor look at this and provide you a diagnosis, here are some symptoms you should keep an eye out for (after full recovery from original injury):

- joint locking: as you walk you have a sharp pain at a certain angle or your leg will stop in a bent position.

- joint instability: knee gives out or feels loose while twisting, turning or side-to-side movement

- onset of pain during exercise: joint pain builds during exercise and recedes after.

All these point to joint/ligament damage that should be fixed or addressed with caution.

 

[docjohn]

Thanks Doc. I'll take two and call you in the morning. :smile:



Thanks. Do you have a rough idea on these kind of tests? Anything I can self administer? The last time I went in to check on my plantar fasciitis the entire process was a debacle and basically got nothing useful and I was better off self diagnosing and treating myself.

you cannot provide the leverage nor torque trying to examin yourself,see your doctor.He can decide if an mri is needed.

 

[Vega$ NSX]

I'm not a doctor, but I have experience with an unrepaired ACL tear and a portion of my meniscus removed. If you choose not to have a doctor look at this and provide you a diagnosis, here are some symptoms you should keep an eye out for (after full recovery from original injury):

- joint locking: as you walk you have a sharp pain at a certain angle or your leg will stop in a bent position.

- joint instability: knee gives out or feels loose while twisting, turning or side-to-side movement

- onset of pain during exercise: joint pain builds during exercise and recedes after.

All these point to joint/ligament damage that should be fixed or addressed with caution.

Great advice, thank you. Is this speaking from experience? These are the types of things I want to be looking for. Typically, my knee feels fine and I forget that I even had an injury. However every once in a while I get this feeling in my knee and I'm just concerned that even though it feels fine, I'm hanging on my a thread and that I'm just bound explode my knee becuase there was more than meets the eye. If there are tell tale signs that I should be looking (like the above) that will help me diagnose if I should hold off and do the old wait-n-see or if I should get thee to a MD post haste.

 

[DocL]

If it was as simple as you think it is to diagnose your knee problem, then everyone on the internet should be a doctor.

I'm sorry, but if you really want to find out what the problem is I suggest you take the advice previously given. On the otherhand, when my patients feel that their internet diagnosis is better than mine, I'm usually the one who is correct six months down the road. I love the six month waiting period. Because the longer you wait the more expensive it is to correct the problem.

 

[synergy004]

If it was as simple as you think it is to diagnose your knee problem, then everyone on the internet should be a doctor.

I'm sorry, but if you really want to find out what the problem is I suggest you take the advice previously given. On the otherhand, when my patients feel that their internet diagnosis is better than mine, I'm usually the one who is correct six months down the road. I love the six month waiting period. Because the longer you wait the more expensive it is to correct the problem.

I agree. Get checked!!!

 

[Vega$ NSX]

If it was as simple as you think it is to diagnose your knee problem, then everyone on the internet should be a doctor.

I'm sorry, but if you really want to find out what the problem is I suggest you take the advice previously given. On the otherhand, when my patients feel that their internet diagnosis is better than mine, I'm usually the one who is correct six months down the road. I love the six month waiting period. Because the longer you wait the more expensive it is to correct the problem.

No I definitely don't think that at all and I definitely don't think I can diagnose or know more than a doctor. What I'm saying is that my very few and limited experiences with doctors have not been very good. I've sat for hours to see a doctor who really gave me about 3 minutes of attention, didn't really take the time to fully hear my issue, sent me off with some routine tests and gave me basically Internet level of advice: take it easy and see what happens. No follow up from my tests and a bill for well over $500 (and that is with insurance). The internet advice is at least free. It's not the doctors I have an issue with, it's the system that I have an issue with and why I am trying to avoid it as much as possible.

 

[DocL]

...It's not the doctors I have an issue with, it's the system that I have an issue with and why I am trying to avoid it as much as possible.

I completely agree with you. I think you need to ask some friends, family, or coworkers who may have had a knee injury who they say. I'd say 98% of my patients make the same statement to me about prior dentists that they have seen. The one's who don't believe me the first time and go somewhere else, unfortunately end up back in my office with thousands of dollars of corrective work needing to be done.

I'm sorry you have had a bad experience and wasted your money. However if you look hard enough you will find a good doctor. It's just like looking for a good NSX. They are out there, but you have to search them out.

 

[docjohn]

I completely agree with you. I think you need to ask some friends, family, or coworkers who may have had a knee injury who they say. I'd say 98% of my patients make the same statement to me about prior dentists that they have seen. The one's who don't believe me the first time and go somewhere else, unfortunately end up back in my office with thousands of dollars of corrective work needing to be done.

I'm sorry you have had a bad experience and wasted your money. However if you look hard enough you will find a good doctor. It's just like looking for a good NSX. They are out there, but you have to search them out.

correct and do so before 2014 when your doctor will have a longer line at the door:wink:

 

[ediddynsx]

Your knees are hurting from all that force from your turbo kicking in....:tongue:

Hope your knee is ok man...take it easy on all the workouts. You don't want to blow it out.

 

[steveny]

Skiing is so bad on your knees. A salesman was in the office the other day talking about his extreme skiing when he was 20 years younger. Now 20 years later his knees bend backwards 3 to 4 inches and his knee caps float around his leg. Hobbling is how he walks now, but from the sounds of it he had a lot of fun as a teenager.

 

[Vega$ NSX]

I completely agree with you. I think you need to ask some friends, family, or coworkers who may have had a knee injury who they say. I'd say 98% of my patients make the same statement to me about prior dentists that they have seen. The one's who don't believe me the first time and go somewhere else, unfortunately end up back in my office with thousands of dollars of corrective work needing to be done.

I'm sorry you have had a bad experience and wasted your money. However if you look hard enough you will find a good doctor. It's just like looking for a good NSX. They are out there, but you have to search them out.

I agree with you. But here's the thing. I've tried three different doctors each with similar results. BUT, the doctors themselves were great! Very nice, knowledgable; you can see they are really trying. I think I've actually seen three great doctors. The problem is I've seen less shuffling and churning at cattle calls then at these doctor's offices. You could see an internal clock in their head to push these people through, and the rediculous amount of CYA and paperwork is mind boggling. Especially for tiny, inconsequential, yuppie, oh cry me a river injuries like mine (oh poor training for a marathon and skiing injuries, boo hoo). There is just no way for them to be effective. So even if I were to shuffle off to 3 more good doctors, I have no reason to think it will be any different because our crazy system. And actually to be honest, the feedback from this forum have been infinitely more helpful so far. :smile:

 

[Vega$ NSX]

Skiing is so bad on your knees. A salesman was in the office the other day talking about his extreme skiing when he was 20 years younger. Now 20 years later his knees bend backwards 3 to 4 inches and his knee caps float around his leg. Hobbling is how he walks now, but from the sounds of it he had a lot of fun as a teenager.

I think my major problem is that I completely suck at skiing. I'm switching to snowboarding simply based on trying to shift the parts of my body getting beat up when I fall down. :biggrin:

 

[steveny]

I think my major problem is that I completely suck at skiing. I'm switching to snowboarding simply based on trying to shift the parts of my body getting beat up when I fall down. :biggrin:

The day after Snowboarding for me is spent on the couch rubbing bengay on my hips