4k mileage and new clutch?

Ill know more tommorow. Its all speculation at this point. I am definately going to call other dealerships for a second oppinion once the problem is diagnosed.

What started the bad taste in my mouth over this was the service manager at mcgrath. He has not been very pleasant to deal with. Smoke usually=fire.
 
OPCX said:
the service manager at mcgrath. He has not been very pleasant to deal with.
I would guess that at least 90 percent of the reason that so many NSX folks are happy to take their cars to Acura of Brookfield - including owners in the Chicago area, a hundred miles away (despite a couple of other dealers experienced in NSX service who are located much closer) - is due to their satisfaction with the Service and Parts Director there, John Vasos. Maybe even more like 100 percent.

Thanks for the update. Keep us posted - and good luck!
 
nsxtasy said:
The following post sounds as though he indeed may have abused his NSX:

A bad downshift can not only cause unusually rapid clutch wear; it can even destroy the engine (a "money shift", i.e. overrevving to exceed redline). A bad downshift is abuse by anyone's definition.

However, unlike others here, I would not jump to the conclusion that the clutch is worn, or is not worn, until the transmission is opened. Maybe the clutch is not worn and there is another explanation that will mean that the warranty will cover it. But if the clutch is worn, it is not covered under Acura's warranty. They may or may not cover the repair anyway, as a goodwill adjustment, but the warranty explicitly excludes coverage of clutch wear, as well as problems resulting from abuse (which, in this case, may turn out to be the same thing).

In any case, once they open the transmission, they should be able to see whether or not the clutch is worn, or whether there is evidence of any other problem. It may be that the problem is totally unrelated to the bad downshifts. Or, they may decide to cover it anyway, as goodwill. We won't know until the dealer opens it up. Until then, it's all idle speculation anyway.
Exactly


That's baloney, pure and simple. You cannot predict whether or not they will cover it. You don't even know what the problem is yet. Until the transmission is opened, none of us do!

It amazes me how some people want to jump to conclusions (and even start talking about lawyers!) before we even know all the facts... :rolleyes:
I'm not making any assumptions however, I doubt this is a case of abuse. One would think investing almost $100k would buy a degree of Manufacture support.

I agree that suggesting a lawyer was pre-mature at this point. Although, I would be very reluctant to invest another $5000 into a new NSX.
 
nsxtasy

If you rev your engine to 12000 and it blows.... I consider that being stupid. Come on.... we are talking about common sense things like wear and tear items wearing faster then they should....

A better example would be spinning your tires on every stop then complaining that the tires wore out to fast......

good luck OPCX
 
Yes, and a better example would be slipping your clutch all the time and expecting it to be covered under warranty, even it you wear it out in 4k miles. ANY clutch can have a life of 4k miles to 150K miles or more, depending on how it is used/abused.

I am not suggesting this is the case with this situation, but to make the statement "4K miles everything should be covered" is just not correct. Clutch is a WEAR ITEM, just like brake pads. Newby, Did you expect the dealer to warranty the brake pads you toasted at the track??

OPCX, I do not think you will be able to readly get second opinions, once the trans is out and the clutch apart. Since the car will not be movable, it makes that pretty difficult:).

Good Luck, Hope it all works out,
LarryB
 
It surpises me that you guys keep bringing up warranty issues when it comes to racing your car at the track. Warranties aren't designed to cover vehicles that are raced. First of all....I'm guessing that 75% of us owners don't race our cars at the track. And if we do, it's for fun once or twice a year. So my opinion is based on what OPCX described when he said "I have in no way beat on the car" I took that to mean he drives the car on normal streets. Unless his 4K was put on while driving in the city with a stoplight at every city block and he regularly rides the clutch between every shift.....then maybe the clutch would fail based on wear and tear.
However, BESIDES RACING YOUR CAR, wear and tear items should not go out on a 2004 with 4,000 miles.
 
newby said:
you guys keep bringing up warranty issues when it comes to racing your car at the track.
Not true. Check the topic again, and you will find that we are NOT discussing warranty issues concerning track driving OR racing. There has been no mention whatsoever of racing - "Use of the vehicle in competition or racing events" - which is explicitly excluded in the warranty. The only reference to track driving was when I mentioned it as an explanation for wearing through the brake pads in less than 4K miles. What I said would have been equally applicable had I worn through the brake pads in 4K miles without any track driving. The warranty explicitly excludes certain parts, including brake pads and clutches, for replacement from wear. Regardless of where the car was driven, they're excluded. (They could still be replaced as goodwill rather than warranty coverage, though, although such decisions are at Acura's discretion.)

This topic is not about warranty coverage for cars used on a track, or for cars used in competition. If you would like to start a separate topic to discuss that, feel free (although I suggest you do a search first, because that has been discussed here before).

Frankly, I'm hoping that they discover that OPCX's clutch problem is not due to the clutch material being worn... OPCX, any news?
 
There are other causes for premature clutch wear. I worked at a repair shop many, many years ago (I'm old) and the owners stick shift blazer was eating clutches every few thousand miles. Being a 4x4, it was a major undertaking to replace it. The owners wife drove the truck most of the time and never did anything that would cause the clutch to go out.......until we had her take us on a few sneaky test drives to try to find out the cause of the wear. We didn't say why we needed rides, as we tried to catch her off guard. After a few trips, we found it. She was resting her foot on the clutch, applying just enough pressure to slip the clutch(even though you couldn't feel it). She was asked if she was resting her foot on the clutch, but she said no to that question many times. Next clutch and a change in driving habits had cured the problem. I am not implying that this was the case here, as I was only showing other causes of premature (still not used to that word in everyday context) wear that can happen, without thinking anything was being done wrong.
Good luck with your car,
John
 
ANYTIME said:
(I'm old)
nono.gif
 
OK guys... I give in... It's just not worth getting into a big discussion. I am baseing my comments on personal experience. I've owned a couple brand new vehicles (not an NSX unfortunately) and I've taken them in for issues relating to wear and tear items. Warranties say they don't cover them... but there is usually an exclusion as to whether it's operator error or a problem with the item in question. I've never had something not fixed. If it was my fault...so be it. But I know enough about cars to know what should wear out and when.

Just my .02 I hope it's not a wear issue.... but I guess we'll see
 
Final Verdict:

New clutch+flywheel+10 hours of labor = $4800.00. I decided just to eat the cost so I can get the car back. I miss it :cool:

Nsxtacy: Ill definately take your advice in the future for any other major repairs.

Thanks to everyone else for your imput. Nice to have a place like this around :)
 
Do you have the old parts and are you going to NSXPO2004? If so, bring them, we can discuss the failure in detail.

LarryB
 
Larry Bastanza said:
Do you have the old parts and are you going to NSXPO2004? If so, bring them, we can discuss the failure in detail.

LarryB


Good idea, Ill request them today. I get the car back next week as they had to order the flywheel. I am going to try and make nsxpo for sure.

Thanks again.
 
newby said:
OK guys... I give in... It's just not worth getting into a big discussion. I am baseing my comments on personal experience. I've owned a couple brand new vehicles (not an NSX unfortunately) and I've taken them in for issues relating to wear and tear items. Warranties say they don't cover them... but there is usually an exclusion as to whether it's operator error or a problem with the item in question. I've never had something not fixed. If it was my fault...so be it. But I know enough about cars to know what should wear out and when.

Just my .02 I hope it's not a wear issue.... but I guess we'll see

I agree with you. I feel a dealership should replace just about anything on a car with only 4000 miles, especially a dealership who wants my return business.
I was just denied a repair on my 2004 touareg. With only 2k miles on the clock there is a vibration in the steering wheel. The balancing weight has come off the rim and thrown the tire out of balance. The VW service manager will not balance the tire for free. To me it seems silly on their part not to do a (under 20 dollar) repair to keep my business.
 
Here is my questions.

Why would anyone with a 97+ NSX not pay $300 bucks for the conversion to allow you to use 91-96 clutches on the 97+ cars?

Seems like a small price to pay to save $1000 on a clutch. Seems like a no-brainer to me.

Am I missing something here?
 
NetViper said:
Why would anyone with a 97+ NSX not pay $300 bucks for the conversion to allow you to use 91-96 clutches on the 97+ cars?
Labor: To open up the transmission and install the main shaft and put it all back together.
 
Ojas said:
Labor: To open up the transmission and install the main shaft and put it all back together.

Would you not still be ahead in the long run? How much labor are you talking about?
 
NetViper said:
Would you not still be ahead in the long run? How much labor are you talking about?
Someone who has done it can answer better than I, but there are a bunch of gears, synchros, and other components on the main shaft. It's not as simple as pulling the old one out and sticking a new one in.
 
Swapping the mainshaft is close to a short gear install, a lot of work. Updating the mainshaft to use a dual disk clutch is a possibility, but I would think just going to the Spec single disk stage II would be a WAY better idea:), if the reason is merely a clutch replacement.

If you had a definitive reason for wanting the dual disk, then swap the mainshaft. Typically if you were to do this, bearings, syncros, etc. would be looked at and replaced as needed, and it really turns into a trans overhaul.

My $.02,
LarryB
 
i do recall a letter to "Click n Clack" regarding shortest life ever on new clutch... a father taught his daughter to drive a stick, and let her drive his brand new, less than 100 mile VW in the school parking lot all day with him at work... 38 miles later (totalling 138 miles on the clock) she pronounced herself proficient, but also mentioned the car wont drive, it only revs... :D
item was not covered, as the clutch was totally worn out... amazing!
 
peiserg said:
i do recall a letter to "Click n Clack" regarding shortest life ever on new clutch... a father taught his daughter to drive a stick, and let her drive his brand new, less than 100 mile VW in the school parking lot all day with him at work... 38 miles later (totalling 138 miles on the clock) she pronounced herself proficient, but also mentioned the car wont drive, it only revs... :D
item was not covered, as the clutch was totally worn out... amazing!


That's an interesting story. I've seen some people ride a clutch....but that is way beyond just riding.
OPCX - sorry to hear of the cost. It's pretty sad that the dealer would not, at the very least, cut the price in half or something. Did you buy it from that dealership?
Good luck....make sure you ask the service mechanic how the clutch was worn so if it happened to be your driving...then you'll know. 4500 every 4K can get pretty pricey.
 
OPCX I am sorry to hear your clutch needed to be replaced so soon. I, and I'm sure everyone else here, would like to help you avoid a repeat.

What is your experiencing driving manual transmissions?

What exactly did the dealer say about the clutch?

Can you post some digital pictures of the parts you got back from them, particularly the friction surface?
 
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