Ahhh, nsxtasy. I go out for a nice dinner and come back to
this!! Ouch -- this seems to be getting personal. Let me respond one last time, but before doing so I would like to clarify the following: my purpose of posting to Prime is to learn, educate (when I can) and professionally discuss differences of opinion. I would hope that if such differences of opinion exist -- as seem to be the case now -- that we recognize them as such and leave it at that, rather than calling the other party "argumentative." Although you have expressed your opinion equally forcefully on this thread, I wouldn't label you as argumentative, but merely somebody trying to state what you believe. I would hope you would extend me the same courtesy
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
I pointed out that the first car wasn't new, and that most people willing to pay the price for a new car would buy a new car, not a used car, no matter how low the mileage is on the used car.
Most people won't, agreed -- because many of those are "gung ho" about buying a new car. Heck, for them, even a $5K differential won't be enought to opt for the titled car. Why? Because they "want a new car." However, there is a minority that will stop to think:
Hey, I'm getting $4k off (number derived below), for what's really a new car. It's got negligible miles, and the only "issue" is that it has been titled. Not a problem for me because I am going to keep the car for a long while, and I'd rather take the savings.
These people (myself and Fun2romein included), would pick up the cheaper car.
I was out to dinner with my "Porsche" friends tonight, and I polled them on this issue: two said they would, and two said they wouldn't. That's enough to convince me there are people who would go for this trade.
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
You claim that that's not the reason the car hasn't sold - that somewhere, someone ought to be willing to buy it to save a couple grand - but there is clear proof that that is not the case, in the fact that the car hasn't sold. That disproves your hypothesis.
Not at all. What is proves is that it is a weak economy, there are barely any '02's moving in general, and that perhaps those interested in the car may not be in close proximity to it, which means additional shipping costs that would negate the potential price savings. Just because it
hasn't been done isn't to say that it
won't be done. '02's are selling slowly, and the right buyer may be three days away...or three weeks away.
One more (very important) thing: this car has not always been at the But It Now price of $71.5K. In fact -- I can't remember the exact number -- I believe it was somewhere around $75K when it first posted. This changes the whole equation, because at
that price the car was not attractively priced relative to brand new NSX's given that dealers were offering them at a commensurate price. Now that it's been reduced to its current But It Now price -- which I believe has just happened on this listing -- the value proposition becomes a lot more compelling. Another reason why generalizing that just because it hasn't sold previously is reason is proof that nobody will go for this now is wrong -- prices were completely different before.
RPM217 bought his car for $74K. This is
now being listed for $71.5K. I speculate the seller will let the car go for $70K to an interested buyer, in order to get it off his lot. If you live close by, and you don't have to pay for shipping costs, $4k is a good chunk of change to save -- in my books at least!!
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
And someone like you, who is willing to get a used car, would be a lot more likely to get one with 5-10K miles and save $5-10K, than to get one with 90 miles and only save $2K.
No -- it all depends on the financial position of a buyer. Somebody who is looking to spend $60 on a car with 10K miles, will not likely spend $70K for a car with 90 miles -- this is too much of a price "trade up." However, it is conceivable that somebody who is willing to spend $74K on his 90 mile car will spend $70K for a titled, 90 mile car.
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
We have empirical evidence that proves this. You say that you would buy this car, but the fact is, you preferred to save $30K and buy a '95 with a lot more miles.
I would hardly call one data point "empirical." But regardless, the example is flawed, precisely because I did not have disposable income of $70K, and my decision was not, therefore, between buying an '02 or a '95.
It was between a '95 and a '95. The only way this comparision would be structurally sound is if I was looking to buy an '02 and decided, instead, that I would pick up a '95 to save a huge chunk of change -- which was certainly not the case for me. Instead of the example that you indicated, I offer you the following perspective which I believe is more relevant: if I had $74K of disposable income with the idea of consummating a deal to buy a new '02 yellow NSX, and I was provided the deal above (and assuming the car had only been titled once), then I
would buy the car.
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
The fellow in NY was willing to pay the price for a brand new NSX identical to this one, and he did, even though he knew that he could have saved a couple grand on this one.
Based on RPM217's thread, I would say that this was more to do with RPM217's excitement about negotiating a fair deal with the dealer, the ability to look the car over in person, that he was positively excited and wanted that "I'm going to drive this car away tonight" feeling -- as well as the fact that he would have had to pay shipping costs. Perhaps the title issued turned him away, perhaps it didn't. Regardless, given the dynamics of the situation, I don't think we can draw conclusive evidence either way. RPM217??
I respect what you've written nsxtasy, but I think that is perhaps one instance where it might be best for us to
agree to disagree, since neither party is going to convince the other of their side.
For this reason, this is also the last post that I am writing on this thread. If you wish to have the last word, that is your perogative.
I do hope that you will take this in the spirit in which it was intended, and that there are no hard feelings. After all, I've still got a lot to learn from you.
Regards.
[This message has been edited by NSXaholic (edited 02 February 2003).]
