Why should Honda build the 2nd-gen NSX?

[TigerNSX]

As much as I want to see the second generation NSX, why should Honda build one?

The first-gen NSX:

- was not commercially successful (in fact, someone was saying that Honda lost money on every NSX that it built)

- did not enhance the brand image of Acura (people still view Acura inferior to Lexus or even Infinity)

The exotic/high-end sports car market has become extremely competitive and there is no guarantee that Honda will come out on top. So, from the company's perspective, it's a huge risk and bet. So, why should a operationally conservative company like Honda build the second-gen NSX again?

 

[NSXFRIEND]

As much as I want to see the second generation NSX, why should Honda build one?

The first-gen NSX:

- was not commercially successful (in fact, someone was saying that Honda lost money on every NSX that it built)

- did not enhance the brand image of Acura (people still view Acura inferior to Lexus or even Infinity)

The exotic/high-end sports car market has become extremely competitive and there is no guarantee that Honda will come out on top. So, from the company's perspective, it's a huge risk and bet. So, why should a operationally conservative company like Honda build the second-gen NSX again?

Honda was an auto/motorcycle driver-racer. He followed in the footstep's of Porsche first sports cars then peoples cars. For Honda building an empire selling peoples cars then moving on to race cars was the right move. The mission was accomplished by building a car some would say equal to the 90' 911 if not better. So following this strategy Honda would have to build on the existing NSX chassis to comfort fans and keep the image alive for Honda.

 

[j.r]

Honda was all about creating the engine first, and the car second. If they don't make another NSX, let's hope they at least make a car to take their V-10. Whether it's a 911 killer or not.

 

[TigerNSX]

Honda was an auto/motorcycle driver-racer. He followed in the footstep's of Porsche first sports cars then peoples cars. For Honda building an empire selling peoples cars then moving on to race cars was the right move. The mission was accomplished by building a car some would say equal to the 90' 911 if not better. So following this strategy Honda would have to build on the existing NSX chassis to comfort fans and keep the image alive for Honda.

However, Honda buyers (for its bread and butter products such as Civic and Accord), in general, do not know, understand or care about such historical value. Their decision to purchase Honda cars was not based on the historical issue, but rather on the value and quality of Honda products.

Plus, the fan base of the NSX is so small that I wonder whether it's financially justifiable for Honda to invest in a product whose return on investment (both tangible and intangible) is at best questionable.

 

[NSXFRIEND]

However, Honda buyers (for its bread and butter products such as Civic and Accord), in general, do not know, understand or care about such historical value. Their decision to purchase Honda cars was not based on the historical issue, but rather on the value and quality of Honda products.

Plus, the fan base of the NSX is so small that I wonder whether it's financially justifiable for Honda to invest in a product whose return on investment (both tangible and intangible) is at best questionable.

True, but do you think VW owners knew much about Ferdinand Porsche who's Porsche model 60 would become the beattle but rather value and quality in their respective timeline in history.

 

[TigerNSX]

True, but do you think VW owners knew much about Ferdinand Porsche who's Porsche model 60 would become the beattle but rather value and quality in their respective timeline in history.

I am sorry, but I do not think that I understand your explanation. Could you please elaborate on this?

The question that I have a hard time answering is the following. If I am the owner of Honda, am I making the right decision for our consumers, employees and shareholders by producing the second generation NSX? Will Honda be better off with or without NSX in its product line?

I just feel that it's not a financially viable and attractive proposition.
The first-gen NSX was an amazing product that inspired many proceeding sports cars in the market today. However, not many people still know what this car is. The general public does not even think that Honda produces sports cars like this. So, NSX was a success in terms of product itself, but a failure in terms of business profitability and enhancing brand image.

 

[Danny]

Keep in mind a lot of the technology Honda pioneered in the NSX (ie VTEC) trickled down to all of their other cars. The NSX proved Honda could build a car that could compete with the best of them and they were able to use that engineering to better their product line.

 

[N Spec]

Well, it just goes to show you that a single car cannot save a name brand. Acura does not have a single rear wheel drive model besides the NSX. Most people don't take FF cars seriously. The NSX was a great success in the design/engineering aspect, just not marketing. But I'm glad it didn't sell well, it made it even more special and rare. For Acura to save it's brand, they need a FR layout that looks good, not same bloated RL.

 

[CDX_NSX]

If anything, Honda failed in the marketing of the NSX. This is probably the main reason why it has a relatively small following. It is also the reason why it did not help improve the brand image of Honda/Acura.

I think that Honda/Acura does need to step forward with a car that showcases advanced technologies and ideas that mainstream consumers can anticipate will trickle down into the lower tier cars. Honda/Acura also needs to come forward with such a car to show that it is able to stride along with if not in front of competing manufacturers.

With so much comptetion and advances in technology the NSX ceased to serve as an inspiration to the industry and car buyers in general years before the last one rolled out of the factory.

I believe that if Honda wants to remain a contender in the industry, it must come up with a car that says that they have the ability to be a leader and not a follower in the industry.

When they released the NSX, it wasn't just an effort to build a sports car with a Honda badge on it. It was a car that was released to say, "this is what you can look forward to." When they stopped developing on the NSX, buyers and the industry could only look back at the NSX as a car and example that was once great but outlived its use as a forward-looking platform for Honda.

Companies that follow will always be mediocre, and who wants to be the head of a mediocre company? It's time for them to take the lead again, and a proper successor to the NSX is, in my opinion, crucial to that goal.

 

[NSXrunner]

So, why should a operationally conservative company like Honda build the second-gen NSX again?

Marketing. The company needs a halo car of some kind to knock peoples socks off, or at least make it sweat a little :tongue: . Even if it is in limited numbers. Keep the numbers small to keep costs/losses down, but make it cool enough to keep the brand in the headlines and imagination of future customers (little kids).

The problem with that is it tends to be a very long term investment, and corporations these days are more concerned about what kind of return they can get here and now, so long term investments are few and far between.

 

[BladesNSX]

- did not enhance the brand image of Acura (people still view Acura inferior to Lexus or even Infinity)

Why is this? I've noticed that given a choice in a luxury car, most will go for an infinity G35 or Lexus IS350 over an Acura TL. For me, it's a status symbol. What could Acura do to make it more "Status" worthy. I personally think the aforementioned cars all look nice, yet none more enticing than the other.

What is Infinity's Halo car? What is Lexus' Halo Car? Have they ever had one? I Don't believe there has EVER been a Lexus or Infinity Equivalent to the NSX, has there? It is possible that the NSX wasn't created solely, or for the most part, to "enhance" the Acura Image?

 

[TigerNSX]

What could Acura do to make it more "Status" worthy.

Great question. I honestly do not know the answer, but would love to know. I just do not think that creating a "halo" car is the answer as you rightly pointed out that Lexus and Infinity did this without any halo cars.

I also agree that NSX was not created to improve the image of Honda. However, when Honda America marketed NSX under the brand of Acura, one of the goals it wanted to achieve was to enhance the value of Acura brand.

 

[NSXrunner]

What is Infinity's Halo car? What is Lexus' Halo Car? Have they ever had one? QUOTE]

Nissan (Infinity) arguably had their Skyline's as their halo car.

I guess Toyota could call their Supra a halo car since they really didn't have anything else at the time. Although they do have the LF-A coming under the Lexus badge, and Nissan has the new GT-R even though it will be staying under the Nissan name instead of Infinity.

 

[BladesNSX]

Nissan (Infinity) arguably had their Skyline's as their halo car.

I guess Toyota could call their Supra a halo car since they really didn't have anything else at the time. Although they do have the LF-A coming under the Lexus badge, and Nissan has the new GT-R even though it will be staying under the Nissan name instead of Infinity.

True, however there really isn't a Lexus Acura or Infinity in Japan. I believe those brands were created for reasons of "status" here in the States. The Skyline was never really offered in the U.S.; and the Supra was discontinued in the U.S. yet thrived in Japan.

The LF-A and the GT-R are coming out as their Halo car, yet I don't think either companies NEED a boost in image or status. It seems Acura is the one taking a hit with their image. I'm not saying I feel this way. Personally, I LOVE the TSX, I think it's a gorgeous car. Same goes for the MDX. The TL and RL are okay looking. I've just notices most people prefer Lexus or Infinity. Again, for no other reason than STATUS.

 

[CDX_NSX]

I think that because the NSX was produced for such a long time, we should also look at the picture across what I like to think of as two seperate eras in Honda's/Acura's History; pre-'95 and '95 onward.

It is my opinion that Honda/Acura has put out mostly very bland, boring and unimaginative cars since around 1995. So, not only were they not continuing their push in technology, the dulled down the aesthetics of their cars as well.

Lexus and Infiniti while not having a halo car, appealed to the masses by way of style, lux and prestige. All of which Honda was offering quite minimally. Add that to the lack of exciting advancements in technology, Honda/Acura got left behind.

While shoppers are drawn to technological advancements, we fall in lust with the visual, sensual and romantic aspects of the car first. This is what Toyota and later Nissan have achieved and what Honda has yet to recover.

 

[navyflydoc]

Honda is a maverick company based on dreams and technology. Once upon a time while walking home, a little six year old kid in a small village briefly saw a glimpse of something moving fast down a dirt road. He chased after it but it sped away in a cloud of smoke. The boy glanced down and discovered an oil puddle on the road. He dropped down to smell the oil and realized to himself that this "...this is the smell of civilization." That something was a Ford-T Model automoblie. From that moment on, the boy had a dream that someday he would build the best automobile in the world. The boy is Soichiro Honda and his dream was fulfilled with the Honda S500.

http://www.hondas600.com/hist_birthofhondasports.php

Honda legacy from its origin has been and should always be sporty and sexy cars. Civics and Accords are bread but sports cars are its butter.

 

[BladesNSX]

I think that because the NSX was produced for such a long time, we should also look at the picture across what I like to think of as two seperate eras in Honda's/Acura's History; pre-'95 and '95 onward.

It is my opinion that Honda/Acura has put out mostly very bland, boring and unimaginative cars since around 1995. So, not only were they not continuing their push in technology, the dulled down the aesthetics of their cars as well.

Lexus and Infiniti while not having a halo car, appealed to the masses by way of style, lux and prestige. All of which Honda was offering quite minimally. Add that to the lack of exciting advancements in technology, Honda/Acura got left behind.

While shoppers are drawn to technological advancements, we fall in lust with the visual, sensual and romantic aspects of the car first. This is what Toyota and later Nissan have achieved and what Honda has yet to recover.

What technology to you speak of exactly? Do you mean such things as HIDs, computer parking assist, etc.? Do you mean that whatever techno luxury gizmo the other guys came up with, Honda came along too little and too late to mimic? I'm not being sarcastic at all....I'm genuinely curious. Who started HIDs btw? Wasn't it Infinity? Lexus had the lights that turn as you turn? Actually, a European vehicle first came out with this design decades ago. I always forget the name of that car, but if I were a rich car collector I would really want one.

 

[Swift]

IF you replace the word honda with ACURA....
good marketing campaigns...hipe etc...

And you created a car that had power, looked good, sounded evil, and handled good......and could outperform a ferrari and porsche.

Nissan just enhanced their image by SMOKING the competion with their GT-R. Its a nissan even!!!

So Acura can turn everything around if they remember where they came from and how they got there.

If Acura created a "aston martin DBS" that outdid everything..even the GT-R for only around $90k........wouldn't you buy one!?

 

[NSXrunner]

True, however there really isn't a Lexus Acura or Infinity in Japan. I believe those brands were created for reasons of "status" here in the States. The Skyline was never really offered in the U.S.; and the Supra was discontinued in the U.S. yet thrived in Japan.

Good point. They just evolved into halo cars for the US based on word of mouth from the US fan base. Forgot to take that into consideration...:redface:

 

[NSXrunner]

Honda is a maverick company based on dreams and technology.

Im all for technology but the car has to have a look that knocks your socks off or at least gets your heart pounding. They have some nice cars, but nothing really to get people to say WOW.

 

[WingZ]

What technology to you speak of exactly? Do you mean such things as HIDs, computer parking assist, etc.? Do you mean that whatever techno luxury gizmo the other guys came up with, Honda came along too little and too late to mimic? I'm not being sarcastic at all....I'm genuinely curious. Who started HIDs btw? Wasn't it Infinity? Lexus had the lights that turn as you turn? Actually, a European vehicle first came out with this design decades ago. I always forget the name of that car, but if I were a rich car collector I would really want one.

As I recall the Lincoln Mark VIII was the first car to have HIDs. Or maybe it was the Mark VII definitely a Lincoln though.

 

[CDX_NSX]

What technology to you speak of exactly? Do you mean such things as HIDs, computer parking assist, etc.? Do you mean that whatever techno luxury gizmo the other guys came up with, Honda came along too little and too late to mimic? I'm not being sarcastic at all....I'm genuinely curious. Who started HIDs btw? Wasn't it Infinity? Lexus had the lights that turn as you turn? Actually, a European vehicle first came out with this design decades ago. I always forget the name of that car, but if I were a rich car collector I would really want one.

By technology I mean everything that includes engine and chassis design as well as electronics.

During the time of the early NSX, Honda was ahead of the game in all of the above as well as having very good exterior designs. Unfortunately, during the mid '90s, they seemed to have shifted to a philosophy that halted their drive for innovation and imagination. That's when things got boring at Honda/Acura. Lexus and then Infiniti stepped up to the plate that Honda/Acura vacated and have continued to move forward by producing cars that fit within shoppers' expectations of luxury.

The NSX was a platform to showcase Honda's technology, but it is technology that has long since become old news. Their nicely designed cars, in my opinion, ended with the Legends and Accords of the early to mid-90's.

Toyota/Lexus and Nissan/Infiniti had surpassed Honda/Acura even though they did not have a Halo car because they continued to appeal to buyers other senses. Now that Lexus has the LF-A and Infiniti the GT-R, that hole is filled and Honda has a lot of catching up to do.

 

[MCM]

"Why should Honda build the 2nd-gen NSX?"

I am not so sure they should. It might be a bloated pig and just tarnish the name.
If what we have been hearing is true, they should scrap the idea completely.
Talk about being late to the party.................


Agree 100% with CDX_NSX.

The Co., has always produced top shelf commuter cars, and "other" quality products.
Need a bombproof outboard for your boat? .
A practical car that gets great mileage for your kids?
Motorcycle?
No problem

Need a replacement supercar? Need something nice for your empty nester wife?
Huge problem

One of the main issues with NSX sales was do to the economy during its roll out.
Also, it didn't seem to fit into to many classes so race results are limited /almost non existent.
Couple huge wins though, but not the follow through needed.
Then, the reluctance to really change anything or follow up with any development.

A bit of personal history you probably don't care about. LOL LOL

My 1st Honda experience, 1969 - I was 8 yrs old with a mini trail 50. (thanks dad!)

1968 Honda P50 (Look it up) a tool you could use to terrorize the city streets & have a blast with if you were 13 in 1974. here you go.. http://cyclechaos.com/wiki/Honda_P50

I had a 1973 Honda Elsinore . (paper route / mowing lawns) A bike that changed the MX world.

(Then 20+ more Honda bikes, mainly thumpers over the past 30 yrs)

19whatever, Honda mower. Still starts on the 1st pull after well over 10 yrs.

The Co. is probably doing everything "right" Just not what we would like on NSXPRIME.

Honda has had some real ground breaking products that made the world re-think their existing products. Advanced, bullet proof, reliable, etc.

Many are unhappy with their auto line up at this time.............
But in all honesty, aside from the NSX my needs never seemed to line up with their cars.
Tried an Accord as a family car in the early 80's, too small & underpowered.
I have never needed a commuter car. Just sports / Muscle cars, a Truck, and a family car.
So, nothing much their for me at the time. Toyota on the other hand, always seemed to know what I needed.

So if you need a new AC Generator, buy a Honda! They are the best.
Need a new car that excites you? Better look elsewhere...........
Hold your NSX, I believe it was an automotive anomaly, that will most likely never happen again.

 

[Ski_Banker]

Great question. I honestly do not know the answer, but would love to know. I just do not think that creating a "halo" car is the answer as you rightly pointed out that Lexus and Infinity did this without any halo cars.

I think this gets at the core of Honda's problems. The NSX not being updated was a symptom of what has been a gradual decline in their products' competitiveness & brand (Honda and Acura) since the mid 90s.

In the late 80's, early 90s, Honda was on fire. The Acura brand was better than Audi and Lexus. The only way to go was up -- the NSX. Roll forward 15 years, and all of their products (except the aging S2000) are dull and uninspiring. This company does NOT need to invest in an ill-conceived supercar now. It needs to invest in exciting designs/technologies to put the important 99% of Honda autos back on the map. Point being - if a halo supercar strategy failed when Honda was at its peak, it will be a financial disaster these days.

Not that I wouldn't love a Gen 2 mid engined NSX, sitting next to my 2005.

 

[NSXFRIEND]

I am sorry, but I do not think that I understand your explanation. Could you please elaborate on this?

The question that I have a hard time answering is the following. If I am the owner of Honda, am I making the right decision for our consumers, employees and shareholders by producing the second generation NSX? Will Honda be better off with or without NSX in its product line?

I just feel that it's not a financially viable and attractive proposition.
The first-gen NSX was an amazing product that inspired many proceeding sports cars in the market today. However, not many people still know what this car is. The general public does not even think that Honda produces sports cars like this. So, NSX was a success in terms of product itself, but a failure in terms of business profitability and enhancing brand image.

Honda's intention with the NSX was not profit but to show its formula one success technology. Porsche did the same with the 959 all lose and all noteriaty. Honda has no choice but to produce another NSX, just as Porsche had no choice but to produce the 911 after the success of the Porsche model 60-Beattle.

Danny Porsche had the vario cam manipulating the exhaust in mid 89 around the same time. Bmw also was woking on its vanos system. These cars did not need the high revs.