+1 zillion. I try and keep everything protected the same way. I also feel the same about money, lots of it on hand does you no good.
What will happen to the housing market if...
- Thread starter Mike-san
- Start date
+1 zillion. I try and keep everything protected the same way. I also feel the same about money, lots of it on hand does you no good.
Better get used to it. It's ubiquitous and only gets worse. Welfare; you pay for those people who are unwilling or too lazy to work. Insurance; you pay higher premiums for those who drive like idiots. Social security; payment for those who selfishly spent their money rather than saved for retirement.
Get this, I'm unmarried, no kids. I don't use schools, I've never called the police, fire department or ambulance. I'm not on welfare, medicare/medicaid, or social security. I hardly utilize a single government service, yet I paid $120,000 in taxes last year, basically to pay for those who do. I’m slated to pay even more this year, and you better believe, that a good chunk of that money is going to be used to bail out those that couldn’t control their finances.
I am right on the same bus as you, maybe even driving the damn bus. Everything you are saying I am very passionate about and it pisses me off to no end. If I only had to pay for me and not everyone else I would have stopped working years ago and that is why the system is in place, to continue to cycle the money through the economy.
As steveny said, +1 zillion!
Also what people forget is that mortgages is “cheap” money. Not only is the interest rate crazy low, but you can write off the interest, so the net effective interest rate is incredibly low. So low in fact that if you took the money you would have normally applied to paying off the mortgage early, you could invest it in something with a higher rate of return that would actually make you money. In that way, you could actually pay off your mortgage faster if you wanted to(although I wouldn’t recommend it) or just have more money at X number of years in the future then by paying off the loan. Just remember that you will almost always be able to find an investment that will make you more money then you are paying in interest on a mortgage. So if you loaned me a dollar at 5% interest, and I in turn was able to loan it out to someone else at 10% interest, why would I ever want to pay you back and close my account?
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I'm only in my early 20's but my economics/finance back ground and fiscal discipline have caused me the same grief. I remember discussing the situation of a rich guy going to jail for 2 years over tax fraud with a co-worker. The jist of it was the wealthy man bought a painting in NY for 1XX million but did some shady 'moving around' so that he wouldn't have to pay taxes on it back in MA. Long story short he got caught, ended up serving a short jail sentence. We thought "what an idiot, why would a rich guy like that risk jail to save what obviously wasn't critical income".
But only a few years later I can already relate to the guy. It's not just about the $ or greed, that's not the point. The point is you get tired of it. The point is there is something wrong with being forced to give away large portions of your money largly to support government inefficiency and the carelessness of other citizens.
I guess I'm supposed to vote for changes? Vote for who?
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Steve, You're an "online friend", but I need to point something out to you...Aren't a lot of your renters on govt. assistance ? I totally agree w/ your rants on this subject, but aren't you kind of biting the hand that feeds you in a weird, backhanded sort of way ? Again, you're my bud, so don't get pissed !!!
Not to speak for Steve, but it's anything but. If his renters were self sufficient, he possibly could demand greater rent for his properties. The way a lot of government subsidized/aided properties work is that they limit how much a landlord such as Steve can charge. In essence they are tying his hands from making money. And even if they weren’t limiting his rent, it’s still adding insult to injury because the rent he collects is partially paid for by, get this, himself through taxes. In other words, he pays taxes, which then pays these people, which in turn, they pay to him for rent. In fact, I do it, you do it, we all do. Everyone but the actual tenants. Something doesn’t sound right in that equation and that’s what bugs people on “this bus”. Good question, sorry if I’m a bit “passionate” about the issue. :smile:
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Y'know, I never thought of it from that angle !!! I guess my thinking is that govt. assistance at least guarantees a steady income
rolleyes which would be an advantage for someone who collects rent from these people on a monthly basis.
Thanks for that, amazing you found it so quickly. I'm impressed I got the states correct 4 years later.
Not pissed at all. It takes a lot to get me pissed and someones opinion or anything verbal will never get me "pissed."
I think the reason I hate it so much is because I see it every day. I am sure it is how a police officer feels after dealing with a-holes all day. As much as I dislike the police I do sympathize with them too.
Those same tenants who sometimes trash the apartments are the same tenants who I will never collect from. They are the same tenants who are on assistance. I have rarely had a person who is not on assistance trash an apartment. Fairly speaking, not all those who are on assistance trash apartments either but the good majority of those who trash apartments, pay late rent, call code enforcement, write bad checks, all around rotten people are on assistance. That assistance I provide through paying taxes and I get treated like $hit for doing so.
We had a tenant move in last month to a studio apartment. They wrote a check for the rent and security. I call the bank the check is written on to make sure it is a good check, bank says its good. Two weeks later the check comes back as ISF. Those phuckers took the money out of the bank as soon as they signed the lease and I gave them the keys. I go over to the apartment several times, no one is there but a dog is barking in the apartment. other tenants say they have not seen anyone in or out of the apartment for a week or more. I set up with a maintenance guy to get some bread and slide it under the door so the dog can have something to eat. No dogs are suppose to be in the apartment any animals for that matter, but it is not the dogs fault. I call the police. The police refer me to the ASPCA. I call the ASPCA they refer me to the dog warden. He says he can't take the dog because it is in the apartment. A few more days go by and the dog is in the hallway of the building now, skinny and looking pretty bad, hair missing from its entire back, paws bleeding from trying to claw out the door.The dog warden finally comes and gets the dog.
So finally someone gets a hold of me and tells me the tenant is staying in a hotel, BTW paid through the government. I go to the hotel. They sign off on the lease and remove what they want. I tell them I won't go after them for any of the rent they should have paid. They go to the apartment and take what they want and leave 3 truck loads of crap for us to get rid of. The dog has ruined the carpet and floors, door and the apartment smells like crap. There are two dead cats in the bathroom, starved to death.
Can you believe I just get a call from the maintenance man that the tenant cut the cord off the refrigerator? Also cut the the wires inside the refrigerator, and cut the freon line too.
So I was going to let it go and not chase down the bad check but now I am pissed about the fridge. So I call the police department about the bad check. They refer me to the bad check department for the county, not connected to the police department. I give all the information to the lady who answered the phone after 5 minutes on their automated system. The last question the lady asks me is what the check was for. I say rent. WELL... they don't handle rent checks I have to take it to civil divisions. I guess it is not ok to steal from Walmart but it is ok to steal from landlords through the use of bad checks. You see the bad check place knows too that it is a big waste of time to go after these people, just like the police department knows. NO ONE WANTS TO HELP WHEN YOU ARE DEALING WITH PEOPLE ON PUBLIC ASSISTANCE BECAUSE THERE WILL BE NO SATISFACTION. I call my lawyer. He says to call the police department back. I call the police back and finally get someone who will help me. Keep in mind this is the same police department I called first, but must have gotten one of the lazy officers the first time. So tomorrow I have to go in to the police department and fill out all the proper paperwork to probably never collect on the check but at least the bad check writer/refrigerator destroyer will go to jail. BTW I can't have them arrested for vandalism of the refrigerator because I didn't see them do it, like they would have done it in front of me anyways
.Any type of payments these people receive I can not garnish and they know it. That sucks. I should be able to garnish their SSI/welfare check and leave them to freeze in the streets. There is no penalty for them and they take advantage of everyone all the time.
Even though I do receive a lot of payments through government assistance programs I feel that 95% of the people receiving those payments are not worthy of receiving said payments.
It's like the bad cop, subprime loans, a lot of the threads on prime there is just no accountability anymore. At least no accountability for those who make bad decisions and are backed by a whole department of other bad decision makers or those who have nothing to lose.
When will there be a bonus for doing good things, the right things?
Yes they do limit the amount we can collect and in fact most agencies won't allow you to rent the apartment unless all the utilities are included. Why is this you ask, because the tenant can't get utilities in their name because they have unpaid utility bills. So in essence the government is helping the tenants screw the utility companies which ends up screwing the people who do pay their bills because the utility company raises the rate of the payers bills to make up for the non-payers.
In the next county over if you don't rent your apartments in 30 days the county can fill the apartment with anyone they want at a set price and you can not refuse to take the tenant.
Also if a tenant is not paying the rent and the utilities are in the landlords name the landlord will go to jail and pay a fine for having the utilities shut off. Again the accountability only lies on the shoulders of ONLY the people who can pay. ONLY the people that have anything to lose.
Y'know, I never thought of it from that angle !!! I guess my thinking is that govt. assistance at least guarantees a steady income
It's anything but steady. If the tenant fails to fill out the paperwork every month the rent payment stop in most cases. We also have to resubmit on our end every few month too.
Take this to the bank if you want to get an idea of what I deal with, less than 5% of our leases with subsidized rents are ever fulfilled.
How many people on prime have never fulfilled a lease and left an apartment trashed and the rent unpaid?
I tell you what guys some days having Prime here is just about the only thing that keeps me sane.
Not pissed at all. It takes a lot to get me pissed and someones opinion or anything verbal will never get me "pissed."
I think the reason I hate it so much is because I see it every day. I am sure it is how a police officer feels after dealing with a-holes all day. As much as I dislike the police I do sympathize with them too.
Those same tenants who sometimes trash the apartments are the same tenants who I will never collect from. They are the same tenants who are on assistance. I have rarely had a person who is not on assistance trash an apartment. Fairly speaking, not all those who are on assistance trash apartments either but the good majority of those who trash apartments, pay late rent, call code enforcement, write bad checks, all around rotten people are on assistance. That assistance I provide through paying taxes and I get treated like $hit for doing so.
We had a tenant move in last month to a studio apartment. They wrote a check for the rent and security. I call the bank the check is written on to make sure it is a good check, bank says its good. Two weeks later the check comes back as ISF. Those phuckers took the money out of the bank as soon as they signed the lease and I gave them the keys. I go over to the apartment several times, no one is there but a dog is barking in the apartment. other tenants say they have not seen anyone in or out of the apartment for a week or more. I set up with a maintenance guy to get some bread and slide it under the door so the dog can have something to eat. No dogs are suppose to be in the apartment any animals for that matter, but it is not the dogs fault. I call the police. The police refer me to the ASPCA. I call the ASPCA they refer me to the dog warden. He says he can't take the dog because it is in the apartment. A few more days go by and the dog is in the hallway of the building now, skinny and looking pretty bad, hair missing from its entire back, paws bleeding from trying to claw out the door.The dog warden finally comes and gets the dog.
So finally someone gets a hold of me and tells me the tenant is staying in a hotel, BTW paid through the government. I go to the hotel. They sign off on the lease and remove what they want. I tell them I won't go after them for any of the rent they should have paid. They go to the apartment and take what they want and leave 3 truck loads of crap for us to get rid of. The dog has ruined the carpet and floors, door and the apartment smells like crap. There are two dead cats in the bathroom, starved to death.
Can you believe I just get a call from the maintenance man that the tenant cut the cord off the refrigerator? Also cut the the wires inside the refrigerator, and cut the freon line too.
So I was going to let it go and not chase down the bad check but now I am pissed about the fridge. So I call the police department about the bad check. They refer me to the bad check department for the county, not connected to the police department. I give all the information to the lady who answered the phone after 5 minutes on their automated system. The last question the lady asks me is what the check was for. I say rent. WELL... they don't handle rent checks I have to take it to civil divisions. I guess it is not ok to steal from Walmart but it is ok to steal from landlords through the use of bad checks. You see the bad check place knows too that it is a big waste of time to go after these people, just like the police department knows. NO ONE WANTS TO HELP WHEN YOU ARE DEALING WITH PEOPLE ON PUBLIC ASSISTANCE BECAUSE THERE WILL BE NO SATISFACTION. I call my lawyer. He says to call the police department back. I call the police back and finally get someone who will help me. Keep in mind this is the same police department I called first, but must have gotten one of the lazy officers the first time. So tomorrow I have to go in to the police department and fill out all the proper paperwork to probably never collect on the check but at least the bad check writer/refrigerator destroyer will go to jail. BTW I can't have them arrested for vandalism of the refrigerator because I didn't see them do it, like they would have done it in front of me anyways
Any type of payments these people receive I can not garnish and they know it. That sucks. I should be able to garnish their SSI/welfare check and leave them to freeze in the streets. There is no penalty for them and they take advantage of everyone all the time.
Even though I do receive a lot of payments through government assistance programs I feel that 95% of the people receiving those payments are not worthy of receiving said payments.
It's like the bad cop, subprime loans, a lot of the threads on prime there is just no accountability anymore. At least no accountability for those who make bad decisions and are backed by a whole department of other bad decision makers or those who have nothing to lose.
When will there be a bonus for doing good things, the right things?
Dude, time for the Vito & Rocco collection agency. You no pay once, you no walk so good. You no pay twice, you no breathe anymore. These people get away with that crap because they know they're untouchable & hard to find. Our "legal" system has removed any & all consequences. Bring back the good old fashioned ass-kicking, broken knee caps, & cement shoes. The problem will go away, one way or another.
Don't even tempt me.
You want to hear something horrible...I have over a 1/2 a million dollars that is owed to me in judgements that I will never collect. :frown:
Not pissed at all. It takes a lot to get me pissed and someones opinion or anything verbal will never get me "pissed."
I think the reason I hate it so much is because I see it every day. I am sure it is how a police officer feels after dealing with a-holes all day. As much as I dislike the police I do sympathize with them too.
Those same tenants who sometimes trash the apartments are the same tenants who I will never collect from. They are the same tenants who are on assistance. I have rarely had a person who is not on assistance trash an apartment. Fairly speaking, not all those who are on assistance trash apartments either but the good majority of those who trash apartments, pay late rent, call code enforcement, write bad checks, all around rotten people are on assistance. That assistance I provide through paying taxes and I get treated like $hit for doing so.
We had a tenant move in last month to a studio apartment. They wrote a check for the rent and security. I call the bank the check is written on to make sure it is a good check, bank says its good. Two weeks later the check comes back as ISF. Those phuckers took the money out of the bank as soon as they signed the lease and I gave them the keys. I go over to the apartment several times, no one is there but a dog is barking in the apartment. other tenants say they have not seen anyone in or out of the apartment for a week or more. I set up with a maintenance guy to get some bread and slide it under the door so the dog can have something to eat. No dogs are suppose to be in the apartment any animals for that matter, but it is not the dogs fault. I call the police. The police refer me to the ASPCA. I call the ASPCA they refer me to the dog warden. He says he can't take the dog because it is in the apartment. A few more days go by and the dog is in the hallway of the building now, skinny and looking pretty bad, hair missing from its entire back, paws bleeding from trying to claw out the door.The dog warden finally comes and gets the dog.
So finally someone gets a hold of me and tells me the tenant is staying in a hotel, BTW paid through the government. I go to the hotel. They sign off on the lease and remove what they want. I tell them I won't go after them for any of the rent they should have paid. They go to the apartment and take what they want and leave 3 truck loads of crap for us to get rid of. The dog has ruined the carpet and floors, door and the apartment smells like crap. There are two dead cats in the bathroom, starved to death.
Can you believe I just get a call from the maintenance man that the tenant cut the cord off the refrigerator? Also cut the the wires inside the refrigerator, and cut the freon line too.
So I was going to let it go and not chase down the bad check but now I am pissed about the fridge. So I call the police department about the bad check. They refer me to the bad check department for the county, not connected to the police department. I give all the information to the lady who answered the phone after 5 minutes on their automated system. The last question the lady asks me is what the check was for. I say rent. WELL... they don't handle rent checks I have to take it to civil divisions. I guess it is not ok to steal from Walmart but it is ok to steal from landlords through the use of bad checks. You see the bad check place knows too that it is a big waste of time to go after these people, just like the police department knows. NO ONE WANTS TO HELP WHEN YOU ARE DEALING WITH PEOPLE ON PUBLIC ASSISTANCE BECAUSE THERE WILL BE NO SATISFACTION. I call my lawyer. He says to call the police department back. I call the police back and finally get someone who will help me. Keep in mind this is the same police department I called first, but must have gotten one of the lazy officers the first time. So tomorrow I have to go in to the police department and fill out all the proper paperwork to probably never collect on the check but at least the bad check writer/refrigerator destroyer will go to jail. BTW I can't have them arrested for vandalism of the refrigerator because I didn't see them do it, like they would have done it in front of me anyways
Any type of payments these people receive I can not garnish and they know it. That sucks. I should be able to garnish their SSI/welfare check and leave them to freeze in the streets. There is no penalty for them and they take advantage of everyone all the time.
Even though I do receive a lot of payments through government assistance programs I feel that 95% of the people receiving those payments are not worthy of receiving said payments.
It's like the bad cop, subprime loans, a lot of the threads on prime there is just no accountability anymore. At least no accountability for those who make bad decisions and are backed by a whole department of other bad decision makers or those who have nothing to lose.
When will there be a bonus for doing good things, the right things?
Steve, how do you NOT punch these people in the mouth? What kind of a-hole vandalizes your fridge after screwing you, as if that wasn't enough. Unbelievable...
Steveny,
this problem with the irresponsible tenant is becoming an annoying pain in the neck. one would expect problems with tennants like this to be in the "ghettos" but truth of the matter is, it's happening everywhere in the bayarea. my dad owns apt complexes here and there in the santa clara county even in fairly well off areas. but the truth is that because most of the southbay is inhabitable due to high cost of living so renting an apt is the most economical route.
due to the weak renters market, my dad decides to keep the monthly rent below market price in order to keep the place filled at all times but no matter how vigorous the interviews are. we are constantly decieved. we have people who never pays rent on time but my dad let that slide because he feels sympathy for these people. whereas we have people who would at first tell us that they'll pay next week and we come back to pick up the rent, they'd threaten with all sorts of laws and regulations that they know not of and even threats to our well being
my dad always tells me, "i'm sick of this bs i have to put up with...i'm paying taxes to help these people pay for rent and they still can't do it?" we once a had a lady who lives there with 2 small children and she would constantly call upon us to fix torn screen door. my dad fixed this for about 2 weeks and finally he got sick of it the kids constantly ripping through them every week and asked for it to be fixed, he stopped fixing them. we got taken to court, we won the case of course. she moved out shortly after without paying the last month's rent.
we had a guy that seems nice at first but decides to make and deal drugs out of his apt. well, the FBI came ripped the walls, floors, cabinets apart looking for more drugs. at the end, we had a completely torn apart place and they're only liable to pay for the lock to the front door. it's irrating to see that the illegal things these people did in this apartment and having the FBI tear everything apart, and all of the financial responsibility falls on our shoulders, we have to do the cleaning and remodeling.
in many aspect i'm sympathetic to some of the hardworking tennants who scrapes by and makes an honest living for once upon a time, my family came from a poor background and we know how hard it can be. it seems to me that some of the modern people have lost their ethics and are no longer willing to work to live, instead they'd resort to lie, steal and cheat their way through life in order to cheat my dad and numerous other people out of a few months' rent.
i mean being poor doesn't mean you're a bad person but it seems just like adam smith's "invisible hand" has somehow pushed these people to the dark side. it is bluntly obvious that it's no longer easy nor cheap to live in the bay area but something must be sacrificed if one wants to live here.
this problem with the irresponsible tenant is becoming an annoying pain in the neck. one would expect problems with tennants like this to be in the "ghettos" but truth of the matter is, it's happening everywhere in the bayarea. my dad owns apt complexes here and there in the santa clara county even in fairly well off areas. but the truth is that because most of the southbay is inhabitable due to high cost of living so renting an apt is the most economical route.
due to the weak renters market, my dad decides to keep the monthly rent below market price in order to keep the place filled at all times but no matter how vigorous the interviews are. we are constantly decieved. we have people who never pays rent on time but my dad let that slide because he feels sympathy for these people. whereas we have people who would at first tell us that they'll pay next week and we come back to pick up the rent, they'd threaten with all sorts of laws and regulations that they know not of and even threats to our well being
my dad always tells me, "i'm sick of this bs i have to put up with...i'm paying taxes to help these people pay for rent and they still can't do it?" we once a had a lady who lives there with 2 small children and she would constantly call upon us to fix torn screen door. my dad fixed this for about 2 weeks and finally he got sick of it the kids constantly ripping through them every week and asked for it to be fixed, he stopped fixing them. we got taken to court, we won the case of course. she moved out shortly after without paying the last month's rent.
we had a guy that seems nice at first but decides to make and deal drugs out of his apt. well, the FBI came ripped the walls, floors, cabinets apart looking for more drugs. at the end, we had a completely torn apart place and they're only liable to pay for the lock to the front door. it's irrating to see that the illegal things these people did in this apartment and having the FBI tear everything apart, and all of the financial responsibility falls on our shoulders, we have to do the cleaning and remodeling.
in many aspect i'm sympathetic to some of the hardworking tennants who scrapes by and makes an honest living for once upon a time, my family came from a poor background and we know how hard it can be. it seems to me that some of the modern people have lost their ethics and are no longer willing to work to live, instead they'd resort to lie, steal and cheat their way through life in order to cheat my dad and numerous other people out of a few months' rent.
i mean being poor doesn't mean you're a bad person but it seems just like adam smith's "invisible hand" has somehow pushed these people to the dark side. it is bluntly obvious that it's no longer easy nor cheap to live in the bay area but something must be sacrificed if one wants to live here.
I just break my own stuff and then I feel better!:wink: :biggrin:
At least we are not alone. I hear you on the whole, back to fix the same thing the tenant broke several times themselves. We had one tenant break the heating system on purpose and then call code enforcement. Code came and we are both looking at the furnace and the tenant says I haven't been there to repair the furnace for a month, which is a lie. I tell the code officer, looks to me this is not habitable space. Code guy looks at me and say, you are right. He condemned the apartment. I looked at the tenant and said, well the apartment is condemned you have 24 hours to move out. :biggrin: Mark one up for the good guy.
We had a drug bust like the one you had. The tenant who rented the apartment had a great application and we were happy to rent to him, even a little curious to why he wasn't buying a house. We never saw him after that. He dropped off two guys who were dealing drugs out of the apartment. The swat team came and broke down the door to the neighbors apartment first, then broke down the door to the correct apartment second. They did a pretty through job of trashing the place looking for drugs. In NY the police are not responsible for any damage they do during a drug bust, or so they told me.
The police took the two occupants to jail and the ring leader got away. apparently the ring leader had a couple of guys in each city within a 200 mile radius and would drop off product and pick up cash. Because they never found him in possession of anything they couldn't do a damn thing to him.
I wouldn't worry about the renter market if the mortgage rates aren't frozen.
Wow... what a subject...
Been there... done that with tenants. No matter if it's Cali or Fla. people are quite similar in nature. Or should I say irresponsible people.
The market will balance itself out in TIME. We must not forget that R.E is cyclical.
For those that feel cheated by Mtg. Brokers, perhaps they did not read the Truth In Lending Statement. People who opt. for ARMs not only wanting a lower payment, but also hoping to cash in on increasing property value. I call them the semi-flippers. There is nothing wrong with ARMs if you know how to play your cards right.
As for Gov. help, they will put a band-aid on it.
As for rates, it should stay where it is or lower in the next 3 years.
Lenders will have stricter guidelines.
Perhaps more Owner Financing will pop up.
Bottom Line…now is the time to buy.
Been there... done that with tenants. No matter if it's Cali or Fla. people are quite similar in nature. Or should I say irresponsible people.
The market will balance itself out in TIME. We must not forget that R.E is cyclical.
For those that feel cheated by Mtg. Brokers, perhaps they did not read the Truth In Lending Statement. People who opt. for ARMs not only wanting a lower payment, but also hoping to cash in on increasing property value. I call them the semi-flippers. There is nothing wrong with ARMs if you know how to play your cards right.
As for Gov. help, they will put a band-aid on it.
As for rates, it should stay where it is or lower in the next 3 years.
Lenders will have stricter guidelines.
Perhaps more Owner Financing will pop up.
Bottom Line…now is the time to buy.
Spoken like a true real estate broker. Now is definitely NOT the time to buy around here. Prices are still far too high and I suspect will continue to drop for at least the next year at a minimum. I could be wrong, but saying 'now is the time to buy' like you're certain that prices are going back up tomorrow is misleading at best.
Can I break some of your stuff? I'm very good at blowing up engines. :wink:
I have an extra sledgehammer if you want to help me with that fridge tomorrow.
You should look at the real estate trend my friend. The cycle tends to be from 7-10 years. If you buy now, chances of it increasing to at it's peak would be in the next 7-10 years. If you wait to buy later, you could perhaps going into the top of the next bottom.
Will the sun rise tomorrow? Chances are very very high.
Will the Real Estate prices go back up tomorrow? Chances are very very low.
Did I say prices will go up tomorrow? NO:biggrin:
"Spoken like a true real estate broker" hmm...stereotyping still exists today.
I'm shocked.
But at the end, I understand what you are attempting to say. :wink:
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