If Honda manages to produce incredible performance numbers (Enzo numbers) with the ASCC would that change your opinion? If we refuse to still buy the ASCC because of the hideous looks, does that make us posers?
what if the ascc peforms.... REALLY performs?
- Thread starter nicholas421
- Start date
It depends. Even though I know how an Elise performs, you could never get me to buy one because I don't care for how the car looks, or how small the cockpit is.
The ASCC is not a finished car, it is a prototype. That will play out over the next couple of years. This is not the first time Honda or Acura have dropped real turd bombs into the auto show. I remember the a few of the RDX concepts a few years ago - whewwww, what stinkers! The ASCC could still turn out a good looking car. What won't change is the fact that it is a GT, and not an exotic. It can fly like a rocket on the tarmac, but I'll never sport a woody for a FR layout - EVER!
So yes, you can call me a poseur I guess.:biggrin:
The ASCC is not a finished car, it is a prototype. That will play out over the next couple of years. This is not the first time Honda or Acura have dropped real turd bombs into the auto show. I remember the a few of the RDX concepts a few years ago - whewwww, what stinkers! The ASCC could still turn out a good looking car. What won't change is the fact that it is a GT, and not an exotic. It can fly like a rocket on the tarmac, but I'll never sport a woody for a FR layout - EVER!
So yes, you can call me a poseur I guess.:biggrin:
Oh, and Nick: You're a tool.
Very hard one!
I am a gouge Honda fan an will always be. I still will support the ASCC if it goes racing I will still like it and if I have the cash I will buy it BUT the HSC is so much better and I like it so much more so let's get the HSC on the road and keep the ASCC as a replacement for the S2000 witch it would do very well (scale it down).:redface:
I would be more happy with a HSC than a ASCC.
Lotus:
Yep your right just is not a Honda (plus it has a Toyota engine and I am not a big Toyota fan!)
This could be a nice slogan.
RATER PUSH MY NSX THAN DRIVE A ASCC.
But that's a big step for me to say!
It does count for the new Lexus or the R8
I am a gouge Honda fan an will always be. I still will support the ASCC if it goes racing I will still like it and if I have the cash I will buy it BUT the HSC is so much better and I like it so much more so let's get the HSC on the road and keep the ASCC as a replacement for the S2000 witch it would do very well (scale it down).:redface:
I would be more happy with a HSC than a ASCC.
Lotus:
Yep your right just is not a Honda (plus it has a Toyota engine and I am not a big Toyota fan!)
This could be a nice slogan.
RATER PUSH MY NSX THAN DRIVE A ASCC.
But that's a big step for me to say!
It does count for the new Lexus or the R8
I might be the only one.... started when I was 13 years old
-First Love - Lambo Countash
Learned about exotic cars when I found a 12 page color spread in Playboy of all places (LAMBO, FERRARI, and LOTUS)
-Second Love - Lotus Esprit from James bond movies
-Third Love - 308 and TR from Magnum and Miami Vice
-NSX came along and made the exotic dream into a driveable affordable car -4th love.
So... I am an exotic fan! Have been for 30 years. Love the cars because they look like nothing else on the road! Love the engine behind my seat! Love the feeling of driving a twisty road ( don't care how fast car is in a straight line, or how comfortable, or how much luggage it fits in the trunk )
The reason the ASCC doesn't do anything for me (no matter how it preforms) is that it doesn't stand-out in a crowd! The 1st rule of Exotics is- they look low, wide and sleek. Driving is something special and something differnt from my everday use of automobiles.
Not a poser. I like the wild look of the exotic because it pleases my eye.
This is why I love F1, Cart, Indy Car, IRL all over NASCAR.
The cars look neat and I love the high tech that goes into putting the engine in the back.
I spend too much of my life on the road looking at millions of boring everyday drivers. They all have the engine in front, and it gives the car a tall long front end, which makes it look more like a SUV or Town Car than a Diablo or 512TR
That's why Honda will die in my dreams and I will have to drag my butt over to Lotus if their next Esprit is a sexy wedge shaped exotic that celebrates all the GREATNESS that was the EXOTIC Car industry at its highest piont of crazy looking cars 1975-1995 (before the baby-boomers got fat, rich, and old. And companies like Ferrari and Honda started chasing them with bloated GT cars...that are easy to drive, and enter and exit, with a bad hip or knee and a extra 50 pounds)
Everyone loves their posters from their boy-hood days. People love the wild Diablo, Esprit, Ferrari Testarossa.... but no one is building a modern version. Lambo Gallardo is closest thing out there but just a tad expensive for me to daily drive. I was counting on Honda.
Exotics use to be 100% BadAss cars..... now all the big players are stepping on their own balls in such a rush for the door to build Super Exotic Cars that blend in.
Whats wrong with the world?
Exotics use to look like they could go 300mph (even if they could only do 150mph)
Now Exotics look like the can only do 130mph (even if they can go 250mph) Not as much fun
-First Love - Lambo Countash
Learned about exotic cars when I found a 12 page color spread in Playboy of all places (LAMBO, FERRARI, and LOTUS)
-Second Love - Lotus Esprit from James bond movies
-Third Love - 308 and TR from Magnum and Miami Vice
-NSX came along and made the exotic dream into a driveable affordable car -4th love.
So... I am an exotic fan! Have been for 30 years. Love the cars because they look like nothing else on the road! Love the engine behind my seat! Love the feeling of driving a twisty road ( don't care how fast car is in a straight line, or how comfortable, or how much luggage it fits in the trunk )
The reason the ASCC doesn't do anything for me (no matter how it preforms) is that it doesn't stand-out in a crowd! The 1st rule of Exotics is- they look low, wide and sleek. Driving is something special and something differnt from my everday use of automobiles.
Not a poser. I like the wild look of the exotic because it pleases my eye.
This is why I love F1, Cart, Indy Car, IRL all over NASCAR.
The cars look neat and I love the high tech that goes into putting the engine in the back.
I spend too much of my life on the road looking at millions of boring everyday drivers. They all have the engine in front, and it gives the car a tall long front end, which makes it look more like a SUV or Town Car than a Diablo or 512TR
That's why Honda will die in my dreams and I will have to drag my butt over to Lotus if their next Esprit is a sexy wedge shaped exotic that celebrates all the GREATNESS that was the EXOTIC Car industry at its highest piont of crazy looking cars 1975-1995 (before the baby-boomers got fat, rich, and old. And companies like Ferrari and Honda started chasing them with bloated GT cars...that are easy to drive, and enter and exit, with a bad hip or knee and a extra 50 pounds)
Everyone loves their posters from their boy-hood days. People love the wild Diablo, Esprit, Ferrari Testarossa.... but no one is building a modern version. Lambo Gallardo is closest thing out there but just a tad expensive for me to daily drive. I was counting on Honda.
Exotics use to be 100% BadAss cars..... now all the big players are stepping on their own balls in such a rush for the door to build Super Exotic Cars that blend in.
Whats wrong with the world?
Exotics use to look like they could go 300mph (even if they could only do 150mph)
Now Exotics look like the can only do 130mph (even if they can go 250mph) Not as much fun
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Nice post Nick!
I actually believe that it will perform and have great performance numbers. I was never a Honda fan. I never cared much for the looks of the NA1 NSX and didn't think the S2000 looked like anything special when it first came out. Of course now I'm on my third S2000 which I just love to look at and I have an NSX that's always on my mind. I know it will be the same for me with the ASC.
I'm not surprised at how much negativity the ASC is drawing as the NSX draws the same negativity from alot of owners on this board. It's amazing how many NSX owners on this board get attacked when they say think their NSX is still equal to current cars. Oh did I mention thses attacks generally come from other NSX owners
So I fully expect to get crap once I get my ASC even if it hangs with or beats it's more expensive competition
I actually believe that it will perform and have great performance numbers. I was never a Honda fan. I never cared much for the looks of the NA1 NSX and didn't think the S2000 looked like anything special when it first came out. Of course now I'm on my third S2000 which I just love to look at and I have an NSX that's always on my mind. I know it will be the same for me with the ASC.
I'm not surprised at how much negativity the ASC is drawing as the NSX draws the same negativity from alot of owners on this board. It's amazing how many NSX owners on this board get attacked when they say think their NSX is still equal to current cars. Oh did I mention thses attacks generally come from other NSX owners
So I fully expect to get crap once I get my ASC even if it hangs with or beats it's more expensive competition
I have little doubt the AASCC will be one heck of a performance machine. Performance is not everything too me though. There are a lot of great performance cars out today that I never dreamed of owning. I woudn't mind owning a lot of them for sure, but its not cars I dream about. The NSX was a car I dreamed about owning like the Ferrari's and Lamborghini's. Worked hard and saved money for 10+ years to achieve that goal. The AASCC is not really a car I'm dreaming about.
However, the price of the AASCC could very well change my mind. As an owner of 3 Acura Legend Coupes, I always wanted Acura to come out with another flagship coupe. If this AASCC can be that flagship coupe at a good price and not really the Astin Martin competition people are talking about I'd be all over it. Unfortunately I'm thinking of a sub $70K coupe which I highly doubt this car will be anywhere near that cheap.
However, the price of the AASCC could very well change my mind. As an owner of 3 Acura Legend Coupes, I always wanted Acura to come out with another flagship coupe. If this AASCC can be that flagship coupe at a good price and not really the Astin Martin competition people are talking about I'd be all over it. Unfortunately I'm thinking of a sub $70K coupe which I highly doubt this car will be anywhere near that cheap.
Nice post Nick!
I actually believe that it will perform and have great performance numbers. I was never a Honda fan. I never cared much for the looks of the NA1 NSX and didn't think the S2000 looked like anything special when it first came out. Of course now I'm on my third S2000 which I just love to look at and I have an NSX that's always on my mind. I know it will be the same for me with the ASC.
I'm not surprised at how much negativity the ASC is drawing as the NSX draws the same negativity from alot of owners on this board. It's amazing how many NSX owners on this board get attacked when they say think their NSX is still equal to current cars. Oh did I mention thses attacks generally come from other NSX owners
I partially agree with where you're coming from. I think the real problem is that the ASC and the NSX shouldn't be compared at all. I think the ASC is fully capable of becoming a great, great car. But Honda is the one who chose to compare the NSX to the ASC, thereby alienating current NSX lovers and jading them against the ASC.
Really, when I post about how much I dislike the ASC I'm really thinking about the HSC and what it could have been with a V-10. So in a way I'm being unrealistic as well. But I think us NSX owners are really just finally realizing how great the HSC could have been...it's like you meet the woman of your dreams, go out on a date or two and she dies in a car accident before you can ask her to marry you...you'll think about how great it could have been forever.
But I wouldn't be surprised about all the negativity since it was Honda's call to link it inextricably with the NSX...
That's what steams my bean. This is clearly no HSC...and clearly no NSX. It's not exotic at all in my mind...the NSX was undeniably exotic.
I partially agree with where you're coming from. I think the real problem is that the ASC and the NSX shouldn't be compared at all. I think the ASC is fully capable of becoming a great, great car. But Honda is the one who chose to compare the NSX to the ASC, thereby alienating current NSX lovers and jading them against the ASC.
Really, when I post about how much I dislike the ASC I'm really thinking about the HSC and what it could have been with a V-10. So in a way I'm being unrealistic as well. But I think us NSX owners are really just finally realizing how great the HSC could have been...it's like you meet the woman of your dreams, go out on a date or two and she dies in a car accident before you can ask her to marry you...you'll think about how great it could have been forever.
But I wouldn't be surprised about all the negativity since it was Honda's call to link it inextricably with the NSX...
Dude what a depressing story..LoL
Might be me ,but when I think sucessor and then they tell me it will be FR V10. My mind says "oh it replaces/succeeds the NSX as Acura/Honda's top of the line sporstcar" Honda is saying "Hey we gave you the NSX now we're giving you another performance car" I can't understand why other NSX owners don't get that
It can't be a real replacement as the NSX was cancelled. I loved the HSC as well ,but when Honda talked about building that everybody b1tched that it wouldn't compare to the Ferrari/Porsches because it didn't have enough hp. So Honda killed it and now people keep bringing it up ,but it's dead and they aren't going to make it! why make yourselves miserable over it????If you wish to praise the R8/Lotus or whatever go to their boards and do it! ,but why diss the ASC? it's not even finished yet for cripes sake! Jeez!
Because Honda is listening :biggrin: They killed the HSC because people trashed it all over the web?
If we can make a big enough stink.... we might be able to get Honda to hear us again!
Concept cars are sent out to check for public interrest.
:tongue: :frown: :tongue: :frown:
Because Honda is listening :biggrin: They killed the HSC because people trashed it all over the web?
If we can make a big enough stink.... we might be able to get Honda to hear us again!
Concept cars are sent out to check for public interrest.
You honestly think Honda cancelled a car because it was trashed on the web? come on man. Honda hears dollars if they were on this site they would've heard the majority of people hear say they couldn't wait to buy one used. Used cars are not an incentive!
NSXprime is linked to and quoted by other cars sites. I've even seen the major Automotive Press quote something from NSXprime.
The guys on FerrariChat and RennTeam are talking about- "even the guys at NSXprime aren't happy about this new car"
I'm hoping some lurkers, that don't post on Prime, but might like to write letters to the Car Mags, pick up on the negative buzz going around here, and we get some snow-ball effect that way also.
It was a general feeling at the auto shows, and the car magazines, and the web, that killed the HSC because 300 HP was wrong!
I would guess, all that empty space around the Acura display at the Detroit Auto show combined with the fact that Acura didn't win Crowd Favorite or any other awards... will all ads up when Honda has to pull the triger for real (this showcar was just a model)
Plus...I'm sure that young college guy that designed the New Acura came over here to take a peek...and see what the old owners are saying.
Wouldn't you?
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I wholeheartedly agree. Honda can make the ASC a great car. But they very much alienated the NSX community by linking the ASC with the NSX. Even I, a genuine liker of the ASC, was disappointed by the ASC as a "successor." By all means, make the ASC great - it can stand on it's own. But don't conjure up thoughts of a new NSX and then destroy it with a front engined GT.
It's akin to Porsche promoting a new 911 and then showing the 928. One is not the other.
That all said, bring on the ASC! <- provided it's 500hp +, paddle shifted, big braked, and weighing less than 3300lbs.
You can rest assured that the new car will perform. SH-AWD with a super suspension and great tires will out handle the F430. You may not like the way it looks but get ready for a great car, looking back at what the President of Honda stated months ago. He said, a Ferrari beater, and as ground breaking now as the NSX was in 1991.
Well Prime is the largest NSX fan website ,but I truly hope no one from Honda pays any attention to us as we get pretty rowdy and some responses to the ASCC have been uncalled for! Also NSXprime guys truly don't care what FerrariChat guys say!
Funny if that's the case Porsche wasn't listening because nobody complains about the Cayman S power and price and the HSC would've outperformed that car , plus it would've been cheaper as Honda planned to use regular manufacturing not have that one hand built.
I would guess, all that empty space around the Acura display at the Detroit Auto show combined with the fact that Acura didn't win Crowd Favorite or any other awards... will all ads up when Honda has to pull the triger for real (this showcar was just a model)
Plus...I'm sure that young college guy that designed the New Acura came over here to take a peek...and see what the old owners are saying.
Well his friend posts on here we could ask him what's being said.
They may have alienated the NSX community, but it is so small.
I believe they are moving on with a car they can be proud of and still have decent sales compared to our beloved NSX.
Honda is the one saying that this is the replacement for the NSX. They're creating this bond. But this car has almost nothing in common with the NSX other than it's a sports car. I think that's what's bothering NSX owners.
Also, yes, the HSC caught hell but only because Honda was trying to actually suggest that they could beat the existing engine block to death and be content with 350HP!
Power can be changed but Honda's utter failure in R & D for the NSX resulted in them not having a better engine/tranny ready by 2003. Of course the HSC would have been a laughing stock at 350HP. It would have easily equaled Ferrari and Porsche with around 425HP. Honda could have even stuck with a V-6. A new 3.5-3.8L V-6 could easily have produced 425HP (110-120 HP/L). Or finally, they could have just used the existing C32 Type-R engine and used a CTSC. There's 400HP easily.
The fact that Honda killed the HSC for no reason other than it's procrastination in R & D and lack of HP is really frustrating. I don't think NSX owners want the HSC to be resurrected. I think it's time has passed. But I do think NSX owners want an exotic track-tuned car that's Formula One inspired. I don't think the ASC is that car. The ZO6, Vanquish, and 599 GTB aren't that car either but they are still great cars in their own ways. The ASC may be one of those cars. But it won't be like the F430, Gallardo, Elise, CGT or like the HSC would have been.
If their were enough NSX owners for Honda to care we wouldn't be having this conversation. I'm sure lack of possible sales is what killed the HSC ultimately I mean why produce another slow to none selling MR just to make a couple of people happy. Been there done that!
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I feel the ASCC is to compete with the like of BEnz SLR, Dodge Viper, Toyota Supra, Nissan GTR35.
We wont be disapointed and I think it will preform great.
I think they should make both cars, the ASCC and the HSC. But its all about the money.
We wont be disapointed and I think it will preform great.
I think they should make both cars, the ASCC and the HSC. But its all about the money.
The sales were slow because Honda didn't add HP over the years. American's love HP and the Japanese didn't listen....or understand. People love MR cars but
300hp in a new HSC or an old NSX isn't going to sell.
So now they are fixing the mid-engine problem by moving it to the front,
when the real problem all along was lack of HP in all of Honda's MR plans.
So one mistake(letting NSX die a long slow death) is followd by the next bad move....jumping into a over-saturated market of luxury GT's with superior heritage.
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Well the Hp debate is a lengthy one. 300ZX TT , Supra TT , RX7 , VR4 had plenty of hp and still went the way of the dodo before the hp wars heated up. I've never once heard anyone say the Supra wasn't fast or that it didn't have enough hp .but the NA2 NSX was still faster yet it doesn't get that same respect. Insufficient HP did not kill the NSX. It's the fact that it was a Honda priced near $90k. Noticed I said priced near $90K because it sure wasn't selling for that ask anyone that bought one new. There's actually a couple left out there for a lucky owner:biggrin:
Form a pure economics point of view you are right. Not everything in marketing has to be about immediate sales though. Sometimes creating a good buzz also plants the seeds for future sales. Why does Honda keep racing in Formula One and saying they will release the next NSX when they start winning in that event again? Why not just quit already? The spend what? $400 million each year in F1? What is more believable? Showing their F1 heritage followed by a Honda Civic with VTEC, or showing the same heritage followed my an NSX like car? I don't remember any car company building a "Halo" car to make money from that car. It generally is to open the eyes of people and shed light on what the car company can build and generate sales for their bread and butter cars.
True ,but the NSX gave a nice trickle down effect of technology for awhile and that was useable. They love to race is the reason and have been doing so for years. Heck Toyota races and when was the last time they had a sporstcar. Lexus doesn't have a halo sportscar and won't have one until 08 or 09 so it's not essential. Of course whatever the ASC evolves into it will spread whatever they decide to put in it down to other models.
The sin Honda/Acura committed on the NSX was not that they built such a nitch market car, but they neglected to upgrade it throughout the years. The poor sales numbers is not all the NSX's fault. It is the same like the Lexus SC400 that came out in 1992 and continued to 2000. The sales numbers dropped year after year and the barely sold in the last years. 14 years with only 2 or 3 major updates is just not enough to keep the public interested in any car.
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