Vendor processing suggestion to mitigate risk of customers getting... screwed

[Aiken Drum]

Well, I can't speak for any other buyers, or any other vendors, but if it's not forum policy to police the vendors, and if everyone thinks users need to take care of themselves, this is my solution for at least one vendor:

From now on, any thread that involves advertising from, or people considering purchasing from, Dali Racing, will receive a PSA from me on the possible dangers of doing so.

If we have to do the policing ourselves, this seems like a good start.

 

[Ponyboy]

I can't agree with RSO more, the sole responsibility lies with each of us.

x3. The buyer must consider and make their own decision on whether to do business with any other member here. That said, if you get taken advantage of, scammed, or stolen from, I recommend you list the facts to the community honestly and in the most respectful manner possible. As long as it doesn't become a lynch mob mentality or unreasonable, self-policing seems a viable option.

Out of the multitude of transactions that I've been a part of here, I've only had two that were negative. I wouldn't let that color, entirely, my view of the community or my trust in the commroderie on Prime. There are awesome awesome people here. That said, protect yourself at all times.

 

[ANYTIME]

I don't like the idea of getting a website owner involved into peoples personal business transactions. Proceed with caution, just like you would normally do.
This is a hobby and in no way should it be anything more (managing the site is already quite time consuming I'm sure).

 

[NSX Prime]

For my personal policy, if I deal with anyone overseas.... this is what I will demand, no exception.

You have just found the solution to your own dilemma IMO. Everyone else needs to do whatever makes them comfortable before sending money to any vendor (or private seller!). I am not going to get into the business of trying to "verify" vendors... Sorry if that does not suit anyone.

What I will do is post a link to a more detailed "How to check vendor reputations and protect yourself in a transaction" type write-up if someone here will create it. It was discussed before but nothing ever came of it. If one of the people who cares so passionately about this issue wants to do something constructive, pick up the ball and run with it: http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89286

From now on, any thread that involves advertising from, or people considering purchasing from, Dali Racing, will receive a PSA from me on the possible dangers of doing so.

No.. vendor disputes will remain in the designated forum. There are two people suspended from this site right now for continuing to disregard that rule (though it had nothing to do with the vendors in question in this thread).

 

[Ponyboy]

What I will do is post a link to a more detailed "How to check vendor reputations and protect yourself in a transaction" type write-up if someone here will create it. It was discussed before but nothing ever came of it. If one of the people who cares so passionately about this issue wants to do something constructive, pick up the ball and run with it: http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89286

That document does, indeed, exist somewhere in my hard drive. However, it simply looks very similar to what is already listed here and here.. So much so, that it makes the document I created virtually unnecessary and redundant.

I can submit it but not sure what good it'll do since the present guidelines are fairly comprehensive. Just let me know...

 

[Aiken Drum]

No.. vendor disputes will remain in the designated forum. There are two people suspended from this site right now for continuing to disregard that rule (though it had nothing to do with the vendors in question in this thread).

It's not a vendor dispute. My vendor dispute IS in the disputes section. I'm posting vendor cautions elsewhere. Why can he advertise freely after screwing multiple people over, and I can't warn people who are considering his current advertisement?

That's ridiculous. You're protecting the offender and squelching the victim. It's one thing to to allow the vendor freedom to advertise, but if one can speak, the other ought to be able to as well, and in the same place as the advertisement so potential buyers will see it.

 

[Aiken Drum]

Actually, let me soften that. I'm pretty pissed off about Dali and the fact that Mark's able to screw people over and over.

However, I'm aware that you run this site mostly gratis and I'm grateful for that. I don't mean to alienate you. I'm just pissed off that this guy keeps getting the benefit of the doubt over and over, and he abuses it over and over.

 

[RSO 34]

Actually, let me soften that. I'm pretty pissed off about Dali and the fact that Mark's able to screw people over and over.

You are not alone in that "club". Normally in disputes both sides post their versions and it is up to the rest of the community to make up their minds as to the credibility of the respective parties involved. However, in light of the fact that Dali/Mark Johnson simply refuses to even acknowledge there is a dispute let alone give his "defense" I have always felt he should be suspended until such time as he expresses a willingness to respond publicly to the public allegations. Even Tamoske at least periodically posts another "story" as to why he has not shipped the orders but Dali/Mark Johnson just ignores the complaints and continues to reap the benefits of being able to dupe the next flock of sheeple.

 

[NSX Prime]

Actually, let me soften that. I'm pretty pissed off about Dali and the fact that Mark's able to screw people over and over.

However, I'm aware that you run this site mostly gratis and I'm grateful for that. I don't mean to alienate you. I'm just pissed off that this guy keeps getting the benefit of the doubt over and over, and he abuses it over and over.

I understand that you are upset. And you are entitled to your opinion and you can condemn me if it makes you feel better. However, I am simply not going to run a site where any/every person who has a dispute with a vendor (or another user) can continually to spam their dispute in every thread from that person ad infinitum.

 

[Coz]

Maybe it would make some feel better Lud if you exeicute Mark Johnson and burn down his business.

Fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, shame on me...

get over it and move on. I've had to with other vendors. Everyone else can too.

 

[nsxotic911]

You have just found the solution to your own dilemma IMO. Everyone else needs to do whatever makes them comfortable before sending money to any vendor (or private seller!). I am not going to get into the business of trying to "verify" vendors... Sorry if that does not suit anyone.

Thanks for responding Lud!

I understand the desire not to be the police for the forum. I can respect that. I agree with you that this solution may "work" but it is limited in effectiveness if it does not become the standard policy, or is mentioned to the vendor by an member with authority (such as yourself) outright.


If I say "I want your super duper part, but I will only do COD since you are from Russia.." and the other 9 members of the GB are willing to risk it, the vendor can very easily just say "sorry, too bad...."

However, if you let international vendors know that they either must do this, or get a big RED posting of "International Vendor unwilling to do COD, proceed at your own risk!!" it is much more effective and motivating for the vendor.

If I do that, I'll just be called a hater or troll..

I understand that it's an extra step that would get you involved in a general market transaction process where you've historically, for a number of valid reasons, have not. However, the # of international vendors are limited and I think the tax would be minimal.. and this step would be extremely valuable.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[RSO 34]

If I say "I want your super duper part, but I will only do COD since you are from Russia.." and the other 9 members of the GB are willing to risk it, the vendor can very easily just say "sorry, too bad...."

I still think the solution is that if you don't want to risk your money under the terms of a group buy, then don't join in. If the other 9 lemmings want to risk their money, that is their prerogative as it is the prerogative of other members to say "I told you so". It is simply a case of a risk/benefit anaylsis that needs to be performed by EVERYONE anytime someone makes a decision whether to enter into a transaction. How much is the individual willing to lose on a deal with the understanding that he is on his own if the deal falls through.

 

[NSX-Files]

Or how about this option - Lud can just shut down the vendors forums, the "for sale" forums, ah heck, close down the entire site? Look, Lud is doing all of the members of this site a HUGE favor by providing a method of communication and a wealth of information. Why are we even considering burdening him with more responsibility than he has already undertaken on his own?

Maybe it's just time for us to grow up and quit relying on the authority figure to protect us from the big bad world. Isn't that one of the major problems with society and its governments? Too many people want to be coddled and spoon-fed.

I say do your own research, make intelligent decisions, and learn from the mistakes as you go. You'll be better off in the end.

 

[Coz]

Well said !

 

[LJSB]

I am simply not going to run a site where any/every person who has a dispute with a vendor (or another user) can continually to spam their dispute in every thread from that person ad infinitum.

.

I have a idea. Lud sells Dali spam tickets. For every $10.00 you pay you get to post (1) time in a vendor thread started by Dali.

(6) for $50.00:biggrin:

 

[Aiken Drum]

Put me down for a dozen.

No, really. If I can post a caution to Dali's next year's worth of monthly-special ads, I'm in for the hundred bucks.

Prime gets a few bucks to run the site for another twenty minutes or so, and I get to warn people about Mark. Seems like a good deal to me.

 

[NSX-Files]

.

I have a idea. Lud sells Dali spam tickets. For every $10.00 you pay you get to post (1) time in a vendor thread started by Dali.

(6) for $50.00:biggrin:

Like Carbon Credits.

 

[heySkippy]

My opinion is anyone getting screwed by the vendor most in question in this thread deserves it considering the vast number of negative experiences and cautionary tales already posted about him.

As for the OP, I think that's a terrible idea. There's no way this site should dictate terms to vendors. If you want to insist on COD as a customer, go ahead and good luck with that.

 

[NSX Prime]

Hope that makes sense.

It makes sense. And I have to disagree with some of the other posters in that I certainly don't think it's a terrible idea or that anyone deserves to get burned. But, at least right now, I am not going to get involved at that level.

What I would suggest for now is to clearly outline in the type of document I mentioned previously some additional precautions people might want to consider when dealing with international transactions.