To Eibach or not to Eibach?

Viper Driver

Viper Driver

Experienced Member
Joined
22 May 2002
Messages
1,310
Location
Tucson, AZ, USA
Howdy all-

I'm in a bit of a dilemma, and I'm hoping that I can squeeze some advice out of a few of you with regards to a mod that I may be doing to my '91 NSX. First, a little background on me and my car.....

I am currently running aftermarket 17/18" wheels on my NSX, and I really like the look that the lowered cars have. However, one tradeoff for me is that I am already near my limits for scraping the front end on the little lip at the end of my driveway. So, when I first purchased my NSX a few months ago and I had money to throw away, I opted to order a set of Eibach springs for my car because I heard they still offer the progressive spring rate and they lower the car the least of all the lowering springs out there. I didn't lower the car because it hasn't been convenient for me since then to have it done.

Now, on to the present day. Due to a short-term deployment for some work-related training, I am headed to Phoenix next week and I'm driving my car down there for some minor service work at Basch. I'm toying with the idea of having Mark & co. swap out the stocks for the Eibachs, but I'm now wondering if that's the best thing for me.

I don't track my car yet, but I am planning on running it in some Auto-X events next year. In the future beyond that, I would like to take it to a few time trials and get some track experience. I'm a complete novice, though, and I'm betting that my car sees an actual track no more than a handful of times. In addition, my car will see the road a heck of a lot more than it will ever see a competitive driving event.

On the side of the Eibachs as well, I'm not interested in a system that's going to beat the hell out of me every time I drive my car. Also, the fact that the car is lowered should make it handle better, anyway.....right?

So, with the discussion of lowering springs contributing to shorter shock life combined with the idea that I might be better off by getting something more performance-oriented, I'm now reconsidering my idea of having this done. The bad news is that with the Eibachs, I'm going to have to sh*t or get off the pot since I have a rare opportunity to have it done in the best NSX shop in the country next week. I don't have the money (maybe through credit card) to buy a different set up, but there may not be anything in Phoenix in stock to replace the Eibachs with, anyway.

So, in short, I like the lowered look. However, I'm not sure if the Eibachs are right for me.

Any opinions or advice out there? It would be greatly appreciated, especially from folks who currently run a lowered setup. Also, is there any advice on getting a newly lowered car in and out of a driveway and other places that were difficult before the car was lowered?

I'm going to ask Mark for his advice on this, too, and hopefully I'll have a decision that I'm happy with.

Thanks to all who can help out.

Chuck

------------------
'91 Black/Ivory NSX
'89 Gray/Gray F-16C
 
I wouldn't have a mod done by a distant mechanic if I thought there was a good chance I might want to reverse it when I got home and tried it on my driveway. This is no slight against Mark Basch, only an observation that you might be doing something that you'll want undone, and IF you want to do that kind of mod, you'd be better off finding someone local to do it.

It's also worth noting that the labor on each iteration of install/reinstall is not trivial.

If you are unhappy because you are already scraping the chin spoiler, it's only going to get worse if the car is lowered more.

And, it's also worth noting that you can probably sell the Eibachs as new for close to what you paid for them, whereas if you install them on your car, their resale value is going to go down.

My advice is this. If you think you're likely to want to keep the Eibachs and live with more severe chin spoiler scraping, then have Mark put them on. If you think there's a good chance you're going to regret that decision, then sell them - or, if you insist on trying them out, have them installed by someone local to you.

Since you mentioned the possibility of track events in the future, it's also worth noting that there's a huge all-NSX track event coming up in a couple of weeks, which is the perfect venue for novice NSX owners to drive on a racetrack with instruction from experienced instructors, most of whom drive NSXs also. It's not too late to sign up for NSXPO 2002, which is the most fun you can have with your NSX. And you're lucky because this year it's closer to your home than it's likely to be for the next few years. For more information click here.

[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 25 October 2002).]
 
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
If you are unhappy because you are already scraping the chin spoiler, it's only going to get worse if the car is lowered more.
Click to expand...

I should have mentioned that it's not actually scraping every time that I pull into my driveway.....it scrapes when I'm backing straight out sometimes when I'm not careful. I will note, however, that there's not a whole lot of space even when I am careful. I suppose that we can remove the "chin spoiler scraping" from the record. No matter what decision I make on suspension, the car will probably end up lower than before. One of the reasons I picked the Eibachs in the beginning was the fact that it lowers the car the least of the aftermarket spring choices. I'm not looking for a lowrider....a more agressive stance is what I'm after.

And, it's also worth noting that you can probably sell the Eibachs as new for close to what you paid for them, whereas if you install them on your car, their resale value is going to go down.
Click to expand...


I hadn't thought of that, but I guess that does make another type of suspension $250.00 more affordable!

If you think there's a good chance you're going to regret that decision, then sell them - or, if you insist on trying them out, have them installed by someone local to you.
Click to expand...

That's why I'm looking for advice here. Scraping on my driveway aside, what is the better setup for me?

(1) Eibachs now....less potential performance than something like a TEIN setup and possible trouble finding someone to install it and set it up correctly.

(2) TEIN setup or similar later......more cost, too harsh of a ride, and potential overkill for what I'm using my NSX for.

I'm looking for the great folks here to help me separate the wheat from the chaff and help me make up my mind. I've read some of the other threads here on this forum already pertaining to the Eibachs, but I really can't seem to come to a decision.

We have a great NSX Tech here in Albuquerque. However, I'm not sure of his experience with aftermarket stuff, particularly suspension. I wouldn't know who to take it to here besides him no matter what type of suspension I decide on (except the Zanardi.)

It's not too late to sign up for NSXPO 2002, which is the most fun you can have with your NSX. And you're lucky because this year it's closer to your home than it's likely to be for the next few years.
Click to expand...

I know.
frown.gif
I wish that I could go, but money and work are keeping that from happening. When I first bought my car, I told myself that I was going. Unfortunately, reality set in last month when November's schedule filled up for me at work.

Anyway, NSXtasy, thanks for the advice. It is much appreciated!

Chuck


------------------
'91 Black/Ivory NSX
'89 Gray/Gray F-16C
 
Chuck,
When I bought my 91 I was dead set on doing nothing to it toyed about the same thing to lower or not to lower. I did one track event bone stock which was a blast and then I got a ride in a 91 on the track with all the goodies it was night and day.

So I decided to go with Eibachs and Konis first then the 17-18 combo I was really surprised at how nice the ride is. I expected a harsh ride but it really is not that bad at all yes you might scrap a driveway or two but hey buy a new lip every year at $90 no biggie.


Just a reminder once you start modding it's hard to stop but your car will look so much better so just do it
wink.gif


Steven 91 Blk/Ivory
 
Don't get the springs, it's a waste of money. I've done enough of them in different cars to learn the hard way. The only thing you will get is a cooler look, other than that, get ready for a harsh ride, scraping everywhere, uneven tread wear pattern on your tires, just uncomfortable all around without a major improvement in handling. I think it does nothing for handling but many people would disagree with me. I've only raced Mustangs in the 60s in South America so what do I know.

Leave your stock springs unmolested, they will give you the best compromise of ride and handling. Just my 2¢ of course, everyone is welcome to disagree.
 
I think differences in shocks make a bigger difference in handling than differences in springs. Springs may reduce body roll more, but shocks will affect the overall handling more.

I also think that there's a far greater difference between new OEM shocks and old worn OEM shocks, than there is between new OEM shocks and new aftermarket shocks.

All just my O. Conclude what you will from it.
 
Yes, I agree with nsxtasy. There's a night and day difference between old worn oem shocks and new oem shocks. For me, the ride quality is almost the same between eibach + bilsteins and eibach + new oem shocks.
 
I have Eibach + OEM. OEM with 16 K miles when first installed. Now, 21 K miles. Ride is very good, drove from MI to TX in 2 days with no pain, almost the same as stock. Handles much better. Looks MUCH better, (17/18). Very important, 4 wheel alignment ASAP after changing the springs.

Just Do It.

Tim
 
Originally posted by jorligan:
I have Eibach + OEM. OEM with 16 K miles when first installed. Now, 21 K miles. Ride is very good, drove from MI to TX in 2 days with no pain, almost the same as stock. Handles much better. Looks MUCH better, (17/18). Very important, 4 wheel alignment ASAP after changing the springs.

Just Do It.

Tim
Click to expand...
 
Viper Driver (that's the best handle you could come up with for an NSX list?):

I too have a 91' with Eibachs. I do a handful of track events a year but primarily (but not often) drive the car on local roads. I also have a steep driveway.

The trick to minimizing scraping is the angle of attack. I back out of my driveway almost sideways which sems to work for me. I'm sure the neighbors think I'm nuts (as if they need another reason).

As far as the harsh ride, as Miled would say, fugetaboutit. If you're really worried about a harsh street ride, replace your 11 year old shocks.

Finally, the best and main reason for going with the Eibachs is "the look". It's all about "the look". Just do it.

Dave (my real name)
NSXCA Member #38
 
If you like the look, do it, but don't even count handling improvements in the equation at this time. The minor change in roll center is insignificant and if anything the progressive rate is a negative because it starts out very soft (for street civility). If someone turns significantly better times by changing just the springs to Eibachs it is probably because the resulting balance is better suited to that driver, not because the potential of the car has risen. As a novice, the last thing you need to worry about is that last fraction of 1% from suspension tuning.

So, if you like the look then go for it since you already have the springs and an appointment with MB. There's plenty of time for trick setups after you learn to drive an already superb car.
 
The NSX obsession, runs real deep would you agree? Everything from the finest car care products to the best maintenance money can buy and in some cases heated garages. All these things seem crazy to other people, but not to the person with the obsession. The dilemma of trying not to scrub your lowered vehicle on your driveway, seems to be the problem of many… Rather that trying to make your car fit that drive way, why not make your driveway fit your car? Repave the driveway with a different included angle. Walla!! No more scrubbing, it will be money well spent for the “NSX Obsession”! But what do I know, I don’t have my NSX yet and I hope my driveway won’t be a problem. Just food for thought… By the way, who here has revamped their driveway to better accommodate your NSX?
 
I've had eibachs and bilsteins before but was not too happy because of the excessive negative camber and the rubbing of my TE37s. This was on my '95 NSX.

I have since upgraded to an '01 NSX and instead of using eibachs again, I used my bilsteins set on the lower perch coupled with OEM springs. The height is perfect. No rubbing, no excessive camber, handles well, and it looks good!

------------------
2001 NSX-T
- Bilstein Shocks
- '02 OEM Wheels
 
Originally posted by DaveG:
Viper Driver (that's the best handle you could come up with for an NSX list?)
Click to expand...

I've never driven a Dodge Viper before. My handle is work-related.....It's a nickname for what I "drive" at work (see below)

Just what I expected....lots of great feedback from you guys. I really appreciate everyone who's took the time to answer. As it stands right now, I'm loading up the Eibachs for the trip to Phoenix.

Adios!

Chuck


------------------
'91 Black/Ivory NSX
'89 Gray/Gray F-16C
 
please post your impressions of the Eibach's after you're done. thanks.
 
Viper Driver:

After talking to Mark Basch's sidekick, Nick, when he was in raleigh. He opted for the Bilstein's at the lower perch with OEM shocks on his personal NSX-T. This is the same setup as RyeRye210's. Maybe Mark will consider a trade for hte Eibach's since they are still new to go for the Bilstein's, which loweres the car .75-1" and leaves the alignment factory....

when I get extra petty cash, I plan on this set up with mine. also I have a steep driveway and manage to approach the driveway at angles like someone said prior.... Ask CHudson about my driveway-- he has eibachs and 17-18" setup and scraped going up at an angle.



------------------
Biaggi
92 Red NSX #483
94 CBR900RR
 
Chuck,
I also have 17/18 and eibach/oem shocks, I noticed that the ride is not that harsh, I agree with everyone that the look is more what you get out of the setup. If you want to go strictly performance it may not be the way to go, but from what you described 99% street and 1% track, I think you won't be disappointed. The setup lowered my car to around 24" front (ground to top of wheel well) and 26 rear. The ground to front lip is 4". your definately going to scrap more, if your scraping already. My car looks great, I'm pleased.

Paul
 
I have both the Tiatec coilovers (on the yellow "and" Eibachs on the red NSX's.
note...I LOVE them both.

Daily driving only or mostly IMO "Eibach"
(they are inexpensive and drop the car to where it should be "to me")and stiffen the car a bit but still plush to me.

Racer/driver Taitec coilovers (adjustable,precise but if I were in NY vs' AZ I dont think I would be as tolerant of the stiffness "even set on the softest".
They are not too uncomfitorable for "me" but I would imagine most might feel they are a little much for heavy 10-15k/year drivers.

Thats my .02 WWW.mynsx.COM
 
Hey just to help Viper Driver more, anybody around with same Eibach on a 91 NSX could give him a ride?

The best is to compare side by side...

My little suggestion...

By the way, I agree that this little NSX owner cummunity is great!

My respects everyNSXbody!
 
Thanks everybody for the replies! MYNSX, your side-by-side comparison is exactly what I was looking for.

As an update, I had the car in Basch's garage all week (and took up a lot of his time BTW....sorry to all you BBSC customers) and I took the plunge with the Eibachs. The bad news, of course, is my little incident with the porcupine on the way to Phoenix and my NSX needing some minor bodywork. I stopped in on Friday after the springs were installed. I didn't get to drive it, but the car definitely looks a lot better. Mark agreed with me, and said that aftermarket 17/18 or bigger look a lot better when the car is lowered.

I'll have a nice, long drive back to Albuquerque in a few weeks when my car is done.....I'll write my impressions and update you guys on how I get my car into the driveway when I get it back to Albuquerque. Thanks to insurance, I'll have a fresh new spolier to scrape!

Chuck


------------------
'91 Black/Ivory NSX
'89 Gray/Gray F-16C
 
I can definately see the improvement in looks. can someone comment additionally on the ride quality? it may be something i just have to drive to know, but additional descriptions of the difference would be helpful. i love the ride as is, and dont want to screw that up in order to look good.

hey chuck--hows the viper vapor life?? i always wanted to do what youre doing. very cool.

i had a group (multi-force mix) of pilots do motivational training at a national sales meeting a couple of years back. have you heard of these guys(and gals). most were still active at the time. we got to hear/see the whole 'bingo fuel' training clip. an excellent reallife example of multi-tasking and task saturation. felt a little sorry for whoever that pilot was. that must of made his file, huh.

thanks again.
 
Originally posted by JimK:
please post your impressions of the Eibach's after you're done. thanks.
Click to expand...

I just got home from Phoenix and Mark Basch's place Friday night. I drove the NSX home on the new Eibachs and I've had the car out on the road a few times since then.

My initial impressions of the Eibachs were from the exterior. I think my car looks the way an NSX should....it's low, but not too low. It's really sharp, and just that little bit of lowering makes the car look WAY more agressive. (I could post a few before/after pics, but I don't have an image host)

Now, driving it....I think the suspension is definitely stiffer, and I seem to feel the bumps a bit more. However, it isn't uncomfortable at all, and I still felt comfy after my 5-hour trip back from Phoenix (450 miles with two fuel stops.....you do the math.
smile.gif
)

As for handling, the car has less body roll and my seat-of-the-pants feeling is that the car will hold a little better in the corners. This is by no means scientific, though.

On to the ever-so-important discussion of keeping the NSX's driveability and that "feel" that made the car so attractive to me to begin with......I really haven't noticed an appreciable difference in the overall feel or how the car drives. If I had my car on a track every weekend, then I might notice some differences. However, the car is just as driveable and confidence-inspiring as it was before. The biggest difference is that now my butt is about one inch less off of the pavement than before, and the ground rush at speed in the car is much more incredible.

Now, getting the car home, I was relieved to find that I can get the car in and out of the driveway without scraping. However, it is really close now, and I'd probably be scraping a lot if I ever went on a grocery run!

Chuck

------------------
'91 Black/Ivory NSX
'89 Gray/Gray F-16C
 

Similar threads

Ron1999
Suspension Eibach Lowering springs - 2 Sets
Replies
2
Views
147
Ron1999
Ron1999
fatalblitz
WTB: Eibach or H&R Lowering Springs
Replies
2
Views
124
centerpunch
centerpunch
TANTO
COILOVERS
Replies
19
Views
685
RyanRA
RyanRA
1
Third NSX 30 years after my first!
Replies
6
Views
242
18000rpm
1
Ron1999
Wheels **SOLD** 18' / 19' Double staggered FastFC wheels with Continental ExtremeContact tires
Replies
0
Views
205
Ron1999
Ron1999
Back
Top