I just visited the Stoptech site and I am a little shocked to see their NSX 4 wheel kit is now $5190. The front is still $1895. I was hoping that they could make a rear big rotor kit to compliment the front big caliper kit.
Steve
Steve
Stoptech big brake kit
- Thread starter whiteNSXs
- Start date
there is still a chance a rear big rotor kit (using the stock caliper) will happen. i believe the increase in price on the four wheel kit is due to a very complicated bracket required to make the st-10 parking brake fit. i can confirm that tomorrow.
ok... here is the official word from StopTech.
the price has gone up to reflect the additional cost of an all-new custom NSX-specific rear caliper. the new design will allow for more wheel clearance as well as more room for their st-10 parking brake caliper.
it looks like i will have the fronts installed next week.
i'll be sure to post some pics as well as give my impressions.
-mike
the price has gone up to reflect the additional cost of an all-new custom NSX-specific rear caliper. the new design will allow for more wheel clearance as well as more room for their st-10 parking brake caliper.
it looks like i will have the fronts installed next week.
i'll be sure to post some pics as well as give my impressions.
-mike
Hi Mike,
Make sure you push them to also make the rear big rotor kit too. At close to $3300 for their current rear kit, they sure did deter a few buyers. I am sure they will sell like hot cake if they have a cheap rear kit.
Thanks,
Steve
Make sure you push them to also make the rear big rotor kit too. At close to $3300 for their current rear kit, they sure did deter a few buyers. I am sure they will sell like hot cake if they have a cheap rear kit.
Thanks,
Steve
Hey Mike,
Any update or pictures on the Stoptech BBK?
Steve
Any update or pictures on the Stoptech BBK?
Steve
my kit was installed on friday (fronts only.)
haven't really had a chance to get on it due to my moving and a wedding over the weekend.
i'll post my impressions as soon as i have had a chance to get the pads bedded.
haven't really had a chance to get on it due to my moving and a wedding over the weekend.
i'll post my impressions as soon as i have had a chance to get the pads bedded.
How about rear kit that SOS sells here? http://www.scienceofspeed.com/products/braking_performance_parts/NSX/ScienceofSpeed/AP_Racing/
would that screw up the brake balance if used with stoptech front I wonder.
would that screw up the brake balance if used with stoptech front I wonder.
Can someone please educate me on brake topic?
Brembo or Stoptech big brake setup look sweet.. Sadly, but $ 5,000+ is just way out of my league. That is a lot of lunch money i might add..
anyhow, my question is:
to the best of my knowledge, and from my sports bike experience: front brakes (and tires) would provide 85+ % of the braking power under DRY condition, perhaps even more if you have sticky tires on decent road surface.
I understand NSX is MR layout, but, does MR make that much difference though (in dry condition)? your front brake/tires are providing most of the braking power anyways right?..
In wet condition, rear brake might help to balance & stop your car.
Other than bragging right, and show off ticket. Do you really need all 4 wheel big brake combo? in dry condition that is.
-jjc.
Brembo or Stoptech big brake setup look sweet.. Sadly, but $ 5,000+ is just way out of my league. That is a lot of lunch money i might add..
anyhow, my question is:
to the best of my knowledge, and from my sports bike experience: front brakes (and tires) would provide 85+ % of the braking power under DRY condition, perhaps even more if you have sticky tires on decent road surface.
I understand NSX is MR layout, but, does MR make that much difference though (in dry condition)? your front brake/tires are providing most of the braking power anyways right?..
In wet condition, rear brake might help to balance & stop your car.
Other than bragging right, and show off ticket. Do you really need all 4 wheel big brake combo? in dry condition that is.
-jjc.
ak- you can use the sos rear kit but you need to notify stoptech when you place your order. they need to reconfigure the piston sizes to account for the increased rear braking power.
jjcnsx- you are correct... the front kit is really all you need. you should only consider the 4-wheel kit if (1) your nsx is a track car, or (2) you have more money than god and spending 5 grand on brakes puts a big smile on your face.
jjcnsx- you are correct... the front kit is really all you need. you should only consider the 4-wheel kit if (1) your nsx is a track car, or (2) you have more money than god and spending 5 grand on brakes puts a big smile on your face.
supergreen125 said:
Even for track, when dry, would rear big brake make any noticeable positive difference? would it help with lap time at all? If not porportion right, it might just lock out your rear tires and give you ackward brake right before entering corners..
but, i gotta say, that mini rear brake caliper does look good.. i know late model Rerrari has it too.. What the heck do those mini calipers do? can someone pls educate me?
-jjc.
are you talking about the extra mini caliper?
if so, that is the parking brake. most aftermarket or high performance calipers don't have a parking brake built into them.
if so, that is the parking brake. most aftermarket or high performance calipers don't have a parking brake built into them.
supergreen125 said:
yup, those minii calipers next to main calipers.. it look damn cool though, at first i thought it was some kinda of helper caliper,, like helper spring of TEIN suspension
-jjc.
If you get a front brake kit for the NSX, the rear is a must. Or you will be working hard to fight the car at the track. Even with my porsche big red up front and the SoS rear kit in the rear, I still have to go with more aggressive pads in the rear.
Andrie Hartanto said:
Andrie,
pls educate me, what do you mean what do you mean by working hard to fight the car? what would be the problem on track for just have front big brake?
is it because of NSX MR layout?
thanks
-jjc.
I unfortunately, have not tracked my car but I went with the bigger brake kit to compliment the larger wheels, lighten the overall unsprung weight of each heavier wheel system, guaranteed not to crack/warp rotors. My Rear Wilwood Big Brakes 13" Rotors are almost done.
Tan
Tan
JJCNSX said:
Front BBK's can be bought for the extremely low discounted clearance price of less than $1895.
JJCNSX said:
Wow, bikes have potentially 85% or more front bias? Wow!
JJCNSX said:
Yes, it does make a difference. The MR design allows the NSX to have more rear bias than a FR configuration.
JJCNSX said:
Rear brakes do balance and stop your car. Actually, too much rear bias and the rear is gonna snap around. Especially in wet conditions. Basically you want the fronts to lock up just before the rears do. This results in straight braking...longer distance straight braking but at least it's straight braking. Compare this to uncontrolled and spinning braking and well, you see my point?
JJCNSX said:
Absolutely not - do you need a 4 wheel kit. If the brake manufacturer has designed the kit appropriately then the kit will retain the stock brake balance. That means no rear caliper or bias valve. The Tech and FAQ section at www.stoptech.com is a great reference.
Big brakes don't produce shorter stopping distances necessarily but do provide better heat soak, many times better modulation, and lighter unsprung weight. My Stoptech calipers are almost 2x as big as the stock '91 calipers and weigh a full pound less. The 13" (actually 12.9") rotors are nearly as heavy as the stock versions as well.
With all due respect afforded to one who seems as track addicted, if not more, than I am, have you tried a bias valve to correct your apparent front bias? But that's the tricky part though...b/c if you're fighting the car (and I'm supposing that means keeping your elbow before your rear) that means that you have too much rear bias already. If you had too much front, you'd just be experiencing longer braking distances than optimal.
Hope this helps a bit.
Ponyboy said:
Shawn,
first I upgraded just the front brakes with my Porsche kit which uses 12.63" rotors and piston size of 36mm and 40mm. I had so much problem with the car on the track that the fronts constantly locking up even with the ABS. The ABS on the NSX is old and very slow to react. This in fact require me to brake a lot sooner than I was with stock brakes.
Then I tried to balance the rear by using more agressive pads to no avail.
I then installed Tilton lever type bias valve on the front and that creates whole new problem. The lever is so inconsitent to each other my car will pull to one side all the time.
I then changed the bias valve to knob type and it got better, but even with the bias all the way loose I still get too much front bias.
I installed the rear SoS kit, combined with the bias valve and can somehow get it almost there. However, because of the bias valve interfere with the ABS, it got bad everytime I got the ABS working. If I brake just right before the ABS, the car is ok. Once the ABS kicks in, I'm in trouble.
So, I yank the bias valve out and tried to do without. With slicks, it works great, cause there is more weight transfer. With R compound tires I still have to use more agressive pads to work ok.
Igor Lyustin (Lyke007) also installed just the front wilwood kit cause he thinks it will be ok. On the first event with the brakes, he experienced it first hand and now he is getting the rear upgrade.
Ponyboy said:
Obviously, too much rear bias in the wet is a dangerous condition, but wet conditions DO NOT exasperate rear bias results since the car is more evenly balanced when braking in the wet (longer stopping distance=less weight transfer) and therefore more weight is at the rear of the car; this is why racers adjust the bias towards the REAR when it rains.
In the dry high-traction conditions using slicks short stopping distances, these conditions require dialing in less rear bias.
Wonder why the motorcycles have so much front bias? Take a look at their stopping distances—not sure if the rear wheel even is on the ground sometimes!
Anyway, I think we’ve been focusing too much on brake balance issues with regard to these brake upgrades. If you’re concerned about braking at the track then just get the front kit and see how that works, lots of fast people out there have just the front kits. A front-only kit will be biased a little too much towards the front, which is safe and controllable and will still offer better stopping than the OEM setup…it’s also nice to have this margin of error so if your heel-toe technique isn’t honed in, then there is some margin for a botched shift. If you want to take it to the next level, then install a rear upgrade and biasing valve, but I’d wait to do this until you’ve got your car control skills fine-tuned because figuring out the right bias adjustment for the conditions/track/tires/driving style can be a hairy business and your heel-toe technique (engine braking effects rear bias, big time) better be consistent all day long.
There is very little to be gained at the track by adding the rear setup. According to Skip Barber’s book, late braking has the least impact on lap times when compared to driving the proper line and getting on the throttle early in the corners. In my experience as an instructor, drivers who brake really hard usually brake too much and therefore enter the corners way too slow so all their really doing is going slower while heating up their brakes while making me want to vomit in the passenger’s seat. If you want to be a good on the brakes, first learn how to enter corners at the max speed.
DanO
DanO,
Excellent stuff.
Thanks,
LarryB
Excellent stuff.
Thanks,
LarryB
DanO said:
Dano,
I agree with you on the late braking stuff. That is the most common mistake. As I progress, I found out I brake earlier and less.
It is hard to explain about the front brake only upgrade. What I felt was the front was locking up, the ABS is too intrusive, and the car end up hard to control because it upset the balance so much.
Erik Messley commented on my front brake bias problem as well, the last time he drove my car with same brake compound front to rear.
How about a Stoptech front kit with a Wilwood rear kit?
I like the price of $1895 for the front. But $3295 for the rear is a bit hard to swallow. I might end up getting the SoS rear big rotor.
Steve
I like the price of $1895 for the front. But $3295 for the rear is a bit hard to swallow. I might end up getting the SoS rear big rotor.
Steve
Dan O and Andrie's comments couldn't have come at a more opportune time as we prepare for NSXPO 2003 ......
And I agree 100% regarding the braking stuff ....... Excellent confirmation.
We have been teaching the need to brake before the braking zone markers just to allow finishing with all the braking and shifting and getting on the throttle before the turn in ........ it's a difficult habit to break as we all want to test how late we can brake and how well the new mods are working ............. not realizing that we are often either continuing to carry the braking at turn in or coasting into the turn in because we didn't transition in time ..... and both mean less traction and thus slower speeds at the track out .........
By the way, did you notice that the ALM cars were taking early apexes on most turns at Infineon Raceway .....
And I agree 100% regarding the braking stuff ....... Excellent confirmation.
We have been teaching the need to brake before the braking zone markers just to allow finishing with all the braking and shifting and getting on the throttle before the turn in ........ it's a difficult habit to break as we all want to test how late we can brake and how well the new mods are working ............. not realizing that we are often either continuing to carry the braking at turn in or coasting into the turn in because we didn't transition in time ..... and both mean less traction and thus slower speeds at the track out .........
By the way, did you notice that the ALM cars were taking early apexes on most turns at Infineon Raceway .....
What about trail-braking? Will that be disouraged practice for novice at NSXPO?
Btw, my trail-braking technique suck. need practice.
Andrie, what brake pads are you using? Front & Rear?
Btw, my trail-braking technique suck. need practice.
Andrie, what brake pads are you using? Front & Rear?
Hrant said:
Two different topics Ken. Andrie already had a big brake system and had some issues with it. I doubt Porsche had the NSX in mind when they designed a brake system for their cars.
Andrie, sounds like you've went thru all the options! Is the pad remedy what Erik recommended?
In any condition, if the rears lock up before the fronts, you've got a problem. I was meaning that most would rather spin on a dry track then a wet one. You're right, you can get away with more rear bias in wet conditions. And I can only speak second hand in saying that the amount varies in amount and from lap to lap depending on conditions.
