REM Metal Surface Finishing Service

[liftnot]

In addition to whats commonly available for treatment in California such as detox, drug, anger, alcohol, botox, ED, anti-aging, anti-wrinkle ....we have another treatment avail. for you its called REM.

Hung out w/ my Ex-Nissan buddy who is with Toyota NASCAR/Off-Road program, as we were chatting, he asked about my next upgrade on my NSX and I said Exedy twin carbon but I have to buy a new duel spline shaft because my gearbox is a 6-spd. etc.etc. I found out they use REM for their gears and I casually asked if I can use that service and much to my surprised...he obliged! He even showed me the whole process and I can tell the machine alone is quite expensive and the chemical is not cheap either. Not something a small shop would invest so this is the real thing.

The photos below are the BEFORE pic. and I will post AFTER treatment soon.
He also surprised me by saying if I have other gears that want treatment, he is happy to help.

To give you an idea, the cost per "complete" gear set treatment is around $450-500. Please don't ask for GB price as this is not one of those cases where low price is an option if you want to win.

Attached is a pdf of a short summary of what isotropic super finishing is about. Its a long article from Race Engine Technology. AFAIK, many top racing teams are using this method and its not just for racing. This process will give your gearbox some TLC with no other modifications needed.


Since I was on a roll, I pushed ahead asking about DLC(diamond like coating) and he said they send it to France and no more questions.

You can begin your own research by starting here.

http://www.remchem.com/

If you decided to do this treatment, you would need to pack and label/ID all your disassembled parts so its easier to keep track for them and for you as all gears look alike. A photo with numbers of parts included would not hurt either. This is to prevent any mix up and make life easier for all. Ship it to us and we'll make sure you meet all the requirements before we take it to them.

We are not comparing WPC vs REM here. If you want this type of treatment, you don't need to polish every teeth like Billy did on one of the MotorIQ articles about rebuilding a NSX gearbox with WPC treatment as this process will do it for you.

 

[Mac Attack]

Very cool technology and I was first exposed to it while previously working in the defense industry.

FYI - REM licenses their technology to others that might be able to turn your items around quicker/cheaper if you do a little research. Some don't want to be bothered with small jobs though.

I also DLC-coated engine components a few years ago. Well, only the floating piston wrist pins. That was due to more of a concern with galling the titanium rods than it was for friction reduction. I didn't send mine to France though - it was done in NASCAR country.

I figure all this stuff gives me a few thousand more miles before the next rebuild, but most importantly, will save me about 0.01 seconds on my daily commute.

Dave

 

[liftnot]

Its correct what you said. Its more fun making the car more efficient thru optimizing what we have and make small improvements. All the free, low $ mods on our NSXs are so done long ago and this is a special process that will make all the running gear last a little longer, a little quieter, a little cooler, a little less wear.

Would it lower your lap time? Probably hard to quantify but its the combination of small upgrades that can make a difference and this is not just for high speed stuff but longevity. The idea is the same as WPC which is also a proven process.

We're sure there are many shops can do this but we trust my source and they have it dialed-in AND know that they won't take short cuts and they don't mind small jobs.

Its gonna look like chrome when its all done minus the bearing surface and its impossible to tell if it was REM treated so honesty is important to us. Actually, they prefer cars like ours than say the mass ricer crowd. Only people who understand what it is and willing to put up the cash so its gonna be a very small number and that is fine. The typical cost vs benefits analysis is not linear in this case but curious mind wants to know and willing to pay.

Now we've opened a can of worms and may have to deal with gears with unseen micro cracks w/o magnaflux prior sending it to us and that is a slippery slope.

afaik, FXMD did DLC as well and it wore off. Not sure how long the coating suppose to last so it does matter who is doing it. Not saying your NASCAR source is not.

 

[stuntman]

REM finishing is nothing like WPC (which is a more fine but similar process to shot-peening). REM polishing is a must and all NASCAR teams have machines in house for their gears. The need isn't as necessary for higher quality gears like Honda and they will not round off the sharp stress rising edges of the gears like hand de-burring, but they do slightly help in that regard and its not a labor intensive process.

WPC recommends REM polishing most domestic gears before WPCing them, but its not as crucial for Honda gears. I wouldn't bother WPC a stock domestic gear and would put the $ into REM instead, which can pick up a handful of HP. For Honda gears ideally you'd do both REM & WPC but the REM isn't as necessary. Either way you'll probably see (minimal) gains bit gains none the less from either process on a Honda gear.

IMO the most important things are hand deburr 2nd & 3rd gear and REM/WPC everything (or just 2-3 & R&P)


0.02

 

[liftnot]

Not expecting much if any gains but curious if it can make shifting smoother with all the forks and gears and if not, so be it and it wouldn't hurt anything. WPC afterwards was mentioned but doubt we gonna go that far(well depends how fast Nick can move:biggrin. IMO, it can only make things a little better. Nick has seen enough WPC so this process is "new" to us. Doing it its the only way to find out. A little TLC to make the 6-spd last longer thats all. Besides, if it wasn't for the porky oem 6-spd clutch and the dual spline needed for a lite clutch, we probably won't go this far but the gearbox has to come apart anyway and its a sin to put it back stock right? We'll see if we can take some data how the 6-spd turns b 4 and after the treatment.

 

[Mac Attack]

...and this is not just for high speed stuff but longevity.

I agree. I'm all for strengthening the transmission but keeping the axles as the weak link.

 

[liftnot]

Then you know what to do. Crack is cheaper.

 

[Mac Attack]

Now we've opened a can of worms and may have to deal with gears with unseen micro cracks w/o magnaflux prior sending it to us and that is a slippery slope.

That's what disclaimers are for!

When my engine was apart, I did have my crank magnafluxed before it was deburred and balanced. Its going to be hard to tell with gears though. Maybe some other NDE tests would be cheaper and better, like dye penetrant.

- - - Updated - - -

afaik, FXMD did DLC as well and it wore off. Not sure how long the coating suppose to last so it does matter who is doing it. Not saying your NASCAR source is not.

Like any coating, the key is in surface preparation. Calico Coatings did mine and I'd like to think they know what they're doing (check out their coatings website), but only time will tell.

 

[Nero Tenebre]

Does this or WPC make the 5MT shift more smoothly? Like the way the 6MT cars feel-

 

[liftnot]

Short ans.:Yes in theory. WPC/REM or Both. You have the key word: "feel".... we're 99.5% certain this is costly to quantify but we're 99.5% certain this has no negative side effect. If we can tell the car is quieter db-wise, then we know its working...likely at all speeds.then we're :smile:

REM smooth out the peaks and valleys from machining. WPC coats the surfaces to fill the peaks and valleys. IMO to do either one is beneficial but doing both seem overkill unless we get paid to race with a large purse for taking 1st place then its a no brainer. REM won't wear over time, WPC coating? we're not sure but probably not much.

We gonna have the 6-spd apart so as might as well give the gears/CV/forks/sliders some love. Every little helps and they will all add up to make the car more efficient. We are stoked to have a reliable legit source to offer this love to Prime on Valentine's day:biggrin: Its a proven process FINALLY affordable after many years in action but there is ZERO hp gain so its not friendly for the "cost vs benefit analysis sensitive type". Those who believe Honda machining is top notch(not saying its not), then should move on to the next mod.

 

[greenberet]

WPC coats the surfaces to fill the peaks and valleys.

Just as a note: WPC say their process is not a coating but a shot peening with really small media. See here.

 

[liftnot]

Ok Thx. My bad. Memory is getting bad. Sucks being old.
All this is to reduce parasitic friction loss.

 

[liftnot]

REM'ed

this looks like the same finishing as all the gears/shafts/ring/pinion etc. we had at NPTI. they taped the bearing surfaces before treatment. Now we gotta save up mo $ for the clutch..its just never ends. <sigh></sigh>