Porsche owner interested in an NSX - some questions.

[RedWings]

Though you don't necessarily need a test drive,
try to hook up with a current owner in your region (there is a regional section here on Prime)
Go for a ride, perhaps a drive, see what you think
Its a very different driving experience from a 911 as others have noted
Quite simply, its an easy car to own and drive if you have a regularly maintained example
Its very likely that you will experience zero depreciation if you get one at a fair price
nice bonus, you rarely see another one

 

[stuntman]

To get you in the mood:

 

[xxaarraa]

Wow, didn't realize this thread had turned into a Porsche debate. Yes, 996s in particular have been known to have a few issues, but in general, Porsches are made with care, for a very discerning buyer. I'd buy one again, just the metal working alone is a work of art.

I'm still interested in owning an nsx. But let's be honest, it was a flawed car in many respects, and precisely the reason it sold in double digits its last few years and was killed off. Any 'exotic' that makes very little power that it's going to be constantly embarrassed by teenagers in accord v6s and forester/imprezas is a goofy car - no I am not comparing today's Accords with the 89 NSX. An Accord hybrid V6 or TL-S in 2005 made about the same power as the 2005 NSX. And Honda's belligerent stubbornness to not give their high end cars a proper v8 is fascinating. Quite the reason acura suffers greatly and may well go out of business. The whole "high revving v6s are better than lazy v8s" argument is bs, because Porsche, Ferrari, Audi and pretty much all good engineering companies have small, high revving, sophisticated v8s. A "lazy v8" is a domestic pick-up truck concept and doesn't really exist in the exotic car market anymore. The other thing people lose track of, is Honda's complete lack of pedigree in making a super car. They don't have 40 years of history making sportscars (Porsche) or even more years making exotics (other German and Italian brands). Which makes it all the more important that they should try harder (hint: V8 or V10).

Bottom line: EVERY car has its pluses and minuses. Thanks for all your thoughts. I hope to join the community one day.

 

[blue_myriddn]

Not buying it.

"it was a flawed car in many respects, and precisely the reason it sold in double digits its last few years and was killed off."

I agree it was flawed, but I disagree with your reasons and also its double digit sales (always stayed above 100 )

" Any 'exotic' that makes very little power that it's going to be constantly embarrassed by teenagers in accord v6s and forester/imprezas is a goofy car - no I am not comparing today's Accords with the 89 NSX. An Accord hybrid V6 or TL-S in 2005 made about the same power as the 2005 NSX."

Ah - the underpowered argument that comes up so often from people who haven't driven the car. "power" is a touchy thing in a sports car and it is about more than just comparing raw numbers. The NSX is certainly underpowered compared to vettes, ferraris, etc - but it has no issues against an Accord or TL-S despite having similar HP numbers. An interesting scenario is to plug an OBD2 reader in to your car and watch the live read out of HP curves while you are driving. In most instances you are using a remarkably small amount of the HP that a car has to offer.

"And Honda's belligerent stubbornness to not give their high end cars a proper v8 is fascinating."

About as fascinating as Porsche's belligerent stubbornness to keep the engine in the wrong place in the 911.

"Porsche, Ferrari, Audi and pretty much all good engineering companies "
I am sorry, did you just list Ferrari as a "good engineering" company while leaving Honda out? Seriously? You just did that. Wow...

Anyways, to get to the point, the V6 isn't the problem with the NSX. The problem occurred with the fall of the Japanese economy in the 1990s which left high expense projects like the NSX to die on the vine. It is hard for many Americans to truly appreciate the rise and fall of the Japanese economy during the late 80s and in to the 90s. When the NSX was in development, the sky was the limit as their banks financed corporations to grander and grander heights. There was a point in time when a tiny strip of land in central Tokyo was briefly worth more than the entire state of California. That of course all came crashing down after the NSX came in to the marketplace and by 2003 the Nikke stock average bottomed out at 80% of its previous value.

All of this translates to a GREAT car that came out in the late 80s, but was then ignored for the rest of its lifetime. While automotive technology marched on (Ferrari 355, 360), Honda had lost its momentum and funding for the NSX and left it to falter with trivial updates mostly due to marketing information that $$$ spent on the project were not worth the returns.

 

[xxaarraa]

Not buying it.

"it was a flawed car in many respects, and precisely the reason it sold in double digits its last few years and was killed off."

I agree it was flawed, but I disagree with your reasons and also its double digit sales (always stayed above 100 )

hmm yeah, even true blue blooded exotics that cost 5-6 times as much as the NSX sold more than 100 a year. Like it or not, sales numbers that low even for a handmade car is a dismal failure.

"

Any 'exotic' that makes very little power that it's going to be constantly embarrassed by teenagers in accord v6s and forester/imprezas is a goofy car - no I am not comparing today's Accords with the 89 NSX. An Accord hybrid V6 or TL-S in 2005 made about the same power as the 2005 NSX."

Ah - the underpowered argument that comes up so often from people who haven't driven the car. "power" is a touchy thing in a sports car and it is about more than just comparing raw numbers. The NSX is certainly underpowered compared to vettes, ferraris, etc - but it has no issues against an Accord or TL-S despite having similar HP numbers. An interesting scenario is to plug an OBD2 reader in to your car and watch the live read out of HP curves while you are driving. In most instances you are using a remarkably small amount of the HP that a car has to offer.

You sound like all the other Honda fans over the decades that just love academic reasoning. "it's a 4 cylinder, but its got a VTEC. Its a 6 cylinder, but its light. Its a 6 cylinder but it gets great MPG" here's the bottom line in the black and white world of the exotic automobile. No V8 or V10 means no dice. I don't want to spend big money on a car and then have to force my friends to listen to my pedantic arguments as to why "it makes enough power" And no, I am not a poser magazine racer, I am talking about conversations that happen all the time on pit lane at a track day.

"

And Honda's belligerent stubbornness to not give their high end cars a proper v8 is fascinating."

About as fascinating as Porsche's belligerent stubbornness to keep the engine in the wrong place in the 911.

haha, fair. Porsche's aren't super cars, never were. Unless you consider their one-offs like the CGT or 959 or 918. But the engine hanging over the rear wheels makes the HP go much farther. 320 HP in a Carrera does the same work as 400+ HP in most front drive V8s. You can't say the same about a mid or front engined car, power wise.

"

Porsche, Ferrari, Audi and pretty much all good engineering companies "
I am sorry, did you just list Ferrari as a "good engineering" company while leaving Honda out? Seriously? You just did that. Wow...

I did leave Honda out, precisely to get that exact reaction out of you and other Honda fans. Honda is a great engineering company. That insists on fighting with one hand behind its back.

 

[Bram]

Wow, didn't realize this thread had turned into a Porsche debate.

I'm still interested in owning an nsx. But let's be honest, it was a flawed car in many respects, and precisely the reason it sold in double digits its last few years and was killed off. Any 'exotic'

Wow, stick with your Bettle....STOP you search for an an NSX NOW, you are wasting your time.

Good luck

 

[blue_myriddn]

I am actually not a Honda fan. Ever since the 90s, their cars have little to no interest to me. I like the NSX because it fits in my exact niche of what I am looking for in a car, nothing more, nothing less. I am however a fan of accuracy and providing an educated view, which is why I responded to your posts.

Everything else I have already stated clearly in my first post, so no need to repeat.

Good video on the Japanese auto industry:

 

[dablackgoku1234]

Just to reiterated what you said earlier...

After a few AMGs, nearly anything south of super car territory is going to feel dog slow to me. In fact, it took me several years of hesitation before I "downgraded" to a 911 in terms of speed and torque. So stepping down to 270 hp isn't a problem at all.

Any 'exotic' that makes very little power that it's going to be constantly embarrassed by teenagers in accord v6s and forester/imprezas is a goofy car

I did warn you about the HP difference, yet you have contradicting views of it. Are you planning to race between the lights? Yes, an NSX is overpriced, under powered, and dated. For the same money, you can get a GTR with 500+hp, or a C7, or any other modern rocket. If you cant get past this fact, then this debate pointless.

 

[xxaarraa]

Just to reiterated what you said earlier...





I did warn you about the HP difference, yet you have contradicting views of it. Are you planning to race between the lights? Yes, an NSX is overpriced, under powered, and dated. For the same money, you can get a GTR with 500+hp, or a C7, or any other modern rocket. If you cant get past this fact, then this debate pointless.

Great post. This isn't a debate at all, I was actually surprised by all the discourse on Porsches. You are correct. Yes, I am past the facts, and want to enjoy the NSX for what it is and what its not. Just mildly irritated by all the honda fans who want to pretend those facts don't exist. "but it's got 3rd gear VTEC" is the exact sentiment that killed my RSX-S ownership experience for me, and some of the sentiments on this page are eerily similar.

Now, back to regular programing

 

[socalx]

The nsx is not a flawed car. Especially compared to a 911

I am very familiar with the engine issues that prompted a lawsuit on the 996/997
The fact that the engine is in the wrong place (cayman /boxster cgt and 918 spyder AND nsx have it in the right place
911 still only uses aluminum for some panels unlike the flawed nsx that uses it everywhere 25 years ago
No matter what you do the flat 6 on a 911 sounds like crap from an exhaust perspective

So yes to some the nsx was underpowered, but to call it flawed compared in the context of a 911 is ridiculous

 

[payam972]

Lol. Pls go drive an nsx for more than an hour. I've owned a 996 c2 and a 993 c2. The nsx shits on both of them in handling, and performance. Real world is very different than what's on paper. Just do yourself a favor and go drive one for an extended period of time.

 

[GECKO]

Keep your cars out of this - I want to know about your BIKE RACING??????????

 

[91 X]

Wow, didn't realize this thread had turned into a Porsche debate. Yes, 996s in particular have been known to have a few issues, but in general, Porsches are made with care, for a very discerning buyer. I'd buy one again, just the metal working alone is a work of art.

I'm still interested in owning an nsx. But let's be honest, it was a flawed car in many respects, and precisely the reason it sold in double digits its last few years and was killed off. Any 'exotic' that makes very little power that it's going to be constantly embarrassed by teenagers in accord v6s and forester/imprezas is a goofy car - no I am not comparing today's Accords with the 89 NSX. An Accord hybrid V6 or TL-S in 2005 made about the same power as the 2005 NSX. And Honda's belligerent stubbornness to not give their high end cars a proper v8 is fascinating. Quite the reason acura suffers greatly and may well go out of business. The whole "high revving v6s are better than lazy v8s" argument is bs, because Porsche, Ferrari, Audi and pretty much all good engineering companies have small, high revving, sophisticated v8s. A "lazy v8" is a domestic pick-up truck concept and doesn't really exist in the exotic car market anymore. The other thing people lose track of, is Honda's complete lack of pedigree in making a super car. They don't have 40 years of history making sportscars (Porsche) or even more years making exotics (other German and Italian brands). Which makes it all the more important that they should try harder (hint: V8 or V10).

Bottom line: EVERY car has its pluses and minuses. Thanks for all your thoughts. I hope to join the community one day.

Wow....all the sudden you sound bitterly uninformed and whiney...an 89 NSX??? Where can I find one of those???

And If your worried about what your friends think, that's a whole new subject.....

Good luck.

 

[Mikexike]

Please drive the car, numbers on papers don't do justice.....

 

[jcbadcura]

Honda is a great engineering company. That insists on fighting with one hand behind its back.

[/COLOR]

Touché.

....But I still love em. Maybe they'll quiet the critics with v2. In the mean time, almost no car competes with a properly done nsx in my mind for so many reasons and on so many levels. You say it's flawed yet the nsx has been criticized for not having flaws. Anything can be argued.

It's a matter of opinion and honestly no one person will likely sway you either way. Obviously being on an nsx forum you know what kind of response you'll tend to get. There's good information posted vs Porsche and having just driven a 997.1 GT2 with 39k and a tensioner pulley that needs replacing because the bearing is shot and it's noisy, I have to roll my eyes despite the blistering hp (its FAST) and refined interior. Being that you won't keep the car long, that may not be as big of a deal to you.

You're on the right track loving the Nsx for what it is. Do yourself a favor and own one. It's worth it, even for a short time.

Oh, and get a 97+ for the extra tq/hp vs 91-96.

 

[myw]

do u know why it sounds like this? i have always wondered ??...

No matter what you do the flat 6 on a 911 sounds like crap from an exhaust perspective

- - - Updated - - -

that's minor. 3 engines went belly up this month on the forums; 2 of which had 25k miles; all 997s.... could have been just a bad month?!? who knows; but one thing for certain i never seen stuff like this on the nsx forum.

now obviously this doesn't happen in all cases, but for the most part extended additional warranties are very common or 'self-insurance'.

There's good information posted vs Porsche and having just driven a 997.1 GT2 with 39k and a tensioner pulley that needs replacing because the bearing is shot and it's noisy, I have to roll my eyes despite the blistering hp (its FAST) and refined interior. .

 

[oldnews]

I believe xoxoarra is just trolling.

 

[HKF]

I have a 2006 997 C2s, owned since new, and a 1991 NSX, bought a year ago with 41k miles on the odometer.

The 997 is quicker, feels more agile, and is a blast to drive. But there is something special about the NSX. I think it a combination of the driving position, its amazing suspension, and mid engine layout. It just feels...special.

I plan to sell the Porsche, keep the NSX, and likely buy the new NSX. Not bad for a 23 year old car.:smile: