Nsx vs Nsx

[naaman]

Why should it look like the old NSX? The original isn't a particularly beautiful car to start with. Basically a Ferrari rip-off. The 02+ is a Ferrari rip-off with Graves Disease. There are a lot of things I like about my NSX, but styling is not one of them.

I think you will find yourself deep in the minority on that particular issue on this particular forum (which, predictably, is biased toward the NSX). I for one, can scarce comprehend how anyone could not think the car at least looks cool (even if it's not they're top pick in terms of aesthetics).

Personally, I'm unwilling to spend any money on a car if the styling does not appeal to me. The R8 is one such car that, no matter how much performance/technology/breakthroughs it manages to achieve, I would never desire to even drive (let alone buy) it. This is just based on the styling alone. The Gallardo, on the other hand, has great styling, and I would definitely be eager to get behind the wheel of that car. The Ferrari 360 is another example where I would love to drive it, whereas the 458 fails to entice me.

Anyway, your comment just surprised me: it's definitely not everyday that you read about someone on this forum who doesn't like the styling.

 

[N Spec]

Why should it look like the old NSX? The original isn't a particularly beautiful car to start with. Basically a Ferrari rip-off. The 02+ is a Ferrari rip-off with Graves Disease. There are a lot of things I like about my NSX, but styling is not one of them.

Lol see what you've done now Nero. You've brought more people into this thread who are ignorant of the NSX origins Sorry if I offend, but it surprises me even how ignorant some NSX owners may sound.

NSX is a Ferrari ripoff... Right, like saying the F355 was a SW20 MR2 ripoff If you would have said a MID-4 knockoff, it would have been more believable. However the MID-4 II debuted in 1987 which was probably right around the time that Honda finalized their NSX concept before debuting it finally in 1989 after Nissan, Honda and many other Japanese companies decided to start a stir mid 80s. BTW, Honda used Ferrari as the target for performance, not to ripoff. Ferraris during the 80s are ugly IMHO and none of them resembled the NSX.

Which Ferrari in the 80s (and most of the 90s) existed that could wholly compete styling wise with the NSX (let alone other aspects)? The NSX concept was being finalized a few years before the 90s even came and Ferrari's answer ~5 years later was the F355 that somehow resembled a $25K Toyota. You don't see any biased journalists hardly mentioning that. I guess they were too intoxicated by the V8 exhaust note. It wasn't until the late 90s or so when Ferrari actually started getting pretty good.



Anyways Nero, I don't think the new NSX concept is perfect, but it's definitely a better step towards greatness. I hope that Honda will tweak it and in 2-3 more years, I am sure it will evolve. I think it looks like a proper NSX in the making as it retains many elements of the original NSX. It is still based on the original chassis.

If you look at the early concepts of the original NSX back in ~1985-1988, they were kind of shabby, but Honda had the basic idea down in there heads and it was consistent across their various concepts. I think the new NSX will shape up nicely as long as we don't have another global economic stumble :frown:

 

[Nero Tenebre]

Well at least this part of prime is active!! the rest of prime has been a bit slow! Haha, so I will say that both the ferraris of that era and the NSX were both styled by pininfarina so they probably have some similarities. If you really look at them they start to look different- the NSX nose is much shorter than the 355 and 348 and the tail is much longer. But on first impression they are both wedge shaped exotics. The NSX has aged much more gracefully than the 348!

 

[BD]

Why should it look like the old NSX? The original isn't a particularly beautiful car to start with. Basically a Ferrari rip-off. The 02+ is a Ferrari rip-off with Graves Disease. There are a lot of things I like about my NSX, but styling is not one of them.

There are two reasons people stare at a car, either it is extremely beautiful, or extremely ugly.

Therefore, if you park a NSX in public and people are will to go near it and take a good look, or snap a picture, that make NSX a very beautiful car.

If a car is ugly, most people will stare at it trying to figure out what it is, that goes with poorly mod cars too...:biggrin:

 

[Olyar15]

First off, where did I state that the NSX was ugly? I stated that it isn't a particularly beautiful car. Yes it is low and sleek (hard to make any car that is only 45" tall to not look sleek), and it looks exotic, but it isn't a shining example of rolling automotive art. That doesn't mean it is ugly (although the headlights on the 02+ sure come close). The NSX is better known for its engineering, handling, and reliability, not its styling.

Again, it isn't an ugly car, but has a somewhat generic/safe exotic look to it, so I really don't see what about the styling that people want to carry forward to the new car.

And N-spec, if you don't see the similarities between the Ferraris of the early 90s and the NSX, you are blind.

 

[BD]

Hmmm, no one is claiming you said the NSX is ugly. "It is a shamelessly knock off of a Ferrari 328," according to Jeremy Clarkson.

 

[Honcho]

I think the NSX is much better looking than any of the 3XX derived Ferrari V8's, except for perhaps the 458, which is a beautiful car. I think the 328 and 348 look very dated- like old 80's cars. People still ask me if my 1991 NSX is a new car. Just sayin...

 

[N Spec]

First off, where did I state that the NSX was ugly? I stated that it isn't a particularly beautiful car. Yes it is low and sleek (hard to make any car that is only 45" tall to not look sleek), and it looks exotic, but it isn't a shining example of rolling automotive art. That doesn't mean it is ugly (although the headlights on the 02+ sure come close). The NSX is better known for its engineering, handling, and reliability, not its styling.

Again, it isn't an ugly car, but has a somewhat generic/safe exotic look to it, so I really don't see what about the styling that people want to carry forward to the new car.

And N-spec, if you don't see the similarities between the Ferraris of the early 90s and the NSX, you are blind.

Again, read what I put and know some of the history. The NSX concept was finalized in the late 80s - somewhere around 87-88 and debuted in 89. SO you should be comparing the 80s Ferrari to the NSX as they were the only ones that came before it. You can't compare cars that came after the NSX and say the NSX is a Ferrari ripoff. That is a fail in logic. Just because the NSX came to America in 91 doesn't mean that it wasn't already finalized in 1989 and the various concepts were being shown way before then.

All of the pics You showed of the 90s Ferraris looked worst than the NSX. You actually showed with the pics that Ferrari was feebly attempting to outdo the NSX and failed for nearly a decade. So I guess the 90s Ferraris are generic/safe looking too? lol. Outdated they definitely look and they came AFTER the NSX. Yea I'm sure glad Honda didn't copy Ferrari. The F355 you showed is 5 years after the NSX and MR2. You glazed over my comment of how it looks like an expensive SW20 MR2.

 

[Olyar15]

Again, read what I put and know some of the history. The NSX concept was finalized in the late 80s - somewhere around 87-88 and debuted in 89. SO you should be comparing the 80s Ferrari to the NSX as they were the only ones that came before it. You can't compare cars that came after the NSX and say the NSX is a Ferrari ripoff. That is a fail in logic. Just because the NSX came to America in 91 doesn't mean that it wasn't already finalized in 1989 and the various concepts were being shown way before then.

All of the pics You showed of the 90s Ferraris looked worst than the NSX. You actually showed with the pics that Ferrari was feebly attempting to outdo the NSX and failed for nearly a decade. So I guess the 90s Ferraris are generic/safe looking too? lol. Outdated they definitely look and they came AFTER the NSX. Yea I'm sure glad Honda didn't copy Ferrari. The F355 you showed is 5 years after the NSX and MR2. You glazed over my comment of how it looks like an expensive SW20 MR2.

Holy F**k, do you think you are the only one around here that knows anything about the NSX? Those Ferrari pics span the 80s and 90s, which mean some of them were styled well before the NSX. Seriously, do you know anything about cars other than the NSX? Yeah, Ferrari has been building mid-engine sports cars for decades. Honda has built one. What I showed was that you could fit the front end of an NSX onto a Ferrari and it would not look out of character. As far as whether you think it looks better than the Ferraris, well that is your opinion.

But whatever dude, you go carry on all high and mighty about car styling. I'm done arguing with idiots.

 

[N Spec]

Holy F**k, do you think you are the only one around here that knows anything about the NSX? Those Ferrari pics span the 80s and 90s, which mean some of them were styled well before the NSX. Seriously, do you know anything about cars other than the NSX? Yeah, Ferrari has been building mid-engine sports cars for decades. Honda has built one. What I showed was that you could fit the front end of an NSX onto a Ferrari and it would not look out of character. As far as whether you think it looks better than the Ferraris, well that is your opinion.

But whatever dude, you go carry on all high and mighty about car styling. I'm done arguing with idiots.

Aww, don't get all upset. I'm sorry if my evidence is too idiotic for you. You say the NSX looks like it has graves disease and then you say "I didn't call it ugly." Control your emotions and think before you post. Your misconceived statement about the NSX being a Ferrari ripoff is inaccurate. Then you further delude your ignorance by saying Ferrari has been building mid engine cars a lot longer so they must be better

Ferrari wins races and they are very good at doing so. They were terrible at building production cars for a very long time, just like Lamborghini. They don't have the resources that Toyota or Honda has at their disposal - this alone also does not mean that you will necessarily build a great car either. Just because someone has been doing something for a long time does not guarantee they are exceptional at their job. Ferrari did not become exceptional until they actually approached building production cars with more sensibility, higher levels of tolerances and craftsmanship. This was Honda's approach and it paid off. Stop living in a dream world where fanboys and journalist put these old exotic cars on pedestals and cannot back up their claims with any data, because they were rather flawed.

The Ferrari 328 you showed looks nothing like the NSX. You show the front views and the only thing they have in common are that they are all mid-engine and have popup headlights. None of the 80s-90s era Ferraris looked like the NSX. The MR2 would be closer in resemblance to the Ferraris and it would be more accurate to say the MR2 is a Ferrari knockoff, but then the F355 jocked the MR2's styling so what does that make Ferrari?

So let's compare 80s-90s Ferraris:

1975-80s 308

1985 328

1989 NSX

1989 MR2

1989 348

1994 355

Again, tell me why Ferrari deemed it cool to copy a Toyota? They had 5 years to do something and it still did not surpass the NSX and looks like an evolved MR2. The sad thing is that everyone thinks the MR2 copied the Ferrari, but the SW20 was on sale in 1989, so both the 348 and 355 were not in Toyota's line of sight before they even rolled in production.

 

[N Spec]

Well at least this part of prime is active!! the rest of prime has been a bit slow! Haha, so I will say that both the ferraris of that era and the NSX were both styled by pininfarina so they probably have some similarities. If you really look at them they start to look different- the NSX nose is much shorter than the 355 and 348 and the tail is much longer. But on first impression they are both wedge shaped exotics. The NSX has aged much more gracefully than the 348!

O and Nero, I don't want to sound like the almighty guy that Olyar15 claims I am, but the NSX was not designed by Pininfarina, that was the HP-X in 1984, the precursor to the NSX.

Pininfarina seems to either hit or miss because their concepts are really unique or just out there. They usually miss in my book for most of the cars they they have touched :frown:

The NSX was all in house I believe. This came in 1985 or so after the HP-X:

You can see the evolution from the short HP-X hatchback to eventually the longer, stretched look. It's easy to see early elements that made it to final drawing board. I like how they also mention the targa top option. This really brings into question the claims that some have made about the targa top being an afterthought just to increase sales. I believe Honda already had the idea back in the 80s but decided to hold off because of the extra weight, otherwise, how could the top fit so well in the engine cover?

Then you have this running prototype:

That was still not quite refined but the basic shape was there. This occurred sometime around 1987-1988 before the final reveal in 89.

Again, just to poke at Olyar15 some more, in all of these sketches, none of them resembled anything Ferrari came up with. They definitely have a Honda feel to them.

 

[Nero Tenebre]

Didn't know that, I thought I always read that Pininfirina penned the NSX. Seeing all those ugly concepts gives me hope for the new NSX! Hehehe Seriously though, Honda has gone through it's share of bad concepts so hopefully they will knock this one out of the park. But I think that Honda said that the new concept is like 95% of the production car as far as looks go so there again my hope for an appropriate face recedes. *Cough* Put HSC headlights and front bumper on it Honda *Cough* NSPEC, you should use your 3D voodoo to do a mockup study to get the ball rolling You might have to play with some proportions to get it to work but I bet it could look so perfect. Oh and have you seen this: http://humster3d.com/2012/02/25/acura-nsx-2012/

 

[N Spec]

Didn't know that, I thought I always read that Pininfirina penned the NSX. Seeing all those ugly concepts gives me hope for the new NSX! Hehehe Seriously though, Honda has gone through it's share of bad concepts so hopefully they will knock this one out of the park. But I think that Honda said that the new concept is like 95% of the production car as far as looks go so there again my hope for an appropriate face recedes. *Cough* Put HSC headlights and front bumper on it Honda *Cough* NSPEC, you should use your 3D voodoo to do a mockup study to get the ball rolling You might have to play with some proportions to get it to work but I bet it could look so perfect.

Yes, to think in January 1986, before I was even born, Honda already had the basic idea and shape of the NSX on four wheels as evident in the conceptual board. They exclaimed that the cockpit was too large, making it appear less aggressive. So they spent 2-3 years fine tuning the proportions and details that resulted in what we have today.

Honda once again has about 2-3 years to fine tune and I am sure it will get better. I still believe the focus should be on the rear and not the front end. I think I am done playing around with the new NSX model because it will just be for fantasy purposes and that generally becomes quite depressing at times. I probably will just do renders from this point on. I'm sure I will make a new one whenever the production model drops though.

Oh and have you seen this: http://humster3d.com/2012/02/25/acura-nsx-2012/

http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/custom-honda-nsx-2-3d-model/666313

I think mine is cooler :tongue:

 

[blue_myriddn]

And N-spec, if you don't see the similarities between the Ferraris of the early 90s and the NSX, you are blind.

Count me in as blind too, because I am not seeing it either.

I like the late 80s Ferraris, if I could grow a big fat mustache I'd consider buying one and cruising around town in it because of the cool factor - but they are a very different look and feel from the NSX. Living down in the N.Va area, I get to see a fair number of them in person too which is the only way to REALLY see cars rather than just looking at pictures. While they are both low and sleek, they have entirely different personalities.

 

[BD]

Holy F**k, do you think you are the only one around here that knows anything about the NSX? Those Ferrari pics span the 80s and 90s, which mean some of them were styled well before the NSX. Seriously, do you know anything about cars other than the NSX? Yeah, Ferrari has been building mid-engine sports cars for decades. Honda has built one. What I showed was that you could fit the front end of an NSX onto a Ferrari and it would not look out of character. As far as whether you think it looks better than the Ferraris, well that is your opinion.

But whatever dude, you go carry on all high and mighty about car styling. I'm done arguing with idiots.

Come down buddy.

It's a mid engine car, you can only make it looking certain ways...lol

I say Ferrari copied Honda since the body designer of the NSX did ENZO.

 

[influence82]

Honda named the cars HSC and HSV because they wanted to make it distinct from NSX, probably due to the engine placement. They were intended to be different from the beginning. I saw the HSV as more of a S2000 descendant (since it is a smaller FR), than a NSX descendant in terms of lineage.

 

[VampNSXX]

Why should it look like the old NSX? The original isn't a particularly beautiful car to start with. Basically a Ferrari rip-off. The 02+ is a Ferrari rip-off with Graves Disease. There are a lot of things I like about my NSX, but styling is not one of them.

Sorry for the language but are you fucken kidding me?

 

[GBL1]

Great info & cool old pics!

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[naaman]

Thank goodness they didn't go with that 2-tone idea... it really is amazing how the NSX has such a timeless design. It may look "old" today, but compared to it's contemporaries, it's not even in the same league!

And that very last picture looks a lot like what the 4th generation Camaro turned out to be.

 

[GBL1]

100% agreed, the new one is a mistake and looks so much like an R8 it's shameful. The HSC would have been a beautiful evolution of a true NSX.

+100

It was because everyone, at the time of it's unveiling, didn't like the HSC enough for Honda to make it. They liked the overall shape but everyone was complaining about the low power 350hp engine and didn't like the rear end.

So add more HP to the HSC and call it a day!

I dont think the new NSX look like an R8 that much,

Side view profile of the front end...it does look like an R8...to hood high & stubby nosed.

I do not agree at all with that. The new one looks generic and not special. It kind of looks like a camaro to me.

Ditto!

I don't know where you got that Camero look.

Side view profile of the rear end...it does look like a Camaro...angular fender lines and all.

I have to be honest. I don't see any resemblance to the camaro

See above post...it's so obvious...think "very close general shape" verses "spot-on" xerox copy.

Camaro? Yeah, a blocky, retro-styled FR Camaro looks EXACTLY the same as a sleek, futuristic-looking mid-engined NSX that's about 2 FEET shorter and literally like 9" lower. I really don't know what some of you are on sometimes.

Again, see above post...

I like both designs for both the NSX 2.0 and the HSC but I would just rather the HSC to be the next NSX because it brings out a lil bit of the NSX 1.0

I don't really see the NSX 2.0 looking like an R8 or the camaro. We need a picture of all 3 cars being side by side.

Again, see above post...

I guess for me, the way that owners are being forced more and more to take their car back to the dealer/manufacturer for even just regular maintenence is really annoying. Cars are so touchy and gimmicky now-a-days that it takes all the fun out of driving (to me, it's much more fun to drive a car that I have built--or at least planned out and chose the aftermarket add-ons) than to just drive something that can only function properly in the same condition as it was built. It feels like I'm just borrowing the car, rather than that I own it.

I feel the same...the seat of my pants is the only computer I need controlling the car!

Ferreri couldn't figure out how to built high out engine for road cars and reliable F1 engines until they hired Osamu Goto from Honda after 1992. Honda philosophy saved Ferrari!

Very possibly...

As for the McLaren, it's the best looking car since the NSX 1.0/1.5

Yes...what became the MP4-12C SHOULD have been the NSX 2.0!

Why should it look like the old NSX? The original isn't a particularly beautiful car to start with. Basically a Ferrari rip-off. The 02+ is a Ferrari rip-off with Graves Disease. There are a lot of things I like about my NSX, but styling is not one of them.

Are you drunk...or stoned?

Personally, I'm unwilling to spend any money on a car if the styling does not appeal to me. The R8 is one such car that, no matter how much performance/technology/breakthroughs it manages to achieve, I would never desire to even drive (let alone buy) it. This is just based on the styling alone. The Gallardo, on the other hand, has great styling, and I would definitely be eager to get behind the wheel of that car. The Ferrari 360 is another example where I would love to drive it, whereas the 458 fails to entice me.

I agree...except that the 458 is beautiful...also faster than the NSX...but not as much fun to drive what with the automatic tranny only & too many computers and what all...

There are two reasons people stare at a car, either it is extremely beautiful, or extremely ugly.

Therefore, if you park a NSX in public and people are will to go near it and take a good look, or snap a picture, that make NSX a very beautiful car.

If a car is ugly, most people will stare at it trying to figure out what it is, that goes with poorly mod cars too...:biggrin:

Same goes for women. LOL!!

"It is a shamelessly knock off of a Ferrari 328," according to Jeremy Clarkson.

Mr. Clark needs glasses...or to quit drinking whiskey for breakfast. He could not be farther from the truth...328, indeed. Ferrari 408 maybe (as discussed below), but never the 328.

http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php?t=138378

I don't see a camaro in the new design at all. Sure some similarities in the first gen NSX since the design was copied.

1996 Camaro totally tried to copy NSX with this Oprah-sized fat pig (see below pics)


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[2slow2speed]

I agree...except that the 458 is beautiful...also faster than the NSX...but not as much fun to drive what with the automatic tranny only & too many computers and what all...

Hmm... Have you actually driven one?

The F458 is insane, it is a lot of fun to drive, it is even possible to turn off all the computer related aids (besides ABS). I'm not too keen on most DCT's (PDK on Porsche's or even the DCT on my GT-R), but the one on the F458 suits the engine/chassis really well.

IMHO the F458 shares quite a bit of the design philosophy of the original NSX, more so than NSX 2.0.

 

[GBL1]

Hmm... Have you actually driven one?

The F458 is insane, it is a lot of fun to drive, it is even possible to turn off all the computer related aids (besides ABS). I'm not too keen on most DCT's (PDK on Porsche's or even the DCT on my GT-R), but the one on the F458 suits the engine/chassis really well.

IMHO the F458 shares quite a bit of the design philosophy of the original NSX, more so than NSX 2.0.

Yes, I have...for over two hours and into triple digit land.

To be fair, I did not turn off all the computers, so perhaps I did not get to truly "feel" the car...but no matter how many computers you turn off, you cannot get rid of the automatic transmission.

I will tell you, the 458 paddle shifted WAYYYYY better than the Lambo Superleggera on a few hot laps. The Lambo was flat-out clunk-y & lame in it's shifting.


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