Mac anti-commercial (warning: language)

[tucsonsx]

The war is over and Mac has lost - thank god. The hackers can continue to concentrate on Windows and that delightful XP operating system. I'll continue suffering with my OSX v 10.3 and hope that 5 - 10 % of the market is all Mac ever has.

 

[NSX-Racer]

tucsonnsx: I 2nd that. The company I'm working for did receive an average of 800 virus infected mails per day (!) overall plus 21,000 virus attacks at the several workstations in the 3rd quarter of 2003 - me at home with the Mac: zero.

 

[tucsonsx]

nsxtasy,

Your mention of Betamax VCRs ( yes it was a better system - proving that superior engineering means nothing once the marketing boys swoop into action ) made me think of the current "war" between DVD-R and DVD+R. Which do you think it will be? This whole tech. thing is in its infancy; it reminds me of cars from the 30s - lots of potential but a long way to go before becoming the "don't give them a second thought products they are today ". Our cell phones don't work in large parts of the world , you can't buy a video tape in Europe to play here, and broadband is still rediculously expensive in the US thanks to plenty of gov. regulation - the "information superhighway" is still just a cow path.

 

[PHOEN$X]

Saw that earlier today. Once again the better part of my evening will be spent patching machines I wish folks wouldn't work so late so I could get to this stuff earlier!

You should thank Bill...for providing job security!

Anyway as spookyp says, if the Mac OS was anywhere popular as Windows, it would be constantly under attack by hackers and there would be no end to security advisories as well. Linux is starting to become a target, and the various vendors have been releasing patches too. The only reason Mac users have been pretty much immune to these events is because of its relative obscurity.

I like the Mac, but prefer to build my own PCs, so it's not an option for me. I also have no desire to repurchase my entire software library, and having to convert my data to a different platform, so I'm staying put with Windows for now. If Apple had been a little smarter and took control of the market before Bill came into the picture, I might very well be using a Mac right now. It's just too late at this point in the game IMO.

 

[Jimbo]

The notion that there has to be only one platform is ludricrous. That's like saying the sports car war is over and the Corvette won. The Betamax/VHS analogy is fundamentally flawed. We're not discussing a single fixed format like 8-track tapes or cassettes or CDs.

Computers are, by their very nature, infinitely adaptable. The standards that we all adhere to (i.e. html, xml, jpeg, mpeg, ascii, unicode, mp3, etc, transcend platform and manufacturer. The Internet has made this fact even more clear.

I can launch Virtual PC on Mac - create a MS Word document and then open and edit same in MS Word under OSX.

And for those who wish to make it an all-or-nothing "war"...it seems to me that if you want to view it that way...the Macintosh actually won the war. Apple might have lost the dominant market position for now - but it's clear that the Mac has shaped and defined all personal computing. In other words, without the Mac, all you other guys would still be running DOS 32.5.



That's why MS develops Macintosh applications. Certainly not for the revenue stream. Microsoft keeps a finger in the Macintosh pie in order to see where the next innovation will be.

I have no doubt that if the Mac were the dominant platform that virus authors would target it. It doesn't bother me that I'm benefitting from "protection by obscurity". That's like saying the crime rate is lower in the suburbs. OK. That's fine with me. It's not like I'm giving up anything.

I have a robust, elegant OS that can run all the important applications I need. I can exchange files and content with my Windows counterparts - and in the rare occasion when I need to run Windows. I do so on my Mac.

-Jim

 

[PHOEN$X]

The notion that there has to be only one platform is ludricrous. That's like saying the sports car war is over and the Corvette won.

I wonder if Apple is as happy about having a tiny market share as some of its enthusiasts appear to be.

I don't think anyone said there has to be only one platform, I use several different flavors of Windows and Unix myself. The point was that once a technology gains enough momentum it's hard to switch to something else. Why do people stick with eBay if there are cheaper alternatives? Because they don't want to have to switch to something new and start all over again. Operating systems are not like cars, you can't just switch from Windows to OS X and expect to know how to do everything like you can with an NSX and vette. I think the more appropriate analogy wolud be, Windows is like a car and the Mac is like a motorcycle. Both can get you to your destination, but they do it in different ways.

 

[Jimbo]

Phoenix,

I'm sure Apple would love a larger market share. However, as Steve Jobs recently said in a Business Week article and elsewhere...

http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/jan2004/tc20040126_9608_tc055.htm

Apple is one of only two companies making money in the PC business. We're not making a lot, but other than Dell, we're the only one. Others are losing money -- a lot of money.

Apple's market share is bigger than BMW's or Mercedes's or Porsche's in the automotive market. What's wrong with being BMW or Mercedes?

"We've got 25 million customers that want the best computers in the world. If our market share grows, we're thrilled. But we've held our own, while our rivals were losing hundreds of millions of dollars a year," he says. "We're in pretty good shape."

 

[PHOEN$X]

Thanks for the link, Jimbo, but I wonder why Steve Jobs is comparing Apple to PC hardware vendors rather than Microsoft? (I thought we were talking about OS here?)

 

[Jimbo]

I guess because Apple is in a unique position since they make both HW and SW.

-Jim

 

[Jimbo]

An interesting article that does seem to place some blame on the Windows architecture.

http://news.independent.co.uk/digital/features/story.jsp?story=489935

"Windows doesn't separate the authorities required to install new software from those required just to view attachments; so you can get infected by an executable program when you thought you were looking at a file. That's because Windows started life as MS-DOS, which was always intended to be a single-user product, not shared among users with different levels of authority over the machine. The antivirus companies couldn't protect people because in general they can only ward off programs they already know about." Charles Arthur reports for The Independent.

 

[PHOEN$X]

Damn Jim, you seem to have a vendetta against M$! J/K

I agree, part of the blame resides with Windows, and that sh*tty program called "Outlook (Express)", which is why I've removed it from all my personal systems. Instead, I use an old version of Eudora that doesn't do HTML or "auto-preview" attachments, and I only open attachments with "safe" extensions like JPG, MPG, etc. Computers aren't perfect (I'm sure there are also Mac vulnerabilities that have yet to be exploited); they are complex devices, and a little user know-how & common sense goes a long way.

 

[Jimbo]

Nah, actually I do use MS apps a lot.

I use MS Office (but not their mail app) and I run Virtual PC on my PowerBook when needed. My company also has several Wintel PCs which I use from time to time. But I do (as you've no doubt guessed ) prefer the Mac.

OSX made a huge difference. I think the Mac's UNIX underpinnings will win a lot of new converts in the future. Whether that translates into market share remains to be seen.

I think that a lot depends on the market too. For example, in the professional photography market - the Mac is widely accepted - with a 50%-75% market share. Publishing/graphic design and music are other markets where the Mac has a large percentage of the market.

-Jim

 

[PHOEN$X]

I can't believe I posted so many times in this thread without using one of my favorite smilies! I'm about to rectify that omission right now.

 

[NeoNSX]

Just to balance things out... Mac has a security alert today with a <A HREF="http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/security/bulletin/MS04-005.asp">Vulnerability in Virtual PC for Mac could lead to privilege elevation (835150)</A>.


Kelvin, that's my favourite smiley too... Ken's moonie smiley takes 2nd place.

 

[nsxtasy]

Why do people stick with eBay if there are cheaper alternatives? Because they don't want to have to switch to something new and start all over again.

No. I stick with eBay because that's what everybody else uses, so that's where all the traffic is, among both buyers and sellers.

 

[Jimbo]

That's correct. eBay isn't a good analogy either.

eBay is a huge worldwide flea market and you might as well shop at the flea market that has the most stuff.

In eBay's case, size matters.



-Jim

 

[PHOEN$X]

No. I stick with eBay because that's what everybody else uses, so that's where all the traffic is, among both buyers and sellers.

Similarly, most popular software is developed/available for Windows first, then the Mac (if at all). While there are Windows simulators available for Apple, software vendors will most likely not provide support should problems arise, hence the reason most businesseses run Windows (because that's where the support/"traffic" is, and what most computer users are trained to use).

However, if Apple was ever to come out with this Mac, I would be seriously tempted to make the switch.

 

[Jimbo]

Now that's funny. I like that ChiaMac!

With regard to popular software... Now with Mac OSX the huge world of UNIX apps now have a chance for a second life on the Mac.

Of course, MS Excel was developed on the Mac first and so was PageMaker and Photoshop for that matter.

And...the very first web browser was developed on the NeXT platform (which has now evolved into OSX).

-Jim

 

[PHOEN$X]

With regard to popular software... Now with Mac OSX the huge world of UNIX apps now have a chance for a second life on the Mac.

And I would love to see Unix/Linux dethrone Windows in the OS market (or at least grow enough popularity to eliminate the virtual monopoly that M$ has). I hope the SCO linux suit is shot down quickly.

 

[NSX-Racer]

add to Jimbo: Microsoft Word was also developped first for the Mac AFAIK.

 

[scNSXgirl]

LOL!!! That's funny...I should turn my friend's old iMac into a ChiaMac.

 

[NeoNSX]

<IMG SRC="http://www.freepixhosting.com/uploadedfiles/chia-mac.jpg">

A very "green" PC.

 

[Jimbo]

http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/AnchorDesk/4520-7297_16-5122766.html

Interesting POV from an unbiased user.

 

[PHOEN$X]

"Unbiased?"

 

[Jimbo]

Well, at least he's not a dyed-in-the-wool Mac user.



-J