LOTUS TT VS BASCH SUPERCHARGED NSX

A

ALLAN

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7 November 2001
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well boys, here it is. i finally got my friend to race me in his 91 supercharged nsx. his car also has exhaust and headers. his car has been outfitted with all the latest basch accesories and he said the car makes 400 rear wheel hp. we raced twice, 1st time we went from 1st gear to top of 4th, and the second time we went 2nd to top of 4th. the nsx clearly has an edge in the instant throttle response action as it could get the lotus down low, but then once the lotus boost came in it would pull right back. the end result is both cars ended up being pretty much dead even. i have to say that the nsx had a big improvement over what it was before.

i took some pictures of both cars and ill post them later.
 
I am not even gonna say nothing on this.
 
Originally posted by Deqle:
I am not even gonna say nothing on this.
Click to expand...

deqle, since you obviously would like to doubt my story, ill tell you this. call mark basch, and ask him to ask steve what happened when we raced, he knows him well. it was actually the nsx owners first words after the race" wow theyre pretty much dead even". his other comment was that the lotus feels faster when you drive it than the nsx.
 
Well Allan, tell me what you think?
The guy said that he has about 400rwh, that's a lot, that's equal to 440 something at the crankshaft, and your Lotus (if it is stock) has 350 hp at the crank. let's said that the two car weight about the same, then how do you justify that the cars are dead even. One explaination, you guys are pretty equal in the hp department and driver's skill. that's being said, the NSx then are not a bad platform to do a few modification here and there to run in the 12, given that the stock one are low 13, which would equal to your Lotus and other 12s cars.
 
deqle, no one said the nsx is a bad platform to modify. i would say that lotus has more than 350hp, because lotus never changed its rating from the tt's intro, and yet it uprated its computer for more torque and power. one aspect of the race between us that i did not mention is that he was power shifting, and i was not. this is in direct reference to the fact that the lotus tranny is the weakest link and also ill add that i like the nsx's shifter better than the lotus. my point is, that the nsx, in the hp department is playing catch up to these cars. regardless of which car you like better, the truth remains, that you must modify the nsx substantially to be "as-fast" as other cars are to begin with. what will happen now, if i go get a race ecu(allows for full boost in the 1st three gears, almost double the boost the car runs stock)add blow off valves(will get rid of the lag time the car sufferes from in each gear change) change the turbos(upgrade kit allows for 40% more air flow) and intercool the car. all this can be done for approximately the same cost as adding a supercharger to an nsx.these same modifications can be done to an early model esprit, which can be bought for just about the same amount of money as an earlier nsx.now youll have a car which is much faster than a supercharged nsx and faster than gerrys nsx.
 
Well Allan,
The NSX after all is an 12 years old design now, even then there are only a number of cars out there that can beat it stock to stock (2002 model), your Lotus being one of them. But these cars also cost more than a used NSX, so it is justifiable for me to spend 6-10 to regain that lost ground. And if anyone want to save some money, go nitrous, then you will have one hell of a car, look good, and still reliable.
 
again not really true, as a new lotus is in the same price range as a new nsx, as is a used lotus in the range of 91-92 nsx's. Also the lotus's platform has been basicly the same since the late 80's. the engine configuration was changed in 97 but the body and chassis is basicly the same.
 
In that case, I said a used NSX is a better deal, because there seem to be a market for them. It has a lot going for it, the look, the performance (even by today standard), and the reliability that people look for.
 
Yeah, but I still got you on the reliability issue. Case proven, my own freaking car. I am putting a lot of time in the vehicle. One time, I down shift to 2nd going 110 mph, rpm needle bury, but she's ok. In other vehicles, we would have had engine damage now, wouldn't we?
Now if that is what you think, wouldn't you rather trade your NSX for a used Lotus instead?
 
no, deqle, i wouldnt because as snobby as it sounds, i can have both, and enjoy both. i am rather looking forward to completely re-doing the nsx.
 
You have to get this, i don't consider you snobbish, I am glad that you are doing well, (someone has to, especially if that person consider himself an NSX owner), but that does not stop me from disagreeing with you on conflicting topics.
 
"But these cars also cost more than a used NSX, so it is justifiable for me to spend 6-10 to regain that lost ground."

Deqle, I have to disagree with this... because that would be the same as saying that a Civic and a Modena are on the same level since it is "normal" to invest the 140k$ price difference "to regain the lost ground" and build a 0-60mph Civic that runs 3,5s.
 
Hey Allan-

Is your Lotus stock? I ran around with a bone stock 97 or 98 TT (can't remember)a couple weeks ago. High speed rolling starts ended with the same result as low speed starts, the NSX pulling steadily. In speaking with the guy, he talked about wanting the race ecu upgrade as well. The car was relatively low miles and excellent condition.
 
i totally agree with Allan ,,,,,about the nsx playing catch up with today performance car .as much as i like my nsx ,i know my nsx is not the greastest car in performance and value like some people think .even with all that mods on the nsx it still couldnt beat the lotus . Allan ,whats your plan for the nsx in terms of mods?
 
First of all, we are comparing NSX (89,900), or used one (30,000) supercharge or what ever to a Ferrari, or a Porsche. Not a civic to a Ferrari, that is stretching thing.
Second of all, didn't you read my last post, stating that the 91S NSX and the Lotus is probably putting down about the same amount of power, do you seriously believe that an NSX which has more power wouldn't be faster, given how easy it is for the NSX to put that power down to the ground. I race my NSX many time, I know, do you guys race yours frequently?
 
Well again deqle, the same arguement holds true for a new nsx or an old nsx. pay 90 or even 75,000 for a new nsx, and you get your doors blown off by a new 50,000 corvette.

sig, i dont know who you were racing or what mods you have done to your car, but if your nsx is stock and you were pulling away from the lotus steadily, then either the guy couldnt drive, or something is wrong with his car. ive spoken to smoore, who confirmed that the lotus would be a good race in his opinion against the supercharged nsx, and his brothers car is a bone stock 97. in all honesty, getting out of my lotus and into the nsx, makes the nsx feel like such a dog. even just normal in traffic, in gear acceleration is miles ahead of the nsx.the arguement again here is,30,000 nsx +10,000 worth of work=being able to purchase a 97-98 lotus, if you wanted to.

everyone here is always pointing to the nsx is soo great on the track, well i dont think its that great anymore. 12 years ago it was, but not anymore. the nsx will get dogged in the straights, its brakes are now under-par, and its handling is still good, but equalled and surpassed by many cars. case in point:august 28 issue of Autocar:
porsche 996 c2 lap time 1:30.31
new acura nsx lap time 1:31.85

the nsx is a great car, but if you wanted to really do it up, the way i would, youd be looking at:
30,000 for the car
10,000 for the body kit
10,000 for engine mods
3,000 for wheels and tires
2,000 for brakes
2,000 misceleaneous.
Youd spend 55-60,000 easy on a 10-12 year old car when for that price there are plenty of cars you could of had.
 
Originally posted by ALLAN: ....as snobby as it sounds, i can have both, and enjoy both.
Click to expand...

Man that sounds so snobby Allen (kidding)

Seriously though, your threads do keep this forum lively.....you must have the record for most posts to your topics.
 

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