I would call a bottom end tear down a rebuild and no so much a refresh. But let us know how everything works out!
Jinks engine build thread
- Thread starter Jinks
- Start date
How's it looking Jinks??
Haven't heard anything yet. I'm about 100 miles away from the shop so I cannot stop by and chat/see the build. I should have some pics to post soon. As far as I know the engine is out and being disassembled.
Mini update: Engine is at the machine shop and is being crack inspected. I should know all the details by early next week.
Big update for today as I spoke with Driving Ambition this morning and I just got home from Florida.
The crankshaft is good as new, whew!!! The block also does not have any cracks and is good to go. No spun bearings either. The engine has returned from the machine shop in pieces and is ready for assembly. The valve covers have been powder coated and Shad says they look incredible. I should have pics very soon. Shad is sick so I am going easy on him.
We are just waiting on some bearings at this point and then we can have everything put back together. The blower will be sent back for cleaning and inspection. See below why.
The diagnosis of the motor failure is still to be talked about as I didn't harp on it much but this is what we know so far.
The rear bank head gasket blew so badly that the coolant pressure blew right past the valve cover gaskets. This in turn got oil and coolant in the blower and pissed all over my rear hatch. So he thinks it is best to make sure we have a squeaky clean blower to mount to a new engine. The cats may need to be replaced. He pressure washed them like crazy but they were filled with coolant. We must pass smog, so if they need to go he has used ones on shelf.
Then lastly, the front bank pistons all have holes in them. So I am guessing I was running lean at some point but I dunno, I don't fix cars so....
That's all for now, hopefully I will have some pics to upload shortly. I will also be taking pics of all the old parts as they are being saved. But at this point we are looking at being right on budget.:biggrin:
The crankshaft is good as new, whew!!! The block also does not have any cracks and is good to go. No spun bearings either. The engine has returned from the machine shop in pieces and is ready for assembly. The valve covers have been powder coated and Shad says they look incredible. I should have pics very soon. Shad is sick so I am going easy on him.
We are just waiting on some bearings at this point and then we can have everything put back together. The blower will be sent back for cleaning and inspection. See below why.
The diagnosis of the motor failure is still to be talked about as I didn't harp on it much but this is what we know so far.
The rear bank head gasket blew so badly that the coolant pressure blew right past the valve cover gaskets. This in turn got oil and coolant in the blower and pissed all over my rear hatch. So he thinks it is best to make sure we have a squeaky clean blower to mount to a new engine. The cats may need to be replaced. He pressure washed them like crazy but they were filled with coolant. We must pass smog, so if they need to go he has used ones on shelf.
Then lastly, the front bank pistons all have holes in them. So I am guessing I was running lean at some point but I dunno, I don't fix cars so....
That's all for now, hopefully I will have some pics to upload shortly. I will also be taking pics of all the old parts as they are being saved. But at this point we are looking at being right on budget.:biggrin:
Thanks man. It was mostly a cost issue. Head gasket jobs with time serts and arp studs can be about half the cost of a full rebuild. So I just rolled the die without it.I rolled snake eyes though! Lol. Rob told me I should do it though. But it couldn't be in better hands in Nor-Cal, so it is what it is. Water under the bridge at this point.
Wow, that's a crazy post mortem! Rollercoaster emotional ride haha
So I guess the moral of this lesson is to check the head gasket for leaks? Or just to replace them every so often.
You know Jinks I just got into working on cars 2 years ago. I used to tell people "I am not a car person" because I was really not an expert by any teams. However recently I had nightmares while sleeping and my nightmares are my Mazdaspeed3 knocking and my NSX ending up like yours did in the story. Now I know that maybe I am becoming a car person lol. I miss the old days when I would just have nightmares about clowns killing me in my bedroom.
You know Jinks I just got into working on cars 2 years ago. I used to tell people "I am not a car person" because I was really not an expert by any teams. However recently I had nightmares while sleeping and my nightmares are my Mazdaspeed3 knocking and my NSX ending up like yours did in the story. Now I know that maybe I am becoming a car person lol. I miss the old days when I would just have nightmares about clowns killing me in my bedroom.
The rule of thumb here for years is the paper head gaskets of the early NSXs suck. Boost it and it's a ticking timebomb. Not easy to find that info I suppose if you don't lurk here regularly.
Yeah pretty much. Mine ran beautifully for two years on the dot. Literally days away from two years before it completely exploded with an oil and coolant fireworks display!
Rule of thumb, if you ever have to top off coolant without finding a leak, DO NOT DRIVE THE CAR. Tow it to a mechanic immediately.
Update: To sleeve or not to sleeve....
One of the cylinders can not be cleaned up by boreing so now I am either going to sleeve the block or Shad has a 3.2 bored block ready to go. So I am at another decision point. Sleeving will be costly but safer and close up the deck some.
I still have not decided yet. The motor basically hydrolocked.
One of the cylinders can not be cleaned up by boreing so now I am either going to sleeve the block or Shad has a 3.2 bored block ready to go. So I am at another decision point. Sleeving will be costly but safer and close up the deck some.
I still have not decided yet. The motor basically hydrolocked.
There's another cheaper fix if it's just one cylinder:
https://www.knowyourparts.com/technical-resources/engine/installing-cylinder-sleeves/
You can do a single cylinder dry sleeve. Your old iron sleeve is bored slightly and then you do an interference fit with this dry sleeve. If you get a competent installer you should be OK for your HP goals. Not the hard-core preferred $15k C-series build way, but it should work fine.
Otherwise, sleeving your block will be a good $2k.
Side question if you're considering the 3.2L block - Is a FIC on a OEM ECU for a 3L work adjustable enough for a 3.2L?
Obviously you'll need different pistons too if you've already purchased the 90.5mm ones.
Also, if you go with a 3.2L, I would also want to go ahead and upgrade to the 3.2L larger intake valve. Just seems prudent to do while you're in there.
https://www.knowyourparts.com/technical-resources/engine/installing-cylinder-sleeves/
You can do a single cylinder dry sleeve. Your old iron sleeve is bored slightly and then you do an interference fit with this dry sleeve. If you get a competent installer you should be OK for your HP goals. Not the hard-core preferred $15k C-series build way, but it should work fine.
Otherwise, sleeving your block will be a good $2k.
Side question if you're considering the 3.2L block - Is a FIC on a OEM ECU for a 3L work adjustable enough for a 3.2L?
Obviously you'll need different pistons too if you've already purchased the 90.5mm ones.
Also, if you go with a 3.2L, I would also want to go ahead and upgrade to the 3.2L larger intake valve. Just seems prudent to do while you're in there.
Hey Mac,
Thanks for posting. I am new to this engine build stuff so bare with me. I have not seen the single cylinder repair option yet. The pistons which were already ordered to spec Shad can use in another project. So there is no lost money there as we can just order the ones we need if I choose the 3.2 bored block he has. However, my wife and I will be listing our home in California for sale next month and moving back to my home state of Florida where there is no air restrictions.
I am seriously considering removing my ctsc with less then 10k miles, selling it, and going turbo with a decked and sleeved block. Or, doing the 3.2 block swap and staying ctsc'd. But with a 1.6L blower, it will never spin enough for that kind of build. I need to sleep on this a bit and gather my thoughts. Any recommendations is highly appreciated.
Thanks for posting. I am new to this engine build stuff so bare with me. I have not seen the single cylinder repair option yet. The pistons which were already ordered to spec Shad can use in another project. So there is no lost money there as we can just order the ones we need if I choose the 3.2 bored block he has. However, my wife and I will be listing our home in California for sale next month and moving back to my home state of Florida where there is no air restrictions.
I am seriously considering removing my ctsc with less then 10k miles, selling it, and going turbo with a decked and sleeved block. Or, doing the 3.2 block swap and staying ctsc'd. But with a 1.6L blower, it will never spin enough for that kind of build. I need to sleep on this a bit and gather my thoughts. Any recommendations is highly appreciated.
Are you looking for a monster 500hp+ motor? Slippery slope, as you know because other things will start breaking. I recently installed a switch to change boost from 8psi to 15psi.
I say build it up to handle 15psi but go with a safe 10psi to buffer against pushing things to the max.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I say build it up to handle 15psi but go with a safe 10psi to buffer against pushing things to the max.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'd say I will be happy with 400-450 hp being that I do not drag race or track the car yet. I'm still kind of leaning leaning the bored block. But I wonder, doesn't boreing the cylinders weaken them even more as you're basically just removing material?
At some point unit must be true that cylinder walls will be the limiting factor but I'd be surprised of you were anywhere near there unless you are pushing more power than you are taking about.
I was in your place about five years ago when we packed up in SC and moved to OR. The NSX was in the middle of my engine rebuild and I shipped everything over in pieces. Stressful time for sure. Best of wishes in your decisions!
Based on your power goals, I would highly recommend the individual cylinder sleeve if Shad is also for it. Bottom line is that I would trust Shad. But, if you have the time, I would send it out for a full resleeve and do 95mm pistons (3.3L) before buying a 3.2L block and using it for a higher HP build.
Reason? Look at posts 6 and 15 of this thread:
http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/173005-c32b-overbore-pistons-work-with-FRM-sleeves?
EDIT - Maybe I misinterpreted your post on a 3.2L. If it's a factory 3.2L, then the FRM concern in the link above is valid. Is it a bored 3.0L with the OEM cylinder liners? If so, you would be using a 93mm diameter piston whereas a common 400-450HP build would use a 90.5mm diameter piston. Is the extra 1.25mm of reduced wall thickness enough to make a difference in longevity? There have been a few cases of cracked OEM cylinders, but those are kind of rare. The real issue would be the higher boost cylinder pressures acting on the cylinders and causing them to balloon in the middle or also ovalize. Piston rings can't effectively seal under these conditions and you'll have massive blowby, oil consumption, and reduced power over time.
I'd still do the individual sleeve if Shad is OK with it, or do a full resleeve on your 3.0L block to use 95mm pistons (3.3L). The aftermarket cylinder sleeves are much tougher than factory, and you can run them a bit thinner.
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Yes Mac, this is a 3.0L block which has been bored to just a hair under 3.2L spec.
I'm waiting for some quotes to see the cost difference. Trust me, this block is not cheap either. Maybe just a hair. But it means getting my car finished sooner.
Nsxrookie, south Florida is full of bikini clad women, smooth roads, and no state taxes. :biggrin:
I'm waiting for some quotes to see the cost difference. Trust me, this block is not cheap either. Maybe just a hair. But it means getting my car finished sooner.
Nsxrookie, south Florida is full of bikini clad women, smooth roads, and no state taxes. :biggrin:
No new updates yet. I am growing so anxious to get my car back. So much so I have been driving the Korean land yacht around town on sport mode.... I think I will drop by DA this week to get the skinny and see how things are really progressing.
Adrian!!!!!Lol
Engine building takes time. Even the best builders will fall behind schedule so give them their space. You rather get things done right then them miss something and then the fingers game point and you're out another bill.
Just be thankful you have a good company doing the work, but still plan on it moving very slowly, going over budget, and also over deadline. It's the nature of the beast but the outcome is rewarding.
Just be thankful you have a good company doing the work, but still plan on it moving very slowly, going over budget, and also over deadline. It's the nature of the beast but the outcome is rewarding.
