Is Hyundai the new Honda?

[TURBO2GO]

Part of the secret is a big pocket book via gov't subsidies.

Last I checked South Korea is not big on natural resources like oil, gas, or precious metals. Not a big farming state, and not a great tourist destination either. Money comes in from industry so I am having a hard time seeing how the government would subsidize their industry when inudstry is where they get their revenue from!

There is the one fact that we pay for their military, have been for decades (don't go blaming Obama, he's the one that cut it back). So if there is a subsidy going one some place it is from us. LOL

 

[EZdoesIt]

Last I checked South Korea is not big on natural resources like oil, gas, or precious metals. Not a big farming state, and not a great tourist destination either. Money comes in from industry so I am having a hard time seeing how the government would subsidize their industry when inudstry is where they get their revenue from!

There is the one fact that we pay for their military, have been for decades (don't go blaming Obama, he's the one that cut it back). So if there is a subsidy going one some place it is from us. LOL

Well... I could go on on this topic but I won't :biggrin:

 

[TURBO2GO]

Well... I could go on on this topic but I won't :biggrin:

If its about Korea, do. If it's about our politics, don't.

You gotta admit what they are accomplishing is pretty amazing.

 

[jond]

Seems like all car makers go through phases and Hyundai has been smart.
Counter their image of poor reliability with a 100,000 mile warranty.
Counter their image of poor resale with a guarantee on trade-in.
Counter the fear of buying during a recession with a buy-back program if you lose your job.
Hyundai is smart. I'm curious how they do if the economy gets better.
Like McDonalds and Walmart, some things do better in recessions.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Seems like all car makers go through phases and Hyundai has been smart.
Counter their image of poor reliability with a 100,000 mile warranty.
Counter their image of poor resale with a guarantee on trade-in.
Counter the fear of buying during a recession with a buy-back program if you lose your job.
Hyundai is smart. I'm curious how they do if the economy gets better.
Like McDonalds and Wallmart, some things do better in recessions.

Exactly... and all those vehicle dynamics we make a big deal of... the average population could give a rat's ass. Not everyone reads car and driver. So in a way... they are already ahead.

 

[Gansan]

It's interesting the different perceptions I get from different people on Hyundai.

Coworkers who are not really car buffs are super impressed with the bold and sleek designs of new Hyundais. The looks of the car really matter in perception. Some of these guys acknowledge the good looks but don't want to consider the car because of its past reputation, but that might change over time.

People who work on cars for a living have a pretty bad impression of Hyundai's reliability and quality. Customers bring in their Hyundais to be worked on and so these mechanics see all the bad stuff that can happen under the shiny exterior. Granted, I'm sure many of these cars are older Hyundais, but the auto mechanics I know will never buy one for themselves.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Granted, I'm sure many of these cars are older Hyundais, but the auto mechanics I know will never buy one for themselves.

Fast and vast improvements over the years. They improve greatly EACH year. They are not junk by ANY means, and if these mechanics don't see that they are either working on old cars or have a real unfounded bias.

 

[Jetpilot3]

Don't really care about Honda anymore.:frown:

Until those "mass production" companies change their tune or improve their quality (I'm not saying reliability) but interior material quality then I'll continue to buy VW.

My 08 GTI interior is superb. Awesome materials and quiet. Not plasticky and squeeky like a Civic etc. Exhaust note, DSG transmission, turbo performance; how does Honda even compete? Tell me what does either brand (Honda or Hyundai) sell that would compete? Civic SI? Lame-o-la....OMG! the same 197hp its had since god knows how long...

I do give Hyundai props though...nice looking cars and brilliant marketing strategy to get people in them.

 

[Jetpilot3]

People who work on cars for a living have a pretty bad impression of Hyundai's reliability and quality. Customers bring in their Hyundais to be worked on and so these mechanics see all the bad stuff that can happen under the shiny exterior. Granted, I'm sure many of these cars are older Hyundais, but the auto mechanics I know will never buy one for themselves.

Hmmm....seems like the ol' Ford vs. Chevy comments you hear all of the time.

I tend to doubt your statement or else I can't see how Hyundai would back their cars for the massive warranties they include free of charge. They don't offer them knowing they'll pay out....

 

[s14_tat]

People who work on cars for a living have a pretty bad impression of Hyundai's reliability and quality. Customers bring in their Hyundais to be worked on and so these mechanics see all the bad stuff that can happen under the shiny exterior. Granted, I'm sure many of these cars are older Hyundais, but the auto mechanics I know will never buy one for themselves.

The reason why the mechanics only see the hyundai's with problems is because they are over 10 years old. Most newer hyundais are only serviced at the dealer due to its warranty. We almost never see new hyundai's for major work other than regular maintenance.

 

[EZdoesIt]

It's interesting the different perceptions I get from different people on Hyundai.

Coworkers who are not really car buffs are super impressed with the bold and sleek designs of new Hyundais. The looks of the car really matter in perception. Some of these guys acknowledge the good looks but don't want to consider the car because of its past reputation, but that might change over time.

People who work on cars for a living have a pretty bad impression of Hyundai's reliability and quality. Customers bring in their Hyundais to be worked on and so these mechanics see all the bad stuff that can happen under the shiny exterior. Granted, I'm sure many of these cars are older Hyundais, but the auto mechanics I know will never buy one for themselves.

Agree with this. Living in Socal I have friends who are effectively end-user test drivers for Honda and Audi. They both still feel Hyundai has got a long way to go in terms driving dynamics. Which is irrelevant for the person who needs just basic transportation. I still think the interior in the G-coupe is attrocious and not sure where all the praise is coming from. I'll make it a point to check out their other offerings... Right now, if I want a cheap commuter that's still fun it looks like the BRZ/FR-S is high on the list. Too bad it's not a real 4 seater which is a big point of compromise.

Again, I neither care or don't care about where Hyundai is now and how far they've come. I think they build decent cars that addresses the need for basic transportation. All the points that Jond has mentioned is just smart business (I commend them for that) it doesn't necessarily mean they make a very high quality car.. they may just make a car that's adequate. I don't own one.. that's just my impressions from close inspection.

The Genesis Coupe is still on my list but from what I've seen and driving impressions i've heard it's not high on the list anymore. I'll reserve final judgement until I drive one.

 

[s14_tat]

Agree with this. Living in Socal I have friends who are effectively end-user test drivers for Honda and Audi. They both still feel Hyundai has got a long way to go in terms driving dynamics. Which is irrelevant for the person who needs just basic transportation. I still think the interior in the G-coupe is attrocious and not sure where all the praise is coming from. I'll make it a point to check out their other offerings... Right now, if I want a cheap commuter that's still fun it looks like the BRZ/FR-S is high on the list. Too bad it's not a real 4 seater which is a big point of compromise.

Again, I neither care or don't care about where Hyundai is now and how far they've come. I think they build decent cars that addresses the need for basic transportation. All the points that Jond has mentioned is just smart business (I commend them for that) it doesn't necessarily mean they make a very high quality car.. they may just make a car that's adequate. I don't own one.. that's just my impressions from close inspection.

The Genesis Coupe is still on my list but from what I've seen and driving impressions i've heard it's not high on the list anymore. I'll reserve final judgement until I drive one.

You keep on bringing up the genesis coupe interior. Its a shame because that is the worse interior in their entire line up. Look at the sonata, a veloster, the kia optima, the Equus, the Genesis sedan. It makes the coupe's interior look and feel like crap by comparison.

 

[NsXMas]

^^ Exactly. Hyundai and Kia have the best interiors in their class. The Kia in particular has been chosen by automotive reviewers as one of the best interiors.

I have spent a lot of time on the Hyundai and Kia forums prior to making my purchase and after, and the mechanics on those forums say great things about these cars.

It's easy to spread FUD, but the reality is Hyundai / Kia is kicking butt while Honda sits idle.

 

[NsXMas]

I know... Yes, I was at the most recent LA Car show and I was shocked at how crappy the interior was in the G-Coupe. Admittedly I was not in the market for the other models so I did not inspect them. Perhaps the other models were better but the G-Coupe was horrible. I was especially annoyed with the window switch placement on the door. The plastics were horrible too.

I'm not expecting BMW quality but the fit and finish of a Honda Fit/Accord was much much better albeit the quality of the materials weren't too much better either.

Yes, I stand by the fact that the interior on the G-Coupe is awful.

I think it's all relative. The G-Coupe is definitely not the best, but not the worst either. Some of the Range Rovers have the window switch placements in the center console, as some of the Mercedes, which is awful imho.

 

[PoKnow]

Mine looks like this... I love it.

 

[EZdoesIt]

The interior in the pics provided look very nice! Glad to hear the G-coupe maybe the worse of the bunch. Well, not so glad since that car was on my short list.

At least we can all agree Honda is falling into the abyss.

 

[Gansan]

Hmmm....seems like the ol' Ford vs. Chevy comments you hear all of the time.

I tend to doubt your statement or else I can't see how Hyundai would back their cars for the massive warranties they include free of charge. They don't offer them knowing they'll pay out....

What statement do you doubt? That there are people I know who work on cars for a living and are not Hyundai fans? Should I get voice recordings of them saying so?

Or do you actually mean you doubt that Hyundais have problems? I think that might be due to the older cars that these guys work on. If Hyundai has made improvements to their cars recently, then obviously, the cars that come into get fixed will be the older models which are no longer taken to dealers.

As for 100K mile powertrain warranties, that's really something a manufacturer does to try to instill confidence in their product because they have an image problem. Not because they are necessarily superior.

 

[PHOEN$X]

I'm seeing more and more Hyundais in my work parking lot, and my coworkers are increasingly buzzing about them too. Funny but I can't recall seeing any late model Accords or Camrys, and not just because I find them bland. Reliable or not, I guess Hyundai is doing something right.

 

[Dhalsim]

KIA GT

 

[Vega$ NSX]

Here's what I said in this thread a few months back:

I am constantly getting more and more impressed with what Hyundai is putting out.

Is it just me, or is deja vu all over again? I mean isn't Hyundai doing, almost exactly what Honda did a couple of decades ago?

1: Start a motor company from nowhere.
2: Be the butt of every automotive joke.
3: Produce very inexpensive vehicles with the focus on value.
4: Continue to improve and advance while the manufacturers you aspire to, stagnate.
5: Grow beyond inexpensive economy cars, and focus on higher end sports and luxury, all the while providing comparable cars for less than the established manufacturers.
6: Produce a flagship, mid engine sports car to show the world you can compete with the best of them.
7: Actually become a well recognized, quality manufacturer.

Haven't we've seen this script before? Looks like Hyundai is round step 5, working their way up to 6.

 

[NSX-C2]

Will we be ditching our NSXs to buy the up coming mid engined flagship from Hyundai in step 6? Does Honda want to find out the answer?

 

[Track Addict]

Hyundai has a ton of money and nothing to lose with building cars that are, "on the edge" whereas Honda has a well established reputation for building "green" cars. Even when the NSX debuted it was hailed as a "green" exotic.


Honda will put something out eventually that will quell our belly aching...whether or not it will make our jaws drop is doubtful.

Hyundai is the "young gun" and is doing very well for itself. Kudos.

 

[Gansan]

Here's an interesting thought experiment.

Suppose Hyundai decided to make their own affordable exotic sports car?

It would be:

• mid engine
• v6 or v8 engine
• 430+ hp @ 8200 rpm
• double wishbones all around
• handling tuned by Sebastian Vettel (or your favorite suitable celebrity)
• about 3000 lbs.
• about $90K
• Exotic styling with the same design language as their latest cars

Think GT-R but lighter. Would we all consider it? I'm thinking yes. The next few years would be a great time for them to create themselves a halo car to show the world they have grown up.

 

[MoogieBoogie]

Last I checked South Korea is not big on natural resources like oil, gas, or precious metals. Not a big farming state, and not a great tourist destination either. Money comes in from industry so I am having a hard time seeing how the government would subsidize their industry when inudstry is where they get their revenue from!

There is the one fact that we pay for their military, have been for decades (don't go blaming Obama, he's the one that cut it back). So if there is a subsidy going one some place it is from us. LOL

I'm offended by your statement.

First, South Korea has a burden sharing agreement for the US military presence there. A simple google search turned up this article on Politifact. So no, South Korea doesn't get free military defense from the USA. Korea helps cover at least some of the cost ($678M according to the article).

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-trump-says-south-korea-doesnt-pay-us-troop-/

Second, South Korea is an ally with the US, as both military and trading partners. South Korea sent over 300,000 troops to support the US and UN forces during the Vietnam War. South Korea was also the third largest military presence in Iraq, after the US and GB. The two countries recently signed a free trade agreement. As a friendly country to the US, I find it offensive that you imply Korea is free-loading off its friend.

Finally, Korea has a culture as rich and vast as other Asian countries. It actually is a popular tourist destination area in Asia. According to Wikipedia, it was the 36th most visited city in 2007.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_South_Korea

I also fail to understand your logic behind Korea only getting revenue from industry so it would be unable to subsidize industry. There are several different industries that provide revenue to the Korean government. Wouldn't the government be able to subsidize one industry over another? ie. revenues from tech industries provide bailout funds for auto industry?

In any case, you should be more careful with your assumptions as they can be offensive to some people.

 

[Yawwn]

I'm offended by your statement.

First, South Korea has a burden sharing agreement for the US military presence there. A simple google search turned up this article on Politifact. So no, South Korea doesn't get free military defense from the USA. Korea helps cover at least some of the cost ($678M according to the article).

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-trump-says-south-korea-doesnt-pay-us-troop-/

Second, South Korea is an ally with the US, as both military and trading partners. South Korea sent over 300,000 troops to support the US and UN forces during the Vietnam War. South Korea was also the third largest military presence in Iraq, after the US and GB. The two countries recently signed a free trade agreement. As a friendly country to the US, I find it offensive that you imply Korea is free-loading off its friend.

Finally, Korea has a culture as rich and vast as other Asian countries. It actually is a popular tourist destination area in Asia. According to Wikipedia, it was the 36th most visited city in 2007.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_South_Korea

I also fail to understand your logic behind Korea only getting revenue from industry so it would be unable to subsidize industry. There are several different industries that provide revenue to the Korean government. Wouldn't the government be able to subsidize one industry over another? ie. revenues from tech industries provide bailout funds for auto industry?

In any case, you should be more careful with your assumptions as they can be offensive to some people.

+1
Well said and researched.