that sizing looks good. i'm on the fence about different/unique finishes. lately i've been considering moving my nsx back to the stock(ish) look as it really allows the timeless style of the nsx to really shine. i'd consider other colors too, but the standard 02+ "polished" style would definitely be high on my list.
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I can make forged 02+ replicas in 17/18 stagger
- Thread starter TURBO2GO
- Start date
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Will these clear stoptechs?
I really like the idea of completely stock looking wheels but with better offsets and diameters. I have a couple of questions: Q-1), in order to maintain the 'stock' wheel look, I'm assuming that the decrease in offset (~ 55mm to 40mm) would come via an increase in the thickness of the mounting flange on each wheel. To compensate for a thicker flange, the lug bores in the wheels would be deepened to keep the stock lug stud lengths and acorn style stock lug nuts. Is this the design plan for the wheels? Q-2), what would the approximate weight difference between the 17/18 wheels vs stock 17/17 (+02)? Put me down as very interested in a set of 17/18 wheels.
Yes to question 1.
Don't know to question 2. Most likely not quite as light. Factory units are forged, smaller in width, smaller in diameter, and have less metal in the hub section. More metal plus lack of forging will mean slightly more weight. Forged will cost 4K plus.... It's not easy to make fully forged wheels. I think that kind of pricing is too rich for most people's blood. Of course I will do whatever I can to keep them light and strong.
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Yes
Don't know to question 2. Most likely not quite as light. Factory units are forged, smaller in width, smaller in diameter, and have less metal in the hub section. More metal plus lack of forging will mean slightly more weight. Forged will cost 4K plus.... It's not easy to make fully forged wheels. I think that kind of pricing is too rich for most people's blood. Of course I will do whatever I can to keep them light and strong.
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Yes
And not 18x9.5? Did you read my reasoning for opting for a 9.5 rear instead of a 10" rear. I will make whatever people want, but first I would like to hear a good reason why a 10 is better than a 9.5. He may come back to me and say for cost or production reasons it must be a 10 and then I would go with it. But I think there is some valid reason to go for a 9.5. I want to emphasize to the guys that don't really get all the wheel-spec talk, that I feel a 9.5 will give better fit and performance with the tires we use most. I have adjusted the ET on the 9.5 to give the same flushness. I personally run 18x9 right now.
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I would be interested in 17x8 & 18x10 too . for maximum rubber width.
What size are you planning on installing? A 9.5 can handle up to a 285 section width and I almost never see anyone put that on an NSX, mostly 265, 255, and some 275. And as I've stated, unless someone proves to me a performance advantage on the NSX of a 10" over a 9.5", I can't alienate the guys that are more conservative for the guys that want to go very aggressive. I want to meet a middle ground, and I don't particularly want to sacrifice an ounce of performance for a look a few may like better on their NSX. Again, a 10" wheel puts a slight stretch on a 265, and an even greater stretch on a 255, which is the most correct size to keep OEM ratios on any car newer than a 1994. That keeps the TCS the happiest. If someone wants something very wide on their NSX there are lots of aftermarket options. Why get an OEM replica. "Maximum rubber width" is a rather general statement. I've created this thread to discuss this very stuff, but I've been clear I feel a 9.5" wheel is lighter and a better fit than a 10. If some of you guys want to go with a 10" I need some valid reasons. Let's not do something because that's been common in the past. The reason I sold so many Advans in 18x10 and 18x9 is that there was no 18x9.5. The reason we see a lot of 10" rears isn't based on performances criteria, it is based on what is available.
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I don't want the sidewalls sitting square to the lip. I like the tires stretched within reason gives more clearance in the wheel wells for those of us that have our cars set up low and still trying to keep the suspension adjustments as close to stock as possible. I don't want to go with a smaller tire to get the clearance. Most aftermarket wheels at 10" in the rear arnt they? I believe the wheels I have now are 10" wide with a 265 and the tires fit perfect and have just the right amount of clearance. If I put a wider tire on my wheel it will rub.
With a 17x8 front tire, it will give you a slight stretch with a 215/40/17 (on most tires) - if you want the amount of stretch to match then I would say a 10" rear - keep in mind it is not too much of a stretch (I currently have 265's on a 10.5)
If you are going to stay conservative then why bother making wheels - I almost wanted to say 18x10.5 rears!
If you are dead-set on a 18x9.5 rear wheel then I think a 17x7.5 or eve 17x7 front would be a better match - but then we already have the factory wheels now don't we...
As most of us know, there is a big width difference from tire to tire, I have even seen OEM 17" rears with 255's that looked a bit stretched - it all depends on the tire you use.
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I should also note that a +30 rear wheel on a stock height car will likely stick out - I like the idea if making the pad thicker and maybe not drilling the lug holes as deep to allow machining the offset.
If you are going to stay conservative then why bother making wheels - I almost wanted to say 18x10.5 rears!
If you are dead-set on a 18x9.5 rear wheel then I think a 17x7.5 or eve 17x7 front would be a better match - but then we already have the factory wheels now don't we...
As most of us know, there is a big width difference from tire to tire, I have even seen OEM 17" rears with 255's that looked a bit stretched - it all depends on the tire you use.
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I should also note that a +30 rear wheel on a stock height car will likely stick out - I like the idea if making the pad thicker and maybe not drilling the lug holes as deep to allow machining the offset.
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What do you mean by Most? On Advan RS we do 10 because that is what is available. On Enkei Kojin and certain weds we do 9.5 because that is what is available. The popularity isn't necessarily based on the science of it, it is based on availability.
You have a very popular sized tire. For that tire, an ideal size is 9.5", not 10". 9.5 sets you exactly in the middle of its limits. For a 255 tire, which many use, a 10" is really on the edge of that tire likes to see. What is it you are worried about? you'd basically have the same exact fit as you do now with a happier rear tire, and less weight.
What would the benefit of a 10.5 be for you? It's just going to continue to make the wheels heavier.
The offset on its own is not the determining factor on how much a wheel sticks out. You know that. I dropped wheel width 1/2". That places it 6 mm further in. Going from an ET of 35 to 30 pushes it 5 mm back out. So really, it is 1mm further in than the size you are recommending. I am running an ET of 25 on my own car BTW.
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I am in, I need to get my 18/19s HRE's off. I can see both arguments but I am leaning on the 9.5" I am no way a wheel expert but from the arguments put forward 18x9.5 gets my vote. I am running stoptechs so clearing those is number one to me, two for me would be weight but I know not everyone would be willing to pay the extra for forged, that being said I am and would love to get a set that was forged for strength, but it isn't a deal breaker for me. Third would be how flush they fit with a lowered stance, nothing to crazy from stock, and any issues with rubbing on a full turn of the wheel (I am also going to be running the downforce wider front fenders in the front so I will probably end up with a space in the front anyways). So I am in, and I vote for forged wheel if enough other people are interested. It seems if this is going to happen it will only happen once, might as well do it "right" IMO the best and not go cheap. If they are forged I would probably buy three sets. One to put on, one just incase, and one to make a profit on in a couple years 
You should really be making 10" wide minimum in the rear Dave, the stock wheel is already 9" wide so
1/2" is nothing to rave about. You cant just add negative offset to bring the wheel out IMO- you MUST have extra width to make the contact patch wider and make the wheels look good from the rear. Everybody pretty much wants 17x8 and 18x10... Otherwise your wheels will not be much different than stockers. Also, unless you're doing forged wheels like oem you are going to pay a big weight penalty with the cast wheels anyways. Most people will buy these wheels for looks, and cast wheels is the only way to make this viable enough for the market. Even a 10" wide rear is conservative as 11" will fit on a stock body without any poke at all. I understand the weight penalty is there for going wider but I bet you will find that these will just be some street wheels to floss around on for most people so most won't care as long as its not terrible. Just my take on it, having debated this idea with others.
1/2" is nothing to rave about. You cant just add negative offset to bring the wheel out IMO- you MUST have extra width to make the contact patch wider and make the wheels look good from the rear. Everybody pretty much wants 17x8 and 18x10... Otherwise your wheels will not be much different than stockers. Also, unless you're doing forged wheels like oem you are going to pay a big weight penalty with the cast wheels anyways. Most people will buy these wheels for looks, and cast wheels is the only way to make this viable enough for the market. Even a 10" wide rear is conservative as 11" will fit on a stock body without any poke at all. I understand the weight penalty is there for going wider but I bet you will find that these will just be some street wheels to floss around on for most people so most won't care as long as its not terrible. Just my take on it, having debated this idea with others.
OK, I will go to ten if others don't say so otherwise. But why is it none of you guys give me actual facts and data to bolster the 10" argument? I am giving you mine: Better tire fit, less weight. Saying "the factory is 9 so 9.5 is not enough" doesn't mean a whole lot. saying "This is the size tire to use and this is why, and this tire needs a 10" is something I can make sense of. Nero, you say "you can't add negative offset to bring the wheel out", but that is what it does. You also say "you must have extra width to make the contact patch wider and make the wheel look good from the rear". I don't get that. How is a wider wheel, going to make a contact patch wider? If you want the widest actual patch, then the PROPER sized wheel for the tire is what you should be using. But even if it did make the patch wider... how does that translate into looking better when it is the same size and section width tire? It's not like because you widened the wheel suddenly the tire looks wider from the back. My logic is based on math. I feel like we are just doing ten because well.... that's what we do a lot. But when I look at the numbers, the math tells me a 9.5" rear wheel is the most appropriate size of wheels for the tires we actually USE on the NSX.
I am not trying to be an ass... and I sincerely hope that a debate here does not lead to tempers flaring and people taking positions and being defensive. My goal in this is to help the community. I honestly don't even want the responsibility and the headaches of dealing with it all, but I am doing it. I don't think I even want a set. So what is my motivation? it's to do something no one else has been able to do and help everyone that has waited for so long. So far I have gotten a lot of arguments, but can someone tell me where the flaw in my logic is. One can also hellaflush an NSX to the max and put a 295/20 in the rear. But not everyone wants that. What is the goal here? It isn't JUST looks. And even if it was, I am unconvinced that a 10" LOOKS better than a 9.5. Go to any tire manufacturer's specs. On a 265, the ideal wheel size they recommend, is a 9.5. Not a ten. Ten is on the outer edge of fit. On a 255, 9.5 is on the outer edge and 10 is too wide. Are people reading these facts I am presenting? The size that best maintains TCS stability on a 215/40/17 front which 85% of everyone will be using, is a 255/35/18 rear. That tire simply sits better on a 9 or at most a 9.5" wheel than a 10" wheel.
Is that 10 just is a higher number and sounds better than 9.5? Should we forget the fact that a 255 rear is an ideal rear tire for many NSX's? Or that a 265 sits better on a 9.5? I need facts please. I do not want alienate anyone. I just feel it is healthy to really have this debate before I go and make a one-off wheel.
I am not trying to be an ass... and I sincerely hope that a debate here does not lead to tempers flaring and people taking positions and being defensive. My goal in this is to help the community. I honestly don't even want the responsibility and the headaches of dealing with it all, but I am doing it. I don't think I even want a set. So what is my motivation? it's to do something no one else has been able to do and help everyone that has waited for so long. So far I have gotten a lot of arguments, but can someone tell me where the flaw in my logic is. One can also hellaflush an NSX to the max and put a 295/20 in the rear. But not everyone wants that. What is the goal here? It isn't JUST looks. And even if it was, I am unconvinced that a 10" LOOKS better than a 9.5. Go to any tire manufacturer's specs. On a 265, the ideal wheel size they recommend, is a 9.5. Not a ten. Ten is on the outer edge of fit. On a 255, 9.5 is on the outer edge and 10 is too wide. Are people reading these facts I am presenting? The size that best maintains TCS stability on a 215/40/17 front which 85% of everyone will be using, is a 255/35/18 rear. That tire simply sits better on a 9 or at most a 9.5" wheel than a 10" wheel.
Is that 10 just is a higher number and sounds better than 9.5? Should we forget the fact that a 255 rear is an ideal rear tire for many NSX's? Or that a 265 sits better on a 9.5? I need facts please. I do not want alienate anyone. I just feel it is healthy to really have this debate before I go and make a one-off wheel.
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They look better. And the whole point of aftermarket wheels/non oem is looks/more tire width etc. Running a 285 or whatever you mentioned before on a 9.5 is NOT a good idea. I wouldn't suggest a 285... but many like 265 and certainly 275 which fit a 10" much better.
10" wide is just a better overall idea, and that's what the people are asking for!
10" wide is just a better overall idea, and that's what the people are asking for!
Dave the average nsx owner is not going to post..the guys posting are more extreme and are looking at this subjectively..because you asked...but I'm with you 255-265 tires fit just fine on a 9.5 wheel.....and the purpose or intent I gather was to offer a oem like look for less $. I have been using a 275 width tire as a track tire for ever on a 9.5 wheel...looks and works great.
I'd prefer to stick with 17X8 front and 18X9.5 rear.
Maybe this is not directly applicable - but I have a Pantera and many Pantera owners have gone to extra wide aftermarket rear wheels and tires to get the big meat on the rear. Unfortunately the front tire & wheel width, similar to NSX, is restricted to roughly stock width because of body work and suspension interference. To me, the cosmetic result of very wide rears and relatively skinny fronts often gives these Panteras an unappealing 'funny car' look. Wider rear tires compared to the front also affects overall handling as the balance is changed so that the front tends to push more (understeers) when cornering hard.
For my NSX, my personal preference is to keep the rear wheels closer to stock width. I don't want 'big meat' on the back.
Maybe this is not directly applicable - but I have a Pantera and many Pantera owners have gone to extra wide aftermarket rear wheels and tires to get the big meat on the rear. Unfortunately the front tire & wheel width, similar to NSX, is restricted to roughly stock width because of body work and suspension interference. To me, the cosmetic result of very wide rears and relatively skinny fronts often gives these Panteras an unappealing 'funny car' look. Wider rear tires compared to the front also affects overall handling as the balance is changed so that the front tends to push more (understeers) when cornering hard.
For my NSX, my personal preference is to keep the rear wheels closer to stock width. I don't want 'big meat' on the back.
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Start with these facts:
Most 215/40-17 tires are approved for wheel widths of 7.0-8.5".
Most 255/35-18 tires are approved for wheel widths of 8.5-10.0".
Most 265/35-18 tires are approved for wheel widths of 9.0-10.5".
In general, you don't want to be at the extreme ends of those ranges. Why? At the low end, because they make the tires look "bulging". At the high end, because they make the tires look "stretched". Also, if you're at the high end, it increases the chances that the tire sidewall doesn't stick out further than the wheel does - which means you run a BIG risk of the wheels getting damaged ("curbing") when you're parking alongside a curb. BAD idea.
If you want to keep away from the ends of those ranges of widths, and you want to make them fit both sizes of rear tires, they ought to be 17x7.5 or 17x8 in the front, and 18x9.5 in the rear. You really don't want to go 18x10 in the rear, because that exposes those with 255/35-18 rear tires to substantial risk of curbing damage (and it means greater risk of damage for those with 265/35-18 tires than with an 18x9.5 wheel, too).
Most 215/40-17 tires are approved for wheel widths of 7.0-8.5".
Most 255/35-18 tires are approved for wheel widths of 8.5-10.0".
Most 265/35-18 tires are approved for wheel widths of 9.0-10.5".
In general, you don't want to be at the extreme ends of those ranges. Why? At the low end, because they make the tires look "bulging". At the high end, because they make the tires look "stretched". Also, if you're at the high end, it increases the chances that the tire sidewall doesn't stick out further than the wheel does - which means you run a BIG risk of the wheels getting damaged ("curbing") when you're parking alongside a curb. BAD idea.
If you want to keep away from the ends of those ranges of widths, and you want to make them fit both sizes of rear tires, they ought to be 17x7.5 or 17x8 in the front, and 18x9.5 in the rear. You really don't want to go 18x10 in the rear, because that exposes those with 255/35-18 rear tires to substantial risk of curbing damage (and it means greater risk of damage for those with 265/35-18 tires than with an 18x9.5 wheel, too).
This is a big issue, and an important advantage which you can rarely find in aftermarket wheels. It's not just a performance issue; it's also a reliability issue. I know a lot of folks who get aftermarket wheels with a different bore, and they encounter one problem after another - problems with vibrations (even if they do everything right when tightening the lug nuts on the car), problems with finding and fitting hubcentric rings, etc. If you can find aftermarket wheels with the exact centerbore you need, that's a HUGE advantage.
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