How Profitable is a Race Track?

Alittleboost · 1 June 2005

My buddy and I were talking the other day, since we just go back from streets of willow.

How profitable is a race track?...I'm thinking decent to good, because it only takes the initial investment in land. But there could be other factors, such as: design (3-D or other computer designs), R & D, Material, and maitance....but in the end its just a patch of road....i'm not sure if they use different material, but maybe the high end ones do. But at Willow Springs, it just seems like regular road but only thicker.

I'm thinking that is not bad, there will always be racers and car enthusiast for a while....at least still in my lifetime.

So is it just build it, maintain it, and race on it?

Input guys?

Dave Hardy · 1 June 2005

General wisdom is that you will never make money on a racetrack. There is the land, then figure anywhere from a couple of hundred thousand up to a few million for paving and facilites. It takes a while to recoupe that at $1000 - $2000 / day, renting maybe 100 days a year.

Russ · 1 June 2005

Ask the owners of Bridgehampton :frown:

NSX-Racer · 1 June 2005

Nearly no racetrack in the world is profitable alone without regarding the economic enviroment (shops, hotels, restaurants etc.).

Here in europe you pay about 7000 Euros a day for a private non-FIA-race approved track including medical, surveying and technical staff (to pull you out of the gravel), about 15,000 Euros for bigger and race approved tracks and up to 30,000 for the best tracks (e.g. Paul Ricard, F1 test track and personal property of Bernie Ecclestone). None of them makes real profit (okay, maybe Bernie's place).

The real profit is made by the surrounding economy with participants and spectators. So usualy it's the community in the region that really pays for the track.

92 white 0650 · 1 June 2005

Nearly no racetrack in the world is profitable alone

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, not so sure about that here in Central CA. Thunderhill is owned by the San Fran region of SCCA and with very low overhead and the track rented 99% of the time, I know they're profitable. I'd be willing to bet the same applies to Buttonwillow, owned by that region of SCCA. And Laguna is run by a non-profit organization and with their attitude and prices, you know they make money. Don't know about Infineon, but there's 3 out of 4 in my backyard.

Who was it was saying Japanese tracks charge $2000/driver for a track day due to demand?

docjohn · 1 June 2005

From what I can see,to start your own for profit track you will need lots of capital,paving alone is half a million for starters.Then the whole problem of getting the propper permits can crush the deal.The wave of the present and future is to generate up front $ by starting country club like share arrangements,in essence guarenteeing income.Also if you are serious you need to sign some pro series,bikes or cars.To just build your own course and hope to recoup your capital by selling days is folly,unless you are a multy millionare :wink:

NetViper · 1 June 2005

I was told that texas motor sports ranch, where we had NSXPO2002, cost 7 million to build and it was not very large!

Alittleboost · 1 June 2005

Thanks for the input....Yeah i know the permits and such would be a hassel..but its just a thought, or a dream to own one, not private but it would be awesome if it was FIA approved and we got F1 to come over.

What do you think about getting sponsorship?......like car manufactures, that get special discounts to use the track as R&D? or maybe even car magazines that use the track....I can think of many ways to maybe keep the track in business but the main thought in mind is how to get investors?

I'm pretty sure many so-cal people are sick of making the long trek to willow or button....forget about seca, and thunder...unless u plan on making it a weekend adventure.

Wouldn't a race track near irvine be awesome? :biggrin: .......yeah it would cost $$

rickysals · 1 June 2005

sponsorship would be tough unless u have F1 or NASCAR or a very widely known circuit there. It's one thing to have companies sponsor things with like $500 or $1,000.. It's another to get them to shell out milions of dollars.

This is one of my dreams in life, to build an amazing road course to rival the best in the world. Will it ever happen... who knows? But if I don't try it will never happen anyways, lol...

Good luck man, it'd be sweet, but I believe that the estimates here are low...

I have no experience at all, but I'd estimate like atleast $25 million right?! Depending on the land you have to move and shape, landscaping, you'd need buildings too, pits, administrative offices, garages, think about EVERYTHING encompassed in a racetrack. I think it would be very expensive.

I don't know how profitable they are, cuz I don't know how the money works with them getting money. But it'd be so awesome to just go drive around whenever u wanted haha,

NSXDreamer2 · 3 June 2005

I'm glad you guys pointing it out... If I ever won Mega Million (note: the little lotto ticket won't do

) Mark my word that I will build a Race track, complete with mini track (For testing / karting) , then a community and maybe even a pass to part of the track, (you know like those premium Apartments / houses at golf club ), Big Auto "strip" mall... Yeah, that's my fantasy, where all motorheads live together, where all buildings feature double vane glasses, so rest assure Tubi exhaust Ferrari will be appreciated when it fire up at 7am Sunday morning.... well, look at my screen name, I do dream a lot....

NSX-Racer · 3 June 2005

Dreamer, your dream already exists somewhere in spain: A community like the one John Travolta lives in, but with a racetrack instead of an airport. I saw that in TV a while ago but can't remember the name of the facility and also was not able to find the website in spain, bummer.

What I remember is that you can buy or build a house there with the permission to use the racetrack - would be much cheaper than building and maintaining your own track.

edit: Just found that on msnbc:

In southern Spain, Dutch oil tycoon and racing enthusiast Klaas Zwart will soon open the Ascari Race Resort in a grassy oak-studded valley near Ronda. The camp will feature a custom-designed, 5,425-meter Formula One race course that re-creates features pluck-ed from legendary European tracks like the Paddock Hill Bend at Britain's Brands Hatch and the Eau Rouge curve from Spa, Belgium. Campers will be able to drive exotic cars (like Ascari's own KZ1; top speed over 320kph) as fast as their makers intended. Slated for completion in 2006, Ascari's promoters are promising a unique fusion of "high-speed adrenaline and luxurious relaxation."

It seems that the ressort is already open - the link is here, not sure if that is what I had in mind but I will keep on searching.

NSXLuvr · 3 June 2005

you can try the country club approach that has been sucessful lately.

Also, MSR in Fortworth has Condo's with 3-6 car garages so that u don't have to trailer to the track. Pretty good idea IMHO.

http://www.motorsportranch.com/

nuccaJB · 3 June 2005

South of where I live in Joliet IL there is Autobahn Country Club. I think it is like 25k to join and then you can by a lot and build any kind of garage you want. A patient of mine's brother goes there and he races his Stradale. He also took another Doc I know who has a Noble M12. It has two tracks that they can link into one.

SilverOne · 4 June 2005

Alittleboost said:
Wouldn't a race track near irvine be awesome? :biggrin: .......yeah it would cost $$

Yes it would be awesome! I'd definitely patron and support the track

But, city of Irvine is quite strict, good luck getting a biz license for it.

Alittleboost · 7 June 2005

SilverOne said:
Yes it would be awesome! I'd definitely patron and support the track But, city of Irvine is quite strict, good luck getting a biz license for it.

Its just a thought.....something to maybe someday come true. But for now a fatansy, but hey everything awesome starts with a dream. A country club idea is awesome....but it would even better to make it public, but hey...who has any knowledge of land development?

Klayton · 7 June 2005

NSXDreamer2 said:
I'm glad you guys pointing it out... If I ever won Mega Million (note: the little lotto ticket won't do ) Mark my word that I will build a Race track, complete with mini track (For testing / karting) , then a community and maybe even a pass to part of the track, (you know like those premium Apartments / houses at golf club ), Big Auto "strip" mall... Yeah, that's my fantasy, where all motorheads live together, where all buildings feature double vane glasses, so rest assure Tubi exhaust Ferrari will be appreciated when it fire up at 7am Sunday morning.... well, look at my screen name, I do dream a lot....

*sigh* nice dream

How Profitable is a Race Track?

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