How much of your annual income did your NSX cost you?
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MF-DIF said:
wouldn't your company help you sell the house if you'd have to move for professional reasons ? I'd say buy a small house/condo/townhouse you can afford for the same price you pay rent and start building some equity instead of "loosing" 100% of your money in rent.
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The point you are missing is that you will NOT be able to live as a student once you're out of the student world. And how does an NSX looks pulling in the drive-through window of a fast food ? Do you think the dates you'll be getting wont think you're cheap since you drive such a car and you live like a student ?MF-DIF said:
Disclaimer: I am not referring to the lucky students whose daddy bought them the latest 911/M3/... This dude is obviously the one paying for the car)
My advice to you is to wait patiently some 2 more years and SAVE into a savings account the $$$ you'd be making payments with. For these 2 years, the interests will work FOR you instead of AGAINST you. This way you'll even find out for sure if you can REALLY live on $600 a month. Plus, in 2 years, when you'll have saved about $10,000 (24 months *$400 + Interests) you'll know for sure if you'd like to use the $10,000 for an NSX or for something else more important at that time in your life. If the NSX is still your thing, then you'll have a by-2 years newer car than if you'd buy it now, for the same price as you'd pay today. Plus, with such a downpayment, your loan will be much more "friendly" to your pocket... Just my $0.02
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MF-DIF said:First post so greetings to all.What pertcentage of your annual income did your guys NSX's cost you total?
...and to answer your questions, less than 15%, which is about the right amount qualifying de facto that you can actually afford it. (30% house, 30% living expenses, 30% savings, 10% Misc)
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I am really enjoying reading this thread! There are a lot of years wisdom in the words above, both for and against buying your NSX now... <br>
MF-DIF... I am 27 now, and have only had my 91 X for a year (it was about 10% of my income at that time) I would say from reading over your money situation, that the best thing you could do for yourself is to wait a few years before buying the car. I don't think you will have any more enjoyment from the car now as opposed to a few years from now, and you need to be in a better financial position to own/maintain a car like the NSX, and more importantly, you need to start to establish yourself in a career path and some sort of investment portfolio (and I agree with your father that it should concentrate in real-estate).
I say this because I really don't think buying a car like this should effect someone's financial future and it will strongly effect yours at this time in your life. Above and beyond the cost of buying the car, insuring, and maintaining it, it will cost you the ability to invest money in assets that you can use to make you more money. I am lucky enough to have my own business that is doing well now ... and just this week I found a car I have been wanting for quite awhile (01 M5). I can afford it easily, it is a fantastic deal, and I really want to own it ... but after talking to my fiance, we have decided it better to pass and invest the money in an asset ... there's plenty of time in the future for toys!
MF-DIF... I am 27 now, and have only had my 91 X for a year (it was about 10% of my income at that time) I would say from reading over your money situation, that the best thing you could do for yourself is to wait a few years before buying the car. I don't think you will have any more enjoyment from the car now as opposed to a few years from now, and you need to be in a better financial position to own/maintain a car like the NSX, and more importantly, you need to start to establish yourself in a career path and some sort of investment portfolio (and I agree with your father that it should concentrate in real-estate).
I say this because I really don't think buying a car like this should effect someone's financial future and it will strongly effect yours at this time in your life. Above and beyond the cost of buying the car, insuring, and maintaining it, it will cost you the ability to invest money in assets that you can use to make you more money. I am lucky enough to have my own business that is doing well now ... and just this week I found a car I have been wanting for quite awhile (01 M5). I can afford it easily, it is a fantastic deal, and I really want to own it ... but after talking to my fiance, we have decided it better to pass and invest the money in an asset ... there's plenty of time in the future for toys!
Another thing you might want to bear in mind is the pain in having to part ways with your NSX in the unfortunate event that you start to realize that you really can't afford the maintenance and the repairs (it's going to be an old car, remember) and everything else that piles up after initially taking possession of the car. You want to buy the car for the enjoyment of it, but the possibility of it becoming a (financial) burden could turn your dream into a nightmare. I've had two NSXs, and it was with great reluctance that I had to sell the first. And you know what? After having driven an NSX, every other car short of a McLaren F1 is going to leave you very disappointed.
But if you really know what you're doing, and you know you can afford the day to day maintenance of the car, all I can say is take extra special care in inspecting the car before you buy it. The last thing you'd want is to get hit with big bills while you're still in your honeymoon period because you suddenly realize that, after having driven the car for only 2,000 miles, you need new tires, and new brake pads, and a new timing belt, and the A/C stops working, and maybe a new battery, etc.
Sorry for being so long-winded.
But if you really know what you're doing, and you know you can afford the day to day maintenance of the car, all I can say is take extra special care in inspecting the car before you buy it. The last thing you'd want is to get hit with big bills while you're still in your honeymoon period because you suddenly realize that, after having driven the car for only 2,000 miles, you need new tires, and new brake pads, and a new timing belt, and the A/C stops working, and maybe a new battery, etc.
Sorry for being so long-winded.
FWIW - I spent about 8% of my income on the NSX, including maintenance items that were due. Any more than 10% would seem too high to me, although people do it all the time. I'd rather have the bulk of my income available for savings, investing, real estate, and emergencies. Life is no fun when you are always stretched to the breaking point - it's really only a matter of time before something happens that pushes you into the swirling vortex of uncontrollable debt.
Hey everyone! I'm a poor college student also hoping to own an NSX one day (hopefully an X2 by the time I'm in the market for one 
), and I find all of your comments very helpful and informative!
After considering you guys' comments, my plan after graduating in a few years is...
1) Get a good job.
2) Get a beater car.
3) Get a house (ideally with a garage for the X)
4) Invest/ go on business ventures (real estate, etc...)
4) Get NSX.
Hopefully things will work out as planned one of these days...but for now, I just gotta focus on my studies and stop day dreaming about owning an NSX too much!
), and I find all of your comments very helpful and informative!After considering you guys' comments, my plan after graduating in a few years is...
1) Get a good job.
2) Get a beater car.
3) Get a house (ideally with a garage for the X)
4) Invest/ go on business ventures (real estate, etc...)
4) Get NSX.
Hopefully things will work out as planned one of these days...but for now, I just gotta focus on my studies and stop day dreaming about owning an NSX too much!
I read somewhere (banking/investment strategies) that you should not buy a car that costs more than 33% of your net incomes, this when you are planning to use the car for 4-5 years.
I paid more than that (but not by a lot) because I consider that car nuts it should be ok to exceed... the car is can also be budgeted under "Hobby" in our case!
I paid more than that (but not by a lot) because I consider that car nuts it should be ok to exceed... the car is can also be budgeted under "Hobby" in our case!
gheba_nsx said:I read somewhere (banking/investment strategies) that you should not buy a car that costs more than 33% of your net incomes, this when you are planning to use the car for 4-5 years.
I paid more than that (but not by a lot) because I consider that car nuts it should be ok to exceed... the car is can also be budgeted under "Hobby" in our case!
That 33% guideline: is that the full price of the NSX, or minus the value of your trade-in?
If it's the latter, what I paid was right around 33%. That seemed a little high--I wouldn't recommend that everyone spend that much--but I have no debt, no rent (house is paid for), and no dependents.
I also told myself the "rules of thumb don't apply to car nuts and NSXs" line.
And... I expect to drive the NSX for more than 4-5 years.
If I remember correctely it was the complete price, indipendently of your trade-in (after all the trade-in value is net-value on your side).
Here are some scary statistics from Feb. 2004 Money magazine pg. 145
In California 40% of all car buyers are upside down in the loan.
down payments on an average are now just 5%. Historically down payments were 10-15%
The average car payment is $453/month down from $470/month as the average car price raises to $25,523.
Almost 40% of new car loans are financed longer than 60 months, up from 24% last year. Leaving the average loan length at 63 months
30% of the buyers borrow for 72 month term and some banks are now going out as far as 96 months
In California 40% of all car buyers are upside down in the loan.
down payments on an average are now just 5%. Historically down payments were 10-15%
The average car payment is $453/month down from $470/month as the average car price raises to $25,523.
Almost 40% of new car loans are financed longer than 60 months, up from 24% last year. Leaving the average loan length at 63 months
30% of the buyers borrow for 72 month term and some banks are now going out as far as 96 months
This is an easy one, but hits me close to home. I graduated from FSU (in Tallahassee). I realize how MF-DIF feels, the town is quite easy to live in, and incredibly cheap.
I don't think it makes sense at all to purchase a 25,000 car at this point. Any "unexpected" expense or life change blows the budget. For example....
* NSX repairs and maintenance (already mentioned, but I thought i was worth repeating)
* The opposite sex
* vacations?
* Christmas/Birthdays
* transfer for your job? (budget probably wouldn't work in another city)
I don't believe you have to purchase a house before a car, or be making money by the boatload, but you definately should be a little further ahead. You don't want to be constrained financially at this point in your life, it's just not wise.
Having to sell a NSX at a loss due to a minor life change will hurt, bad. Wait a couple years and save up a substancial down payment. Then you can really enjoy the car.
I don't think it makes sense at all to purchase a 25,000 car at this point. Any "unexpected" expense or life change blows the budget. For example....
* NSX repairs and maintenance (already mentioned, but I thought i was worth repeating)
* The opposite sex
* vacations?
* Christmas/Birthdays
* transfer for your job? (budget probably wouldn't work in another city)
I don't believe you have to purchase a house before a car, or be making money by the boatload, but you definately should be a little further ahead. You don't want to be constrained financially at this point in your life, it's just not wise.
Having to sell a NSX at a loss due to a minor life change will hurt, bad. Wait a couple years and save up a substancial down payment. Then you can really enjoy the car.
MF-DIF , gheba_nsx does bring up a good question:
Do you consider yourself Car Nutz?? Which, actually by my defination is that your priorities are always Cars, Cars and cars???
I think I only do a little bit better than your annual income, however, since I have been practicing saving more than one pay check every month (I have a bi weekly pay period)... I bite the silver bullet and bought my X... I can not be happier...
Not to say I'm doing the best thing for me financially/ socially, but the nsx means a lot to me that It is the Best Thing in my life. Yes, I remembered someone here mentioned, "it's better than Sex". Yeap, wait until I take it to the track.
I managed to have a weekend job to make the car payment. At your age, that could be the option. Yes, it will make your social life mesarable, but if you value other stuff better than the nsx... Then I'll join everyone here to tell you "wait and save up more".
I don't make a lot of money, but I think I managed my money pretty well off... An Example, a lot of people, especially new grads from College, would think $7 lunch is normal. Lets see you have 52 wks with 5 days work, If you save $4.50, you'll get $97.5 in a month. If you put a lot of thinking on the money u spent everyday, you'll find a lot of savings. That of course, based on that you in case valued cars as important as I do...
Do you consider yourself Car Nutz?? Which, actually by my defination is that your priorities are always Cars, Cars and cars???
I think I only do a little bit better than your annual income, however, since I have been practicing saving more than one pay check every month (I have a bi weekly pay period)... I bite the silver bullet and bought my X... I can not be happier...
Not to say I'm doing the best thing for me financially/ socially, but the nsx means a lot to me that It is the Best Thing in my life. Yes, I remembered someone here mentioned, "it's better than Sex". Yeap, wait until I take it to the track.
I managed to have a weekend job to make the car payment. At your age, that could be the option. Yes, it will make your social life mesarable, but if you value other stuff better than the nsx... Then I'll join everyone here to tell you "wait and save up more".
I don't make a lot of money, but I think I managed my money pretty well off... An Example, a lot of people, especially new grads from College, would think $7 lunch is normal. Lets see you have 52 wks with 5 days work, If you save $4.50, you'll get $97.5 in a month. If you put a lot of thinking on the money u spent everyday, you'll find a lot of savings. That of course, based on that you in case valued cars as important as I do...
I've just turned 22 and I've had my X for 4 months now and it costs me 25% of my net income. I sold the M3 my parents gave me as a present and used the money to buy a house and bought the X in my own name from the money I saved. Can't beat that feeling having things in your own name and being able to afford it.
Oh yeah the X is way better than the M3.
Now saving up for a 3.2 or some serious NA mods.
Oh yeah the X is way better than the M3.
Now saving up for a 3.2 or some serious NA mods.
nkb said:
Probably it also includes repair & insurance for expensive cars and also the amount of money that you leave "invested" in the car... this is indeopendednt from what you owe on the car. Anyway it is only a very approximate rule to say that a car that costs 40%-50% of your NET income is maybe too high.
nsx ownership
IM 21 paid cash for 91 red/black with very low miles and its for sell I now wish to sell so I can get the 04
IM 21 paid cash for 91 red/black with very low miles and its for sell I now wish to sell so I can get the 04
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Re: nsx ownership
Since you are 21 and said that YOU paid cash for a 91 with very low mileage, let's do some math (with some assumptions):
Assumptions:
-you got your 91 with very low mileage, say at a bargain price of $30,000, from money you earned and saved.
-you dropped out of school early in order to maximize the time you are working.
-of course, you do not live with your parents/relatives and pay your own taxes, groceries, housing, insurance,...
-you put aside 10% of your salary in savings for the NSX
21-14=7 years of working experience
$30,000/7= $4286 per year that you saved to buy your NSX cash.
$4286/10% = $42,860 average net yearly income or around $57,000 average gross yearly salary that you made in the last 7 years.
This is quite impressive, I must confess... but it is also probably completely wrong and not even close to reality. If my assumptions are false, then I'm sorry to break the news to you, but someone ELSE paid cash for your NSX...
So, which of my assumption(s) are false? will you share this info with us ?
jaredNdallas said:
Since you are 21 and said that YOU paid cash for a 91 with very low mileage, let's do some math (with some assumptions):
Assumptions:
-you got your 91 with very low mileage, say at a bargain price of $30,000, from money you earned and saved.
-you dropped out of school early in order to maximize the time you are working.
-of course, you do not live with your parents/relatives and pay your own taxes, groceries, housing, insurance,...
-you put aside 10% of your salary in savings for the NSX
21-14=7 years of working experience
$30,000/7= $4286 per year that you saved to buy your NSX cash.
$4286/10% = $42,860 average net yearly income or around $57,000 average gross yearly salary that you made in the last 7 years.
This is quite impressive, I must confess... but it is also probably completely wrong and not even close to reality. If my assumptions are false, then I'm sorry to break the news to you, but someone ELSE paid cash for your NSX...
So, which of my assumption(s) are false? will you share this info with us ?
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steveny said:Here are some scary statistics from Feb. 2004 Money magazine pg. 145
In California 40% of all car buyers are upside down in the loan.
down payments on an average are now just 5%. Historically down payments were 10-15%
This is probably the case all over the US, not just California. What you are stating can be explained from the following fact. When one buys a NEW car, the instant depreciation is anywhere between 5% to 25%. If one buys the car and puts no downpayment or just 5%, then it's obvious to see why these people are upside down on their loan (owe more on the car loan than the car is worth). Another rule of thumb is that a car usually loses 50% every 36 months. With loans stretched 60, 72 or more months, it is again obvious why some people are upside down during most of the term of their loan.
steveny said:
Worst case than this, is the 0-0-0 marketing scam, where one is not required to pay anything for XX amount of months and "drives for free". Mitsubishi started this scheme and many others followed. After three years into their loan, when people wanted a different car and realized how MUCH upside down they were, they were blaming Mitsubishi for their troubles. Isn't it amazing that it's ALWAYS someone else's fault ?! Geez
apapada said:Isn't it amazing that it's ALWAYS someone else's fault ?! Geez
...and the people with this attitude are more than likely to do it again.
My brother-in-law got into the habit of trading in his new vehicles every 18-24 months over the last few years. By the time he was to far upside down to trade again, he was paying 650 a month for a Chevy Blazer. I gave him the speech and told him to bite the bullet and pay off his mistakes. He finally got the POS paid off last month and thanked me for keeping on him about it.
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I think more than anyone ... the automakers as a group are responsible for the statistics steveny mentions ... and I think they are making depreciation of cars happen faster and at a much higher rate than a few years ago.
For many years now, people have been groomed into the new car every 2-3 years cycle by the leasing system. Automakers purposefully began this method of ownership to feed on instant gratification and peoples desires to keep up with the Jones's ... even if the Jones's DO have the money to pay for the car they own and you just want to look like you do as well. The leases were counted as sales, and added to the bottom line of the manafacturer so they enjoyed their new found scam. In the recent years leases have come under fire by insurance companies questioning who actually owns a lease car, and lawyers suing their way through the posession/ownership chain. Suddenly, the great leasing that had brought a steady increase to many companies bottom lines was coming under fire ... and that coupled with a dropping fed interest rate meant something had to change.
In come the manufactures incentives and rebates, to save the bottom line that started to dwindle as were the new car "sales." Over the past couple years the auto market has been awash with seemingly endless rebates of thousands of dollars, and inceitives such as 0% (or close to it) to keep sales up.
These incentives/rebates are contributing heavily to the deprecation of cars over the recent years. There is no way to expect someone to buy a used car that is a couple years old at $X when they could instead buy a new car that has rebates to bring down the price to a similar price, and have the ability to finance it for a long term. Fine with the car makers, as they are no-longer as interested in the residual value of cars like they were before since leasing is no longer the cash cow it once was ... and they can continue selling the cars at low markup in volume to keep sales up. Consumers again, through leasing, have been groomed to pay for years and wind up with 0, so now if they loose on a trade in, they are fine with rolling the loss into their next payment.
Meanwhile... Money Magazine and others are printing these statistics as if it was changes in consumer habits or spending that is the absolute cause of people being upside down in their loans. <br>Any agree or disagree?<br> sorry this is alittle off the topic, if needed I could start another thread to discuss!
For many years now, people have been groomed into the new car every 2-3 years cycle by the leasing system. Automakers purposefully began this method of ownership to feed on instant gratification and peoples desires to keep up with the Jones's ... even if the Jones's DO have the money to pay for the car they own and you just want to look like you do as well. The leases were counted as sales, and added to the bottom line of the manafacturer so they enjoyed their new found scam. In the recent years leases have come under fire by insurance companies questioning who actually owns a lease car, and lawyers suing their way through the posession/ownership chain. Suddenly, the great leasing that had brought a steady increase to many companies bottom lines was coming under fire ... and that coupled with a dropping fed interest rate meant something had to change.
In come the manufactures incentives and rebates, to save the bottom line that started to dwindle as were the new car "sales." Over the past couple years the auto market has been awash with seemingly endless rebates of thousands of dollars, and inceitives such as 0% (or close to it) to keep sales up.
These incentives/rebates are contributing heavily to the deprecation of cars over the recent years. There is no way to expect someone to buy a used car that is a couple years old at $X when they could instead buy a new car that has rebates to bring down the price to a similar price, and have the ability to finance it for a long term. Fine with the car makers, as they are no-longer as interested in the residual value of cars like they were before since leasing is no longer the cash cow it once was ... and they can continue selling the cars at low markup in volume to keep sales up. Consumers again, through leasing, have been groomed to pay for years and wind up with 0, so now if they loose on a trade in, they are fine with rolling the loss into their next payment.
Meanwhile... Money Magazine and others are printing these statistics as if it was changes in consumer habits or spending that is the absolute cause of people being upside down in their loans. <br>Any agree or disagree?<br> sorry this is alittle off the topic, if needed I could start another thread to discuss!
apapada said:
Mine has spent many an evening at Jack'n the Box and Taco Bell, and they all thought it looked just fine
I'd say just look at your priorities and decide what its really worth to you. About the time I got out of college and got my first job, I really got into motorcycling. I wasn't making much as an entry level tech, so I did side jobs to support my hobby. Made enough from random jobs (construction, computer repair, fixing friends bikes, whatever...) to live just fine, albeit a little minimalistic (mmm... 2 for 99 cents tacos), and support the toys. Had a sailboat and three motorcycles before I even had a car. The extra time and money spent was worth it to me, because there was nothing else I'd rather be doing. Be careful not to overextend yourself financially, but do have some fun while your young. My friends were like me, but now are married and aren't allowed to be anymore
I've got a Sr. Admin position now, so no more side jobs. Still rent because I move every few years, and still live like a student because I'm single, I can, and the money I don't eat keeps everything in the garage running, at the track, or makes them faster
Bottom line: If you really want it, and can do it without financially straining yourself, go for it.
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mdb said:Mine has spent many an evening at Jack'n the Box and Taco Bell, and they all thought it looked just fine
I'm sure it did.
The argument was brought up and meant in the context of a direct consequence of not being able to afford anything else besides fast-food. Anyone who loves fast-food and drives his/her NSX at the drive thru is a free man/woman to do so. Anyone who starves him/herself and can only afford fast food due to his/her expansive toys, needs imho, to rethink his/her priorities.
Re: Re: nsx ownership
I don't know this for sure, but I think Jared is a mortgage broker in Dallas. If his family owns the company or he is competent at his job, the last few years have been very good and he could have made some good coin. I have several friends who fell bass-ackwards into this profession and have been making a mint the last few years with low interest rates and the refi boom.
Then again, he could still be full of sh**.
apapada said:
I don't know this for sure, but I think Jared is a mortgage broker in Dallas. If his family owns the company or he is competent at his job, the last few years have been very good and he could have made some good coin. I have several friends who fell bass-ackwards into this profession and have been making a mint the last few years with low interest rates and the refi boom.
Then again, he could still be full of sh**.
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