Honcho's Long Road to Imola Type-S Zero

[Honcho]

Man... add me to the list of people who thought installing seats were a pain. Install itself is easy but things never seem to fit quite right. I hope my next set goes in relatively painlessly...

Car looks amazing - anxiously awaiting some driving content!

Thanks! Even the OEM seats are misery- its reaching the rear bolts, getting the bolts threaded, wrestling the seat into place without scratching the car, etc. It just sucks. Your car is amazing.

Man, this thread is making me even less excited to do the coolant hoses on my car!

I feel your pain on the seats. My passenger seat is the worst (sparco evo2), either the bolsters hit the door panels or the front of the seat is deeply pressed into the center console. They are wide bois. And it got even worse when I lowered the seats. I feel like there is like 1/2” less width in the cabin on the passenger side than the driver’s side or something. Maybe just my car?

The only thing that worked for me on the passenger side has been a couple hacks: slide the seat to the point where there is the most room between the center console and door panels. Loosen all the bolts so the seat can move in the slop. Rotate the seat a tiny bit in the slop and tighten the bolts. There was a fair amount of clearance I picked up from that and was unnoticeable visually or while sitting. Even after that, the bolster would still rub the door panel a bit. I added a little aluminum shim under the right seat rail to tilt the seat a tiny bit away from the door panel. There is 1/8” of clearance to the door panel and it’s only slightly touching the console up front. Even after all that, no one gets to move the passenger seat around!

The hoses really aren't that bad, just time consuming. Make sure you have a fresh pack of razor blades and a good pick set. The "cut-and-peel" method LarryB taught me works quite well and avoids the suckitude of trying to pull the hoses off of corroded 30-year old barbs. Just make sure not to gouge the aluminum! I just do a shallow cut and then go over it again- most times the hose will split open without having to cut all the way through.

I also feel like the passenger side is smaller. Like overall by about 1/2". The passenger seat really presses into the door panel, where the driver seat just touches it. I'm going to try your hack when the seats come back out for the longer belt buckles. Mounting slots are about 12mm wide and the bolts are about 5mm, so there is room to rotate the seat a little. I also like the shim idea, though it will raise the seat height...

Man so there is no exact aftermarket seat fitment for the type S look....

DF-R seats with the same upholstery as mine would fit fine. I also believe one of the JDM shops is running a set of knockoff R seats, can't remember which ones though.

Recaro ABE + SoS rails is pretty close (but the rails are not powered)

Yep, but you would need to wrap the seats in kevlar for the complete look.

There's also the DF-R seats. Tough to find though, and paying nearly double the price of pole positions for 2nd hand 10 year old knockoff seats is a hard sell. I'd still probably buy some if they came up for sale at decent price with the power rails though lol.

I have a set right now in my house LOL. (they're Spencer's!)

Setting up seats to fit is a monstorous job. I have Recaro Pole Position and they fit quite well with SOS sliders. Takes a long time and many trials of in the car/out of the car to get the rake, centering the seat and getting the sliders to perfrom properly. But once set, I have no issues. But what an interior on your car! Just unbelievable beautiful.

Thanks!

 

[Honcho]

Project Update

Yesterday was a whirlwind. The car needed to go to smog by Jan 18 or I would lose my temp tags. And, there was a large snowstorm moving in that afternoon. My plan was to wake up at 4 am and work as hard as possible to get the car at least driveable. This would allow me to go to the smog station (only 2 miles away) and return before the snow hit in the afternoon. The morning was sunny and warm with dry roads, so it was a great plan. Was.

I got up on time and started working hard. The main tasks that had to be completed in order to drive were:

• Tidy aftermarket wires (wideband, oil temp sensor) to avoid touching hot manifold, driveshaft, etc.)
• Install rear sway bar with new bushings
• Install lower U-beam ("Rod A" per the parts diagram)
• Set alignment to neutral (per the FSM spec)
• Torque check all rear suspension bolts
• Install parking brake cables
• Install rear hatch glass
• Install rear license plate (the Garage Kite beams don't have mounting holes)
• Install front speed sensors
• Install front skit braces.
• Mount tires
• Check/adjust ride height for safety
• Test drive, brake check, etc.

It started well and I was moving fast. Flow state. I got the wires reasonably secure, though I'm not happy with the rear O2 sensor. I may get some tabs that I can mount to the rear heat shield to route the cable more securely.

The rear sway went on without problems. I had to use the impact gun to loosen the ancient locknuts from the old sway links, which were still attached to the bar. I used new OEM bushings and new rear end links.

The Rod A was my first snag. I was missing 2 of the 10x30mm bolts. I spent 20 minutes looking, but they were not in the labeled bag or anywhere else. I didn't have time to keep looking, so i used some 10x25mm OEM spare bolts as a temporary solution and threw 2 new bolts in my Impex Japan parts order cart.

Next, I set the alignment. It took a while with the rear toe because you really need to hit the 40mm gap between the nuts exactly. To do that, you must remove the inner toe ink and rotate it. Then, you have to even the gaps on the center nut. This took over an hour. Camber was much easier- just put the hashes on the cam bolt perfectly horizontal. The alignment shop can tweak the rest.

Torque check went fast. All to spec. At that point, I was feeling good. I would drive the car today.

The the parking brake cables happened. Ohhhh boy. The first problem is that the bolts were missing. I had a few really dirty, old sandwich bags labeled with a big "L" and "R" that has some of them (these were removed almost 5 years ago), but not all, and they were mixed with other bolts from the car. I spent 20 minutes with the parts diagram and a ruler to figure out what bolts went where. Then, while installing the driver side cable, I discovered one of the cable brackets had stripped threads. So, out came the tap and I re-threaded it. Burning precious time. That storm was approaching- I could see it just over the mountains.

The passenger side went smoother until I got to the caliper. I had two bags- one labeled "Rear Brake" and one labeled "Parking Brake Brackets". So, I grabbed the two 8mm bolts from the "brackets" bag and proceeded to attach the cable to the bracket on the caliper. Except, the bolts wouldn't go in. They would start about 2 turns and stop. Ugh, more stripped threads I thought. So, I got my tap and matched it to the bolt to make sure: 8 x 1.25 threads- perfect. But, holy moly, the tap was TIGHT in the bracket. I oiled it and just cranked on it until I had cut new threads. 30 more minutes gone, but the bolts threaded in just fine. I thought I was ok.

Then the driver side bracket. Same deal: two bags labeled "Rear Brake" and "Parking Brake Brackets". I grabbed the same bolts from the "brackets" bag and, wouldn't you know, they didn't go in either. Sigh. This time, before whipping out the tap, I grabbed a shop light and looked at the bracket threads. They were perfect. Wait, what? I looked again. Something wasn't right and my mechanic's brain started to form a thought. I went to the FSM and looked up the brake calipers. It said the thread was 8 x 1.0 not 8 x 1.25 like my bolts. WTF? I grabbed my 8 x 1.0 tap and it threaded right in no problem. Ok, number one, the bolts in the bag that says "Parking Brake Brackets" are the wrong bolts, and number two I have 4 tiny, very specific, 8 x 1.0 bolts somewhere in the garage. I spent 90 minutes looking. I turned over every box. I looked under the snowblower. Nothing.

I was wrecked. It was now 11:30 am. I was only halfway done, the snow is coming, and I have to be back in the office at 2 for a conference call with the government. But who cares, since I'm at a dead end anyway. I can't drive the car without a working parking brake. I went inside on the verge of tears. This whole project stopped by four little bolts. With all the thousands of parts I've carefully tracked and ordered over the years, my spreadsheets, etc. Four stupid little bolts. I threw them into the Impex Japan cart as well and took a shower.

As I headed out of the garage to go to the office, my eye caught something. In the "Rear Brakes" bag lying under the rear wheel were two shiny 8mm bolts. They looked like fine thread too. On a whim, I bent down and hand threaded one of them into the driver side parking brake bracket. It went right in. These were the bolts! But, I was dressed for work, it was 1:30, and I was out of time. I realized, however, that my passenger side bracket was also fine and I had totally jacked it up by tapping the wrong thread for the wrong bolts. Thankfully, a replacement bracket was only $16 at Impex, so in the cart that went too. I'll swap it out when I pull the calipers to do the rear bearings and lower ball joints next year.

So, my plan ended in defeat. I did not drive the car and it's only halfway complete. This is a big storm (it's still snowing as I write this) and another storm is just a few days away behind it. Even with our Colorado sun, it's going to be a few weeks before I can get out on dry roads. But, Mrs. Honcho pointed out that will allow time for the rest of the parts to arrive from Japan and I can finish the car without the crazy time pressure. In truth, it was probably a bridge too far, but I do believe if not for the parts searching, I could have completed it.

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 102

Parking brake

With my newfound bolts, I was able to attach the driver's side parking brake cable. However, I noticed that the cable had to be pulled to make it onto the caliper. That meant removing the center console box to adjust the brake. After many turns of the adjusting nut, was finally able to get some slack. I will check the calipers to confirm the brake lever arm is touching the pin on both sides of the car- I don't want to drive while dragging the rear brakes.

Next up is the hatch glass and engine cover...

 

[Superhatch]

This build needs to be made into a movie.

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 103

Parking brake, MCS suspension

Almost at the end.



I was able to properly adjust the parking brake and get the interior back together. That meant I could at last put the car back on the ground for the first time in almost 5 years! It's not ready for driving quite yet, but I wanted to set the ride heights to a rough standard and then have the alignment shop correct it on their level rack. As you can see, the car is "sittin' fat down south," as it were.




The front shocks are at the top of the threads and the rear shocks are about 3" lowered. This tells me that the MCS truly is set up for the top of the threads to be close to OEM height and anything below that is "lowered". The car is on pavers to allow my jack to fit under, but I just bought a new "low profile" jack to alleviate that. Also, the pavers make it easier to get under the car to measure height.

I will set the rear shocks to the highest setting and then just lower/balance from there. I am aiming for the top of the NSX-R ride height specs which is 165-175mm Front and 203-213mm Rear. As with the "regular" NSX, the range is to account for differences in tire pressure and wear, along with how much gas is in the tank. The top number assumes brand new tire tread at OEM inflation spec with a half tank of gas. For example, my Continental ECS tires will lose 8 mm of tread over their life (from 10/32 to 2/32) if I run them to nearly bald (I won't do that lol). The point is, if you are starting with new tires, you should set the height to the top of the range to allow for tire wear.

Thus, I will set Front to 175 mm and Rear to 213 mm. Lots of up and down...

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 104

Engine cover, NSX-R prop rod, NSX-R chassis bar

I chose to go with the MITA fiberglass engine cover. They later went to a much more accurate aluminum version, but this one is still quite nice and has an OEM feel. It is pretty floppy though, so I may add some aluminum L-channel reinforcement. Also, it is missing the prop rod hole.



After mocking up the cover on the car with the prop rod, I located the hole. They way I made it is to drill a circular hole and then use a dremel to "square" it.



Fitment is excellent. MITA did a really nice job with this part. Even the OEM gasket fit perfectly. My only nit is that the OEM bolts barely stick through the holes far enough for the nuts to grab the other end. I used stainless serrated flange nuts (6 x 1.0 mm) from ACE Hardware lol.



Installed the NSX-R chassis brace with new bolts for the dress-up look.


The prop rod is a combo of the OEM NSX-R rod and bracket and @comtec's excellent no-drill kit.

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 105

Rear hatch, etc.

Dug the rear hatch glass out from under the cobwebs in the basement and spent a good 30 minutes cleaning it up. I used 303 on all of the rubber and plastic and glass cleaner on the glass. For the inside, there was blowby oil from the struts. I used a microfiber with class cleaner to avoid damaging the rear defroster wires in the glass. For the outer glass, I used fine steel wool and glass cleaner, followed by microfiber. It is like a mirror now.

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 106

Rear hatch, struts, etc.

I was able to prep the car and the hatch for installation. First is to place the new gas struts on the car so they can be easily lifted into place while holding the hatch. Honda kindly packages them separately from the ball stud, so it's really just a push-click job.





It's cool- the strut cups come pre-greased.




Next, while doing a final clean on the glass, I noticed this broken off screw on the hatch. It reminded me that I had to drill out the screw on removal since it was totally stuck. After almost 5 years I had forgotten! I now remember what a miserable job it was to reach/bend across the engine bay to get the drill on this thing. But, with this easy access, a pair of vise-grips was all I needed to remove it. The new screws will be going in with anti-seize!



I'm now ready to install the hatch...

 

[ekhonda87]

Your comment about finding that broken screw 5 years later really resonated with me. When working on a project of this size, how do you keep things straight? You must have a to-do list a mile long, but how do you remember to do everything at the appropriate time, so that you don't have to redo things?

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 107

Rear hatch, fitting, axle nuts, etc.

The rear glass is back on the car. It was a 3-person job and my neighbor kindly stopped by to help. Basically, two people hold the glass and a third one (Mrs. Honcho) threads the 6 mm bolts.





My neighbor also brought his very expensive digital torque wrench, which I used to torque the axle nuts. My own 1/2" wrench only goes to 150 lb/ft and you need 234 lb/ft for the nuts.

Also, the package arrived from Japan so I can place the front wheel liners and front lip. Once that is complete, I will set the ride heights and test drive.

 

[Honcho]

Your comment about finding that broken screw 5 years later really resonated with me. When working on a project of this size, how do you keep things straight? You must have a to-do list a mile long, but how do you remember to do everything at the appropriate time, so that you don't have to redo things?

Because my project was "evolving," this was much harder than it had to be. Many of the early removed parts (mostly from the front of the car) were in unlabeled bags because, in 2018, I thought I was just going to repair the steering rack and drive as-is. Once Mrs. Honcho gave the green light for a full restoration in late 2019, I was more organized.

I used the following methods:

• A master excel spreadsheet detailing every single purchased part, price, quantity and source, grouped by car category (engine refresh, body, mechanical repair, etc.). I added a red block to the right of the line to indicate that the part was installed on the car to avoid confusion on what should be in the bag or not. Here's an example of the "engine refresh" section:

• Ziploc gallon bags containing new parts and labeled by source and purchase date (e.g., "Amayama June 2022"). All of these bags are in a single plastic bin. I found this was extremely useful to back-search my parts order invoice when I was looking for a new piece, and then go to the corresponding bag to find it.
• Clear plastic bins containing used parts removed from the car, grouped by area (engine, transmission, subframe, driveshafts, etc.). Inside these bins were sandwich bags labeled with individual items (e.g., "front timing cover bolts")
• An excel task list grouped by area of the car. A red box means "not started", yellow means "in progress" and green means "completed." It is a great visual aid to see how far along I am and what areas of the car need focus. Here's an excerpt:

In retrospect, this system worked quite well and I only encountered problems when I failed to follow it. Several times over the years, I would throw a bag with bolts into the bin that contained the original piece. My thinking was that it would be easier to find the bag when the time came to put the part back on the car. But, in reality all it did was create a chaos of bagged bolts all over the house. For example, right now I can't find the sandwich bag with the engine cowl screws. It didn't grow legs and walk away, but as of now it's lost in the garage or basement somewhere. Instead, it should have gone in the "engine" clear plastic bin.

If I ever did this project again, I would use this system again.

 

[docjohn]

You have literally built an nsx...beyond a refresh...

 

[Superhatch]

The answer is always Excel.

303 over the Honda spec'd Shin-Etsu? Have you tried both?

 

[Honcho]

The answer is always Excel.

303 over the Honda spec'd Shin-Etsu? Have you tried both?

The Shin-Etsu is fantastic and I use it everywhere. But, it is a silicone-based grease so it does leave a light film. The 303 dries matte and I just prefer that look. The 303 also has UV blockers, which is a real concern on this car. I do hit all the rubber seals with the Shin-Etsu once per year though, since it does penetrate the rubber and preserves elasticity in a way the 303 can't.

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 108

Axle nuts, center caps

Got the axle nuts staked and the S-Zero center caps installed.

 

[Honcho]

Major Project Milestone

Test Drive

We had a successful test drive today! The car runs beautifully, even with the dodgy Prospeed tune. No weird noises, clunks, smoke or leaking fluid. The clutch engages very smoothly and the transmission is silent, even at the 25F temperatures we were driving in- the Torco trans fluid is quite good and I did my job right. The seats are remarkably comfortable, once you get in them. We had the heater cranked to 90 mostly for the air bleeding, but it also made the car toasty warm.

I can say that the Continental ECS tires do continue to have acceptable grip at 25F, though I would not do any sort of hard cornering on them. They do not, as the internet forums argue, turn into hard plastic hockey pucks or crack at this temperature. Still, I don't know if I would trust them much lower. I may grab a set of General AS-05 to use during the Dec-Mar period, where is can get really cold here in Colorado (it is 9F today).




Then the sun came out. I had to get a picture of the sun on the pearl paint for the first time.



It was more of a challenge to get here than I expected. Bottom line: the MCS suspension doesn't fit and does not put the car at a street-safe or even technically useable height. I'll post more on that in the MCS thread, but suffice it to say we tried every possible adjustment and spring/shock combo and it just wouldn't work. So, what you are seeing in these pictures is the NSX-R suspension. I ripped open the carefully packed box and slapped it on. It rides beautifully and feels new, even though these are 15-year old dampers.
The drive itself was just around my neighborhood at 15-30 mph, 1st and 2nd gear only and no more than 3,000 rpm. It's hilly where I live, so there were some nice inclines and declines to help the air purging from the coolant hoses. Some feedback:

• The exhaust is LOUD. I mean, I want it loud, but I'm pretty sure the packing is completely blown out of the mufflers because it sounds like straight pipes a la Tatiec GT-009 (this exhaust came from a NSX track car). In addition to the fitment, I will have the shop weld in two new mufflers.
• The steering alignment is hilariously jacked. While driving straight, my steering wheel is cocked about 25 degrees off center. The front toe out is massive and the car looks like Lightning McQueen, according to @Big McLargeHuge. The car desperately needs an alignment and then I can sort out the steering wheel.
• The brake pedal stops, but is spongy. There is still some air left in the lines. I'll have to purge it the old fashioned way with pumping the pedal and opening the bleed screw- a two person job. It's a new master cylinder, so I can press the brake pedal all the way during the bleeding procedure.
• The clutch pedal engages high (near the top of the pedal stroke) and it's been so long since I've driven that I can't remember if that's normal. My lizard brain says it is though. Clutch pedal free play is set to 13mm, so it should be fine.
• The car runs strong- it's hard to describe, but it feels "healthy" and new.

The high is something like 1F for the next 3-4 days, so no more driving for now. The car has to go back in the air to finish the front end and front lip. And, also to bleed the brakes again. Then, I have to install the side sill trim (new) and the Type-S badge. The next real driving day is Thursday, where it will be sunny and 45F, apparently. I hope to sort the brakes before then so I can finally take the car to smog and get my permanent license plates. Hopefully the air inspection shop won't reject me due to the cockeyed steering wheel!

Finally, I would like to say a huge THANK YOU to @Big McLargeHuge, who generously spent the entire morning and most of the afternoon helping me get here. It was his idea to use the NSX-R suspension when I way ready to completely throw in the towel on the idea of driving after it became clear the MCS would not work. His positive energy and considerable wrenching skillz were instrumental in making this happen. It's only fitting that he got to ride along for the test drive. I think he was grinning wider than me.

 

[Honcho]

Re-Assembly 109

License plate, NSX-R suspension, coolant check, etc.

Fabricated the license plate mount. I used spare 5mm rivnuts from the front fender fix. 5mm machine screws and 1" plastic spacers make it work. I may revise the design down the road to something less clunky.



After the MCS debacle, installed the NSX-R suspension. OEM bolted right in no fuss.




Post-drive coolant check (after cooldown). It looks like all of the air has been purged. The level did not change. I will still check the rad and heater bleeders.

 

[docjohn]

Glad to hear the engine feels good..Funny how the things you don't pre-worry about give you the hurdles..

 

[BBVNSX]

Honcho car looks stunning out in the wild! Imola is such a nice color for the NSX! Amazing work!
Congratulations!

 

[Hass]

That’s lovely!

 

[Zoom]

• The clutch pedal engages high (near the top of the pedal stroke) and it's been so long since I've driven that I can't remember if that's normal. My lizard brain says it is though. Clutch pedal free play is set to 13mm, so it should be fine.

That's how it's supposed to be, at least with OEM clutch.

• The car runs strong- it's hard to describe, but it feels "healthy" and new.

I can relate to the feeling

 

[RYU]

I can't even imagine the feeling you must have right now. Awesome!

 

[Superhatch]

Awesome that it's up and running! Cant wait to see some driving vids.

 

[The King]

Your car looks awesome! Looks like you are in for a fun driving season this year! It has been a long haul watching this process, I can't imagine the effort and skill it took to actually make it happen. It has been a privilege to be able to watch this from start to finish.

 

[Valhalla]

I am so happy for you to finally, finally get to the point where the car is drivable. A couple more hurdles to clear but you are almost there. Congratulations.