HELP.....Clutch is ....gone?

[mspears]

OK, right at two years ago my nsx was not releasing the clutch completely. So I immediately had it taken to the Acura dealer here in Orlando. They installed a new slave , master , etc...and charged me accordingly. About four months ago I noticed when the clutch was released and gas applied it was slow to release. By the time I covered the 7 miles from where I was to my house the car was almost unable to move under its own power. I parked it. Now here is my quandry: the (new?) clutch has less than 7K miles on it and it is not like I am boiling the tires or street racing. Also, in my limited experience with clutch burn (not NSX other cars) the odor of something burning was unmistakeable. This is not the case this time nor the first time. Anyway, can I assume the clutch is gone? ....also..shouldn't an expensive repair from the dealer on a clutch last more than 7K?...and what could cause failure so quick?...My experience with the dealer has been less than positive and have had them do a number of repairs over the years and their batting average is about 250. I have read the techie members posts and replys and know that we have an automotive braintrust so I am already resting easier knowing help is on the way. Thanks alot!

 

[Acura NsX Pilot]

Maybe a defective clutch ?

Maybe a bad install ?

I am no expert but otheres will chime in shortly with more info

 

[D'Ecosse]

You're confusing by talking about clutch "releasing" - releasing the pedal is engaging the clutch.
Do you mean that the clutch is not completely engaging (i.e. slipping?)

If it is slipping (not engaging fully) then that is a clutch wear problem.

If the clutch does not disengage properly (to where it is difficult or impossible to put in gear at park without crunching) that is usually indicative of a hydraulic problem (i.e. master/slave/bleeding)

 

[john@johnhudakracing]

OK, right at two years ago my nsx was not releasing the clutch completely. So I immediately had it taken to the Acura dealer here in Orlando. They installed a new slave , master , etc...and charged me accordingly. About four months ago I noticed when the clutch was released and gas applied it was slow to release. By the time I covered the 7 miles from where I was to my house the car was almost unable to move under its own power. I parked it. Now here is my quandry: the (new?) clutch has less than 7K miles on it and it is not like I am boiling the tires or street racing. Also, in my limited experience with clutch burn (not NSX other cars) the odor of something burning was unmistakeable. This is not the case this time nor the first time. Anyway, can I assume the clutch is gone? ....also..shouldn't an expensive repair from the dealer on a clutch last more than 7K?...and what could cause failure so quick?...My experience with the dealer has been less than positive and have had them do a number of repairs over the years and their batting average is about 250. I have read the techie members posts and replys and know that we have an automotive braintrust so I am already resting easier knowing help is on the way. Thanks alot!

Is your clutch the OE twin disc? It almost sounds like the dealer might not have initalized or otherwise installed it properly. Perhaps you can get them to cover it if that is found to be the cause.

My Exedy single disc started noticably slipping today under load. I checked my logs and this would be only one year / 7K miles and one track event since I put it in. Someone called me and mentioned there's went at 9K as well with only moderate street use.

I'd charecterize myself as "active" with engagement but "highly conservative" with usage on this clutch.

I know the reason for the short life in my case is due to ride height. Otherwise it would likely have been fine to near triple that many miles. Given grippy tires and getting in and out of tight parking areas, shops, and more than anything my driveway has proven harsh despite every best effort.

I have a replacement disk on hand as they are cheap, the jack stands lined up, and am dropping the tranny tonight. Just changing into jeans now. I just really wish clutch discs were as easy as brake pads

 

[D'Ecosse]

Is your clutch the OE twin disc? It almost sounds like the dealer might not have initalized or otherwise installed it properly. Perhaps you can get them to cover it if that is found to be the cause.

I believe the symptom of initialization is that is doesnt disengage properly & resultantly is difficult to get in gear.
If I am reading the described syptom correctly, it is not completely engaging .....

 

[KGP]

... the clutch has less than 7K miles on it and it is not like I am boiling the tires or street racing. ....also..shouldn't an expensive repair from the dealer on a clutch last more than 7K?

Describe what you would call a perfect engagement from a drivers perspective of letting the clutch out from a stop, and also while up-shifting. I think you're talking about engagement, and I'm wondering if there's a bit of operator misconception on proper clutch engagement.

 

[zahntech]

7k seems very premature for a street use car IMO, My car had a clutch put in at 45k and it now has 103k on it...just some food for thought.

 

[NSXGMS]

They installed a new slave , master , etc...and charged me accordingly.

Forgive me, but did they actually replace the clutch too, or just what you described above? I hope we haven't been assuming the clutch was replaced when it was just the slave/master.

It's possible that a new OEM clutch, if installed incorrectly and was horribly out of adjustment, could burn up after 7K miles.

If this is true, you should have some recourse against your dealer or mechanic, regardless of the warranty on the clutch itself.

Do a search on Prime for recommended mechaincs in your area, take it there, and get a second opinion. Not all Acura dealers have experience working on NSXs, particularly clutches, transmissions and engines.

Good luck,

G

 

[john@johnhudakracing]

Forgive me, but did they actually replace the clutch too, or just what you described above? I hope we haven't been assuming the clutch was replaced when it was just the slave/master.

It's possible that a new OEM clutch, if installed incorrectly and was horribly out of adjustment, could burn up after 7K miles.
Good luck,

G

I was also initially operating under the assumption that they had done a complete dual disc install in addition to putting in a new master cylinder and rebuilding the slave as he specifically said the clutch had just 7K miles on it.

From the description he gave thou, it sounds as-if previously he had a dealer diagnosed hydraulic issue in his clutch system that was leading to the disengagement issues.. discounting dealer diagnose/install error for a moment... logically this would be normally unrelated to an actual disc slipping problem unless he was getting partial engagement or something odd at the time prior to the dealer repair or shortly there after which weared the discs during that snafu and he's just now seeing it months later after further use.

Another scenario, is that he said 4 months ago a disengagement problem became further apparent. Inevitably he mentioned that it could barely move under its own power after only 7 miles.. hmm.. I am curious if another scenario here could be that due to continuing partial engagement of the discs- they got so hot they were unable to hold the power. Anotherwards, back to the initial engage/disengage problem that was alleged to have been fixed with the S&M.

 

[gtr]

I have taken my car in and thought it was a bad clutch but it was in fact carpet getting in the way to preven disenguagement

 

[nsxtasy]

My experience with the dealer has been less than positive and have had them do a number of repairs over the years and their batting average is about 250.

Give your dealer a chance to figure out what's wrong with it, since they should warranty their repair work (depending on how long ago they did it).

After that, take it to Nabil at First Class Automotive. He specializes in NSX work and knows what's normal and what isn't. Great NSX tech.

7k seems very premature for a street use car IMO, My car had a clutch put in at 45k and it now has 103k on it...just some food for thought.

NSX clutch life varies. Some people wear out the OEM clutch in 25K miles, and for others it lasts 90K or more. Most seem to need replacement in the 40-60K mile range.

 

[Hugh]

Sounds like your dealer had a blindfolded Forrest Gump do the work on your car. Something is definitely not right. My original clutch lasted 130,000 miles. 80,000 of which were put on by me in the last two years since I bought the car. The new clutch is now approaching 25,000 miles and all is well.

 

[NSXSOON]

Nabil truly is a Great NSX tech. You may want to consider taking it to Nabil first and ask him to make the determination if it warrents going to the dealer to get it covered. If you bring it to the dealer first they may take it apart and say it's not covered and then you're stuck with the car disassembled and will need to tow it out or let them do the repair. Kind of like being held hostage!

 

[veronsx]

You better call Nabil or Oster right away,IMO the only place to take an NSX. Just rebuilt my trans and replace clutch among many other items,these guys are fantastic. My car had 25k clutch was very weak,so I guess some last longer than others. Good luck!

 

[mspears]

You're confusing by talking about clutch "releasing" - releasing the pedal is engaging the clutch.
Do you mean that the clutch is not completely engaging (i.e. slipping?)

If it is slipping (not engaging fully) then that is a clutch wear problem.

If the clutch does not disengage properly (to where it is difficult or impossible to put in gear at park without crunching) that is usually indicative of a hydraulic problem (i.e. master/slave/bleeding)

getting the car ins gear is not a problem...it is when i release the clutch pedal that nothing happens. i appreciate the info.

 

[mspears]

Describe what you would call a perfect engagement from a drivers perspective of letting the clutch out from a stop, and also while up-shifting. I think you're talking about engagement, and I'm wondering if there's a bit of operator misconception on proper clutch engagement.

i am definitely no mechanic, but from my simple perspective as i interpret it, pushing in the clutch 'disengages' the gear and releasing the clutch 'engages' or permits engagement...

 

[mspears]

Is your clutch the OE twin disc? It almost sounds like the dealer might not have initalized or otherwise installed it properly. Perhaps you can get them to cover it if that is found to be the cause.

My Exedy single disc started noticably slipping today under load. I checked my logs and this would be only one year / 7K miles and one track event since I put it in. Someone called me and mentioned there's went at 9K as well with only moderate street use.

I'd charecterize myself as "active" with engagement but "highly conservative" with usage on this clutch.

I know the reason for the short life in my case is due to ride height. Otherwise it would likely have been fine to near triple that many miles. Given grippy tires and getting in and out of tight parking areas, shops, and more than anything my driveway has proven harsh despite every best effort.

I have a replacement disk on hand as they are cheap, the jack stands lined up, and am dropping the tranny tonight. Just changing into jeans now. I just really wish clutch discs were as easy as brake pads

i really dont know the type of clutch that is installed...i can venture a guess that because all work done on the care has been done at the dealers it is stock or stock replacement

 

[mspears]

Forgive me, but did they actually replace the clutch too, or just what you described above? I hope we haven't been assuming the clutch was replaced when it was just the slave/master.

It's possible that a new OEM clutch, if installed incorrectly and was horribly out of adjustment, could burn up after 7K miles.

If this is true, you should have some recourse against your dealer or mechanic, regardless of the warranty on the clutch itself.

Do a search on Prime for recommended mechaincs in your area, take it there, and get a second opinion. Not all Acura dealers have experience working on NSXs, particularly clutches, transmissions and engines.

Good luck,

G

i went back and dug out the paperwork from the dealer and it says;

m/cyl assy..cl
cylinder, slave
replaced clutch master cylinder and slave cylinder

 

[joeker]

i went back and dug out the paperwork from the dealer and it says;

m/cyl assy..cl
cylinder, slave
replaced clutch master cylinder and slave cylinder

I maybe wrong but it seems like that the clutch wasn't replaced. How much did you pay for the service?

 

[Larry Bastanza]

Sounds pretty straightforward to me. You had a hydraulic problem 24 months ago and they replaced the hydraulics and it was fine. 20 months later the clutch starts to slip, and now 4 months later it will not "engage".

Pull the trans and find out why, probably a worn out clutch.

Sounds to me like you have had good service, from a good tech. The clutch is either worn out, could be a bad trans seal that has leaked trans fuild all over the clutch, could be another blown slave that has blown brake fluid all over the place in the bell housing.

I do not understand how the "tech/dealer" is in anyway at fault, that is nonsense.

I will agree with nsxtasy, you should go see Nabil for sure, have him assess it, then have the work done. Bottom line is if the clutch will not "engage" you will need to pull the transmission to find out why and repair it.

HTH,
LarryB

 

[mspears]

Thanks for all the input. I will post the outcome.:smile: