Does Mark Johnson steal from a friend who died last year....?

[whiteNSXs]

Just for the point of argument, maybe many others do not share your family analogy.

And to sit at your keyboard challenging people seems pointless.

No flame intended, but there must be a more productive way for you guys to proceed than insulting people whom have had positive dealings with MJ.

Not the most effective way to gain support.

BOL

Yeah, for sake of argument, how about a community/society analogy where people watch out for each other and enforce some moral standard.
How would you want to live in a society where the people defend the thief that stole from you as long as they themselves have not gotten victimized? "
I just happen to agree with dnyhof who has shown nothing but logics and humanity. On the other hand, talking about pointless, what's you point anyway?
Why would you feel insulted when you are asked to explain your logic to defend Mark? Is that because you cannot come up with a good and ethical answer? Right, the good old "Mark has always treated me well and he is a GOOD guy despite all these people he has ripped off." Do you have any answer better than this?
This is really for sake of argument but again from all these exchanges, one should realize there are really different ethical standards, education levels, intelligence, and other human qualities among the society, community, and here at Prime.
Steve

 

[nsxhk]

There's no use to be polite. I've tried that. I've tried just about anything, but that mark 'low life' johnson guy just ignored me like I don't exist. There were quite a few very nice nsx member (you know who you are) tried to help me resolve the dispute with that mark 'low life' johnson but the end result is still the same, no reply no nothing. At one point, he made a promise to one of those nice helping member that he'll return my bbs wheels to me but of course, he lied.

 

[comquat1]

Anyone think that Lud will allow this thread to go to the general forum? I personally think this is a huge issue for our little community and it needs attention and really needs to be dealt with and ended permanately.

Lud, I don't know what your relationship is with Dali, but I'd like to know your thoughts on this seemingly ongoing issue of Dali taking advantage of people here.

I've said before, 1, 2 or 3 minor issues can be considered a hiccup or a miscommunication, but what Dali is doing is blatant, unprofessional, unethical and just plain wrong.

I will say this, and these words may sound harsh, but if Dali isn't booted from here and NSXCA, I hope he rips off a S&%TLOAD of users here, because we're all ripe for the pickings for not standing up to this injustice.

 

[Sig]

edit

 

[blackcat]

I agree

Lud

Please give this discussion serious thought.

On another note. Japanese culture dictates a group decision. Senior employees provide wisdom and the group makes decision best for the group. Imagine if Honda had employees that ripped off the public. This would disgrace their hard earned reputation and Name. Saving face is very important in their culture. MJ has disgraced the community and dishonored himself to the NSXCA. The NSX stands for so much more than just aluminum and titanium parts. A benchmark was achieved for the world to think about. Just by owning a NSX you are privaleged individual. Peoples lives and careers have been about making this car. By taking away a persons money for your own gain and using the NSXCA logo on your web site you try to give crediability to your own operations.

When a individual advertises he is a MEMBER of the NSXCA as MJ does he associates himself with some of the most passionate and intelligent people in the world. I feel sick to my stomach thinking about MJ and what he did to Guus. If anyone can say they would want this individual sitting next to them at NSXPO or any event you dishonor the rest of the whole community. As a human being who has worked hard and make sacrifices to get my NSX I would spit on you MJ.

The seriousness of what you have done is beyond repair. By allowing you to stay as a member ruins the credability of the rest of the members.

Guus I have never met you but I vow to try and make this right for you and help regain honor to the NSXCA for the rest of the members.

Once again lets turn this discussion from talk to getting this issue to the proper channels.

MJ go sell your NSXs and why don't you try something more noble like selling arms to the third world leaders. Maybe sweatshops would be more to your liking. A good thief knows when the game is over so move on.

 

[prova4re]

I don't think we should drag Lud in this big mess.
I think Andy pointed out the first step in this process.

Is there anything in the charter that allows the NSXCA members to vote on banning a fellow member?

Yes.

The bylaws of the NSXCA contain a provision whereby a current member not in good standing with the club and the community can have their membership revoked. No membership = no NSXPO, among other perks.

 

[Yellow Rose]

Friendly Reminder

I'm not beating my own drum, but rather than everyone insulting each other about this topic, as far as I know, nobody has taken the necessary steps to do something about it. Somebody after my first post to this thread asked how to go about my suggestion.

It is really very simple. Draft the "complaint" and send it to the e-mail for the NSXCA's Board of Directors. I do not know that e-mail address but if you go to www.nsxca.org it is probably there somewhere. Or you could send a PM to nsxtasy (avatar of a red NSX following a yellow Integra on the track) and ask him. He is the treasurer for the club.

In the mean time that everyone argues with each other, nothing is being done about the situation. I am not taking sides, just stating the obvious. And no, Lud should not get drug into the mess.

 

[nsxtasy]

Okay, here are a few thoughts.

First, I agree that what has been posted here about Mark Johnson's actions (or lack thereof) sounds despicable. However, I wonder whether this situation is not being described completely and accurately here. Because there is no information from Mark, we are only hearing one side of the story. I am not defending Mark. I just don't feel comfortable in taking any position based on what has been posted here, other than saying "If this is true..." which is conjecture.

Second, I'm not sure whether ejection from the NSX Club of America is an appropriate response, and I'm not sure whether that would accomplish anything more than public embarrassment, which strikes me as counter-productive and petty. Just to throw out one example of something that might be more appropriate and more likely to elecit a satisfactory resolution, many Better Business Bureau offices offer merchant dispute resolution arbitration services, and often these are even provided for free. Maybe a club and/or NSXprime member in Mark's area (San Diego) could represent Guus in this matter. This might have a better chance of eliciting Mark's side of the story and/or recovering payment; even if there is no satisfactory resolution, it also offers the potential of establishing a public record of the dispute with the BBB, which might have more effect than ejection from the club.

I agree with RSO 34 that there appears to be a disconnect here, with people reporting negative experiences in this topic, while those experiences have never been reported in NSXprime's rating system. Granted, this rating system is new; but that would certainly be one avenue where any such grievances could at least be reported and available for other NSXers to review.

 

[nsxtasy]

Draft the "complaint" and send it to the e-mail for the NSXCA's Board of Directors. I do not know that e-mail address but if you go to www.nsxca.org it is probably there somewhere. Or you could send a PM to nsxtasy (avatar of a red NSX following a yellow Integra on the track) and ask him. He is the treasurer for the club.

Speaking officially on behalf of the Board of Directors of the NSX Club of America, the board welcomes all comments and input from club members on club matters. The members of the board are shown on the club's website here. There is an e-mail address where you can send e-mails to the entire board, and it is:

nsxca-board and then insert an at sign yahoogroups and then insert a dot com

Please contact the entire board using that e-mail address, rather than via a PM to me.

The section of the club's by-laws regarding the expulsion of members reads as follows:

ARTICLE II: MEMBERSHIP

Section E: Termination of Membership

Any Member may be expelled from the Corporation by action of the Board of Directors for any of the following reasons:

1. Nonpayment of dues, if dues are not paid within 60 days of the date due.

2. Conduct which reflects adversely upon the Corporation or is contrary to its purposes or in violation of any of its rules. This action will require a three fourths affirmative vote of the Board of Directors. Any Member whose expulsion is sought must be provided not less than fifteen (15) days prior written notice of the expulsion and the reasons therefore, and be provided an opportunity to be heard, orally or in writing, not less than five (5) days before the effective date of the expulsion by a person or persons authorized to decide that the proposed expulsion should not take place. Any expulsion must be fair and reasonable taking into consideration all of the relevant facts and circumstances. Expelled Members will be entitled to a prorated refund of paid dues but will not be otherwise excused from any other obligations they may have to the Corporation.

 

[Sig]

Second, I'm not sure whether ejection from the NSX Club of America is an appropriate response, and I'm not sure whether that would accomplish anything more than public embarrassment, which strikes me as counter-productive and petty.

The 'counter-productive and petty' comment does not sound appropriate levied at the posters in this thread. The MJ/Dali complaints and grievances have a long history in the NSX community. We see plenty on NSXprime and even more go unheard because many NSX folks do not post on the boards. When considering just the content posted on NSXprime, even prior to this latest incident, the problems are widespread and should warrant action. What bothers me the most about this situation is that even before this latest thread, there are a number of folks that are more than willing to defend Dali solely because they themselves were not harmed financially or otherwise by the actions/inactions of Dali. This is another example of why both sides should be heard. Just as some are accused of reaching a guilty verdict hastily, just as many are willing to reach a not guilty decisision and then condemn the victims. Even though MJ is a personal friend to some on this board and treated many(including myself) of us well, this does not excuse the long-running pattern of indiscretions. I personally have had a number of transactions with Dali that were without problems. However, after seeing complaints regularly arise for years and hearing many other complaints from owners that don't make it onto the forum, there is no way that I would minimize the seriousness of others' problems because I somehow managed to slip through unscathed. As someone who takes the business quite seriously, whether a customer has paid $30 or $3000, each one deserves respectful and fair treatment. Anything short of that is not excusable.

A more pragmatic view the situation reveals a business that feels it is above having to explain itself. It just so happens that this latest incident 'sounds' egregious enough that the community pays more attention to it. However, there are many others that have been left swinging in the wind over the years. Even though most had less money at risk, it is my belief that each incident is just as serious as the latest.

As per Ken's suggestion of pursuing action with the Better Business Bureau, I have to disagree. Being familiar with the BBB, I do not believe that is the proper avenue. Though success with the BBB is not unheard of, so who knows... I do not personally endorse kicking someone out of NSXCA. However, simply because embarrassment may result, that certainly does not mean it may not be warranted.

If a jeweler has provided my family fantastic service and top-notch jewelry for many years, has he earned the right to rip-off or deceive my neighbor? Further, do I have the right to tell my neighbor to stop complaining because I have received great service for years and his complaints are not valid because (this jeweler who selectively provides good service) has not harmed me? These rhetorical questions are not aimed at any one person in this thread, but at a popular sentiment that has been expressed over the past couple of years.

I believe each one of us needs to understand that there is not one person out there that is more important than another. This is true for newcomers to the community as well as those who have been around since the beginning. Poor treatment of one person should never be excused by the good treatment of another.

 

[nsxtasy]

The 'counter-productive and petty' comment does not sound appropriate levied at the posters in this thread, but rather to the vendor himself.

Re-read my post. I did not say that the posters in this thread were being counter-productive and petty. I said that public embarrassment, as a way of addressing this issue, is counter-productive and petty.

I would ask those reading this the following question: What are you trying to accomplish? Are you trying to gain a refund for Guus's family? Are you trying to discourage unfair business practices? Or are you just looking to make someone look bad? Because there are ways to accomplish each of these objectives... but I think too many people here haven't even thought through this question, and are just eager to jump on the bandwagon by slamming Mark here.

I said it before, and I'll say it again. I am not defending unfair business practices in general, and I am not defending Mark in particular. But I just don't think we're hearing the whole story here.

 

[Sig]

Re-read my post. I did not say that the posters in this thread were being counter-productive and petty. I said that public embarrassment, as a way of addressing this issue, is counter-productive and petty.

I would ask those reading this the following question: What are you trying to accomplish? Are you trying to gain a refund for Guus's family? Are you trying to discourage unfair business practices? Or are you just looking to make someone look bad? Because there are ways to accomplish each of these objectives... but I think too many people here haven't even thought through this question, and are just eager to jump on the bandwagon by slamming Mark here.

Conceeded, but my point was that revocation of NSXCA involvement may bring about the most change though it is not my personal position. Unfortunately, potential embarrassment may be a more powerful tool as compared to financial reperations.

As to the bandwagon, comment. There is an established pattern of problems that have occured over a course of many years to many in this community. I believe a bandwagon comment may be appropriate if this was the first off-color incident. However, it is just the latest installment in a long history.

That said, both sides deserve to be heard. However, as I stated above, the major reason I even took the time to write a response has little to do with the latest complaint, but rather the many others from the past. This is the latest reminder that these issues have not gone away.

 

[erobbins]

While there may be individuals who have issue with MJ's business practices through Dali Racing, he has done nothing that I can see which would warrant or merit pulling his NSXCA membership as provided for in the club's by-laws.

Dali has no endorsement by the club, nor is a discount provided to club members. No where on the Dali website does an NSXCA logo appear, although the owner is an NSXCA member. I fail to see the connection to how his alleged bad business practices reflects adversely on the NSXCA. It just happens to be that a club member owns a business - not that the business is a club member.

If Lud chooses to drop MJ from NSXPrime.com membership, that's his own personal deal. This is his website - not the NSXCA's, not MJ's, and not anyone else's.

I don't understand why people don't simply let the market dictate Dali's success or failure. If you have a problem with MJ, or are uneasy because of things you read online, then spend your money elsewhere. MJ could probably use the spare time it would give him.

I would, however, caution people against a rush to judgement.

EDR

 

[prova4re]

Didn't Dali/Mark sponsor the Nsxpo last year?
They passed out his T shirt, and he set up a both to sell his goods there. IMO, the NSX Club of America is supporting Dali in his efforts. I don't think you should ban him, but I would not want to see him with a booth there. Or as a sponsor.
I think he should be allowed to show up to the event, just so people can talk to him about were there parts are.

Ken, we all know the BBB won't/ can't do a thing about the problem's that are stated here.

 

[nsxtasy]

Ken, we all know the BBB won't/ can't do a thing about the problem's that are stated here.

I disagree. The BBB can, and does, resolve disputes through its arbitration services. No one knows whether that will resolve it or not, until it is tried.

 

[Dr.Honda]

Please close this thread. A public automotive enthusiast forum
is no place to resolve this issue. I don't know where you draw the line between "vendor review" and "personal attack" but I suspect it's been crossed.

 

[Sig]

Jim-

Where do you suggest a community discuss consumer advocacy issues that are ocurring in the community as a whole? Not to mention, issues that have been occurring for some time. I beleive the NSX community has a right to see the issues our bretheren our experiencing. In fact, this Vendor section was partly created as a result of some old threads relating to problems our community was having with Dali.

As stated above, I have never been wronged by Dali and thus do not have an axe to grind... however, I am deeply interested in how this situation is resolved due to the history of problems we as a community have experienced with this vendor.

 

[RichH]

Jim,

You are wasting your time trying to be rational in this thread.

Their minds are made up, guilty as charged.

Disagree with them and you will surely get a lecture on your lack of morality.

Again, why don't you guys do something constructive with your outrage. You seem to stuck here spinning hostility and negative speak. And forget it, if anyone disagrees with "anything" you say.

This thread is on the ignore list for me.

Maybe Lud should start a hate MJ venue. Hate Mark 24/7!
Maybe that will provide what you seek?

Let it fly!!!!

 

[Sig]

Jim,

You are wasting your time trying to be rational in this thread.

Their minds are made up, guilty as charged.

Disagree with them and you will surely get a lecture on your lack of morality.

Again, why don't you guys do something constructive with your outrage. You seem to stuck here spinning hostility and negative speak. And forget it, if anyone disagrees with "anything" you say.

This thread is on the ignore list for me.

Maybe Lud should start a hate MJ venue. Hate Mark 24/7!
Maybe that will provide what you seek?

Let it fly!!!!

Since it is on your ignore list, it was kind of you to take the time to post in the thread.

There have been many requests to hear both sides of this story, as there have been for years. In addition, I have re-read the thread to see if there was anything "hateful" and failed to find anything. Certainly, none of my words were hateful.

It is however unfortunate that some will condemn those who have had problems with Dali. Once again this has been ongoing for years. Dirt swept under the carpet will yield no progess.

Now, those on this thread should have every opportunity to discuss what they feel is the avenue they would like to take. Ken brought up some options the affected could take, as have some others. Those involved in ongoing diputes with Dali should have the opportunity to discuss this without the others condemning them for bringing light to their issues.

 

[blackcat]

BBB is a joke

Even Wal-Mart and Microsoft has disputes with customers and the BBB cannnot make it right. What makes you think a two bit operation with no real office or telephone will comply with the BBB. Just think about it NO OFFICE where one can go to or no way of calling the company is just ripe for ripping people off.

 

[comquat1]

I may be incorrect here but hasn't a few people gone to the BBB regarding Dali with in the last couple years with no results? I'm not positive nor did I use the search function to see but I think I remember a few threads a while back saying some people went that route with nothing happening.

Well I stated my thoughts before about what I think should happen and I see already some think them too harsh, but what else can you do to get a vendors attention other than to hurt them in the pocket book or maybe humiliation? Am I missing anything? I mean come on, the guy won't even come online to tell his side of the story. Has he ever addressed any of the issues online that people have brought against him? I don't recall any (again I didn't search).

I've seen other boards I've been on ban vendors simply because they were not being good stewards of the boards they were sponsering by attacking other vendors and whatnot, Dali hasn't done that but gone one step further by ripping off it's own customers.

Heck, if Dali keeps getting away with this I think I may start an NSX parts business and keep no inventory whatsoever and steal everyones money. No one can touch Dali, so why not me?!?!
Maybe I'll even do everything half price to really reel in some suckers.

 

[nsxtasy]

I may be incorrect here but hasn't a few people gone to the BBB regarding Dali with in the last couple years with no results? I'm not positive nor did I use the search function to see but I think I remember a few threads a while back saying some people went that route with nothing happening.

According to the San Diego BBB website, two complaints have been filed with the BBB, with "unsatisfactory" results because Mark/Dali did not respond. I am not suggesting merely filing a complaint. I am suggesting looking into whether they offer mediation/arbitration services (as noted on their website, many BBBs do) and pursuing them.

Another alternative might be for someone to file suit on behalf of Guus's estate, presumably in San Diego County. Perhaps the amount involved is small enough that the case can be handled Pro Se (also known as Small Claims Court), where the services of an attorney are not required.

 

[nsxtasy]

Another alternative might be for someone to file suit on behalf of Guus's estate, presumably in San Diego County. Perhaps the amount involved is small enough that the case can be handled Pro Se (also known as Small Claims Court), where the services of an attorney are not required.

A quick web search find that the dollar limit for Small Claims Court in the Superior Court of San Diego County is $5,000, but the claim must be filed by the actual party to the claim. It states that "A corporation or other entity that is not a natural person" - this would presumably apply to an individual's estate - "must be represented by a regular employee or representative. The employee cannot be hired solely to represent the corporation or other entity in small claims court. The employee or representative is required to file a declaration with the court stating the basis of their authority to represent an entity." This could present a problem for someone who might otherwise represent the estate solely for the purpose of the small claims court case.

Hey, I tried...

 

[TyraNSX]

Then couldn't the executor of the will file? Or the lawyer handling the estate? Not a lawyer, but it sounds appropriate.

 

[nsxtasy]

Then couldn't the executor of the will file? Or the lawyer handling the estate? Not a lawyer, but it sounds appropriate.

Yes, they could. However, the fact that they are in Europe makes it rather expensive to make a personal appearance in San Diego...