Clutch vs. master/slave cylinder problem?

[2Di4]

Hey All!

My NSX has displayed some troubling symptoms recently and is nearly un-drivable at this point -- I can't determine whether it's simply a master/slave cylinder issue, or if the clutch itself needs replacing. ...or if maybe there is just a leak in the fluid line.

The car has is a 1991 with 57,000 miles on it -- I'm the 2nd owner. The second gear has always been a little "chattery" ever since I got the car with 39,000 on it. Recently, the clutch pedal has been getting more and more mushy now to the point where it has little-to-no resistance. I checked the fluid in the reservoir and there is none...

Additionally, I cannot shift into first gear when the ignition is on, as though it's "locked out" -- with some pressure, however, it can be pulled into the other gears, but not easily.

Could it simply be a leak in the fluid line? I haven't seen any spots beneath the car. I plan to make one last trip with it, and that will be to the mechanic -- for this journey, would it be wise to add a little fluid into the reservoir, or no? Please let me know your opinions!

Thanks!
-Diane

 

[nikey22]

the puddle could be collecting right under the steering column and you'll have to pull the carpet back a bit to see the leak. If you have NO fluid, likely this is the problem. Now the rule is - replace BOTH mater and slave together and bleed system.

Your clutch shouldn't be bad already at 54k unless you tear it up daily.

let us know how it goes

 

[EdinKali]

Replace both your clutch master and slave. You can probably get your car to a shop by adding fluid and them pumping the pedal to build some pressure back up(may have to refill it again after pumping).

As for the transmission, has the trans fluid ever been changed? It should be changed every 30,000 miles with 3qts of Honda or Acura MTF(bottle with the white cap). Makes a world of difference.

 

[davidf]

I've seen brake master cylinders go bad just by fluid bypassing the seals internally. It does'nt necessary have to leak to be faulty. This can work the same with a clutch master. I also agree with changing them as a pair.

 

[butter78]

I've seen brake master cylinders go bad just by fluid bypassing the seals internally. It does'nt necessary have to leak to be faulty. This can work the same with a clutch master. I also agree with changing them as a pair.

Dito. Had a similar issue last fall (loss of pedal pressure)

 

[nsxot1c]

^^^ All of the above. Replace BOTH. If fluid is low/empty, DEFINITELY fill before attempting to drive or even move the car. You may be able to fill it and pump the pedal up as mentioned to get it to a mechanic. If fluid is empty, this is definitely a clutch master/slave cylinder issue NOT a major clutch issue. Also as mentioned, you will not typically see a puddle on the ground etc.

 

[tof]

An S2000 mechanical guru (Billman, for those who know him) recommends emptying the clutch fluid reservoir with a turkey baster and refilling with fresh fluid from time to time. Prevents debris from building up and getting between the seals and the cylinder walls which in turn causes fluid to leak from the master cylinder into the driver's footwell.

 

[Larry Bastanza]

An S2000 mechanical guru (Billman, for those who know him) recommends emptying the clutch fluid reservoir with a turkey baster and refilling with fresh fluid from time to time. Prevents debris from building up and getting between the seals and the cylinder walls which in turn causes fluid to leak from the master cylinder into the driver's footwell.

This is a good idea, but frankly I would have to call it a bandaid. You need to get the old dirty fluid flushed out of the system. The thing to do is a complete bleed of the clutch system at least at the samer interval(2 years) as the brake fluid. I try to do this once a year, since the clutch pedal gets WAY more action them the brakes.

Funny how this is NEVER mentioned in ANY Honda service manual, at least the ones I have looked at.

HTH,
LarryB

 

[sparky]

for the records, it may not be advisable, but it is possible to replace a faulty slave only, bleed the systems, and .... it works. I just did this and the pedal is now sweet as ... although that bl&&dy rubber boot over the pushrod is a PIA!

 

[bjmills]

Funny how this is NEVER mentioned in ANY Honda service manual, at least the ones I have looked at.

The service "advisor" at my local Acura dealership told me they never replace the clutch fluid in customer cars. I looked at him like he had a third eye. He then went on to say that they would for an NSX, though. Fortunately the actual mechanic knows better.

 

[bjmills]

for the records, it may not be advisable, but it is possible to replace a faulty slave only, bleed the systems, and .... it works. I just did this and the pedal is now sweet as ... although that bl&&dy rubber boot over the pushrod is a PIA!

Before reading the posts here on Prime, I replaced only my slave cylinder myself. It's been fine for years now, but if I had to do it over again I would have done both.

 

[tof]

This is a good idea, but frankly I would have to call it a bandaid. You need to get the old dirty fluid flushed out of the system. The thing to do is a complete bleed of the clutch system at least at the samer interval(2 years) as the brake fluid. I try to do this once a year, since the clutch pedal gets WAY more action them the brakes.

Funny how this is NEVER mentioned in ANY Honda service manual, at least the ones I have looked at.

HTH,
LarryB

I agree, Larry. This is more of an every-3 or 4-month thing, particularly for those who know they won't go to the expense or the trouble of a full drain/flush/bleed every couple of years. (You know who you are. )

 

[2Di4]

Thanks for the advice, everybody! The car goes in for repairs tomorrow -- I will post the diagnosis when I find out!

 

[2Di4]

Hey hey!

Time to wrap up this thread! Turns out my clutch issue stemmed from a worn out master cylinder, slave cylinder, AND fluid line!! Haven't yet picked the car up from Hilltop Auto, but what I gather from all the phone calls is that clutch itself is a-okay!! Whew!
Thanks again for the input Peace!

-Diane

 

[NSX2398]

This is more of an every-3 or 4-month thing, particularly for those who know they won't go to the expense or the trouble of a full drain/flush/bleed every couple of years. (You know who you are. )

So, what would a reasonable estimate be to have the dealership do this full drain/flush/bleed? You are implying that it is expensive and/or a lot of work. Is it a DIY project? I don't see a writeup anywhere.

 

[NSX2398]

Hey hey!

Time to wrap up this thread! Turns out my clutch issue stemmed from a worn out master cylinder, slave cylinder, AND fluid line!! Haven't yet picked the car up from Hilltop Auto, but what I gather from all the phone calls is that clutch itself is a-okay!! Whew!
Thanks again for the input Peace!

-Diane

Diane, if you don't mind me asking, approx how much did this end up costing? ie. new master/slave and bleed. I may be looking at this soon as I am nearing 180k

 

[davidf]

So, what would a reasonable estimate be to have the dealership do this full drain/flush/bleed? You are implying that it is expensive and/or a lot of work. Is it a DIY project? I don't see a writeup anywhere.

Flushing the clutch master and slave are probably one of the easier things you can perform yourself. I gravity bled mine and recommend it a doityourselfer.

 

[Ritesh]

Bump. I had the same issue happen last weekend on the NSX. How difficult of a DIY project is this?

 

[TyraNSX]

About as difficult as using the search.

http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20258