Advice: Going Faster Scary?

TigerNSX

TigerNSX

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Dear All,

My first year track season has finally ended as of last weekend.
I have done a total of 15 track days this year, and enjoyed tremendously.

Nevertheless, I am currently having a big dilema. Now that I am in the middle of the learning curve, I noticed that I drive my car definitely faster than I did in the first couple of events. As I drive my car faster and things happen more quickly, I have become quite cautious of safety.

Most of all, I am now so scared of the speed and of the possibility of spinning out (I have spun out 3 times already - luckily, I stayed on track all times) that I am not sure if I am enjoying this as much.

For instance, last weekend, during the two day event at NHIS, I found myself driving substantially more conservative than before. My old instructor was surprised that I braked earlier, and accelerated slower than I did in my previous event. At the end of the two day event, I was not very happy. I was just too scared of going faster.

I love this sports, but I cannot seem to remove the fear of going faster. Will I be able to overcome this with more track time?

Has any of you gone through this?
 
I know exactly what you're saying. I've never found driving street cars at the limit of adhesion to be all that much fun; it has always made me feel very unsafe and scared. If you want to prove it to yourself drive a real race car. The feeling of safety that a full roll cage and the controlability that a no compromise suspension setup and race tires give you will make you understand what I am talking about instantly.

Having said that, why not try turning track days into a chance to drive your high performance street car at 8/10s instead of 9/10s. You still get to drive WAY faster than you can on public roads and you certainly lessen the risk of serious injury ( or worse! ) or of turning a prized possession into recycled aluminum. Unless you're Michael Schumacher there will always be someone who is a better driver in a faster car. There is no big Penske contract for the fastest person at any HPDE, so why not make the goal be having fun instead of gettin all tensed out trying to find tenths. :)
 
Maybe it is time to buy a cheaper car to thrash around at the track without worrying much about damage. My first track experience was also in an NSX, but I understand your anxiety regarding pushing it to the next level. Your attachment to the car definitely will damper your desire to take some new risks as you build up your confidence. I would suggest getting a cheaper track modified car or a used race car. A used race car may already have a nice rollcage built into it, so you will also have some confidence from the increased safety. Earlier this year, I was at a track going almost 125mph through ess type turns in my NSX without a rollcage... after that day, I realized the potential risks to my safety in case of a mechanical failure or any other emergency at those speeds... So I have decided to take the race car route myself.

Though, if you have the $$ and personal detachment from your NSX, it is a great platform to continue practicing to reach the next level.
 
I agree with Kenji. You should look for a cheap miata or something similar.

I am in the same boat. The tracks in Texas are fairly safe. Most of time when I spin, all it does is get the car dusty or muddy. However, I sure would hate to crunch my NSX. So, a friend of mine and I are looking for Spec miata. We are going to start out with HPDE's. When/If our skills improve, and IF we have time then we are planning on moving forward with SM SCCA racing.
 
Although the advice on getting cheap por beater car is sound, it is totally different experience. I love driving my NSX at the track. And I'm about to get another street car to bring to HPDE. I won't like driving my race car on HPDE unless it is for testing. That's what high performance street car like NSX are for. To have fun at local tracks.
 
For me, in retrospect, the solution to this was to switch to a good set of track tires. You can drive just as fast as you were, and keep up with almost all of the rest of the guys (although not Andrie - I was on the track the same time as him at the Glen...), BUT be using only about 80% of the limit of the tires. You can do things like lift in the middle of big sweepers or brake in mid-turn, or avoid other spinning cars, and still not get to the limit of them. I went back to street tires after getting used to track tires, and I felt just like you describe - it felt like I was on slick pavement and was very close to losing it most of the time. I feel that track tires are so much safer for that reason. It made it pure fun again.

My motto: once you go track, you never go back.

Jeff
 
Jeff A said:
For me, in retrospect, the solution to this was to switch to a good set of track tires. You can drive just as fast as you were, and keep up with almost all of the rest of the guys (although not Andrie - I was on the track the same time as him at the Glen...), BUT be using only about 80% of the limit of the tires. You can do things like lift in the middle of big sweepers or brake in mid-turn, or avoid other spinning cars, and still not get to the limit of them. I went back to street tires after getting used to track tires, and I felt just like you describe - it felt like I was on slick pavement and was very close to losing it most of the time. I feel that track tires are so much safer for that reason. It made it pure fun again.

My motto: once you go track, you never go back.

Jeff
Click to expand...

I disagree with this advice. You will inevitably start to want to get further than 80% limit of your car as you get more comfortable with your car. Setting a artificial limit on yourself based on the characteristics of what you think the car is capable of will not only hinder your ability to improve, but also this is not safe.

You often learn from your mistakes, so avoiding mistakes completey will limit you as well... you just have to make sure your mistakes don't injure other track participants. Once you build a certain level of confidence and skill, you can always go back to your NSX and feel 99% confidence using 99% of your car's ability.
 
Thank you so much for the valuable advice.

I guess that I will just have to regain my confidence over the winter and see where I stand.

My instructor over the weekend, however, told me something intriguing: "if you can master driving this NSX, you can drive any cars fast."
 
KenJim - I certainly respect your opinion, you have a ton more experience than me. It's amazing how much of a head game performance driving is. I will think about this interesting dialogue as I continue to grow in motorsports.

Jeff
 
Evo 8 MR! 6 speed and .99 g's! Just saw one this weekend. Didn't think the MR's would be out until the end of the year. My cousin who just had a baby two days ago is thinking about one as well.
 
Tiger you need more seat time period.The more familiar it becomes the less frightened of speed you will be.If you sit at home and think about all the potential danger involved with hpde,I'm sure you could scare yourself with other activities we do on a daily basis.I get more nervous driving in stop and go highway traffic with the setting sun in my eyes than I do on the track.I occasionaly scare myself on track , as well,but as you learn to controll the car nearer the limmit you can reduce your fear.
 
Tiger:
John's right. Confidence is the by product of experience. I too was afraid of speed during my early learning years. My first two years were the most stressfull you can imagine. Here I am driving what was then a $65,000 car on a race track...I got to be nuts!!! But as I learned car control, understood cornering dynamics and developed heel toe downshifting, I discovered smoothness. Now when I'm on the track I find a calmness within. The rear steps out, I pull it back in. I feel that there is nothing that the NSX can do that I can't overcome. Every year I get better and faster.
I used to tense up at Watkins entering turn 10. Now its all gas all the time, same with the downhill at Lime Rock, weather permitting of course. No lift... no braking. I never thought I'd be able to do that. I trust the car and I trust myself. You can write that on my tombstone.
Today I was driving to a business appointment, an on coming Toyoto in the other lane starts to move closer to the double yellow line. The driver is not even looking ahead. He's looking down at the passenger seat or adjusting his radio, cd player..whatever. I start moving towards the right shoulder. We pass. His left side of the car is in my lane.
On the track I choose to run with the fastest and the best...on the street I don't have a choice.
Enjoy your off season. I'll guarantee you that right out of the box you'll be a better and less fearfull driver in 05 than you were this year.
 
Thanks so much for the wonderful advice.

It's comforting to hear that you guys also felt the same in the early period of the learning stage.
 
SoCalDude said:
Evo 8 MR! 6 speed and .99 g's! Just saw one this weekend. Didn't think the MR's would be out until the end of the year. My cousin who just had a baby two days ago is thinking about one as well.
Click to expand...

I would second that. The MR will be one bad machine. The 6-speed also makes it a much better car for highway driving.
 
I'll look into the MR. However, generally 6 speed or more gears are better for track driving. The goal of more gears is to have less gap in between gears. Thus the need to shift more to keep the engine on the sweet spots. This beat the purpose for highway driving.

If what I hear about MR correct, I much rather have the stock one. I need a daily driver, and I much have a comfortable daily driver.
 
Andrie Hartanto said:
I'll look into the MR. However, generally 6 speed or more gears are better for track driving. The goal of more gears is to have less gap in between gears. Thus the need to shift more to keep the engine on the sweet spots. This beat the purpose for highway driving.

If what I hear about MR correct, I much rather have the stock one. I need a daily driver, and I much have a comfortable daily driver.
Click to expand...


Andrie,

From what I have read, the MR uses revalved Bilsteins that are supposed to be much nicer for "average" roads, vs. a smooth track. The biggest difference you will probably see around town is slightly more turbo lag due to the larger turbo. Hence the six speed tranny.
 
Hey Tiger. I feel exactly the same as you do. That's exactly how I felt at Watkins Glen. But at the end, what's the point of having an NSX and not drive it to its full potential. I generally don't speed or do anything crazy on the street or the highway so track is the only place I can really have fun with the NSX.

-ak
 
Hi Guys,

Is the Miata the small Mazda roadstar? Its called something different in the UK..

They are great cars for learning how to drive properly, and things crucially happen at slower speeds. Over here you can pick second hand examples up for a few grand.

The NSX is a bit like jumping in the deep end, as your instructor says, once you have mastered the NSX, any road car will be easy. Take this as motivation, it may not be easy to drive fast but you are gaining valuble experience over the wimps who drive race prepped FWD cars.

With regards to your instructor, if he has realised you have become like this it would be good if he could demand more of you. Does he take you on hotlaps? If he can show you just what the NSX can do, maybe this will give you more confidence as well.

Good luck,

-Rob
 
tucsonsx said:
why not try turning track days into a chance to drive your high performance street car at 8/10s instead of 9/10s. You still get to drive WAY faster than you can on public roads and you certainly lessen the risk of serious injury ( or worse! ) or of turning a prized possession into recycled aluminum. Unless you're Michael Schumacher there will always be someone who is a better driver in a faster car. There is no big Penske contract for the fastest person at any HPDE, so why not make the goal be having fun instead of gettin all tensed out trying to find tenths. :)
Click to expand...

I agree! Make it a fun day and keeping the losses to a minimum is the way to go:-) I have done several HPDE and lap days and have gotten away with only killing one RM Racing Front Lip. I plan to get a "race car" next season so I can compete in SCCA Solo 1 and other race events and keep my girl without a dent or scratch!
 
Going Faster Scary?

It's best to try to do your fastest driving toward the end of the second track session of the day and during the third session. By the fourth session of the day (especially Sunday), one is usually mentally tired, prone to make errors and become anxious because things aren't going so well. One loses confidence.

Try to dial it back in the fourth session and just enjoy it. That way you won't leave the track frustrated and disappointed in yourself. As several others have said, ultimately more track time will lead to greater comfort.
 
Last edited:
It's scary if the car isn't equipped to handle it. It's not worth your health/life to push the car past its (and your) limitations. Ruining an NSX is pretty $$$$$$.There is a safety threshold that good drivers can feel in themselves and the car. "A man's got to know his limitations"....... Dirty Harry, Magnum Force. ;) :)
 

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