Adjusting tire pressures

[rbpeirce]

That logic is nonsense. On the track, the big variable is driver skill, much MUCH more so than differences between cars' capabilities. Very few of us are using such a high percentage of their capabilities that the difference in cars matters.

I guess I should have added "by drivers of equal skill." What I have observed is drivers I used to be able to pass with ease have acquired newer cars which are much more difficult or even impossible to keep up with. They don't necessarily corner any better but some of these cars can brake later and most of them are much quicker down the straight. The drivers man not be any better than before but they lap faster.

On the skill note, a couple of years ago I had driver who wanted to show me a new line through a curve. His car was in the shop and he had a rental. I and another fellow in an M3 had some difficulty keeping up with him because he could drive so well. I've seen the same thing from Mid-Ohio School instructors. So, I agree with what you are saying, but other things being equal, the car is a factor.

 

[docjohn]

I also have to disagree Rob with your strong stance that the car is your limiting factor in your lap times.You claim to not care so much about your times and are just out having fun,,but you blame the nsx for mediocre performance compared to whatever newer cars are lapping you.I can assure you that the number 1 issue with your lap times is you.I have been tracking the car for 10 yrs and my times have decreased slowly over the years,my attitude is to improve myself,never blaming the car,,that has helped me.My cars' times are still competative with the other instructers' times regardless of equipment.I hope you will really use this coming xpo to ride with as many of the faster instructers as possible to apreciate what a 16 yr old car design can still achieve.

 

[rbpeirce]

I also have to disagree Rob with your strong stance that the car is your limiting factor in your lap times.

Other things being equal. If you have two drivers of equal skill and one is driving a better car than the other, why is it so difficult to believe the guy in the better car will turn in better lap times? On an opposite note, that doesn't mean the less good car is mediocre. It also doesn't mean either driver couldn't improve his lap times.

I think you are reading more into my comments than I am actually saying. I actually did say the NSX is probably the best balanced street car out there. I have also been able to keep up with some of the slower track cars, even though I am driving a stock car on inexpensive (some would say inferior) tires. I am pretty sure that is the car, not me.

OTOH, some of the cars that have come on the market the past couple of years are spectacularly quick, and more drivers seem to be bringing track tires. Even a few years ago, drivers of race prepared NSXs were complaining about the power they were giving up to other cars. So it should not be surprising that technology might be catching up.

I am not saying the NSX is a bad car. It is a great car. However, it hasn't changed much in ten years and other cars have. Hell, I have a 30 year old 6.9 that was one of the fastest cars of its time. I am certain my CLK350 would turn much quicker lap times. That doesn't make the 6.9 a bad car, just an old car.

 

[docjohn]

Well lets talk specifics then ;what newer street cars are faster on track than you?There is only one newer street car that is faster than me at the tracks I frequent- c6 zo6.My car on Ra1's keeps up with every thing else- again street cars.I let the race trucks,cup cars,challenge 360-435 on slicks,and radicals pass me by.:smile:

 

[L8apex32]

Bob,
I have to say, this is one messed up thead on NSX Prime. I think the feedback you are getting is, primarily, "we don't agree".

The original subject was adjusting tire pressures where you confidently stated that, "I just set the cold pressures to my customary levels of 33# front and 36# rear and left them there all week-end. I got terrific grip. I am running Sumitomo HTRZ II tires, so your experience may vary."

Some of us tried to be nice while not agreeing with you. It is much better to set pressures while hot. I wouldn't even chime in on this, except you then started to say that your NSX isn't fast enough. Well, if you want it faster, learn to set your tire pressures correctly.

Second, what you felt was an average street tire. Others at the track tend to use sportier tires. You think the HTR-Zs are good enough for you on the track... but if you then wonder why someone else is faster or why your car isn't fast enough, "We don't agree." Use better tires for the track and it is night and day difference. You can't compare an NSX on Sumitomos to a 911 turbo (or whatever) on race tires.

BTW, you have a Zenardi edition NSX with tires downgraded from the stock Yokos?

When it comes down to ultimate lap times, the driver makes a huge difference. We all think we are great drivers and could easily win races. The truth is far from that... there difference between top and average drivers is a lot... many seconds per lap. This often is enough to make up for differences between cars.

YLTMV (your lap times may vary)

 

[rbpeirce]

Bob,
I have to say, this is one messed up thead on NSX Prime. I think the feedback you are getting is, primarily, "we don't agree".

You are absolutely correct. This has really gone far afield of the original topic, which was basically just an observation on my part that was true for my tires but possibly not true for anybody else.

I really don't disagree with anything anybody is saying. I just think they have read more into my comments than I intended. This is always a risk in an open forum, so I will butt out.

 

[Onsoku]

Good thread...may I ask what size tires and wheels are you running?

 

[Nimbus]

Good thread...may I ask what size tires and wheels are you running?

Bob's signature shows "completely stock", thus my guess would be he's using stock Zanardi BBS wheels and tire sizes not too far off from OEM.

 

[rbpeirce]

Good thread...may I ask what size tires and wheels are you running?

I stopped subscribing to this thread because it was getting too far away from my original point. However, I run 205-16 at 33# on the front and 255-17 at 36# on the rear, Sumotomo HTRZ II. The spec is 215 and 245. I understand there is a 225-16 available, but I have been happy with this setup.

I ended up here (flame retardant suit on) because I felt the NSX was a bit under-tired in the rear compared to the front. I can floor the accelerator around the turns 10-11 hairpin at BeaveRun and they hook up just fine. In fact, if I don't accelerate hard the front will start to push. This setup doesn't provide the ultimate in grip but it is pretty much right on for balance.

 

[stuntman]

When it comes down to ultimate lap times, the driver makes a huge difference. We all think we are great drivers and could easily win races. The truth is far from that... there difference between top and average drivers is a lot... many seconds per lap. This often is enough to make up for differences between cars.

YLTMV (your lap times may vary)

What's going on? I'm now agreeing with you AND nsxtacy on some issues