Activate the lockout solenoid BUTTON (5 to 6 speed swap)

[JeffShoots]

Building a weekend warrior out of my NSX.

Next project is the 6 speed swap W/NSX-r shaft for my Exedy and an OS LSD W/4.44 Ring and Pinion.

Now before everybody says just buy the CT box for ~$600 NO I Don't Wanna when you can do the same (almost ) with a ~$10 Button.

So if I understand this right the steel lockout pin closes off reverse at FORWARD speed.

From looking at the service manual the solenoid is power ON to disengage the pin and put the car in reverse?

If I installed a big red "spring" button that activated it when it was pressed I could back up, and then locked it out the rest of the time when it was released?

But it looks like the button would have to be held the entire time I wanted to reverse? Power "ON" to the solenoid? RIGHT?

Has anyone done this? I did search :biggrin:

If you have post a pic of a cool location in the cockpit for the button.

BTW: Wouldn't this make the car fun or what for a thief to try and steal my car

 

[john@johnhudakracing]

Building a weekend warrior out of my NSX.

Next project is the 6 speed swap W/NSX-r shaft for my Exedy and an OS LSD W/4.44 Ring and Pinion.

Now before everybody says just buy the CT box for ~$600 NO I Don't Wanna when you can do the same (almost ) with a ~$10 Button.

So if I understand this right the steel lockout pin closes off reverse at FORWARD speed.

From looking at the service manual the solenoid is power ON to disengage the pin and put the car in reverse?

If I installed a big red "spring" button that activated it when it was pressed I could back up, and then locked it out the rest of the time when it was released?

But it looks like the button would have to be held the entire time I wanted to reverse? Power "ON" to the solenoid? RIGHT?

Has anyone done this? I did search :biggrin:

If you have post a pic of a cool location in the cockpit for the button.

BTW: Wouldn't this make the car fun or what for a thief to try and steal my car

Jeff, you may PM Dave Leevy (titaniumdave) as your drivetrain configurations sound very similar. He recently went with the OS 4.44 in his early model and you might see what solution he employed for lock-out on his. For what it is, the CT box is pricey. I wouldn't be surprised if a vendor by now had Brian Zublin or another make an equivalent solution for less. Others might know more as to the history on that specific part.

He worked on my 6 speed; installing the R 4.23 final drive and R spec diff, and I noted while seeing his all apart at the time that another path less taken for a weekend warrior is to simply remove reverse all together and save the ounces.

With the Exedy, I never found backing up to be all that much fun anyway. Start parking front in, and that would be something to see on video. :smile:

 

[drew]

You can wire the lockout switch to the brake.

It is very likely the only time you would shift into R would be with the brake depressed.

It would be unlikely that you would be hitting the brake when shifting to 6.

 

[JeffShoots]

You can wire the lockout switch to the brake.

It is very likely the only time you would shift into R would be with the brake depressed.

It would be unlikely that you would be hitting the brake when shifting to 6.

Damn, That's good and you just saved me ~$600

I need to send you some FORUM BUCKS.

Thanks, Jeff

 

[titaniumdave]

You can wire the lockout switch to the brake.

It is very likely the only time you would shift into R would be with the brake depressed.

It would be unlikely that you would be hitting the brake when shifting to 6.

It is the 5th gear shift, not 6th. If you ever start to trail brake it is conceivable you could have light brake pedal pressure, clutch in, 4th to 5th shift. I admit, this would be odd, but why not stick with the console/knob/dash mounted switch???

 

[JeffShoots]

It is the 5th gear shift, not 6th. If you ever start to trail brake it is conceivable you could have light brake pedal pressure, clutch in, 4th to 5th shift. I admit, this would be odd, but why not stick with the console/knob/dash mounted switch???

Dave, You are raining on my parade but you ARE an Instructor so are you going to be in the car as I LEARN to "trail brake" into the corner and be the MASTER TYTE DRIFER Yo

OK, Ok how about just as easy wire into the E-Brake handle.

Get into the car, start car E-Brake still on, put car in reverse, take off E-Brake and back out of the parking spot?

I know too easy..............and you'll talk me into a BBK that takes out the E-Brake anyway.

 

[titaniumdave]

Dave, You are raining on my parade but you ARE an Instructor so are you going to be in the car as I LEARN to "trail brake" into the corner and be the MASTER TYTE DRIFER Yo

OK, Ok how about just as easy wire into the E-Brake handle.

Get into the car, start car E-Brake still on, put car in reverse, take off E-Brake and back out of the parking spot?

I know too easy..............and you'll talk me into a BBK that takes out the E-Brake anyway.

I like the E-brake route, one is never shifting to 5th gear when you enter an E-brake drift turn

 

[JeffShoots]

I like the E-brake route, one is never shifting to 5th gear when you enter an E-brake drift turn

OK cool, now if nobody has any other great ideas about how I can save 600 smacks...............

Please lets all have a moment of silence for the death of the magic black 6 speed swap box.

 

[Fastrunner]

Hi, Guys;

I just did the 6 speed conversion....now, seems like nobody have the reverse lockout kit for sale, not even Comptech. I'm afraid to drive and accidently go into reverse at 70MPH... Does anyone know where to install the switch or have a schematic to solve this problem?

Thanks in advance.

 

[MJK]

....now, seems like nobody have the reverse lockout kit for sale, not even Comptech

SOS sells a lockout box, too. That being said, I hope this thread continues to evolve as I just bought a 6speed and would love a solution that saves me the $525.

 

[angus]

SOS sells a lockout box, too. That being said, I hope this thread continues to evolve as I just bought a 6speed and would love a solution that saves me the $525.

ya but when i bought my box from sos it came from ct,
anyone wanna buy it?

 

[Fastrunner]

ya but when i bought my box from sos it came from ct,
anyone wanna buy it?

Yes, I would like to buy it from you..... Please check your PM.:biggrin:

 

[MJK]

OK cool, now if nobody has any other great ideas about how I can save 600 smacks...............

Please lets all have a moment of silence for the death of the magic black 6 speed swap box.

I was thinking about ways to keep this OEM looking. I was thinking that maybe there is a way to mount a pressure switch between the new 6 speed button and the shift plate. So, if you wanted to shift into reverse you could push down on th emblem with your thumb and kick the lever into reverse with your palm.

Thinking about this switch (PDF LINK). Any electrical gurus have a feel for how well this would work, or if there is a better way to do this (different switch, way to push the knob down, pull a collar, etc)?

 

[grog86]

I have the same problem with a five to six speed conversion in an Acura Legend. I never did the swap in my NSX. I would like to say that there is an alternative self buildable kit using a couple of diodes and a "tachometer relay". The problem is, I do not have specifications on the pulse signal from the vehicle speed sensor VSS to be able to choose the correct tachometer relay box from the supplier. If I had specific information on the current, pulse rate, voltage etc. of the signal, I could choose a tachometer relay from a supplier wire it up, and viola, I have a automatic reverse lockout solution. Do any of you all have the needed information?
Thanks,
Tony

 

[whrdnsx]

I had an Idea but I haven't researched it as yet. My thoughts were for cars with power steering. As the power steering only works below 25MPH (So I'm led to believe) Why not hook a relay off the Power steering Control ECU (Not sure what wire this would be but wouldn't be difficult to work out)

Just though this maybe an easy fit & forget solution.

 

[nsxlr8]

I have the same problem with a five to six speed conversion in an Acura Legend. I never did the swap in my NSX. I would like to say that there is an alternative self buildable kit using a couple of diodes and a "tachometer relay". The problem is, I do not have specifications on the pulse signal from the vehicle speed sensor VSS to be able to choose the correct tachometer relay box from the supplier. If I had specific information on the current, pulse rate, voltage etc. of the signal, I could choose a tachometer relay from a supplier wire it up, and viola, I have a automatic reverse lockout solution. Do any of you all have the needed information?
Thanks,
Tony

Hello everyone. I haven' been on here in a while. I just installed an old SOS one on a customers car. It works stricly off the brake. This makes perfect sense to me. If your hitting the brake while upshifting to 6th... .. well. Maybe we shouldn't even go there.

I can give you a diagram with about $5 in parts to create the exact same SOS box. Terribly easy. Please don't PM me. I'll just post it up tomorrow with the parts and the diagram.

Have a great day all. I miss this forum tons.

 

[nsxlr8]

Hello everyone. I haven' been on here in a while. I just installed an old SOS one on a customers car. It works stricly off the brake. This makes perfect sense to me. If your hitting the brake while upshifting to 6th... .. well. Maybe we shouldn't even go there.

I can give you a diagram with about $5 in parts to create the exact same SOS box. Terribly easy. Please don't PM me. I'll just post it up tomorrow with the parts and the diagram.

Have a great day all. I miss this forum tons.

Here you go. It's this easy

Typical Bosch Relay. maybe a few bucks.


It will have the blades on the underside. Numbered.

85
86
87
87a
30

Mount relay close to air box
WIre the numbers as follows.

30 - accessory power on only (maybe take from fuse box, or clamp on from other accessory)
87a to either yellow wire on the lockout.
(Ground other yellow wire from lockout)
85 ground
86 to spoiler brake light wire (vampire clip is best)
it's green wire located next to trunk lid shock tower going under rear air scoop
87 - nothing. pull out or terminate. (with pig tail wire connector)

lockout Relay needs power at all times and takes power away when you apply brakes. not terribly sensitive to amps. lock out solenoid is not Polar. Either way will work.

Thats it. It's that simple. cheap and easy.

I just saved you $500!

 

[MJK]

Hello everyone. I haven' been on here in a while. I just installed an old SOS one on a customers car. It works strictly off the brake.

I don't believe this is universally true.

I was looking for a lockout box a few months ago. When I contacted SoS, they said that their lockout box was manufactured by Comptech. At the time comptech was closing, so they had none. I subsequently found a CT lockout box elsewhere and it is currently installed on my car.

I can shift into reverse with any combination of brakes, hand/foot/both/neither. This is true with the car in any state (off/accy/on/running) with the car at rest. I have no tried it when coasting.

Please understand I am not saying it is not true of the box you installed, but mine doesn't work that way.

 

[Fastrunner]

I don't believe this is universally true.

.

I believe this one made by SOS ????? :wink:

Oh, and it works stricly off the brake.

Photo courtesy of Chis NSX

 

[MJK]

I believe this one made by SOS ????? :wink:

Oh, and it works stricly off the brake.

So you are saying that yours acts differently than mine? Hrm.

Maybe CT is different than SoS and I was I was misinformed when I called them? Something definitely does not add up unless SoS sold different versions (CT and their own) over time.

 

[ScienceofSpeed]

We switched to Comptech to supply the lock out boxes we began using about 8-10 months ago. The Comptech box is triggered of the speed sensor (about 5 mph+ closes the circuit). Not only is this how the factory does it (built into the 97+ ECU) but Comptech also went through the hassle of sourcing and buying a HUGE amount of connectors to make it plug and play. This is probably a bulk of the cost for the unit.

Alternatively since Comptech is out for the time being, and we no longer make it, you can resort back to our original design which as noted above is a 12 volt relay that closes the circuit once the brake light circuit is made. Do not splice directly off the brake wire as the amp draw on the solenoid is significantly higher.

Cheers,
-- Chris

 

[nsxlr8]

I don't believe this is universally true.

I was looking for a lockout box a few months ago. When I contacted SoS, they said that their lockout box was manufactured by Comptech. At the time comptech was closing, so they had none. I subsequently found a CT lockout box elsewhere and it is currently installed on my car.

I can shift into reverse with any combination of brakes, hand/foot/both/neither. This is true with the car in any state (off/accy/on/running) with the car at rest. I have no tried it when coasting.

Please understand I am not saying it is not true of the box you installed, but mine doesn't work that way.

Are you sure yours is installed correctly? But if it works off the speed sensor, then it most likely is installed correctly and just won't lock out until you are at speed. but

I assure you with absolute confidence. The brake is the only source of the lockout servo. The directions are clear and simple. (For SOS)

Now.... That being said. Now that Bryan Z. knows that the lockout solenoid is not polar and can handle plenty of juice... He should be able to make one for around $50 that works off the speed sensor. I would be amazed if it took more than very little effort on his part to make one.

 

[nsxlr8]

our original design which as noted above is a 12 volt relay that closes the circuit once the brake light circuit is made. Do not splice directly off the brake wire as the amp draw on the solenoid is significantly higher.

Cheers,
-- Chris

The way my diagram is above. It (The wire from the Relay to the 3rd brake light) draws next to nothing and is not the source of power for the solonoid. Exactly as the SOS unit does. The "30" pole is the accessory only power line that feeds the Solenoid. So in the wiring explanation I gave above, It will still work perfectly.

Chris. I'm not trying to bash you at all, and definately wouldn't have put this up if you were still selling the units. I heard you were not. Comptech still does I hear, but I don't think I'm going to hurt their business in any way. I'm sure your cost for these things were large from Comptech. Understandable. Just trying to help out the community. Take Care.

 

[UnhuZ]

and if i install a simple on/off button....which 2 wires do i have to use?? :biggrin: :biggrin:

 

[nsxlr8]

and if i install a simple on/off button....which 2 wires do i have to use?? :biggrin: :biggrin:

What a pain, but if you want to do it that way.

Pin wire 86. One wire. Get a small voltage source from Cig lighter or anything like that on one end, and Wire from pin 87 on the other. When you hit the button. It completes and gives your desired result.