A little brake help please!!

[TitaniumVtec]

Hi all!!

I need a little help. A month or so ago I added some speedbleeders and flushed the system with some super blue brake fluid. All was fine... so I thought A few days later I noticed my brake pedal would slowly make its way to the floor when sitting at a red light. I immediately figured I did not get all of the air out of the system so I bled them again. I really did not see any bubbles in the lines. I used the order outlined in the service manual also. The brakes still hit the floor, more noticeably when the car heated up.

After reading some post I came to the realization that maybe the master cylinder had gone bad during the flushing process. So, I ordered a new master cylinder from Ray Laks Acura and threw it in the weekend. Well, now things are really screwy. My pedal is softer than before I changed the master. I ran at least 4 additional liters of fluid through the system and I did not see any air bubbles. I thought, could the new master be bad?? Anything is possible, so I put the original one back in. Same damn thing is happening. Pedal is soft and sitting pretty close to the floor when fully depressed. I'm worse off than before I started this whole process.

Changing the master cylinder is really an easy job. 2 nuts and two lines and you are off and back on in no time. I would not consider this a hard job at all. However, the bleeding part appears to be a little tougher than I originally thought.

Could something with ALB system be causing my soft pedal? I've read several post that stated the two systems are independent of each other (at least that what I believe they were saying), and that the failure of the ALB system should not hinder the other. I need a little extra guidance please. Do I need to bleed the ALB system? I would love to bleed the ALB system, but need to get my hands on the T bleeder tool first.

Any and all help would be appreciated.

James

 

[dquarasr2]

Regarding a low pedal after replacing the master(s):

Strange. I just looked up the master cylinder r&r in the shop manual, and it doesn't mention anything about either bench-bleeding the master before it's installed, or bleeding it after it's installed.

Does this master not require any bleeding?

Other random thoughts:

- I assume you used new, unopened bottles of fluid.
- When you say the pedal goes to the floor, did you start the car and allow the vacuum booster to be fully engaged?
- You didn't mess with the booster adjustment nut, I assume.
- At any point did you allow the level in the reservoir to go too low while you were bleeding?

Hmm, this is a weird one. Sorry if I'm asking "duh" questions. I'm really grasping at straws. It sounds like you did the right things.

 

[MJK]

James,

I rebuilt my calipers a couple years ago, and it took almost 3 full cans of ATE to get everything bled back out properly. Even the smallest little bubbles caused the system to act squirrelly.

The method I found to work best was: I would fill the reservoir, tap the caliper I was bleeding with a hammer lightly and then bleed it. Tapping the caliper seemed to encourage more air to come out with the fluid. I do remember it took forever but I got a nice firm pedal when I was done.

You don't see any fluid puddles on the ground if you try this in the garage (instead of at a stoplight) do you? I am over in Knoxville and have a little free time on Monday night. If you want some help just drop me a line.

Mark

 

[TitaniumVtec]

I also looked at the manual, as well as searching, and it appears that bench bleeding is not necessary.

I used new fluid and did not mess with the booster nut.

I tried tapping each caliper to free up any stuck air bubbles.

The pedal is pretty firm until I start the car. With the booster operating, the pedal just drops like a rock. When I flushed them last month, the pedal was much harder before I started the car. Then it got a little mushy, what I would call normal.

I'm using speedbleeders with a hose and bag, so I am able to see the fluid/bubbles traveling into the bag. The air bubbles are almost non-existent. The right rear took a few extra pumps to get going, but after that, the air was at a minimal. I ran so much fluid through the system I had to buy more. The new fluid is a different color and I could easily see the color change from old to new. No bubbles there either. Speedbleeders make this job very easy for one person to do.

Mark, I'll pm you tomorrow if I need some help. You are welcome to pass by regardless if you are bored. ha, ha

James

 

[KooLaid]

I used speedbleeders on my last sportbike. I was excited about how easy it was to bleed but it made my brakes feel mushy......... I'm sure it's just my situation with speedbleeders but I don't feel they did a good enough of a job for me. I won't run them ever again.

 

[MJK]

James,

I have that t bleeder wrench if you need it, but it is in Jackson. It'll be a couple weeks until I get a chance to bring it over, but I will be happy to if you want it.

Give me a call or a PM if I can help out.

Mark

 

[TitaniumVtec]

Sweet. Maybe I will grab your T bleeder one day soon.

Thanks for the speedbleeder tip. Maybe I'll stick the OEM ones back on and give them a try again.

 

[TitaniumVtec]

Took it to Honda today and they hooked up their super sucker brake bleeding tool up to all 4 wheels. $84.99 later I am rolling with new brakes.

Note to self. Take car to dealer to have brake fluid flushed. Cheaper than 6 hours of weekend time without the aggravation.